Ammo Review: Seismic Ammo 185gr +M 9mm

1. Interesting. But it seems like a lot of bother and expense for 5 grains more bullet than common ammo available in 40S&W. If you’re convinced you need heavier bullets to get the job done but don’t want a 45ACP there’s still plenty of handguns available as 40s. But what the heck, it must be really good at $1.38 per round.

   • Yeah, I don’t quite get this in 9mm because of .40 and because 147 grain works just fine. In .45 tho, a 325 grain bullet going 800 fps would be very impressive as a big game defense gun. Makes me wonder if 10mm would be worth getting at all. 1200 fps with a 200 grain bullet vs 800 fps with a 325gr… decisions decisions.

   • But it’s not just that’s its 5 grains more than a 40S&W. You can carry more bullets in 9mm than a comparable 40S&W

     • Spray and pray member ?

       • A nobody ever said I need less rounds member actually.

     • Sectional density is also better than the .40. Plus, who the heck has .40 ammo available anymore? Ever since the fbi dropped it I don’t see 40 ammo at all. It’s going the way of the dodo…

       • Back when the Army was adopting a new handgun, for a time they had the door open to a new caliber. I was so hoping it would’ve been .40 just to watch the epic meltdown that would’ve occurred in the Gun world.

       • I have no problem getting .40 ammo. Just look online, plenty of it out there.

   • Except 9mm doesn’t have the awful bullet setback problem you get with .40 S&W. I’ll take not having an inherently flawed cartridge any day over .40’s perceived benefits.

   • If you dont have a .40, $1.38 per round is cheap insurance if youre going to be hiking bear country and want deep penetrating hollowpoints. (Though I would personally stick with much ligthter weight +P+ jacketed flat nose rounds in that situation)

2. “Seismic QuakeMaker”?

   So if we all buy a package, load them up in a full size pistol, line up on the San Andreas fault in the wee early hours of the morning and all fire into the fault at the same time …

   Ocean front property in Arizona?

   At long last!!!

   • Arizona Bay

     • https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=jpninPNXHWg

     • I bought 200 of these round and shot 5 before they jammed both my CZ A01-sd and my Kimber 1911, which I actually needed a gunsmith it jammed the slide so badly. Fun when they shoot, but I would say that in most pistols you will have more issues than fun. **

   • I like the way u think

   • Why would you waste all that ammo when one round of 6.5 Creedmoor would be more than enough?

     • “Why would you waste all that ammo when one round of 6.5 Creedmoor would be more than enough?”

       True, but shot placement would be hyper-critical. Wouldn’t want to lose a chunk of Arizona.

       • True, Sam. Wisdom is strong with you.

         • “True, Sam. Wisdom is strong with you.”

           I come by it illegally.

3. Would like to see what happens out of a longer barrel – even carbine length. An ‘outdoors’ round with a non-expanding, broad meplat could be interesting too.

   So when does the 220 grain .40 S&W drop?

   • Or 290 grain ACP?

     • The .45 ACP round is supposed to be 325 grains. Still not available.

       • I was being facetious, but apparently they are planning to be thorough. Yikes! Where are they planning to go? Is .44 magnum on the drawing board? Not that I would shoot it, of course. Too shaky for that.

   • Agree. From a carbine these might be the bee’s knees. My 3913 likes 124 gr pills, BHP doesn’t seem to care. And I also prefer flat-points on solids.
     I wonder if the ShellShock cases are absolutely necessary. If not, conventional brass cases could bring the price down a bit.

     • “Agree. From a carbine these might be the bee’s knees.”

       Like on a pistol AR platform with a brace and a can. A compact, hearing-safe home defense weapon…

     • Regarding the cases: A quick check of reloading forums suggests this ammo is +P which is why the hybrid cases are used. The cases cost about a dime each in bulk, so maybe no huge savings there.
       I didn’t find any bullet construction details but pics here look encouraging.

       • They’re also reloadable if you get the special dies.

   • I have 200g, .40 rounds, advertised at 1050 fps. I keep them for bear country. Also have .357 mag 200g rounds bought them in alaska.

4. “in standard FBI gel test conditions”……NOT.

   The FBI medium and conditions are wildly controlled and specific. This is just an attempt to spitball it. Not criticizing, just correcting.

5. Marketing hype aside, this ammo is truly amazing when paired with most suppressed 9mm PCCs.

   • Exactly what I was thinking but tbh, I’m acctually more interested in the case than the bullet cuz you can cast heavy bullets yourself all damn day, but that increased case capacity seems like the real big breakthrough for 9mm here. Any thoughts?

6. This review would have more credibility if it wasn’t written by a shill. I mean click his name and look at all of his glowing “best in class product” reviews of Sig offerings (of which there arw quite a few) where he never mentions any negative aspects, only how flawless and class leading they are.

   • TTAG has a storied history of SIG and FNH fanboi’ism. You must not remember the days of Leghorn’s competition sponsorships by said companies. It was appalling…

     • Considering the “storied history” of glock “fanboi’ism” where the “flawless” perfection of glocks must be canonized in any firearms publication, or suffer the apocalyptic fiery keyboard wraith of it’s glockbois.

       Any chance you two whiners fit that description?

       • I’m not a whiner, and I happen to like Sig better than
         Glock for the record. Infact, I’m a CZ fanboy. But I still wouldn’t want gun writers to give CZ impartial reviews and omit ANY criticism of the company’s products. Why are you a boot licking bitch that covers for gun writers who write fluff pieces instead of giving real reviews of gear? It’s almost as if they care more about money and free samples to any semblance of truth in regards to informing their readers in an impartial manner.

     • Nastiness of everyone here aside, I honestly thought ttag was more pro glock then anything. When the army adopted the Sig, TTAG and TFB both had an episode about it. Then when the drop firing issue happened, TTAG dedicated an article to bashing on a Sig with a hammer until it fired the round. Everyone said “well why don’t you try that with a Glock too?” TTAG refused and said “we’re not going to do that because we KNOW that a Glock won’t do that.”

       • +1

       • 19 gloeck reviews and counting. all so very different and unique.
         i’m thinkin’ one with finger grooves, one without, a single stack and a double should cover it. and maybe the longslide 10mm. five? no, twenty.
         i wish i had a rami, i’d submit a review… hint.

7. So … basically a light .45 ACP round in a 9mm casing.

   I am curious to see what they might do in .45 ACP or .357 SIG.

   • They have a .45 load coming or is already out, it’s a 325 grain bullet.

     I don’t see them doing more than 9mm and .45, maybe .38 and .357. Popular calibers like that. If they did anything in the .25, .32, .357 Sig then that ammo would probably cost $2/round due to the lack of demand.

8. It’s still just a 9mm. 900(fps) x 900 x 185(gr.) / 450,400 = 333ft/lbs of energy. 16″ of penetration is an improvement over most 9mm rounds, but I don’t see it having a significant advantage over the average 124gr. defense ammo. You’d be better off picking out something cheaper and dedicating a few more rounds for training with your defense ammo.

   • Winner.

     • One huge advantages is that it’s subsonic. Therefore it can be almost fully suppressed and it’s more accurate since it doesn’t cross the sound barrier. Also, because of it’s weight, it packs more energy than most other 9mm subsonic rounds.

9. One more “magic 9mm cartridge”. FBI Bait! Lol. I don’t really mind “be all you can be” endeavors pushing the envelope. Price tag is in the ball park of other “speciality” cartridges. No mention of projectile composition, is it just lead or is there actually a similar colored jacket? Low velocity may not need a jacket to hold it together during expansion.

10. I guess…I don’t really get “why”? Boo-lits moving at 38Special velocities with quite similar diameters?!? Someone will buy it…I’ll stick with 124grain.

11. Your first instinct was correct. Expensive gimmick.

    • As so many of them are…

12. Really enjoyed the review.

    Now…..need 9mm performance for .22LR. My little Neos feels so inferior when I go to the range. (I feel just fine, the Neos is a snowflake)

    Maybe Siesmic can do something with .32? Have my eye on a 1903 Colt hammerless.

    • Have you tried the 60gr .22LR’s from Aguila? They are pretty impressive for an LR… and they’re subsonic too!!

      • “Have you tried the 60gr .22LR’s from Aguila?”

        So far, Remington is the cheapest online at Lucky Gunner. Are the 60gr magnum rounds?

    • “Now…..need 9mm performance for .22LR. My little Neos feels so inferior when I go to the range.”

      Reload that .22lr and experiment with overpressure loads. (Make sure your insurance is paid up, and includes coverage for microsurgery on mangled hands from blown-up guns)…

      http://22lrreloader.com/design-details/

      Complete fingers with no scars are over-rated, anyways… 😉

      • “Complete fingers with no scars are over-rated, anyways…”

        Yeah. I hear ya’ there.

        My annual budget for firearm things is $500. Blowing up my plinker, and the microsurgery would be counted against future budgets. Gotta stay within Beretta warranty.

        • 500 a year? That .22lr reload kit is a100 bucks, right up your alley…

          • “500 a year? That .22lr reload kit is a100 bucks, right up your alley…”

            True. But blowing up the gun, and the ER bill after will mean no gun budget for how many years?

13. In the early 1930s the UK military adopted a 38 S&W round loaded with a 200 grain bullet, later replaced with a jacketed 178 grain bullet. In the US this was known as the police load. Nothing new at all.

14. This rings of “keeping up with the jones’s”…

    I carry Federal HST 165gr .45ACP, that not only outperforms this, but is far less expensive…

15. 9mm the little engine thatt could.

    • I thought you possums hated .22lr… 🙂

      • It’s the Ford F150 that gives them nightmares.

        • “It’s the Ford F150 that gives them nightmares.”

          Must be where Hendrix got the inspiration for “Crosstown Traffic” :

          “I’m not the only soul who’s accused of hit and run,
          Tire tracks all across your back, uh-huh, I can see you had your fun….”

    • rednecks with .22 LR’ driving f-150 Fords are on the sht list, yup.

      • Good thing I drive a Jeep then…

16. The 9mm cartridge is limited to maximum pressure allowed by SAAMI specifications. If a heaver bullet is used, cartridge pressure will limit its speed not case capacity. If there is some ‘magic’ involved with this new case that changes the laws of physics it would apply to standard weight 9mm bullets too.

    • Pressure is not independent of the case capacity.

17. FIRST – why the testing in BARE clear ballistic gel??? Adding the FBI spec cloth barriers is both relevant and easy.
    NEXT – when tests using the FBI protocol (including cloth barriers) the Federal HST 147gr +P load did 1008fps (326 fpe) with 19.2 inches penetration and .60″ expansion (average for 5 shots). This all per Lucky Gunner labs. Shot from S&W M&P 9c, 3.5″ barrel.
    FINALLY – The Federal stuff can be purchased for about $.40/round. Meanwhile, Seismic is $1.38/round!
    Put that in your smoke & pipe it.

    • “FIRST – why the testing in BARE clear ballistic gel???”

      The clear stuff can be re-melted and used again. The tan stuff is use once, and throw away before the stench of it rotting starts to bug you.

      And some folks (unlike you, apparently 🙂 ), aren’t made of money…

      • Read the rest of my statement with BARE being emphasized. My criticism was not directed toward CLEAR ballistic gel, but rather to leaving out a quite relevant item (cloth barrier). You will find NO reference to the tan colored ballistic gel in my comment.And NO, I am not rich, just smart. That is why I consult the “Lucky Gunner: lab tests. Quite professionally executed and free to anyone who looks for them.

        • “That is why I consult the “Lucky Gunner: lab tests.”

          LG test results had a few differences with STB410, a coupla years ago. Overall, I trust STB410 results. Wish he could do more frequent testing these days.

        • The LG tests are all with longer barreled pistols. The STB tests are only valid if you are using a pocket pistol although the 9mm rounds that work in a 3″ barrel are likely to work even better in a longer barrel and rounds that fail to perform will probably work in a 4″ or longer barrel.

          • “The LG tests are all with longer barreled pistols.”

            True. It might be considered “apples to oranges”, yet the testing results were not night and day different, only a few conflicts.

            Here is the chart I pay most attention to:
            “One shot stop percentage – number of incapacitations divided by the number of hits the person took. Like Marshall’s number, I only included hits to the torso or head in this number.”

            “- Percentage of people who were immediately stopped with one hit to the head or torso

            Here are the results:
            .25ACP
            # of people shot – 68
            # of hits – 150
            % of hits that were fatal – 25%
            Average number of rounds until incapacitation – 2.2
            % of people who were not incapacitated – 35%
            One-shot-stop % – 30%
            Accuracy (head and torso hits) – 62%
            % actually incapacitated by one shot (torso or head hit) – 49%

            .22 (short, long and long rifle)
            # of people shot – 154
            # of hits – 213
            % of hits that were fatal – 34%
            Average number of rounds until incapacitation – 1.38
            % of people who were not incapacitated – 31%
            One-shot-stop % – 31%
            Accuracy (head and torso hits) – 76%
            % actually incapacitated by one shot (torso or head hit) – 60%

            .32 (both .32 Long and .32 ACP)
            # of people shot – 25
            # of hits – 38
            % of hits that were fatal – 21%
            Average number of rounds until incapacitation – 1.52
            % of people who were not incapacitated – 40%
            One-shot-stop % – 40%
            Accuracy (head and torso hits) – 78%
            % actually incapacitated by one shot (torso or head hit) – 72%

            .380 ACP
            # of people shot – 85
            # of hits – 150
            % of hits that were fatal – 29%
            Average number of rounds until incapacitation – 1.76
            % of people who were not incapacitated – 16%
            One-shot-stop % – 44%
            Accuracy (head and torso hits) – 76%
            % actually incapacitated by one shot (torso or head hit) – 62%

            .38 Special
            # of people shot – 199
            # of hits – 373
            % of hits that were fatal – 29%
            Average number of rounds until incapacitation – 1.87
            % of people who were not incapacitated – 17%
            One-shot-stop % – 39%
            Accuracy (head and torso hits) – 76%
            % actually incapacitated by one shot (torso or head hit) – 55%

            9mm Luger
            # of people shot – 456
            # of hits – 1121
            % of hits that were fatal – 24%
            Average number of rounds until incapacitation – 2.45
            % of people who were not incapacitated – 13%
            One-shot-stop % – 34%
            Accuracy (head and torso hits) – 74%
            % actually incapacitated by one shot (torso or head hit) – 47%

            .357 (both magnum and Sig)
            # of people shot – 105
            # of hits – 179
            % of hits that were fatal – 34%
            Average number of rounds until incapacitation – 1.7
            % of people who were not incapacitated – 9%
            One-shot-stop % – 44%
            Accuracy (head and torso hits) – 81%
            % actually incapacitated by one shot (torso or head hit) – 61%

            .40 S&W
            # of people shot – 188
            # of hits – 443
            % of hits that were fatal – 25%
            Average number of rounds until incapacitation – 2.36
            % of people who were not incapacitated – 13%
            One-shot-stop % – 45%
            Accuracy (head and torso hits) – 76%
            % actually incapacitated by one shot (torso or head hit) – 52%

            .45 ACP
            # of people shot – 209
            # of hits – 436
            % of hits that were fatal – 29%
            Average number of rounds until incapacitation – 2.08
            % of people who were not incapacitated – 14%
            One-shot-stop % – 39%
            Accuracy (head and torso hits) – 85%
            % actually incapacitated by one shot (torso or head hit) – 51%

            .44 Magnum
            # of people shot – 24
            # of hits – 41
            % of hits that were fatal – 26%
            Average number of rounds until incapacitation – 1.71
            % of people who were not incapacitated – 13%
            One-shot-stop % – 59%
            Accuracy (head and torso hits) – 88%
            % actually incapacitated by one shot (torso or head hit) – 53%

            Rifle (all Centerfire)
            # of people shot – 126
            # of hits – 176
            % of hits that were fatal – 68%
            Average number of rounds until incapacitation – 1.4
            % of people who were not incapacitated – 9%
            One-shot-stop % – 58%
            Accuracy (head and torso hits) – 81%
            % actually incapacitated by one shot (torso or head hit) – 80%

            Shotgun (All, but 90% of results were 12 gauge)
            # of people shot – 146
            # of hits – 178
            % of hits that were fatal – 65%
            Average number of rounds until incapacitation – 1.22
            % of people who were not incapacitated – 12%
            One-shot-stop % – 58%
            Accuracy (head and torso hits) – 84%
            % actually incapacitated by one shot (torso or head hit) – 86%”

            https://www.buckeyefirearms.org/alternate-look-handgun-stopping-power

        • And what does this have to do with the relative reliability of LG and STB ballistic tests?

        • Marshall’s numbers are provably made up. Between different versions of the books, there were rounds that would have needed more than 100% one stop shots to account for the differences in number of shots and percentage of “one shot” stops.
          Even if the numbers weren’t picked from the air, the methodology is crap. Who is trained to fire once, wait and evaluate the results, and then fire again? All training I know of says to fire until the treat stops, and double taps are common. BTW, the Stassburg Goat Test is another fantasy.

        • This study says nothing about the kind of ammo was used. Most disciplined defenders employ a shoot-shoot-look approach. So on a two shot stop was it the first shot? The Second shot? Both?

      • An inaccurate test can be worse than no test at all.

18. The author did an excellent job. I understand what he wrote and his results were clear. Now, if only I liked 9mm.

19. A 9mm round at 45 Auto velocities is pointless. You might as well go with a .40 or .45. If you are concerned about capacity there are pistols chambered in 45 with magazine capacity ranging from 13-15 rounds. Given that 10 rounds probably covers the 3 sigma case in a citizen DGU the marginal effectiveness of going from 13 rounds .45 to 17 rounds of 9mm is insignificant.

    • Many of us have one or more 9mm pistols and don’t want or need a 40 or 45. This cartridge is a good way to go if you want the performance of a larger caliber but don’ want or can’t afford another handgun. I have 9mm in small, medium and 1911 size and I don’t want another gun.

      • One of the selling points of 9mm is cost of ammo. These rounds are almost $8-$10 per box more. What does this round do that the heavy weight 147g +P HST can’t at a lower cost? If caliber doesn’t matter increasing the mass of a 9mm by 35g shouldn’t matter either.

    • Find me a .45acp with 10 rounds at the size and weight of the P365 and maybe I’ll entertain that it’s “pointless.”

      • Seems that you didn’t read the entire article. It:s not particularly good out of a 3″ barrel. Some of us carry pistols that are bigger than a P365.

        Next.

20. $1.38 a round, no thanks, I’ll put 5 147 HP into the target for the same price.

21. Completely illegal in new jersey of course. They would label this bullet as a terrorist weapon of destruction.

22. Cool, although at that price it’s pretty much a non-starter for me. I believe in practicing with carry ammo as much as feasible and I think I’ll have to stick to a poor man’s hollowpoint box for that purpose.

23. I would really like to have seen you test this heavy weight ammo out of a ten and sixteen inch carbine with good melonite treated barrels. Melonited bores are smoother and slicker than most if from a quality manufacture, and tend allow for faster speeds, although not much but enough I’ve come to respect them tremendously for their bennifit. I’m also a big fan of shellshock s3 cases as they are deffantly ahead of the curve even with the extra expensive reloadind dies. They are cutting edge technology and are now being used to set the bar. For those who doubt this watch the video from Johnny’s reloading beanch using the S3 cases with extreamly insane velocities out of a glock as an experiment. It’ll give you insight as to the case’s strength and technology advancement edge.

24. More options isnt bad, i guess. Not my cup of tea though, 124gr Gold Dot or Fed HST are the bees knees, and have been for quite some time.

25. An ingenious solution to a non existent problem.

26. I can’t see changing from the 9mm Critical Defense or 124-gr JHPs I currently use for self-defense. I can see where this new exotic 185-grain 9mm ammo (if/when I can find any) might be a good choice to improve the performance of my 9mm KelTec Sub2K carbine (my car gun), but if I want a heavier bullet in a defensive handgun, I have .45 ACPs to use.

27. This is my second comment. After reading the others left I beleave one of the over looked aspects of this round is the fact it is a heavy weight in 9mm with out extream heavy recoil, and even though expensive, when it comes to self defense that really should not be a mitigating factor. And he stated this round was geared toward the carbine platform. It apears to be an improvement in a need for not carrying a larger caliber and allowing more to be carried in the magizine. Is there an absolute need for it. Mabey, maybey not. But in carbine use i beleave it is as it will defenatly add to it’s use for hunting. And if this loading is acepted in the firearms community it could lead to other bullet manufactures building some balistic tipped style rounds suitable for deer and hog hunting in this 9mm platform, not that there are many others already available in other calibers. But 9mm cabines are worthwhile and easy shooting for alot of people and applications. And most rounds in 9mm are not really sutible for hunting in cabines as they are really built for 3 and 4 inch shooters. More loadings are needed for carbine use especially for hunting use. This is an area overlooked by almost all the ammunition manufactures. And for those of us who load or reload our own, the real hunting projectiles really don’t exist in the 9mm world. Some work well like hornadys defense projectiles but are allready loaded in in their critical defense loads geared for short barrells not for 16 inch carbines. More choices are allways better.

    • Hope you learned to spell in the last 5 years.

28. Can’t help but wonder what would result from loading those projectiles in a 9×25 Dillon casing and firing from a 6″ barrel… May have to experiment with this someday.

29. Blah blah blah, if you don’t want it, don’t buy it, if you’re interested, try it out.

30. This bullet answers a question nobody asked.

31. Weirdly (tellingly?) there’s no mention of how high they hit the target, relative to normal weight bullets. Probably a good bit higher.

32. HOW ABOUT RELIABILITY. I have seen numerous brands of ammo that had either aluminum or steel cases jam in the chamber and they had to be pounded out especially when the barrel started to heat up. They tend to break extractors as well.

33. “The manufacturer told me that this ammo was designed with carbine-length barrels in mind” but you chose to not test in carbine-length barrel and thus your review has no teeth. SMH

34. Oh lookie, another attempt at getting 9mm stoping power performance on par with .40 S&W.

    So tired of all this!

    If you want or need more power, buy a more powerful gun.

    Compact 9mm carry guns are best served with high velocity light weight bullets. This is where they perform best.

    If in Bear Country, and you own a full size 9mm with 5″ barrel, these loads might offer some benefit, otherwise – why try to fix what ain’t broke?

    • you seem like you think you now everything about everything so idky i’m responding but to me the value of this option is that it’s a heavier version of a 147gr SUBSUBSONIC cartridge which is great for use with a suppressor. More energy, still subsonic. However, the author failed to test if it stays subsonic in a carbine length barrel. I have no interest interest in adding another caliber to my collection, but I am interested in expanding the versatility of the calibers I have.

35. At the end of the day, it’s still just a handgun round. You can roll around in the mud fighting over the most effective cartridge, meanwhile, long guns remain king.

    • Long guns are not maneuverable enough and therefore not king for an in home confrontation. Every type of gun is best suited for certain purposes, but not others.

36. SUB SONIC!!!!
    How is every one missing the point?
    This is a great SUB SONIC round.
    It is a niche cartridge. High capacity,suppressor ready,cross sectional density, etc.

37. I am ready for 95 gr .32 acp HP.

38. I saw an advertisement recently for this stuff showing that apparently they changed the label to say “For carbine use only”. I bought two boxes awhile ago with out that stipulation. Shot up one box in a SCCY CPX. Spent Shell Shock cases had a noticeable bulge in the unsupported chamber/feed ramp area.

    • I would not consider any ammo’s performance in a SCCY to be indicative of anything.

      • I shot the stuff out of a particular pistol and made a comment on my observation. Thank you for reminding me why I haven’t previously spent time sharing my comments on blogs followed by people like you.

        • Maybe try using something other than a POS gun and report back.

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