While Santa Fe County Sheriff’s Deputies have remained tight-lipped about their investigation of Alec Baldwin’s killing his director of photography and wounding his director on the set of the movie ‘Rust’ being filmed in New Mexico, the cast and crew have not. In fact, they’ve been sharing all manner of details about what took place on the set preceding the shooting.
Among those details: how the cast and crew used the same gun that Baldwin fired, killing Halyna Hutchins, for target practice off-set while the crew wasn’t working on the film.
From The New York Post:
The prop gun that killed cinematographer Halyna Hutchins on a New Mexico movie set had been used by crew members offsite for fun, a new report claims.
The gun, which was fired by Alec Baldwin on the set of the movie “Rust,” may have even been loaded with live rounds when it was used for what was essentially target practice, TMZ reported.
Multiple sources connected to the production of the film told TMZ that the gun was fired at off-the-clock gatherings – which could explain how a live round found its way into the gun’s chamber.
Another source who was on set told the outlet that when cops arrived they found live ammo and blank rounds stored in the same area, where the fatal mix-up could have occurred.
Having live rounds along with blanks on a movie set seems to be an obvious safety violation, a recipe for disaster. It’s something a careful and experienced armorer would never allow.
About that armorer, the Post is reporting she encountered more problems on another set:
The “inexperienced” armorer in charge of weapons on set of Alec Baldwin’s movie “Rust” had given a gun to an 11-year-old actress without checking properly for safety, a report said.
Hannah Gutierrez Reed, 24, daughter of prominent Hollywood armorer Thell Reed, was head armorer on set in Santa Fe where Baldwin fired a prop gun loaded with a live round, killing cinematographer Halyna Hutchins and wounding director Joel Souza.
Gutierrez-Reed’s alleged misstep happened on the set of the upcoming Nicholas Cage film, “The Old Way” and temporarily halted filming, sources told The Daily Beast.
“She was reloading the gun on the ground, where there were pebbles and stuff,” one source told the outlet. “We didn’t see her check it, we didn’t know if something got in the barrel or not.”
Gutierrez-Reed reportedly handed the gun to child actress Ryan Kiera Armstrong, forcing concerned crew members to intervene, the report said. The gun was then checked for barrel obstruction, according to the sources.
Baldwin, who was also the producer of the ‘Rust’ film, has reportedly cancelled his upcoming projects. That’s probably a smart move since he’s now facing both potential criminal and civil liability as a result of the shooting.
I wonder…are they trying to hang it around the neck of Gutierrez- Reed to deflect from Baldwin? Is she being incentivised to ” take one for the team or are they straight up shoving her under the bus?
IMHO, her negligence in this incident makes her responsible for what happened. If she had done her job right, this would not have happened.
That does not mean that Baldwin escapes any responsibility. As the one holding the gun, he is the one who broke at least 3 fundamental safety rules. He does not get to be negligent while relying on someone else to not be negligent. Also, as the producer, he was the one responsible for employing this young woman even after previous safety issues on that same set which she was responsible for.
In short, he does not get to evade his own responsibility because of her.
I agree. If you’re an armorer on a movie set you absolutely have to assume any actor is a complete idiot when it comes to guns. Of course that’s not an excuse for actors to be ignorant, but most of them are. And if he was directed to point the gun at a cameraman and pull the trigger, even if the gun was ‘cold’, that makes the director an idiot as well. Of course, hitting the range for some fun with a prop gun and mixing live ammo in with the blanks is beyond stupid.
Idiot or no idiot, armorer or no armorer it is your responsibility to verify the weapon you hold will do no harm. Idiot or no idiot you are adult enough to pick up a firearm and by doing so you assume responsibility.
Those in charge of production should have established strict firearm handling protocol. Never mind what the director said about a cold weapon. Alec Baldwin should have verified the firearm and ammo were harmless before pointing it towards a gullible woman who shares responsibility for taking on the role of a sitting duck.
I do not care if God Almighty racks the slide and squeezes the trigger to verify the firearm is empty and hands it to you. When a firearm touches your hands you keep it pointed in a safe direction and you verify it to be safe…Otherwise God will see you as a novice and an accident waiting to happen.
There’s no excuse for Baldwin other than that’s probably par for the course with 90% of actors. The armorer however has no business handling firearms for herself, let alone anyone else.
“There’s no excuse for Baldwin other than that’s probably par for the course with 90% of actors.”
It may be about to get a lot worse for Baldwin.
It’s being reported he was in a discussion about how the scene would be shot, and was demonstrating how he would perform the draw when the negligent discharge happened.
If true, his life is about to get more interesting…
On another site, someone posted the gun handling requirements for actors right out of their own actors rule book. Most of Coopers rules are restated in it, even if using non-functional firearms. Baldwin absolutely has ultimate responsibility.
The armor has some as well, but mostly, she should never work as an armorer again.
Baldwin was also the producer. Kind of puts him in charge.
I hope they make him as poor as me.
Exactly! He was apparently too busy or too important to take five seconds to open the loading gate and spin the cylinder to ensure there were no rounds, live or blank, present in the gun. That is the responsibility of anyone who picks up or is handed a firearm, regardless of what they are told at the time.
Actually, they were supposed to be shooting blanks, so a cursory of the back of the cartridge would have done nothing. Look down the front of the chambers, maybe.
Doesn’t matter, he was too lazy to read his own actors rule book, of which he violated pretty Much every rule. And yes, those rules apply to a-listers.
I remember a video when an extra mishandled a prop gun next to will smith. Search for the video, it was great.
So it wasn’t a prop gun. Alec should not have allowed a real gun of the same size and shape on his set as a real gun being used by the staff for target practice, he was in “charge”, right?
You are also assuming a young female armorer could really have stopped senior production crew from getting their way and playing with the guns. A more experienced and respected armorer may have been able to put their foot down.
I was an armorer for a Historical Outdoor Drama in Indiana. 17 cap and ball muskets, many pounds of pyrodex, but the worst injury on set was when one of the young idiot actors stuffed his pistol in the waistband of his trousers and then tripped.
His scorched pair of underwear that was cut off in the ER was nailed to the prop-room door.
The only musket ball that was ever on that set was used by me to demonstrate that the muskets were real to the cast and crew, and a TV news crew.
If you are the young female armorer who is disrespected and disobeyed by the senior production crew, you speak with the director. If that doesn’t work, you walk.
“…you speak with the director. If that doesn’t work, you walk.”
It was only her second time doing that job, perhaps she was more afraid of the peer pressure and her need to please if she ever expected to join the armorer community.
I have a suspicion this fuck-up will lead to permanent changes in how armorers function on-set, much like how the stunt community got their wake-up call as a result of the ‘Twilight Zone’ incident that killed Vic Morrow and 2 little kids.
At lest, we can hope… 🙁
There is plenty of negligence to go around. The apparent failure of the armorer was compounded by the actor not visually inspecting the firearm and the crew playing with it. This tragedy could have been avoided. My only hope is that it reinforces safe practices for everyone who handles firearms
Not just one idiot, but a whole crew of idiots with a “real” gun on a fantasy set!? Talk about a recipe for disaster!
From Hollyweird? Tell me it isn’t so.
You can’t make this level of stupidity up.
You don’t have to.
You would think someone would safe and clear the gun after their practice session but that must have felt too much like actual work and wasn’t cool.
I store most of my guns with a neon green Zip Tie in the chamber. The “head” sticking out of the port and the “tail” out the muzzle. Simple, cheap, and highly effective.
Apparently, the armorer’s father is also an armorer (Thell Reed) and trained her.
Kind of surprising he didn’t instill much gun safety in his own daughter…
That was my thought. Here he is, a very experienced movie set armorer and yet his 24 year old protege, his own daughter, has admitted acting as if she had never handled a firearm before. The two just do not compute to me. Had I trained the women she would not “have felt nervous putting blanks in the gun” which was a statement attributed to her in an on-line post she is supposed to have made.
“…his own daughter, has admitted acting as if she had never handled a firearm before.”
It’s plausible she wanted in that union so badly, she was desperate not to be seen to be seen as a ‘Safety Sally’ and not called anyone out on their safety violations…
They would have naturally thought of that if they were more like the people they’re always looking down on and falsely blaming for “gun” violence.
As producer Baldwin is still responsible!
Correct! As the producer, he is ultimately accountable for safety, though he may delegate it to someone else. As the one handling the gun, he was responsible and accountable for it discharging towards another human being. The buck stops with Baldwin, for sure.
What part of hiring an armorer that had trouble in the past and is not union is a good idea? What is an acceptable accident rate for help that doesn’t follow safety rules? She was hired because she would do what the producer said, no questions asked. Having checks and balances is what keeps us safe.
Baldwin is the ultimate one responsible, but just like all other rich insiders, he will get through this.
Any long time gun owner, who knows to check firearms after a range shoot, would do better as armorer than the person on set of that movie.
armorer that had trouble in the past and is not union is a good idea
Yes, sloppy work on another set SHOULD be a caution. Should have checked to see how that trouble happened, and what this amrourer has done to set things right aga, and guard against future “trouble”.
But what I don’t get is how being in a union affects anything? Has any unioni member ever gotten sloppy, irrespsonbile, careless, lazy? OH YES. “ve seen it myself. Being in a union does in no way exempt anyone from being the bove. The film ndustry is full of “good ol buy” ‘inside buddy good deal” stuf, and that’s fine. but that also tends to select folks because ow WHO they are, now what they KNOW and DO. It appears this mechainsm” waas operating on that set. The armourer DOES hold culpability. at NO TIME should any live rounds ever be in the same area s blanks/dummy rounds. And the armourer CERTAINY should have checked and safed that gun before putting it into Baldwin’s hand.. then HE should have done the same before pointing it at any person. BOTH should face conseqeunces for their careless, unpriffessinal actioni/inactions. Any director now retaing that armourer’s services whould have serious trouble finding the rest of his crew, willing to work on a set “guarded” by such a carelss person.
I have been around some union tradesmen in the past and they were idiots. All trades have idiots here and there, union or not. Look at the idiots on this movie set. These are the same ones that want to dictate what we can own, eat, drive, and our choice as to vaccinate or not. This 24 yr. old woman should not be thrown under the bus by herself.
“I have been around some union tradesmen in the past and they were idiots”
I 100% agree.
They are the bane of the nation, a relic from a bygone era. Unions instill laziness in what could be otherwise productive workers.
Unions are inherently corrupt and need to be dismantled for the good of this nation.
Speaking of unions walking off the job over “safety” concerns, one ugly possibility rears it’s head: What better way to illustrate how dangerous the set is, than to surreptitiously slip a live cartridge into one of the prop guns? Just sayin’.
“Baldwin is the ultimate one responsible, but just like all other rich insiders, he will get through this”
absolutely. look how many people tesla has killed and they’re still pumping out these overpriced car bombs.
“She was hired because she would do what the producer said, no questions asked.”
It’s more nuanced than that. Hollywood nepotism may be a factor. Her father is an ‘Old Hollywood’ armorer as well.
It may be saying something about her if he was union and couldn’t get his own kid a foot in door…
What type of firearm was used? I’m assuming it was a revolver?
I had read it was a period piece which I would assume is a single action revolver. Then again, Hollywood probably would have the Battle of Marathon fought with AR15s and AK47s for the “artistic license”.
https://amp.scmp.com/news/world/united-states-canada/article/3153407/alec-baldwin-film-set-shooting-what-are-prop-guns
Looks like a colt replica?
Never wanting a crisis to go to waste this moment will be used to mandate firearms training and a computerized federal list of all firearms interested ” current and future terrorists “. Good times, good times.
Mandated gun training for Leftist Scum like Hollywood is a good thing…
It seems like instead of a culture of safety, it was a culture of cavalierism.
As much as Hollywood rails against the NRA, the basic safety rules that the NRA promotes would have done well on the set of “Rust”.
“It seems like instead of a culture of safety, it was a culture of cavalierism.”
It was the arrogance of “I got this”…
What a bunch of idiots!
having a real gun on set being used a a “prop” is stupidly bad, but actually having live ammo present is just the ultimate in stupid.
This could be another case of Clinton’ body count:
https://conservativebrief.com/husband-of-woman-53243/?utm_source=CB&utm_medium=PP
Clickbait. I read the linked piece. I see NO reason to think that her death can in any way be linked to the deep doodoo her husband is in because he reportely lied to FBI to help lauhcn the “Russiagate” scandal that wasn’t. What gain would arkanciding his Wife provide? Unless she knows he was dirty and planned to help sink him? Far fetched….. but maybe plausible.
What does NOT fit this narrative is Baldwin’s apprently very genuine reaction/response to the incident. This is NOT typical of someone who is a hit man after making his mark.
Not a viable connexion.
Baldwin was used as a patsy who had impression the gun was not loaded with live ammo.
Guns don’t kill people. Alec Baldwin kills people.
with a gun.
i’m hearing better than a dozen union workers left the set, to be replaced by scabs.
new mexico taxes film sets heavily, timeliness matters.
Likely the union workers left the set, not because of unsafe conditions, but rather because on a low budget film, they were told they actually need to do some work.
That is what unions bring, ask me Miner49er all about crooked unions.
Most unions heads are secret millionaires from all the “kick-backs”.
“Likely the union workers left the set, not because of unsafe conditions, but rather because on a low budget film, they were told they actually need to do some work.”
Yep, Democrats *run* when comes to actually working for a living, they just want the free handouts from the wealthy…
“ask me Miner49er all about crooked unions“
Wait a minute, you’re posting under the ‘Miner49er’ name.
Oh, I get it, just more lies and deception by ‘Fake Miner49er’…
Just more bullshit by someone who is afraid to post under a reputable moniker.
I know Cecil Roberts, the President of the United Mine Workers of America, and he’s no millionaire.
And I advise you not to state lies about him in his presence, that old boy will jerk a knot in your ass lickety-split.
I got this twitch in my eye again and drool running from the corner of my mouth.
What the absolute F***!!!!
FACE PLAM!
Ok maybe I am the only one noticing this, but they keep using the term “prop” gun.
It was always my understand that a prop gun is a non functional firearm. Meaning there is a steel bar welded in the barrel preventing an actual round from being discharged through the barrel without destroying the gun. Also for semi automatic guns, and slide springs are usually much weaker since blanks just don’t have the kick and gas build up that live rounds do.
That means this person had real guns on set. Stop calling it a prop gun.
Next we have the gun being used for target practice.
Unless there was a very specific and required reason to have live rounds within a thousand miles of these “prop” guns, it should have never happened.
It sounds like the director or someone other than the principle armorer took the gun off a cart and handed it to Baldwin. This without ever clearing the weapon first, prior to do a scene walk through. Baldwin should have check the gun was clear after being handed the gun.
There should never be any mix up between live rounds and blanks. They look totally different.
This was the perfect storm of ideocracy, and carelessness that led to this tragedy.
Hollywood has no right to lecture us on guns. EVER!
I’ve heard the real guns and live ammo are used for sound sampling to be added in post-production.
“Stop calling it a prop gun.”
And stop calling it a ‘misfire’. A misfire is when the hammer (or striker) falls on a live round, and it fails to fire.
This was 1,000 percent negligence. Baldwin was demonstrating how he would perform the draw when it NEGLIGENTLY fired. Whoever handed him that gun while loudly announcing “Cold gun!” is gonna need a real good lawyer, because as it stands now, that’s 10 years in prison negligent…
10 years for someone like you or me. For Baldwin and his friends, a stern warning and statement of condemnation from the DA & judge is more realistic of what’s going to happen.
The maximum penalty for Involuntary Manslaughter in New Mexico is 18 months and $5k. It’s a 4th degree felony, which would prevent Baldwin from legally touching a gun again.
It seems to me that all guns used in movie sets are called “prop guns”, regardless whether they’re real guns that shoot real bullets, real guns that have been modified to shoot blanks, guns made to only shoot blanks, toy guns, … anything that looks like a gun. This doesn’t make sense to me.
Are there people on the set carrying guns that are not part of the movie production?
I think at this point the media keeps using “prop gun” to make it seem as though these are safe, as opposed to “normal guns” that everyone should keep trying regulate/outlaw because of how dangerous “normal guns” are.
Interesting that I’ve been carrying a real gun loaded with a live round in the chamber for many years and have never had a negligent discharge, or as Hollywood and the media call it a “misfire”.
if a harmless prop gun can cause death…
I do not like the way the media are deliberately misusing what are clearly defined terms.
A misfire is when a cartridge fails to fire after being struck.
What we have here is a negligent discharge caused by incompetence and carelessness.
Palms, meet face.
Here’s a video from a Propmaster detailing the standard safety procedure. If this had been followed, that girl would be alive today.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=TP1X5L-AufQ
The run a rod down the barrel of the gun to prove the barrel has no obstruction may have been a result of the Brandon Lee incident on the set of ‘The Crow’, when a projectile was stuck in the bore and later became a bullet in flight when a blank was fired…
Yeah, this is like that frighteningly bad cop shooting a week ago posted here where everybody from the caller/victim to the 911 dispatcher, to the trigger pumped Responding Os were culpable. I remember back in the ’70s-’80s when action filming expanded out of the super expensive California sets to other parts of the country to save money, they hired off-duty City cops as security to save the expense of a certified union security outfit or whatever their unions had then. We were mainly there for theft, perimeter crowd control, and traffic management but almost every filming session I was on I had to tell somebody in production that they were fucking up with their weapons applications and might get hurt. Weapons seemed to be part of the general prop departments and after doing it for awhile I took it upon myself to check all their inventory ammo guns and knives between takes. Found a couple ‘fake swords’ that could probably kill someone and never found any live rounds but a few ‘blanks’ raised my eyebrows..especially the shot guns with wads that could intentionally could break windows, but were not supposed to be lethal and “besides”, one nitwit once told me. “Nobody’s going to be standing there right behind the glass where it’s hitting?”
I’m surprised this doesn’t happen more often. The only way to get pretty high failsafe percentages in the future is pretty simple, especially for a movie company. Have a spare dedicated small personal camera that can[t be erased except by management that is required to be used anytime and EVERYTIME the actors are getting set up for an action scene involving weapons especially guns to record the hand-over inspection transfer of the weapons. With anybody failing to comply automatically fined, and/or fired. Cost is basically nothing but a couple of extra minutes of time since the whole game of everybody there is knowing how to use cameras and having them readily available to use. So several people can pe trained and ‘available’ if needed so there can’t be any excuses. (‘readily’ however, might still have to ‘defined’ by the Fte for firearms action filming use)
Watch Hollywood Weapons on Youtube. Most of what you need to know is there…
remember after a night shoot that I did an AR-15 turned up missing….wonder what happened to it….
Here’s the problem… the IATSE is a ultra-liberal union that poo poos guns and anyone who enjoys them. I should know, I was a member for over 10 years. Nepotism is RAMPANT, and in reading the first paragraph of the first article I read in this I KNEW how this “armoror” got her job. I’ll say it was a safe bet that there were people on the camera crew that walked that had WAY more “firearms expertise” than this girl did.
I actually watched a props “armoror” leave prop pistols unattended at a Broadway show…it took a total of 30 seconds before all the liberal anti gun zealots were pointing them at each other like 5 year olds. Meanwhile, a .22lr round was found on the floor of a venue I worked in and I was dragged into the office WITH my union steward and outright accused of carrying a pistol into the ‘gun free zone’ and if I admitted to it now I MIGHT keep my job. After a five minute anti-gun-in-workplace dressing down the only “smart” bean counter in the room deduced that IF I WAS indeed carrying a pistol the bullet would be MUCH larger. After warnings that they were “going to check cameras” etc I never heard another word about it.
Fast forward 7 weeks to 09/11/01..two days later we had our first show post 9/11 and the very people who threatened and ridiculed me were now openly asking and hoping that I brought at least one gun to work with me…some asking me if I had any extras for sale!
Was the 22lr mine? Nope. That means at least 2 of us were packing..
Did I have one that day, you bet your ass. Did I admit to it…of course not. As soon as the hysteria died down that would have been used against me FOR SURE!
The IATSE does SO many things that are unsafe during a production its mind boggling. Nevermind EVERYONE sometimes 100+ people driving home exhausted after a 18 hour day to get 4-5 hours of sleep and go do it all over again…and drive home. I knew SO many people who had fallen asleep driving home from a gig it was ridiculous. Between dealing with egomaniacs who demand their entire 55ft trailer be dumped to get to their wardrobe for a 10 minute interview and never changing (J-Lo) to being told after breaking your ass all day to not look the talent directly in the eyes (Jon Bon Jovi) to don’t look at the artist at all (Jon mellencamp) or watching touring personnel eating good catering while you get handed a box with a scrubway sandwich and a Coke. (Don’t like turkey, too bad…oh and there’s no time for you to leave and eat…you eat that or nothing). It USED to be a good gig 25 years ago…now….
There are very, very few OLD stagehands.
“..IATSE is a ultra-liberal union (where) Nepotism is RAMPANT..”
Exactly because the are so corrupt.
This where all unions will eventually end up.
Fake Miner49er, stop lying.
The more relevant part of this post is:
“The IATSE does SO many things that are unsafe during a production its mind boggling. Nevermind EVERYONE sometimes 100 people driving home exhausted after a 18 hour day to get 4-5 hours of sleep and go do it all over again… “
Here’s a past union member stating publicly that union members are hard workers, “18 hour days”.
Yes, you bet production workers are forced to work long days in unsafe conditions, if they want to keep their job and feed their families.
What he doesn’t point out in his post is that the actual promoters and producers of these events are the multi millionaires, the elite 1% who put profits over people.
My 38 spl blanks and those loaded with flat 148 gr wad cutters look identical unless you look at the neck from the top. If I recall, SNL did a piece about Cheney when he had his hunting accident. Wonder if they’ll do the same for Alec aka “Colt” Baldwin.
Someone hands you a gun and says it’s ok, or you pick it up from a “safe” zone. You really know nothing about guns and generally hate those that do. You rail against gun owners. You do not have the common sense to question the safety of the gun in your hand, and do not know how to check it yourself. Sorry I don’t feel sorry you. You are part of the problem.
Catboss………As you and i know as well as the others commenting on this preventible homicide, ALL GUNS ARE LOADED. Until proven otherwise, they are loaded. Upon verification that they are unloaded, they are still not a toy. As we all know, even when “safe”, you never point it at anyone. Only self-rightous, pompos asses that will not listen to the “unwashed masses” about anything have the right to own a gun. Idiots are gonna do what idiots do. In this case someone died. End of rant.
The #AlecForPrison hastag seems to be trending
Legally the armorer has no responsibility for the ND. Its all on Baldwin. That she should never work in that field again is a no brainer, but there is no legal liability on her part.
Andrew Branca, pre-eminent gun lawyer has a great piece detailing the legal implications of this.
Besides managing the guns, the armorer is responsible for establishing rules, training the actors and crew, and making sure the rules are enforced. A really incompetent armorer might have neglected to instruct the actors in proper gun handling, which might remove the criminal liability from Baldwin. However, Baldwin has also been in many productions, and he has probably gotten gun training before. As a producer involved in hiring, he’d still be civilly liable for hiring an incompetent armorer.
https://lawofselfdefense.com/if-alec-baldwin-is-charged-i-believe-hes-likely-to-be-convicted/
Readers need to be careful about the distraction of what the armorer did or did not do as it sounds like they are looking at someone to blame other than Baldwin who was the Producer and essentially responsible for everything going on in this production. The user of the firearm (Baldwin) was the person ultimately responsible for the safe use of that firearm. The first rule of gun safety is for the shooter to make certain that the firearm they are going to use is in the condition necessary to do that safely. If someone hands you a gun and says it is ok to use, it is still your responsibility to check it out and make sure that is true. You do not take someone else’s word for it particularly if all this other nonsense is going on. Baldwin should be guilty of negligent homicide.
alec baldwin is still here? wasn’t he threatening president trump or something like that? can’t recall all these communists anymore, they all run together after a while.
I recall something like he was gonna move to Canada if Trump won back in 2016. He must have just gotten back to party with the left…
Movie stars get a lot of attention.
People get shot everyday.
I bet someone got shot in Afghanistan just now.
This is why the Progressives hate guns – they know, perhaps subconsciously, that they are morons (they are correct) and they don’t trust themselves. In their obnoxious stupidity they include everyone else as well – a common projection.
Most if not all these (non)liberals have grown up with socialist indoctrination drilled into their pea brain. The only experience they have with firearms is the negative use by criminals shown on the news. The same criminals that they insist shouldn’t be jailed or prosecuted. warped thinking from warped minds. They are convinced that the firearm contains evil , not the individual. If they hear about Cain killing Able, they will say he used a 9 mm.
Hire a dumbass 24-year-old Instagram thot, get dumbass results.
1880’s
Single action with no swing out cylinder to examine every chamber. After target shooting, someone didn’t spin through every chamber and examine the load slot as they went by.
My first wheel gun was/is a Ruger Single Six. I habituated myself to spin it three times around to be sure.
One thing that hasn’t been brought up. I can just see our anti-2nd Amendment toadies starting to shriek: Look how dangerous guns are. It (a gun) caused 1 death and 1 serious wound. Their not even safe to handle on a movie set!!
BTW there’s an interesting article about the “professional” armorer:
https://nypost.com/2021/10/25/rookie-armorer-on-baldwin-set-said-she-loves-to-show-how-safe-guns-are/ Actually kinda horrifying to read. Didn’t know how to insert hypertext web address.
Only way to prevent a tragedy like this in the future is to ban hollywood from having firearms. No more action movies, cop shows, cowboy movies.
Hollywood can bring back the musical. I’m sure they’d make just as much money that way as the other. Right?
“Hollywood can bring back the musical.”
They already did, the ‘ABBA’ movie ‘Mama Mia’…
The chain of control over that gun ends at Baldwin but this does not reduce the responsibility of the armorer or the assistant director. Each has 100% responsibility for their failures and in the death of one person and wounding of another.
Baldwin, accepting a gun without visually inspecting the ammunition in it. Then pointing the gun at another human being with no means of shielding, and instead of at a predetermined safe aiming point.
The assistant director for calling out “Cold Gun”. Obviously, it was a very hot weapon, indicating that the required visual inspection was not performed.
The armorer for having real ammunition on not only the set but mixed in with guns that would be used on the set. And then for also failing to verify the loading of the gun.
All three people, at a minimum, each has 100% responsibility for the death and injury that resulted.
So that’s 300%? How’s that work?
Easy, consider how most jurisdictions look at criminal charges for multiple members of a criminal team committing a crime. Each is equally responsible for all injuries, deaths and damages of the crime. Even if one bad guy kills the bank guard, the get-away driver can be charged with the murder even though he never entered the bank and the cops killed the the bad guy who pulled the trigger.
I fully realize it may not play out that way in this case. No one set out to commit a crime here, there was no intent. Only negligence and incompetence. Possibly civil cases will divide the financial responsibility among the chain of control of the gun and the various corporate entities involved.
However all that plays out the critical point for POTG is that absolute responsibility always falls to the person holding the gun when it goes bang. Make all the arguments you care to, but that is the cold hard harsh reality. Your hands, your trigger finger, your fault if you shoot someone or damage something.
End of story.
For all the criticism of unions- these things dont happen on Hollywood. They occur where the crew runs to make a cheaper movie without union wages. I have worked in industrial security which isnt really dealing with bad guys- just access control- but a lot of safety is involved in this title.
I dont know much, just have a degree in Criminal Justice, long time cop
First yep someone did not do their job and someone was killed. So- armorer or propmaster could be charged with negligent homicide. As for Baldwin- maybe. It he was part of the pathetic safety measures on the set- maybe, and probably.
The safety measures were not up to what was used in cowboy movies in the 1950s!
Folks fired away from the other guy, not right at him, so blank paper did not hit their eyes.
We dont have details yet. As for the young armorer- she wasnt serious about her job from what I have seen. Lots of 24 year old cops, soldiers, gunsmiths, are deadly serious. I asked my own daughter if she would have made this mistake at say ten years old. She is 25 and said hell no. But one armorer is never enough, she should have had a crew, at one or two helping her. Just my two cents but we really dont know anything yet.
“these things don’t happen in Hollywood “. Brandon Lee would probably say different if he were still alive.
While the armorer will likely never work in that field again and may lose everything in wrongful death suit, Baldwin is still responsible for negligent homicide. The facts cannot be disputed there. He should have checked the gun’s condition. He should not have pointed it at another person. He should not have had the SA hammer pulled back during blocking or at any time when someone was muzzled.
He should see prison time and huge punitive penalties from the wrongful death at his hands.
It wasn’t a prop gun as you insinuated in the column. Facts cried the liberal if I could speak them I’d be a conservative.
All things used on a set are props regardless of their capacity to perform other functions.
Exactly.
The term “prop” is short for PROPERTY.
These “prop” items are owned or leased by the Studio, and almost always have “prop. of (Studio Name)” clearly marked on them. The word property is almost always shortened to “prop” in the marking of these Studio owned items.
Ex; A lamp marked “prop. of (Studio Name)” will usually be fully functional.
The “prop” terminology does NOT mean the lamp is non-functional.
100% fact. In NO way does “prop” define something as non-functional.
This is what happens when you mix guns with leftards. A monkey would be safer with a gun than these fools. Baldwin will absolutely go to prison and maybe a couple other crew members too…
Lot of verbage, but all that needs to be said is……idiots+firearms=tragedy!!
As far as I’m concerned, at least four people share the responsibility for this Negligent Homicide. Baldwin, Reed, the Assistant Director (I didn’t catch his name in the article), and whomever was in charge of monitoring Set Safety. I don’t know if there’s any licensure or certifications Reed must have to be an Armorer, if there is, those should be revoked immediately. On top of facing Negligent Homicide charges, she should never work in the industry again, that’s how poor her judgement is, I don’t care who her father is. The fact that she had previously showed her inability to follow the most basic rules of Gun Safety, is proof this young lady is a phuck up, period.
The Assistant Director is also responsible, who broke protocol, and has a history of breaking protocol should also never work in the industry again.
Baldwin also bears full responsibility for failure to follow protocols, and because as Executive Producer, he failed to insure Safety Protocols were set up and followed.
The individual(s) responsible for Set Safety, also bear responsibility. In light that several incidents of Negligent Behaviors occurred prior to the tragedy, production should have been shut down, and only resumed when the protocols were established and strictly followed. Obviously, that didn’t occur.
This is a Tragedy that could have been avoided. The amount of Negligent Behavior exhibited by the main individuals involved is criminal.
Baldwin will suffer a financial loss, which he can well absorb. He will not be subject to meaningful criminal prosecution.
He will next go on a crusade about gun safety – something along the lines of how if even “he” in a well controlled environment could accidentally kill someone with a gun, then “common” citizens out in the real world should never be allowed near one of these killing machines. That will be his pathway back into a-list mainstream jobs.
So much talk!
Alec Baldwin’s self-centered arrogance killed a person he was aiming at with a real firearm.
He pointed a sidearm DIRECTLY at a PERSON.
He knew MUCH better.
Armorer allegedly “put the guns in a box for actors to pick up themselves”, so the Chain Of Custody was broken. Hand-to-hand, or NO DEAL.
In California the NRA used to send some poor guy to the elementary schools to sweat in an Eddie Eagle costume and teach CHILDREN good gun Safety. Women Against Gun Violence, Sierra Clubbers, etc. claimed this poor guy was glorifying guns and axe’d him.
Hollywood, on the other hand, teaches “Point, Shoot, This Fixes Your Problem”. THAT’S TRAINING!
As 100% of school kids need and DESERVE gun safety instruction, 100% of the cast and crew should have had the schooling. Every single one would have the knowledge and authority to stop this killing.
Negligent homicide – In over 40 years of acting and bashing the 2A community Mr Baldwin apparently never learned that firearms safety is a real thing. Trying to deflect blame on someone else is just wrong. We all know you always treat firearms as if they are loaded. We all know you never point a firearm at anything you are not willing to destroy. We all know you keep your finger off the trigger until you are on target and ready to fire. We all know to check your target, what is between you and your target and what is beyond your target. Baldwin failed in every respect, and killed someone as a result. The problem was not that someone “gave him a live gun” the problem was that he had no idea what to do with (any) gun.
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