https://youtu.be/9SOX7Z4lkRE
“Appearing on ABC’s This Week, the NRA’s top lobbyist slapped down presumptive GOP presidential nominee Donald Trump for saying club goers should carry guns to prevent another tragedy like the one that took 49 lives in Orlando last Sunday,” rawstory.com reports. “Chris Cox, the executive director of the NRA Institute for Legislative Action, said Trump’s suggestion is both dangerous and against the law. ‘No one thinks that people should go into a nightclub drinking and carrying firearms,’ Cox explained. ‘That defies common sense. That also defies the law. That’s not what we’re talking about here.'”
And there I was thinking that the NRA was all about individual armed citizens carrying responsibly, without preemptive government infringement on their right to keep and bear arms. I mean, isn’t it up to the individual carrying a firearm to drink responsibly — or not drink at all — when carrying in a nightclub? As gun owners do in states where it’s perfectly legal to drink and carry as long as you are not impaired.
Equally, Trump didn’t say people should carry in clubs and drink to the point of impairment. In fact, he didn’t say anything about drinking. Sounds to me that Mr. Cox is bending over backwards to appease firearms fence straddlers. Which may be sound politics but sounds horrible to those who see “gun free zones” as an affront to common sense. Or, if you prefer, a mass shooting waiting to happen.
As for Cox’s explanation of the NRA’s position on the “No-Fly, No-Buy” proposal — prohibiting Americans on the FBI’s secret, unaccountable Terrorist Watch List from purchasing firearms for 72 hours — it’s as clear as mud.
I think the NRA wants the FBI to arrest people on the Terrorist Watch List when they try to buy a gun, within 72 hours of the purchase request, so they won’t buy a gun after the 72 hours and proceed to do something horrible with it. Unless the FBI doesn’t arrest them because the Bureau doesn’t have enough evidence to do so. At which point the person on the Fibbies top-secret potential enemies list can buy a gun.
Which kinda makes the whole “No-Fly, No-Buy” law sound like a firearms purchase “cooling off period” for suspected terrorists. Who could be anyone, really. As the interviewer points out, in reality, the NRA’s 72-hour delay “compromise” is completely unworkable. In fact, it would tip-off terrorists that they’re on the Watch List and, perhaps, trigger an attack.
And if something is unworkable for the government, imagine how unworkable it would be for an individual citizen wrongfully denied their gun rights. Probably just as unworkable as it is for someone wrongly placed on the No-Fly list, condemned by no less than the ACLU for pissing on Americans’ right to due process.
Oh, and one more thing. If Uncle Sam gets into the business of preventing suspected terrorists from purchasing a new gun because they might use it to commit an atrocity, why wouldn’t he take away guns already in the suspected terrorists’ possession? Answer: he would. As they lottery people like to say, it could be you! How great is that?
We all know guns and alcohol don’t mix…unless you are on your farm with some four wheelers, dirt bikes etc….and some tannerite for good measure.
Just joking people.
But, the designated driver should certainly be packing heat…triple D if you will… designated driver and defender.
Around the first Saturday of september, I have been know to open carry a 12 gauge, drive my 4 wheeler, and shoot dove, all while drinking. with other people too. gasp. If we old country boys out here can manage to do that and not shoot each other, perhaps others in a night club can do the same. Or perhaps not. Maybe we rednecks are more even tempered and measured in our actions than your average night club attendee.
“Maybe we rednecks are more even tempered and measured in our actions than your average night club attendee.”
Well, I don’t know about any particular demographic. I know that I am more even tempered and measured in my actions when I have had a chance to drink something nice (whether that is lemonade, beer, or a cocktail), walk or ride around on a bike or ATV, and do some shooting. That is good medicine for the sole.
Yep, riding on the ATV sure keeps the pressure off the bunions. ?
Doh! Should be good medicine for the soul.
+The courts look upon this is an alcohol rather than a gun control issue. They have held that states can regulate activities where alcoholic beverages are sold. For example nude dancing has been held to be protected free speech, except states can prohibit complete nude dancing in clubs that sell alcohol. They can also require that purchased alcohol be consumed on premise. When it comes to firearms, states are allowed to prohibit firearms in a club where alcohol is sold. For example, it’s a felony offense to carry in a such a club even with a valid CHL. Again, it’s all seen as a valid regulation of the sale of alcohol.
Lew says,
Categorical restrictions on alcohol consumption and possessing firearms overlook two important facts:
(1) There is a GINORMOUS range of “impairment” that can result in any given person and in any given circumstance, not to mention across all people. A “large” person who has a one or two drinks daily and consumes one drink AFTER a hearty meal will be absolutely, totally unimpaired, versus a “small” person who rarely drinks and has one drink on an empty stomach. Thus, restrictions based on quantity of consumption are wildly ineffective in their goal of only preventing seriously impaired people from being armed.
(2) An “impaired” person could very well handle a firearm responsibly and effectively. To ban everyone from possessing firearms because some might not be able to handle them responsibly is wrong.
NRA’s gearing up to stab us in the back again. They’re going to put their weight behind “no fly, no buy” then pretend to be surprised in ten years when the extra-judicial watch lists are being expanded purely to deny rights to Americans whose ideas are politically inconvenient.
It’s good for business. People were making too much progress educating others as to the utility and wisdom of the real individual right to keep and bear arms. The NRA doesn’t want to kill the cash cow.
Shame on TTAG. The NRA did NOT slam Trump. I am not a fan of either the NRA nor Trump, but a false headline is worthy of the NYT or Mother Jones. I expect better. In fact, the NRA-ILA guy pretty much agreed with Trump 100%. Again, shame shame.
I’d like to see TTAG’s response to this. Hopefully they don’t just ignore it.
And because I rarely post anything to get their attention, I’d also like to see them fix the mobile version of their website.
Thats what I got out of it also. The headline is misguiding. I will not stick around long if this is the direction TTAG is heading.
Bogus headline crap. The NRA did no such slam. I dislike it when the liberal press spews garbage headlines everyday but I really hate it when the folks we are used to trusting pour on the bullshit. Well live and learn, I guess TTAG is just another bloviator for profit.
The liberal press makes a living and poisons a country by headlines and chevrons. How many people in the comments here have “slammed” the NRA based on the headline. Clearly, most have not watched the interview of Cox. However, they read the headline and believe it to be true and commend accordingly (and erroneously). That is what is so shameful about TTAG in this case. If I can’t believe them about something so basic about the truth, can I really believe them about their review of the new Sig Sauer KGX4000? I already don’t believe them about their pocket dump of the day – but I accepted those as satire.
TTAG – you owe us all an apology and a desire to do better on a go-forward basis.
It won’t be ten years I say less than 4.
Remember: The NRA endorsed the NFA, the GCA and wrote the LEOPA. They were never on your side.
Join the Gun Owners of America. Their endorsements may be shit (my mail ignoring, illegal supporting congressman who refuses to co-sponser the hearing protection act is NOT fit to be senator. He’s not pro second amendment. Same from Cruz) but their actual actions are perfect.
Explain “same from Cruz.”
The NRA, if I didn’t have to be a member of the NRA to be a member at the local range I wouldn’t. My membership is good until September 2017 and I still get membership renewal notices at least monthly. Please send us your money so we can barter away your rights. F ’em.
Perhaps you should lobby your club to allow members to choose which pro-gun rights organization(s) to belong to. As long as you belong to one.
A lot of the NRA membership requirement for clubs is due to them being insured by the NRA and that is a requirement of the insurance.
Same here. I could paper the walls of a bathroom with the “please send us more money” mail I get from them. We have to belong but the NRA gives us no monetary or political support.
People should not drink and carry, much less shoot guns.
Ok, fine. But that’s not the same as saying guns should never be brought into places where people drink. It’s the no gun zones that have to be stopped, no gun zones do not stop people from getting shot. Obviously.
Trump seems to be getting an awful lot of stuff right.
Shame on the NRA.
But someone can go and drink a beer or two and then get in a 2 ton vehicle to drive home, but they can’t carry a gun??? I drink an adult beverage or two most nights and don’t start looking down the barrel of my gun or shooting random things in my house…
Don’t all of the beer ads end with drink responsibly and have a designated driver? Couldn’t this designated driver also be the designated carrier? Or how about this: we assume people are responsible enough to not over consume and drive a vehicle, yes I know it happens, but then we assume they are not responsible enough to consume any amount and handle a firearm. I must be a liberty absolutist, because I blame people for the consequences of their choices, not the objects they use while choosing.
This doesn’t smell right. After years of political diatribes against gun grabbers and democrats, why are Chris Cox and Wayne LaPierre now causing conflict with the only presumptive candidate that seems to support gun rights?
Perhaps it’s the same thought that the cancer medical industry will not let cancer be cured. If you’re livelihood depends on a boogeyman, wouldn’t you not want the boogeyman to be defeated?
Did Bloomberg just make a multimillion dollar contribution to the NRA?
Cox contradicts himself by saying someone with a gun could have done something, but no one there should carry a gun.
I just rewatched. Chris Cox talks about *drinking* and carrying firearms, even though the interviewer didn’t mention the drinking part. I think this is reasonable.
TTAG: you might want to make the title a little less click-baity and more representative of Cox’s stated position.
Done.
At the bare minimum, designated drivers should be allowed to carry.
What a conundrum. Guns and alcohol don’t mix. It’s one of the obvious gun rules right after the main 4.
It’s no conundrum for thinking adults.
Fine. Mixing alcohol and guns is a bad idea. So. Let’s ban alcohol. Can’t nothing go wrong with that, right?
Lol already been tried by the 18th amendment. Repealed by the 21st amendment just 14 years later.
At least they learned lessons “quicker” back then.
yup.
Ah the right, so good at eating their own. If this was a dem organization and a dem said something they didn’t like, they would still circle the wagons around them and fight at all costs to potent that person. It shows you how excited the Republican party is to elect Hillary!
Bull manure headline. Cox did not “slam” The Orange One in the slightest. He said you should not be drinking and carrying, partly because it is against the law. (That depends on where you live, by the way. Some states allow it, although I am not a lawyer and this is not legal advice.)
In the case of the Pulse massacre, I believe that Florida law forbids carrying in a bar, whether the carrier is drinking or not. If I understand the after-action reports I have read, even the armed security guy started the fight outside the club due to this law, at least until shots were fired. (Please correct me if I am mistaken about this.)
Just look thru the annals of history. No one outfit that is supposedly pro gun/2A has written/pushed more gun control than the NRA. Gun control justifies their very existence. Don’t be lazy. Seek the information yourself because I’m entirely too lazy right now to post links. 2 efin times a month I get reminders to send more money. Even right after I last renewed. Went with GOA instead as well as Rhode Island 2nd Amendment Coalition.
Some states already allow CCW in bars/clubs. Not everyone goes clubbing to drink alcohol. The Pulse was a soft target.
Dropped my NRA membership several years ago for a number of reasons.
Blow it out of your ass, NRA. I wish you would start supporting the individual RIGHT to keep and bear arms for a change. Then again, if you were sucessful at defending the RIGHT, y’all would be out of jobs and miss out on all that money. Worse than “prosperity” television preachers!
It’s a pattern now that whatever Sean Hannity says during the week, Trump repeats to the news outlets on the weekends as a Trump idea..
NRA should know that their membership is not going to put up with allowing unaccountable government bureaucrats to put people on secret enemy lists to deny them their 2nd Amendment guaranteed rights. Support that and it will cost them, if it passes and becomes law, it will cost them more.
So the second one has a sip of wine, beer, etc, he forfeits his 2A self defensive rights? Pop the top on that beer and it’s melee weapons, a 911 pleading, or fists to defend yourself against a potentially well armed assailant?
I can’t square this concept either.
Hmm I saw and heard a lot more badgering from the interviewer than NRA slamming Trump, just sayin.
The Donald doesn’t drink and says he carries. He probably can’t fathom someone drinking while carrying! FL law needs to be updated to allow carry in establishments as long as you don’t drink. Wisconsin has this provision and there have been zero problems (and believe me there are a lot of bars!). As far as taking guns away from those already possessing them if they go on the “list”, that would not be possible as we do not have national gun registration (yet). Be vigilant – this may be the real kicker.
We can’t let the NRA sell us out like this! They can’t be allowed to do this again, like the 1968 GCA and the Brady Bill! They are our best line of defense, and if they don’t protect us, no one will.
Keep them accountable, and let them know what you think.
It is ALREADY illegal to carry while drunk. If you go to a bar and don’t drink, you should be allowed to carry a gun. In any case, if they don’t see it, feel it, or hear it, how will they know you have it?
“I mean, isn’t it up to the individual carrying a firearm to drink responsibly — or not drink at all — when carrying in a nightclub?”
GOOD LORD…I ACTUALLY AGREE WITH FARAGO!
This sounds like they got into a point where their messaging is off base because it was suddenly put out. If they can’t get the right message out in a concise manner maybe they shouldn’t be speaking right after an event like this despite people’s urge for them to. Then again with the liberal media the way it is they could probably say anything and get thrashed on.
Call the N.R.A. Chris Cox office or Wayne ” La PUE ” – NO MORE COMPROMISE … !! Make it clear their existence and SALARY , depends on not giving an INCH. WHY must gun owners always give up Freedoms ? The anti-gunners NEVER give up anything …….. I will not renew NRA membership. — N.R.A. Does NOT control MY Rights or those of 150 Million other Gun Owners. —- N.R.A. has become a $$ money $$ racket. Now they want your old cars too.
Call NRA – 703-267-1141
Call Senators – 202-225-3121 ……… No More Gun Laws + Secure The BORDER you morons !!
Amendments to bills # HR 2578 and SA 4685 , are VERY DANGEROUS. FineSwine wants a watch list for 5 years if you are EVER on ANY other ‘ List ‘ …… pound sand bitch.
Newsflash: the NRA isn’t perfect. Neither is TTAG. I make mistakes, too. Call and email the NRA and help make them better and comment on TTAG for the same purpose.
I do drink and carry. A single beer or scotch won’t make me DUI or make me negligently discharge or brandish like an idiot. That’s an important point because driving is more dangerous than shooting.
Editor’s note: two strong rum and cokes, two 12 oz Coors lights, and two tequila shots in the span of one hour put me at a .07% BAC on a calibrated Intoximeters Inc Alco- sensor IV. That’s after waiting 15 minutes to mitigate the effects of mouth alcohol. The sample was two automatic traps of deep lung air. The pas measures to three decimal places past the zero but I don’t recall the rest of the measurement.
I did another sample after two 24 oz Coronas and part of a weak mixed drink in the span of almost 4 hours. That returned .0% BAC.
A single strong mixed drink on a empty stomach can actually make someone DUI – if they are built like an anorexic ballerina. Otherwise a solidly built guy needs to drink a fair amount of booze just to hit a .08 BAC. Also a healthy liver will metabolize about .02 BAC an hour depending upon a host of metabolic factors.
Ya’ know I was going to say pretty much the same thing Accur81. We’d be screwed big time without the NRA. Does anyone REALLY think the NRA should mandate drinking and guns? They are the big dog and everyone else gets very little press(or pull)…oh happy Father’s day Accur!
I also carry when I drink. The club where I shoot has both ranges and a bar. If I’m going there to shoot I will shoot first then drink, it makes sense to do this not only for safety, but also my scores. I don’t have a problem with carrying in the bar though. I don’t expect trouble, and don’t get any either. It’s not the type of place that tolerates assholes, and I expect half the people in there are also carrying concealed. I feel very safe there. I never drink to the point of being out of control, and I don’t have the type of personality that becomes belligerent when drinking. If you know you behave belligerently when drinking then yes, do us all a favor and not drink while carrying, better yet just stay home. But this is and should be a personal decision, made by people taking personal responsibility. No law is going to change that. If you can’t handle the responsibility, then you shouldn’t be drinking, or for that matter carrying in the first place.
Suggesting that no one in that club could be capable to carry a firearm also suggests they all would have left too intoxicated to drive.
The NRA ist Luke Warm on Second Adment in History not more !
They increase significant but not enough in my view !
Carrying while drunk is illegal in my State, probably most others. My best advice is to go the the NRA headquarters, and see what kind of cars get special parking spots… bet they cost allot of money, money people sent to cover the 2nds Six. Money not well spent.
Having a drink in a club while carrying is # 1 , a personal responsibility and # 2 it is a Distraction from the real issue of Bullsh*t Stasi ” watch ” lists where we have the ‘ opportunity ‘ to prove our innocence at our own cost if put on said list , 100 % unacceptable. It’s Communist , in fact.
New Jersey was first like so MANY bad laws. See CT Daily Mirror , 12-11-15 .
http://ctmirror.org/2015/12/11/n-j-already-using-u-s-watch-lists-to-screen-gun-buyers/
Fun fact: you can be in a bar without drinking.
I’ve done it, more than once.
Screw the nra. In Utah you can carry in a bar no problem. The designated driver gets to have one beer and he carries. You can legally have alcohol but you cannot be intoxicated. I can have a beer and defend myself if I have to because Merica. Piss off tyrants.
+ 1 in PA
“…Pennsylvania law does not prohibit an individual from carrying a firearm in a bar or establishment which sells liquor for consumption on the premises. In fact, in Pennsylvania it is not even illegal to drink alcohol while lawfully carrying a firearm. …Many states, even those with minimal gun control laws, prohibit carrying firearms in bars, restaurants which serve alcohol, or at the very least, prohibit those who are carrying from drinking alcohol themselves. Not so in Pennsylvania. However, as we said earlier, just because something is legal, doesn’t automatically make it a good idea. Penn LAGOs are encouraged to exercise extreme caution and be responsible with your firearm around alcohol”
Very true! When going out to a restaurant, I prefer to drive over the state line into Pennsylvania, carry, and enjoy a glass of wine with dinner. Absolutely legal there and not a damn thing wrong with it. One glass is not gong to get my 6’2″ 220 pound frame the least bit smashed or crazy. There is no reason that I should become a victim (of a criminal OR of a police arrest) walking out to may car afterwards.
Forget Watch Lists. Just add a line to the Form 4473 “Have you ever been a terrorist or are planning to be one?” or maybe “How do you like your bacon? – ( )Crispy ( )Tender ( )Forbidden to Eat It.”.
For those purchasing an AR-15, require them to cook and prepare the bacon “Cruz Crispy” http://www.ijreview.com/2015/08/383020-making-machine-gun-bacon-with-ted-cruz/
Fuck the NRA. They’re only in it for $
Oye Veh yet again. Who ever said a thing about drinking and carrying?? Not the Trump nor I who has done both but never at the same time.
Sometimes I wish I could get my Life time membership $$$$ back. What a jackass thing for Cox to say or even bring up.
Can I fire him???
So sick and tired of straw man arguing. Stop it NRA. Being tooled up in a club doesn’t mean being tuned up. Ever hear of being the designated carrier? Sheesh. Even Trump knows that.
When people go out drinking they need a designated driver, unless they Uber. I think people who go out in a group with a DD should also have that same person be a designated concealed carrier.
Chris Cox clears up the media distortion of the NRA’s positions as well as Trump’s.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=kflzQnLC6EE
As does Wayne LaPierre.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=8H6e8ZOHRw4
Who can use the nuclear football when Barry has a drink? Surely he is stripped of the authority to call for a nuclear strike whenever he is around alcohol, right?
And they are worried about my lil firearm… Sheesh!
It’s all bullshit designed to disarm you in any way that they can, folks.
Here is a test to try. Can a person who has had 4 drinks shoot better that a New York cop and his 12 pound trigger pull. Just a thought.
Alcohol and guns dont mix. To be fair, excessive alcohol and guns dont mix. Then again, NOTHING and excessive alcohol mix.
That said, i’d be real damn pissed if the last thought in my head, before Mateen put bullets through it, was, “Damn, I sure wish I’d decided to say screw that dumb law and brought my snubnose .357 with me tonight.”
Use of a illegal gun while intoxicated should be a ‘sentence enhancer’ to an person authorized to carry concealed, NOT a automatic suspension of the right to carry and invalidation of the license.
….just say’n
“Use of a illegal gun while intoxicated should be a ‘sentence enhancer’ to an person authorized to carry concealed, NOT a automatic suspension of the right to carry and invalidation of the license.”
WTH? Are you completely ignoring the RIGHT to keep and bear arms? This permission slip stuff is killing the exercise of the right. THIS type of thinking destroys the exercise of any right. Please consider it as a right of which the exercise should be approached with care by government rather than permission begged from your “betters.” If a government is going to limit exercise of a natural right, it ought to approach it very carefully and beg us for the permission to do so; not the other way around. If someone isn’t going to be able to exercise the right to keep and bear arms, they better be in custody. Anything less is begging for tyranny.
Can America ever be free again with this type of thinking permeating even groups that portend to support individual liberty? I think not!
A great many “assumptions” are ( IMO) being “concealed carried” with this “prohibition” . Because one chooses to attend an event where alcohol is being served is not “defacto evidence” one is drinking alcohol so the NRA is already on soft ground with its declaration. OTOH, Mr.Trump merely iterated an emotional response many americans could identify with. Maybe Wayne should pay far more attention to those paying his (inflated) salary than his own ego !
In Ohio, you’re able to carry in a liquor establishment as long as your not drinking. It’s a felony if you do get caught drinking while armed. This only makes sense, since most responsible people have a DD, why not have a designated defender. It seems like common sense to me.
Posturing politician is posturing politically. Same old same old.
If there is one good thing I had to pick out about the Trump candidacy, it’s how just his very presence highlights who the pinheads in the room are and where their allegiances lay. Paul Ryan, a seemlingly inoffensive vice presidential candidate before has been shown to be a full on party hypocrite. Now we have an NRA spokesman taking a comment that any normally sane person would consider innocuous completely out of context because of party loyalties and the mention of the word “Trump”.
Yes, Cris, I’m sure he completely meant that people should get blasted and carry firearms in a bar. Come on. What are you, four years old? What’s even more amazing is who the hell though somebody would have to defend Trump against the NRA on something like this? Head = ‘splode.
Wow. Just watched the video and in no way took away the impression that the NRA was slamming Trump or changing their position. Click bait at it’s finest TTAG….worked too..
Just lost a fair amount of respect for TTAG’s credibility (particularly with the BS clickbait title), and also for a lot of its readership. If I see much more of this, this will be the group I say goodbye to.
Comments are closed.