The Internet’s alight with the story of a California man found Beethovening (a.k.a., decomposing) in a car outside his Pacific Palisades home. “The man had more than 1,200 firearms and two tons of ammunition stashed in his home and garage,” dailymail.co.uk reports. “Many of the guns had never been fired and some still had their price tags attached.” Needless to say, the media trotted-out the A-word: LA police discover arsenal of 1,200 guns in dead man’s home. Nope. It was a collection.”Police have found no evidence the man, who has not been identified, was involved in criminal activity.” But that hasn’t stopped both the cops and the press from getting their collective proverbial knickers in a twist . . .

Detectives want to find out why he had so many guns and are examining the weapons to determine if they have been linked to any crime.

Cdr Smith continued: ‘We have a lot of work to do. Running the background, history and legality of these weapons is going to require a tremendous amount of time.

(courtesy dailymail.co.uk)

‘It’s not a crime to have a large number of weapons so long as they were legal to own and legally obtained. We want to make sure that’s the case.’

Nice of the cops to throw the firearms in a huge pile dontchathink? What’s going to happen to them now? More indignity, I’m sure. Anyway, I chose the U.K.’s Daily Mail for my source in a search for the most and best anti-gun comments. Found one!

Jesperado Terrifyingly, the U.S. is still living in this bizarre wild wild west mentality, much to the horror of us sensible ones. Never, absolutely ever, should it be legal for a person to obtain & hoard 1,200 guns & 2 tons of ammo!!! England, will you have me? Please get me out of this madhouse!!!

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110 COMMENTS

  1. And yet it would appear that not a single one of those 1,200 firearms was the weapon in an assault or murder. Huh.

    • Oh sure, they will check these weapons for criminal activity but if these guns were turned in for Best Buy gift cards …….

      • My thought also. You run the serial number of a u fired gun still in its original box instead of a pistol obtained through a “buy back” event. Odds are much better the later was used in a crime or is stolen.

  2. If you left them tagged in their boxes there would be no excuse for an incorrect inventory. This is just the cops covering up their cherry picking of this guy’s hoard. No way to tell what’s gone missing in all that mess. If this guy has any heirs they just lost a whole bunch of money.

    • This is just the cops covering up their cherry picking of this guy’s hoard.

      Yep, I’d bet on it.

      • Just for the sake of argument, let’s suppose that all the guns and ammo were moved to a secure police locker and then properly inventoried. Now, under that assumption, why would the police fail to secure the site, allowing only a limited number of specifically-identified officers to collect and tag the guns and ammo under a limited set of details? E.g., get a couple-thousand serial-numbered tags and tag each gun and each pallet of ammo. We have 123 rifles, 234 shotguns, 456 handguns. One pallet of 45 cases said-to-contain 5.56 ammo; . . .

        Once such a control inventory is completed, a larger number of officers under close supervision could load the cache into trucks which would be sealed until they arrived at the police locker. Working from the initial inventory they could identify that tag # 1 is a Colt Revolver Model Super-Shooter Serial 123456; if any gun disappeared they would know this absolutely and that it was a rifle/shotgun/handgun.

        What did the police actually do to inventory the cache? Nothing? Why should we believe, then, that the officers on-site didn’t pick-through the inventory looking for trophies? If the police won’t document the guns they come into possession of why should we submit to National Registration? Because they are “Only-Ones” while we are mere subjects?

        • Bingo.

          Guns for me, not for thee. Guaranteed that these guys are pawing through his hoard and plucking out all the choice bits.

    • A friends father was a high ranking officer in the local, major city PD when he retired. Never purchased a gun in his life beyond his duty weapon but ended up with over 20, mostly rather nice handguns when he retired. You do the math.

      Cherry picking is a thing, it was more common back in the 70’s and 80’s but it still happens. If this guy has no heirs, who is going to say if he had 400 handguns, or 367?

  3. Oh jeez, no laws broken but let’s make him look like a criminal just because he owned guns, I’m glad this is America and not the Soviet Union where even things that were legal got you thrown in the gulag…

    Oh wait. Nice to see the KGB is alive and well in the LAPD.

    • Even if they do, the dings, dents and scratches will reduce the overall value.

      Not to mention the outright breakage … I see at least one nice big scope in the pile’o’rifles. Modern optics are robust, but I don’t think being tossed randomly into a pile is something most non-mil-spec manufacturers assume will happen.

  5. ‘It’s not a crime to have a large number of weapons so long as they were legal to own and legally obtained. We want to make sure that’s the case.’

    Otherwise they’ll charge the dead man.

    • Rather let’s say they ‘find’ one gun in the pile that just happens to have some criminal element associated with it.

      They would then use that to ‘seize’ the entire lot as part of a criminal enterprise. Win!

      • you already know thats done and done. his heirs will never see any of those guns. cops will have some nice ones though

  7. I would like to make a suggestion . If someone can obtain this information and publish it here on TTAG I’m sure there would be a large viewership here on TTAG . Find out what ‘ Make and Caliber ‘ of guns this guy collected . I would love to know what every gun was , a complete list of all 1200 . I may be the only one that would like to see this but I suspect I’m not . This guy probably had some real nice stuff . I’m curious .

      • That’s not fair , I’m busy . QUIT ! Mom , make him stop . He’s looking at me . I’m telling .
        Hey NSA …… How’s the weather there in Utah ?

        • “Hey NSA …… How’s the weather there in Utah ?”

          What do you think, smartass?

          It’s Utah. In July.

          Yeah, it’s hot.

        • OOPS ! Sorry Mr. Smith , I don’t really follow the weather patterns there in the great state of Utah , I hope I didn’t offend you . I was only trying to be polite , sir . I was truly concerned for your comfort . I am ignorant and silly but you probably already know all that . Please don’t be angry with me , I love all you guys .

          I thought there were like 30 thousand air conditioners in that place . See , I told you , I’m a dumbass .

  8. Under what statute, I wonder, did the police come in and do … that … to the collection? Or did the relatives agree to it? (Assuming of course the guy didn’t leave them like that himself, in which case I’d call it a hoard, not a collection.)

    • Under what statute, I wonder, did the police come in and do … that … to the collection?

      Law enforcement has done worse. There was a collector here in Michigan who had all of his guns taken (unlawfully) by law enforcement. As I understand it most were valuable antiques as that is what he collected. When he got them returned to him, someone from the ATF or Michigan State Police had taken an engraving tool and etched serial numbers on all the old, original guns, thereby destroying their original value!

    • They found a dead guy parked out front, cause of death unknown, so they went in to investigate. apparently this guy claimed all kinds of things about being a secretive operative (highly unlikely), and he was probably a hoarder with a lot of money, given the amount of unfired ammo and number of unfired guns. According to one neighbor, the boxes of ammo were stacked up behind his garage eight feet high!

      • secretive operative (highly unlikely),

        Like the CIA is going to admit it. ‘Cmon, man!

        • “…we can neither confirm nor deny that /X/ was ever in our employ…”
          So the Free(?) Press can print whatever they want and the Gestapo can paint the deceased with the most vile brush their PR Dept can think of to present him in the worst light possible with no fear of being corrected. Thereby further villianizing gun owners in the minds of the Subjects of Kalifornia, Comrade!
          As an aside; Excellent idea to start a Kickstarter to buy Jesperado a bus ticket to his Workers (Paki) Paradise across the pond!

      • If I had a crazy neighbor like the one they interviewed I would avoid him too. The news crew must have been “fist bumping” over finding a crazy guy to slander the neighbor on camera, a neighbor they appeared to not ever talked to.

      • So, IOW, what we have here is a stark raving madman, crazy enough to think he’s a secret agent, in possession of more guns and ammo than some national armies. Yet he somehow manages to live his life and die entirely peacefully, without harming a soul….. If that’s not a slamdunk argument against “background checks” and “psychiatric evaluations” and whatever other nonsense the well indoctrinated progressive dimwits likes hiding behind, I don’t know what is.

  9. Nothing wrong so far. Better to own 1200 guns and be a saint, than to own just 1 gun and be a criminal.

  10. “England, will you have me?”

    Likely not, Kickstarter fund or no.

    Most countries are pretty selective about which emigrants they will accept, except as required by treaty (e.g. politically oppressed classes). Unless you’re rich, or have a highly valuable skill, you’re probably out of luck, “Jesperado.”

    But by all means, please try. Besides, who knows, England might just recognize “gunpression” as a valid reason for emigration. Nice if we could trade them one-for-one for Brits who want to have their firearms (and other) freedoms.

    • I bet the 1,200 figure is already the revised downward figure. Reminds me of Mel Brooks announcing the Fifteen..er…Ten Commandments.

  14. Yeah, I’m sure they have probable cause to check all of the serial numbers, because guns!

  16. No doubt the remaining low value arms will be publicly shredded so as to give a false sense of security to the community that the LAPD took 1200 guns off the streets, you can breath easy now CA, feel free to walk around at night.
    Like watching a pile of classic cars get crushed.
    They make them every day, guns will be replaced, the classics will be lost.

    • I have ZERO doubt that if they all turn up clean (now a somewhat reduced number due to spoilage) that some Calif. politician will go ballistic and try to stop such a large sum of death machines being released back into the hands of his heirs.

      1200 (ooops, uh, 937) let loose back into the wild! Unthinkable!

      /Kevin De Leon (etc.)

  18. How many guns puts you over the “Kook Threshold” in order to receive decent local news coverage? I might be slackin’ off.

      • Depends. In California, New York, Massachusetts, a half dozen guns are an arsenal and the sign of mental illness.

        In Alabama, Texas, Arizona the owner of 1200 guns would be described as “that lucky bastard.”

  19. I don’t know why anyone has a problem with an old guy having a large quantity of guns. He only has (had) two hands.

  20. Time line.
    Call to police, There’s 3000 guns and 4 tons of ammo at this house.

    Responding officers, There’s 2000 guns and 3 tons of ammo at this house.

    Media, There’s 1200 guns and 2 tons of ammo at this house.

    Official police report, There were 600 guns and a ton of ammo at that house.

      • Ammo is still more expensive than it was.
        This is the age of Gunbroker dot com.
        ‘We were mistaken in our original estimate; most of the ammunition recovered were either blanks or so corroded that the bomb squad was called in to detonate it in place…’

  21. The LA Times comments were pretty out there as well. A drinking game based on the word “Ammosexual” would have killed you.

  22. Man, if I was an heir, I would have a lawyer there and be all over those Cops about destroying my inheritance. There’s some nice stuff in that pile. I think I see a couple/few pre-lock SW’s, some potentially expensive 1911’s, I even see my Ruger Mk II Target Competition Model Slabside over there just getting banged around. UGH, you bastards, have some respect for people’s property!

  23. Damn, that’s a lot of bang.

    A few random thoughts.

    1200 guns is too many guns. Not because they’re guns, but because 1200 of anything is probably too many. I’m a musician, and if I had 1200 violins, that would be too many violins. This is just my personal opinion, though, and if some dude thinks 1200 is the right amount of guns, God bless.

    As far as the police taking the guns, once the media picked up the story it had to happen. Advertising 1200 guns and tons of ammo in a dead guy’s house is an invitation to theft. Sadly, as many have already written, the man’s heirs (if any, see below) probably won’t get 1200 guns back.

    This story keeps getting weirder. Apparently, this dude told people he worked for some covert-ops-ish agency, and his girlfriend- who was with him when he died- didn’t tell anyone because she assumed the agency was tracking him and would take care of it. AFAIK, they still haven’t positively identified the man, so if there are any heirs, they may not know yet. See this story: http://www.latimes.com/local/lanow/la-me-ln-lapd-guns-20150720-story.html

    • Yeah, if I had 1200 guns, I’d be looking to pare that collection down to maybe my 80 or 90 favorite. Not gonna ever say nobody needs that many guns, but yikes. Sell some of those and start collecting swords or something.

      Now that may change if some were truly collectible, but if they were, they aren’t now after being unceremoniously tossed in a pile and mishandled by police.

    • “I’m a musician, and if I had 1200 violins, that would be too many violins.”

      If you were a rocker and had that many guitars, you’d just be ‘Cool’…

  24. These are Police Officers, right? The ones that have firearms assigned to them by their armories. That they have to take care of and return in the same condition as when they were assigned. People that should know better than to just throw a bunch of guns into a pile on a tarp like that. So what the hell, guys… why are you just tossing all those guns onto a tarp like that? Have a care once in a while. You could at least lay them out sort of neatly in rows or something.

    • “These are Police Officers, right?”

      Yup. As in tax feeders. Happily enforcing whatever nonsense the kleptocrats currently deems beneficial to call laws. IOW, not someone one should reasonably expect much in the way of anything positive from. I have no doubt there are good ones out there, but no less doubt that those decent ones are being ruthlessly squeezed out by others less so, and hence more fitting of government employ.

  25. Curious under what legal authority the cops seized these guns. Last I heard, the 4th Amendment required probable cause that a crime was committed or that the items were contraband in order for the government to seize property. The photo shows a bunch of revolvers, semi-autos, bolt rifles, and one M1A, none of which are contraband even in the People’s Republic of California. The guy was found dead outside his home, not in it where the guns were, and the story doesn’t cite any concern he was murdered with a gun. So long as the property remained secured inside the house, I believe the cops should have left it there for this man’s lawful heirs. The government’s mere curiosity as to whether a gun they encounter is “linked to a crime” is insufficient to justify the seizure of that gun. I question whether the rights of this man’s heirs were violated not only by the reckless handling of the deceased man’s valuable property but by the seizure itself.

    • Apparently, the man’s identity is proving a little tricky to verify.

      You’d think they’d easily be able to do that with his multitude of commiefornia weapon registration forms but I dunno.

    • It is Calif…. I assume that some random ‘in the name of public safety’ pretty much covers:

      Seizing guns
      Killing your dog
      Beating you half to death on the roadside
      Inserting plunger handles in your rectum

      You know, those little deaths of liberty that no one should worry about…

      /sarcasm

  27. So, in Cali., ‘It’s not a crime to have a large number of weapons so long as…YOU DON’T DIE IN YOUR DRIVEWAY. THEN THEY’RE OURS.”

    • I think had the LAPD known the man had 1200 firearms he would have gotten a visit and his collection taken anyway.

      Let’s be honest, he must have been mentally defective to have such a large number of guns and it would have been in the name of public safety. For the children, you know.

      /sarcasm

  28. “We don’t think the weapons are illegal. We are taking them for public safety,” said Sgt. David Craig of the LAPD’s gang and narcotics division. He said investigators removed the weapons to ensure the ammunition and guns wouldn’t be stolen from the home.

  29. Better safe than sorry. You never know how many armed robberies and other crimes of violence are committed with guns that still have factory tags hanging from the trigger guards.

    • On the street, a crime committed using a gun with the tag still on it is referred to as a “Minnie Pearl”.

  30. When Jay Leno dies, are they going to throw 100 cars and 100 motorcycles in a big pile in front of his house?

  31. I’ve worked with the folks in the Public Administrator’s office in a populous county in the Southwest. While I am certain there are differences in law, it is normal to collect the belongings of the deceased where no heirs can be identified, and there is a theft risk. (Don’t flame yet!)

    That said, there is NO CALL to damage the decedent’s property by chucking all of the guns in a large pile. The PA’s office here would have logged the items and had them safely and securely stored until the decedent’s heirs were found (assuming he had such). I’ve personally seen a (much smaller) collection of guns turned over to heirs once they were finally identified.

    The LAPD had no call to treat the decedent’s property in this manner and any damage caused by the rough handling of the property should be paid out by the department (but that will never happen).

    • I agree, except I’d like to see any damage paid for by the individual officers responsible. I know that’s even less likely than the department paying out for damage, but there’s no reason the taxpayers should have to foot the bill for cops being disrespectful assholes.

  32. ”Police have found no evidence the man, who has not been identified, was involved in criminal activity.” But that hasn’t stopped both the cops and the press from getting their collective proverbial knickers in a twist . . .

    ”Police have found no evidence the man, who has not been identified, was involved in criminal activity.” But that hasn’t stopped the cops from trying to STEAL legally acquire all his assets for their monetary/ budgetary gain.

    Fixed that for you.

    Detectives want to find out why he had so many guns and are examining the weapons to determine if they have been linked to any crime.

    You better fvcking believe it. They want to exercise their ability of “asset forfeiture” granted to them. They want to steal his stuff and they are going to keep looking until they find the smallest law broken to make that happen. He’s dead – and they want his money. As simple as that.

    ‘It’s not a crime to have a large number of weapons so long as they were legal to own and legally obtained. We want to make sure that’s the case.’

    That’s bullsh!t. The guy is already dead. A conviction is impossible. They need to find a way to tie his “collection” to a crime – particularly a drug crime, so they can STEAL take his stuff, sell some of them, keep some of them, use the money to buy a new cappuccino machine in the police break room, new gear, new equipment, and larger budget injection. They do not want to provide those firearms to the man’s living heirs. They want to take it!

    Those are not cheap guns – they are expensive. Those firearms are very valuable. I saw what looked like a Barrett 50 cal. M14s, glocks. His collection and ammunition are likely valued near a million dollars or more, and police want it!

    • And anything that CA would define as an assault weapon had to have been registered at the date specified in the law– or they’re gone. Not sure if standard capacity magazines are transferable. Registered ‘assault weapons’ as defined by the law can be inherited, but, there are four choices
      – Destroy them
      – Turn them into an FFL
      – Take them out of state
      – File for a permit. Which is a may issue kind of thing requiring listing intended use of the weapon etc.(…. and directed at machine guns not assault weapons, but it’s the process directed to be used to inherit AWs and keep them in the state. It includes annual inspection of storage as well as the weapons themselves by the state Doj. Which doesn’t make sense since there are no such requirements for folks who registered AWs on time ).

  33. Geeesus guys – did you have to beat them all to shit like that??? Let me guess – because California, right?

  34. The difference between an arsenal and collection? It depends on how many and when the firearms were used at least once.

  35. You’re only allowed to have 1200 of something if they’re cats. And 51% of them need to be alive.

  36. First, what is the legality with regards to inspecting this personal property? If they can do this without a warrant doesn’t that mean they can rifle through any property of a deceased person looking for a crime that may have been committed? Upon death this should belong to the heir of the estate and just like money or jewelry, should not have to be proven legitimate before possession is taken by the beneficiary.

    • Very good question. Deliberate destruction of the value of seized guns, even if known to be recovered stolen property, is almost as much fun as punching a handcuffed suspect. And done as often.

    • Interesting question, but I’m no lawyer. This started with them finding the dead man, so what was their justification for entering his home? I’m assuming trying to find contact information or evidence regarding his death if they deemed it suspicious. Why did that grow into them seizing property from the dwelling? Are they citing just the number of weapons as being reasonable grounds for suspicion? Would the same thing have applied for other collectibles– art, coins, stamps etc. Would they seize those and then investigate whether they’re stolen. OR— claim they were associated with drug crime, in which case they seize, sell and don’t even have to charge anyone with anything.

      If I were the next of kin, that’s what I would be worried about, a police claim that these were associated with drug activity. Then the kin have a much harder time trying to get the property back.

    • Could be that the proper authority over the estate is not immediately apparent.

      Obviously, if a man dies leaving a widow or a son the police are in a position to ask about the decedent’s heirs and lawyer. Is there a will? Who is the executor? Who has custody of the property (e.g., surviving relative, room-mate, etc.)

      In the absence of an immediate answer – e.g., within a few hours – then there is a reasonable excuse for NOT seeking authorization to search the house.

      Now, then, we wouldn’t accept the police randomly picking a house and searching it after there was no answer to a knock on the door. But, this isn’t the case here. There is a body in a car. No autopsy yet; but a body is a body and sitting in an unattended car is probable cause to inquire into the matter.

      Once you determine that the deceased is the owner of some piece of property, then there is an obvious question as to whether that property is secure. Are the doors locked? Are the premises vulnerable to burglary? Is there a pot boiling on the stove? A pet or vulnerable person in the house?

      Reason would lean heavily to enter and secure the house; I suspect the law would support such reasoning.

      Our point, here, ought to be generalized. Whenever the government seizes property it assumes a duty of stewardship to care for that property. Would a “reasonable man” have collected these guns and dumped them in a pile? I think not. Yet, this point would be equally applicable to a person’s china collection.

      Imagine, for example, if the deceased were a dog breeder. Reason compels that the police would enter upon the deceased’s kennels. Now, then, what duty would the State impose upon it’s police employees in such a case? Would the police be empowered to shoot the dogs in their kennels? Could they release the dogs from their kennels in order to set-up the pretext to shoot them for their own protection?

      Alternatively, would the State’s laws impose a duty upon the police to call animal control agents to take custody of the dogs until an executor of the estate could be identified? Admittedly, it’s not far-fetched to imagine that animal control agents might wind up euthanizing many or all the dogs absent any more viable alternative disposition. Even so, it ought to be a duty of the State – and its employees – to preserve property to the extent feasible. Allowing the police to shoot the dogs for their own amusement violates this common-sense conclusion.

      We are far more likely to get a State legislature to pass appropriate legislation (to protect the property of its citizens upon seizure by State agents) if we use an illustration of – e.g., dogs – vs. a less sympathetic object – guns.

  38. This was an illegal gun grab by the police, as the deceased hadn’t, or was suspected of, committing a crime. The premises should have been secured until next of kin could be notified. I think when this is all over, it will be found that the guy used to own a gun store. Regardless of that, the Constitution was not respected this day.

  40. If we’re lucky, these guns will end up on a police auction block, and many people may be able to get a good deal on a decent firearm. Most of them appear good, and there are some interesting choices there.

    Too bad it’s Cali, and there’s an equally good chance they’ll be destroyed.

    • Lol. Vulture much? What pisses me off about this story is this guy most likely had heirs to give those too and the police just came and snatched $1million+ of their inheritance for no reason at all.

  41. What a bunch of assholes. They should have secured the house and let the descendants take care of the collection that’s worth in excess of $1million. There was no reason to believe the guns were used in a crime and so seizing them was unconstitutional.

  42. I hope the estate sues LAPD for negligently tossing around the private property and scuffing up the value of the assets. For no reason.

  45. God damn. 1200 guns? I’d cap it off at around ten. One semi auto mag fed rifle, one semi auto full size handgun, a pump action 12 gauge, a 10/22, a bolt action rifle, one concealed carry hand gun, a 357 magnum revolver, one lever gun, a high quality 1911,and finally a m1 garand. That would cover all my bases. But 1200!? Damn…

    • Sounds like you haven’t capped yours off yet . It will be a nice one when or if you do . The semi auto mag fed , as you put it , has so many choices in caliber and design . I would go with a mini 14 or mini 30 but since you are limiting yourself from the get go I would chose one that accepts standard AR magazines , a Bushmaster would be a pretty good choice . Your bolt could be a Mossberg MVP since it accepts standard AR magazines and is a nice shooter , I’m not sure what you meant by a full size hand gun , Ruger , S & W and Glock all make fine reliable pistols and if you like a 1911 , well , go shoot some . Benallie makes the finest shot guns but Mossberg is a lot of bang for the buck . I would also consider getting a 20 gauge , semi auto . You can’t go wrong with 10/22 . Your conceal carry should be light and have maximum capacity , any thing between a 22 magnum PMR 30 to a S & W XD 40 . Ruger makes a very nice .357 revolver for the money , Lever ( Henry ) ??? . Your 1911 choices are beyond comment and finally , The M 1 , go get a BAR in 30.06 and never look back .
      We gun people also have to consider supplying our friends , families and neighbors , that don’t have the resources , sense or fortitude to be acquiring guns and ammo now . If SHTF , the people who think we are all a bunch of stupid fear spreading retards , will be needing us later or at least they will need some of the fire power we’ve acquired . You can sell it , loan it , trade it or give it . We are our brothers keepers .

      • Well so far I have four. I’ve got a VEPR Kalashnikov in 308.Was also my first gun ever bought. Might not of been the best choice but I was new to the gun thing. Next I’ve got a Glock21SF, a Mossberg 590A1 9 shot w/ ghost rings, and a Ruger 10/22. I’m looking into buying a 1903A3 for my blot gun. I have a thing for iron sights and war-proof ruggedness. For my concealed carry I thinking a Berreta Nano, a S&W Shield or Glock 19. Revolver I’d want a Ruger GP100. Lever gun I kinda want a Marlin in 45-70. Handy little brush gun that can kill anything in North America. And the 1911 and Garand are simply my “America as Apple Pie and Baseball” guns. They would collectable/nostalgic/etc, but could still serve a purpose.

        At last that’s how it stands as of right now. Might change in the future if I move out of the state Iive in. Which limits my current purchase options anyway.

    • I’d bet dollars to donuts that once you cover all those bases, you’ll find another gun you really like and will have to invent a new base for it to cover. 😉

  46. Such stories, such as this one, inspire me to wonder . . .

    What would happen if the average gun-owner ordered an average of 1 80% receiver and 1 barrel in a suitable calibre?

    In a country with an inventory of 300 million guns and 50 million gun owners, that would add 50 million ghost guns to the inventory. What percentage of these 50 million would represent completed projects? 10%? 90%? Who could know?

    I’ve purchased 3 completed lower receivers and 3 or 4 80% receivers and 5 barrels. I’ve completed 1 build; maybe 2. But who knows how many I might complete by next year or the year after that.

    I suspect that the volume of production of “interesting” industrial output is tracked by the Commerce Department; or, if not, that ATF keeps an eye on whatever information might be available to them. E.g., the Commerce Department probably knows how many barrels are produced and the ATF knows how many guns are produced. The difference between the barrel production and the gun production is some index on the production of ghost guns.

    The Antis will never get the message. Congressmen, however, will probably be sensitive to the handwriting on the wall. The prospects of ever getting any handle on who owns what guns is likely to appear to be an evermore unlikely prospect. The faster Congress beats the drums of gun-control, the faster we buy barrels and 80% receivers. Go ahead, knock-yourselves-out.

    • Every gun owner can do their part by completing an 80 pct. lower and give it to someone they deem deserving who will complete it.

      • Isn’t it technically illegal to give or sell a completed 80% firearm to someone else? I thought the legality of the 80% thing hinged on it being for your own personal use.

  47. What about all the knives in the kitchen? Did the officers secure those also? How about the silverware? What about the couch? Did they shake it down for loose change? As long as legal investment assets are being stolen why not simply burglarize the whole house?

    Just think if you were this guys son. Not only did you lose an interesting father, you lost a significant inheritance.

  48. The guy was just a hoarder. I see in the picture an M1A (civilian M14 version), 1911’s, 22lr SW Model 41, an Anschutz 22lr in a bench rest stock etc etc. If the man hoarded more than collected is unlikely that the weapons saw much use if any, and not likely to have been used in any crime. The LAPD is as usual, going Hollywood for the press release and as usual, they are going to fuck up everything. It is, alas, Kalifornia (as in People’s Democratic Republic of). Many people hoard ammo and then they have no time to shoot it or do not care to shoot it, it does not mean they are planning anything nefarious. Anyone with a collection of more than a dozen weapons more than likely will shoot only occasionally unless they are serious competitive shooters; hoarders are not, they just hoard compulsively for reasons they do not know. By the wya, I do not think that the man kept his weapon as shown in the picture, that was probably the police doing (very stupid) so imaging if they had done that with the ammo. SNAFU and FUBAR (situation normal all fucked up, and WWII GI bastardization of the German word FURCHTBAR meaning that something is awfully wrong)

  49. I always see these photo’s of guns sitting in a large pile, and I can’t help but cringe a bit. They should be laying them out, back to back…not on top of each other, now they all will have scuff marks, scratches, dings, etc. Treat someone else’s property like it’s your own……….although I guess in this case, they probably did just that, wrapped it up in a soft cotton towel, and bring it to their trunk.

  50. One other reason we dont want registration. I have no were near that kind of collection.
    But that does not mean I want the Cops digging through my stuff.
    My Kids know were every thing is and have instructions.
    Blue collar gold.

    As a side note: Why were they digging around in his house??? Was he not found out side?
    What was the pretext to enter? Warrant??

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