Over at calguns.net, Kestryl responds to the sinking ship that is California gun rights:
Gun owners in California have taken a major shot tonight. There is no two ways about it. I’d be lying if I said I didn’t feel betrayed, frustrated and angry. I hate what these people are doing to my home and to the extended family of California gun owners, shooters, collectors and competitors. But that was the point I believe. We had everything but the kitchen sink thrown at us this year, a concerted effort to reach as far as they could to curtail our beliefs and remove our rights. But there was more to it then that I think. Every bit as much as these legislators wanted to strip us of our rights it is my belief that they also wanted to beat us down, break our will, to silence us by pushing us to the point of saying ‘What’s the use?’ To drive us to the point of giving up. t’s not enough to subjugate people, you have to make them accept subjugation so they do not fight back. And that I think was a major reason for what we’ve seen this year . . .
I’m angry.
I’ve called, faxed, emailed every day.
I’ve made my voice heard if not listened to.
I’m frustrated that all the effort I’ve seen from the people on this forum and across the State has been completely ignored by those who are suppose to serve us.Saying ‘It’s over, we’re beaten’ would be easy.
But dammit I WILL NOT QUIT!!!!!
I will fight these self serving bastards until these are vetoed and if that does not happen I will fight them in court and if that doesn’t happen I will fight them at the ballot box and in elections!!!
I am on obstinate son of a *****.
I WILL NOT give them the satisfaction of saying ‘We beat him down and made him quit.’
I may end up fighting this fight until the day I die but I WILL NOT ******* QUIT!!!!
I really don’t have much more to say but dammit I needed to say this.
I’m not going to say any more about that than this: this will not end well.
SB 374 defines nearly every centerfire rifle as an assault rifle. You must register assault weapons or you’re violating the law. You can only register weapons bought between 2001-2013.
BREAKING: IT IS THE WEEKEND!
His office is closed but his voice mail, email and fax machine are still on!
If you care about your rights, if you care about your ability to own firearms, take five minutes today and tomorrow. Let your voice be heard!
BREAKING: California strips it’s citizens of their Second Amendment rights!
It’s official, the legislature has passed laws which ban springs and metal. Semi Automatic rifles are now banned. Lead bullets gone! We will see semi automatic hand guns disappear in California within the next 24 months. We no longer have gun rights in California.
Follow the link, you can email and fax right from the website. If you are struggling like many of us you do not have to donate money although we need all the help we can get. Law abiding gun owners can no longer remain silent. If we don’t stop this now, these laws will spread across the country folks. It is critical that all of you take five minutes a day to stop the MADNESS!
CALL! Keep trying, get your voice heard!
Do this for the next 30 days!
~ Daniel
https://www.firearmspolicy.org/the-issues/california/2013-2014/askbrown/
Contact him at his capitol office here:
Governor Jerry Brown,
c/o State Capitol, Suite 1173,
Sacramento, CA 95814
Call Here: (916) 445-2841
Fax Here: (916) 558-3160
Register what guns?
What guns?
And has anybody asked the fine leaders in California how they plan on getting the criminals to comply with the new laws?
Please publish links of groups who will bring the legal challenges so we can donate like we did for the CO recall.
Go to the Calguns site (http://www.calguns.net/) there is plenty of information there
Hell ya! The point they think they are strongest is the beginning of their weakening.
When you live among homos, deviants, and miscreants you get what they vote for. Sometimes you have to come to the conclusion that surrounding yourself with like minded people means you’ll have to move to another state.
lol at you blaming “homos”. It’s 20-gotdamned-13. Get it together.
What diffrence does the year make? GOD has not issued an update to the Bible has he? He, in his word condemned homosexuality. He defined it as an abomination.
GOD said it, that settles it, I believe it. I feel the same way about drunkards. It doesn’t matter how nice the poor guy is, what is wrong is wrong.
Stop RIGHT there, you sanctimonious hypocrite!
God DID issue an update to the bible. It’s called the New Testament. If you’re the kind of guy who thinks someone is a deviant, and an abomination because of what your holy book says, at least learn what the hell it actually DOES SAY.
You can’t talk to your wife while she’s on her period.
You have to burn any bedding that semen touches.
You can’t eat pork or shellfish.
You can’t shave your face.
and you can’t sleep with men.
these are “Old Covenant” rules. They were superceded by the “New Covenant”, stated pretty clearly in John 11:26.
Let me repeat myself, because you’re obviously a thick-headed ole’ coot, stuck in your ways : IF YOU SHAVE YOU ARE JUST AS BAD AS A HOMO. *IF* you choose to follow that set of rules. Don’t you DARE gaybash and say the bible supports it if you’ve never killed an animal in sacrifice. You don’t get to choose to support only those verses that affirm your bigotry.
Such nonsense, SilentSecessionist. As if anything Jesus did not specifically mention as forbidden must therefore not be forbidden. A very convenient but completely false interpretation of the New Testament.
Ok, which PARTS of the Old Testament apply?
I mean, since you OBVIOUSLY give 10% of your gross annual income to the Church already.
I do, actually, and sometimes more than 10%. There are many who try to follow the Law, whether by the Jewish, Catholic, Protestant, or Mormon traditions. Few succeed fully, but there are many who try.
As for your question, I don’t think there’s a simple answer. It’s a question I’ve been exploring for years. I do think it’s worth your consideration, too, if you have a moment sometime to read a bit of the Bible and some of the commentaries on it.
TBH “homos” have more of a reason to carry concealed everyday than you, pal; and people like you are the reason…
+1
And yet fags overwhelmingly support gun control and nanny state politicians.
I guess you haven’t heard of the Pink Pistols. A bunch of gays who are very pro gun and demonstrate that regularly.
Riiiight…. and I bet you know so many gay people.
Love how people deride others for getting their gun facts from TV but then turn around and think everyone in the LBGT community is Rupaul.
Pink Pistols, there’s a real active group. Million Moms may actually have more paying member than that crew.
ah, there’s nothing like a gun owner yelling about “fags” to give us a good image!
Well considering there is a greater percentage of moms than gays..yes yes they would have more members. Use logic Andy…oh wait…
Given that million moms have just about a dozen paying moms, the limp wristed shooters have no one.
^closeted.
So, these folks have more reason to carry because of people, like Andy, are rude to them?
There’s quite a difference between name calling and trying to kill someone.
No, comrade, no, no no. Homosexuals are an official “historically oppressed minority” approved by the multiculturalists and ratified by our venerable Supreme Court. Homosexuals have been accorded the most coveted political status of “proletariats”. Anyone who expresses anything but sympathy for and solidarity with them will be considered an enemy of the people and, since the state is the people’s embodiment, an enemy also of the state.
“homos, deviants, and miscreants” make up a very small proportion of the CA population. CA is, however, way off into la la land, at this point. I left the bay area 10 years ago, and I’m damn glad I did.
Absolutely right Julian!
Of course now the mexifonia governor is going to make it LEGAL for ILLEGAL ALIENS to have drivers licenses…
And in his own words more or less: “To make it easier for the ILLEGAL ALIENS to get to work LEGALLY!”
I think you are getting really worked up about a concept that I think is ridiculous. Declaring someone as “Illegal” is saying that the government gets to decide who is ‘allowed’ in the country. That is not a power I think the state should have.
I understand that if you believe the rules need to be followed that this is extremely frustrating. I used to feel that way as well. Then I realized that the rules were ridiculous, and all that stress and outrage went away. I became so much happier.
Who the heck is the gov’t to say who can come into the country? The fact that I was born in one location and another was born in another location seems to be a ridiculous distinction. From what I’ve seen, it has no bearing on the quality of a man. That is to say, I’ve met a lot of jerks who “belong here” who I’d happily trade for stand-up dudes who don’t.
Maybe you are worried about a torrent of new people speaking an unfamiliar language coming in and taking your job. (Do you need daddy gov’t to stack the deck just to compete? I doubt it.) I think this fear is unfounded, because you are only looking at one side of the equation. More people also means an expansion of the economy – more people means more customers, more opportunity, more business.
America doesn’t have an official language (though all the laws are written in English) and that is the way I think it should be. Who is the state to tell me how I should speak? It’s not like you can really pin down and define what English is anyway. English is a constantly evolving, and living language. It changes. There is no official body like in French, decreeing what is, and what is not French. It is an anarchy that works. That’s why French is dying, and is no longer the lingua franca of the world.
Did I get off topic? I know, I tend to ramble. Really, my point was to make a suggestion that illegals are not the end of the world, and if you stop geting worked up about it, you’ll be happier. You’ll have more time/energy to spend on things that are important. (Maybe that’s repealing gun laws, or maybe that’s eating tacos with your new neighbors, who knows?)
i find it interesting that Kalifornia defied federal laws by allowing illegals to seek refugee in its cities while at the same time is seeking to crush the rights of its citizens to keep and bear arms.
additionally i do believe that the govt has a right to keep people out. its called citizenship and if it has no value then being an American has no meaning. which means the constitution has no meaning and our laws both good and bad are meaningless.
i can handle anarchy. but i’d prefer not to.
@seren
“Who the heck is the gov’t to say who can come into the country?”
It is one of the defining characteristics of a sovereign nation. If you have no borders, you are not a country.
What is it supposed to mean that you spell California with a ‘K’? What am I supposed to take away from that?
@Old Ben
I’m not disagreeing with the borders – but I’m not fully aligned with letting boneheads in Washington decide who can cross them.
But that’s not my major contention anyway – I’m ok with the idea of having a secure border as long as we stop making a big deal about who belongs once they are inside. I really like the idea that, once you’re in, you’re in.
Yeah, just think of all those undocumented voters in the next election. Can you say “election fraud?” Giving them DLs elevates that to an art form. Not only do you not know what district they’re really from, you don’t even know what COUNTRY…
Every time someone tells me that I shouldn’t worry about “illegals”, blah, blah blah,
I say to them, tell me where you live, I’m going to make myself “at home” at your home!
And do you know what?
They don’t like that!
And why is that?
To me, as an American citizen, our borders is MY property.
And by these liberal illegal lovers stating otherwise…
Well, why is mexifornia in the current state that it’s in?
End of story.
@Matt
Actually, I think that the whole California with a K thing originated with people trying to imply that some anti-immigration policies were racist (like prop 187); the K was to suggest a connection to the KKK.
But more recently I think it is simply used as a sign of disrespect. (Possibly it is to make it sound more communist? Because the letter K resembles some of those weird cyrillic letters that the commies use.) A name is a powerful thing – and distorting it can be a powerful insult. (i.e. Obummer, Feinswine, etc.) On a basic level, it says, I don’t respect you enough to refer to you by your proper name.
Using serens logic, all an invading army would have to do is show up on the shores in sufficient numbers. They could vote away every thing that we stand for in the next election and take over without firing a shot.
@Solomon,
interesting, meaning inconsistent? Or interesting meaning that both things line up to one agenda? I think it is inconsistent myself.
I agree that citizenship is very important – but I don’t think it necessitates who is allowed to live here. I think only a citizen should be able to vote. But anyone should be able to live here. However, once they are within our borders, our laws apply. I totally disagree that our laws and constitution and society would become meaningless.
@pk
I understand, but I don’t share the same view that “our borders are MY property”. And since I am a citizen as well, by your logic they are My property too, and I say it’s ok. So there is a conflict.
Your home/border analogy is kind of shaky, but let’s play with it for a bit. You and I live in the same house, am I free to invite people over? How crowded does the house get? Can the new people build a new room out in the back yard where there is some room? Maybe if we have 50 million new immigrants in the next 5 years we’ll either expand the sizes of the existing cities, or breathe new life into the small towns which are dying, or we will build new cities. If you project this too far into the future, you’re going to have to address issues of global overpopulation.
Why is Cali in its current state? I’m not sure what you mean, but maybe you are talking about the tax problems… well, if illegals weren’t living with the fear of being deported, then they wouldn’t have to live in hiding/off the books/undocumented… now all of a sudden they poke there heads up and.. “hello, we’re from the IRS, let’s talk.”
I’m not saying that all illegals would become taxpayers overnight (although they all currently do pay sales tax) but you can’t seriously argue that a large portion wouldn’t – and that’s new money that we currently don’t have.
@Jus Bill… This whole issue about driver’s licenses always seemed odd to me – it’s not like a DL is a license to vote. Why would you want to have unlicensed drivers on the road?
@Justsomeguy… you know, the cynical might argue that that has been happening all along. And I don’t really have a problem with that – by the time the invading army gains their citizenship, I think I would be happy to consider them Americans.
@Seren
There is so much wrong with your thinking that I can only surmise that you are a recent graduate from a typical leftist controlled university.
Dennis Prager refers to the current day universities as a “leftist seminaries”.
Christian seminaries exist to create “committed Christians”, and current day universities exist to create “committed leftists”. The only difference between them is that christian seminaries freely announce their intentions and universities don’t
As Dennis would say…… “If you graduate from a typical 4 year leftist university you are dumber then when when you started 4 years ago. If you follow that up with a graduate degree, now your stupid AND dangerous.
@ Matt: “What is it supposed to mean that you spell California with a ‘K’? What am I supposed to take away from that?”
Makes it sound Communist. People call it PRK, meaning Peoples’ Republic of Kalifornia. …or ‘Republik’ to make that look commie also.
CA… no right to bear arms: http://www.endoapparel.com/california-flag-rkba-infringed-t-shirt/
@doesky2
Yeah, you could say I went to a pretty leftist school. I wouldn’t say it was recently, though; it was over 20 years ago. Anyhow, I’ve never bought into the 1-dimensional left/right thing, and although I’m probably not all that unique in my views, I bristle at you trying to sweep me away as a typical leftist.
So yeah, my college has helped shape my viewpoints, that was probably where the majority of my libertarianism sprouted, although it had roots prior to that, and it has continued to change and grow since. I’m not sure where you are coming from, though.
When you say there is “so much wrong” with my thinking, it sounds like lazy thought to me – how about you give an example?
Seren, since you embrace that concept so much, I’ll be over in a little while to set up housekeeping in your home. I expect you to feed me, as I will not have my own food or a place to store/prepare it; clothe me and do my laundry, as I did not bring any necessities; collect and take out my trash and see to my medical care when I’m ill, because I deserve it.
Oh, by the way, I’ve invited my family and friends, because they deserve it too.
C U SOON, dood…
@Jus Bill
Hi Bill, I think you are confusing the idea of relaxed immigration with welfare. I am OK with you coming on over. There is a spare room you can rent for the time being, and I think we can build a cottage in the back yard when your family decides to come. We can work out whether you want to buy or lease it when you arrive. I didn’t say I would feed you, however. This is america after all.
Anyhow, come on by, we can go shooting and then go out for dinner afterwards. There is an awesome new sushi place that opened down the street.
Seren my family and I will be right over. I don’t however have any intention of paying rent and as soon as we have the numbers we will be holding an election and you will be out. I hope you weren’t too attached to the house.
So Seren, since you like the idea of once you’re in, you are in, does that mean you want to give an invading amy all the rights and privledges of the USA? Are you daft? We have border controls for a reason. We don’t want anoher country dumping their rifraf on us like Cuba did. We don’t need Mexico’s scum hiding up here from their crimes. I have no problem iwth hard working people who want a better life. I want them screened to make sure they are not criminals. I want them to hold jobs and not be a burdon on society. I don’t want them turning this into the hell hole like what they left when they came here.
Please…get off my side.
I have a feeling you’re a troll for MAIG. If not, you’re just an idiot.
And if he is, he is still an idiot.
If you don’t agree with homos you must be an idiot. Please tell us more about your supreme tolerance.
I’m extremely tolerant of idiots and their prejudices. It’s how I put up with people who believe in gun control.
So as a way to show people how tolerant you are you just resort to name calling. Me on the other hand, I’m open and honest about not liking faggots and sexual deviants.
Well, at least the rest of us can see you coming.
Andy, How do you define sexual deviant?
“I’m extremely tolerant of idiots and their prejudices. It’s how I put up with people who believe in gun control.”
Ha, fucking ace comment. So true.
As a man named Andy, i DEMAND you change your name, so I don’t accidentally get associated with your views.
You disgust me.
Given that you’re a homosexual sympathizer, I’ll change my name. I don’t want anyone confusing me with you.
Can we please leave the hate off these forums? Yes, the gun-grabbing politicians are deserving of our collective outrage, but even they do not warrant hatred. Logic, perseverance, and concerted efforts will win the day; not demonizing a minority.
It’s these groups, by and large, who hate gun owners and just about everything I believe in. I’ll leave aside the hatred when they do. They’re the ones who attacked us. This country used to be free; now it’s at best half-free. That’s not because of anything you and I did as gun owners.
Alan Gura is going to become a very wealthy man, and more power to him.
dude! those are brave words but Kalifornia is done. its past time to leave that state.
Not everyone can leave, and no gun owner across the USA can afford to allow CA to fall. If CA falls, the anti-gun crowd will simply take the money they are spending in CA and redistribute it to a state near you. We all stick together or we all fall apart.
If you have a clue, and see the big picture, we must fight for CA. If CA falls all the other anti-gun groups will see CA as a model to do damage to other states. If we fight, if we donate, if we get involved we can show them that CO we not a one time victory. Our resolve must be strong.
BS! to quitting — no matter if you want to believe it or not, we are ALL in this fight otherwise you will be next.
i don’t mean to be cruel but Kalifornia is already gone. compare your right to those in the South. you have nothing and you’re fighting for scraps they have beat down gun owners and the demographics in that state mean that you’ll never get those rights back until a disaster hits and there is widespread unrest mixed with many murders/rapes/etc….even then it might make them go tougher than they already are. think about it. San Fran, Los Angeles, San Diego. those population centers are hopelessly liberal and control the state.
one last thing. Kalifornia arrogance should be a thing of the past. gun laws are the perfect example. where Kalifornia goes so goes the rest of the country???? not by a long shot. if you can’t get out then my heart bleeds for ya but looking at it realistically gun owners don’t stand a chance in that state. hell. taxpayers don’t stand a chance.
You keep thinking that, Hoss.
Sooner or later your southern domain will be in the sights of the grabbers, too. You can already see prominent signs of it in the metro areas of staunchly pro gun states.
Get over your deep seated bias about flaky Californians which I agree there are way too many of, hence our dilemma.
Pascal is absolutely correct in his assessment; the time to fight is now, wherever the grabbers are assaulting gun rights! If we don’t, eventually we will all lose. They will divide us and state by state eventually conquer us all.
I’m a bit cash poor at the moment, but call me when the armed revolt starts.
+1
Let them win in California and they will inevitably move their money and resources to neighboring states. Oregon, Washington, Colorado and Nevada will be next. That process has already started. The same goes for the new gun control push in Massachusetts and Rhode Island.
That’s plain ignorance. Don’ think that the laws won’t come to your state. How do you think Colorado got so fucked? People sick of CA BS moved there. And lo they were afeared of the freedoms they saw, and moved to get guns restricted. And it worked.
As far as the average Californian voter is concerned,the 2nd Amendment is obsolete.
Those “self serving” politicians were lawfully elected by people of California to do their bidding.And clearly,Californians have no use for the RKBA.
Fighting at this point is a waste of time in California.Law abiding gun owners are considered reprobate criminals in CA,and nothing less then a total cultural overhaul will change that.Such a cultural shift is impossible so long as the hoplophobes own the media.
Their system is already starting to unravel at the seams, not so most people feel it yet, but already cities are going bankrupt. The slide to Detroit-ification is now inevitable. Like a junkie, I think they are going to have to hit rock bottom before they admit they have a serious problem. Of course, the Progs will do what Progs do: blame capitalism and double down on past mistakes until they go full USSR. Whether Americans can stop that from happening is another serious question. CA needs many, many boating accidents at this point.
No, the Progs will do what Progs always do – leave the empty, shriveled husk of what used to be a living, vibrant area to ruin a new living, vibrant area. They’re like evil locusts.
+1
The fight is not over. I hope every gun owner understands that even if they are in a free state, they will be coming for you too. CA and CO and others. We are all in the same fight. A win in CO and we all win. A loss in CA and we all loose.
Come this fall, MA and CT and other legislatures will be back for round 2. We all need to continue to fight.
While everyone should join the NRA and donate to SAF or GAO, everyone should at least give to the various local gun groups like calguns (http://www.calguns.net/)
Next up could be Maryland, the Formerly Free State. Come 1 October fascism takes effect, and people will be harmed by the absurd seven month MSP CCW permitting backlog. Then the lawsuits will commence. Stay tuned.
How I wish we had a recall mechanism…
What do you do in a state that doesn’t listen to its people? That ignores law abiding constituents and turns them into fellons, pillages its (fleeing) producers with outlandish taxes, and rewards mediocrity with subsidies? I keep hearing fight fight fight, but how? Your voices fall on deaf ears, your letters are tossed in the garbage, and your very existence an affront to their sensibilities. As of right now the only fight is one last plea to the Governor Brown and god knows what he’s going to do. After that there is just a couple year wait for the trial to work its way up to Obama’s newly reassembled supreme court to rule that banning semi autos and may (not) issue are not an affront to the 2nd amendment. Seriously, whats the game plan Californians?
If you live in. California please call the Governor, his phone number is 916-445-2841. When you call you’ll press 1 for English then 6 to speak to a representative. At this time tell the repreaentative you want the Governor to VETO Senate Bill 374 and Assembly Bill 711. Then that’s all it takes. It is only a 30 second process.
They are closed for the weekend, so call ASAP on Monday. Lucky the phone line has been busy from all us firearm owners calling. So be patient and keep calling till you get through.
Why the f**k should you have to “Press 1 for English”??
Who cares?
For what it’s worth, I haven’t had to “Press 1 for English” for quite a while. Several years, I’d guess. It was all the rage for a while, but anymore, the instructions are simply “Press 2/6/9 for Spanish.” If you don’t press anything, it assumes English. This is an acceptable solution to me.
For now…
Just commented because of Mario’s comment with calling the govenor..
Obviously they love those foreign speaking people!
Yeah what’s the value of a common language anyway? Oh sweet baby Jesus. Amazing how the US survived and prospered for 200 years without being accommodating to foreign languages. Is it beyond your comprehension to fathom that if government agencies were to only accomodate English that it just MIGHT spur people of foreign tongues to learn English sooner if at all?
@doesky2
I was born in a community that spoke mostly German. Neighboring towns had their select language as well. While I was growing up, the revolution into english was taking place. My grandmother insisted that her grandchildren be taught only english. Our country went through many years of language turmoil, and we survived. We need to make english our official language. The accomidation of spanish is not helping those who speak it, it keeps them trapped in their modern ghetto.
+1
Press 2 for Spanish is BS. Catering to and aiding and abetting Illegals (Latino’s from south of AZ,CA, NM, TX state lines statistically).
Where’s the Multilingual signs, and voice cue’s documents etc. for other Immigrants – the legal ones German, Italian, Tai, Spain, Indonesia, French and so many others?
We were told that fighting was a waste of time with the 68 gca. If enough gun owners adopt that attitude, then yes, we’re done. This nonsense will not stop with California.
I don’t own anything that could be classed as an assualt weapon. But I donate money and effort to see to it that the rest of America has that right.
What if I and 9 million other California gun owners decide to sit out the next fight at the federal level to bring another AWB? Would the anti gun sharks smell the blood in the water and attack?
kalifornia isn’t a bell weather anymore! how Kalifornia goes is no indication of how the rest of the country goes. as a matter of fact while you lose rights, here in the south ours are expanding!
additionally i appreciate the work done by kalifornia gun owners do by donating money to gun rights causes but the battle on the federal level was won by those living in free states. your senators voted for the gun ban despite your calls. mine paid attention and did the right thing. what we need are kalifornia gun owners in free states to bolster our numbers.
So, those living in free states don’t need our money or support? So I guess the wisdom of Solomon is that we hang seperately. So much for the POTG. Now it’s every man for himself.
But i’m glad to see that you’ll let me make refugees out of my family and come live in your state. MAIG and kapo bloomberg are sporting wood when they read your comments. Divide and conquer.
thats not what i’m saying and you know it. but get off the high horse of believing that “as Kalifornia goes so goes the rest of the country”! additionally i pointed out that at the federal level the votes are held by your representatives. in Kalifornia they’re inevitably going to vote anti-gun. the facts back that up. additionally i said that while we all appreciate the support, the battle for that state is over. that too is a fact. while Kalifornia loses right the rest of us in the free states are gaining. not being mean but that too is a fact.
long story short you’re fighting a holding action. you’re AT BEST (and i doubt even this) delaying further erosion of your rights but unless a major calamity occurs that changes minds in cities you won’t reverse it.
that leaves a choice. continue to be frustrated and battle on or find another home that meets your belief system when it comes to this issue.
oh and i would never ask a person to orphan their family. you have to make choices and deal with the consequences. if you have no choice but to live their then the consequence will probably be further erosion of your rights.
i don’t deal in feel good. just reality.
California has the 8th largest economy in the world. We contribute three and a half billion more in federal taxes than we recieve in benefits. Yes, as california goes, so goes the rest of the nation. That is a fact. Gun control and preserving the constituion is a nation wide fight. That is a fact. Any retreat on any front is a major loss for us. Fact.
Today your local pols are supporting your rkba. What about tomorrow? What about when kapo bbloomberg buys them? We stick together or we lose. Fact.
Kalifornia = Money + Drain
Leave the place, let it go down the drain faster so it will serve as an example for the rest of the nation.
If eight million California gun owners left the state, California would end up losing 10-12 representatives in Congress. That would be a huge blow to Californian influence on the federal level.
Look at how the 2010 census affected the balance of power in the House. The states that lost population were mostly those with the worst economies (which just happen to be largely crime-ridden, oppressive shitholes) – Illinois, New York, New Jersey, Massachusetts, etc. They all lost reps, while states like Texas, Florida, Nevada, Georgia, and South Carolina all gained reps.
California does have a large, powerful economy. But it’s in decline, as people flock from the state in search of jobs and a better standard of living. It used to be the eighth largest economy, but it’s now ranked at 11th or 12th, depending on the metrics used. The new economic center of this country is moving to the South, where unions are kept in check, taxes are low, and the cost of living is generally low enough for companies to pay a living wage that’s far less than they would pay in the northeast or on the west coast. Political influence follows population and money.
jwm, if you own a Ruger 10 22 then in a few years you will own a weapon that will be classified as an assault rifle. it is just a matter of time until every ca gun owner owns a weapon defined as an assault weapon.
old statistics based on a flawed model. Kalifornia provides nothing except for entertainment (which is fleeing the state), business (which is fleeing the state) and high taxes.
be as defiant as you want. i understand that the truth hurts but Kalifornia stopped being a national leader a loooong time ago. no one wants to admit it. quite honestly, the state reminds me of a middle aged woman that dresses like a teenager. why can’t you admit the obvious. we’re turning into a tale of two nations.
you have the midwest and south that have one belief system and then you have the two coasts. bloomberg isn’t buying our people because they want office more than his campaign contributions. we should know because he’s tried.
get out of that state dude. its done. the cause is lost and its time to face reality. wishful thinking will do you no good.
If you own a Ruger 10/22 then California has now declared that an assault rifle.
Uhhh, how is the Hollywood machine going to make any movies when there are no guns, or gun-looking devices???
OMG – what will Jim Carrey do????? /sarc.
“If you will not fight for right when you can easily win without blood shed; if you will not fight when your victory is sure and not too costly; you may come to the moment when you will have to fight with all the odds against you and only a precarious chance of survival. There may even be a worse case. You may have to fight when there is no hope of victory, because it is better to perish than to live as slaves.” — Winston Churchill
“Never give in–never, never, never, never, in nothing great or small, large or petty, never give in except to convictions of honour and good sense. Never yield to force; never yield to the apparently overwhelming might of the enemy.” — Winston Churchill
“One has a moral responsibility to disobey unjust laws.”
― Martin Luther King Jr.
“If the machine of government is of such a nature that it requires you to be the agent of injustice to another, then, I say, break the law”
― Henry David Thoreau, Civil Disobedience and Other Essays
“I became convinced that noncooperation with evil is as much a moral obligation as is cooperation with good.”― Martin Luther King Jr., The Autobiography of Martin Luther King, Jr.
“Among the many misdeeds of the British rule in India, history will look back upon the Act depriving the whole nation of arms as the blackest. If we want the Arms Act to be repealed, if we want to learn the use of arms, here is a golden opportunity. If the middle classes render voluntary help to Government in the hour of its trial, distrust will disappear, and the ban on possessing arms will be withdrawn.” ― Mahatma Gandhi
California, the choice is up to you. Even if they pass all of those new laws, you still have options and decisions to make. Cut and run, go underground, stand and fight in the courts, at the ballots, and if it comes to it, at the barricades, if you have the stomach and the convictions for it.
you my friend presented them with the reality of the situation. either they become criminals. move. or accept what is facing them…slavery.
its not a happy message but its the truth. the time for disobedience has long since come.
Thank you. I left the PRCa when I retired, because I had nothing holding me there and many good reasons to escape. I do understand that there are many People of the Gun in CA who do not have that option and do not want to leave their home, and I deeply appreciate your determination to continue the fight.
It sounds like Winston Churchill’s words fit your determination: “We shall go on to the end. We shall fight in France, we shall fight on the seas and oceans, we shall fight with growing confidence and growing strength in the air, we shall defend our island, whatever the cost may be. We shall fight on the beaches, we shall fight on the landing grounds, we shall fight in the fields and in the streets, we shall fight in the hills; we shall never surrender.”
I will do what I can by donating to CalGuns. Keep the faith, brother.
Idaho Pete gets it. We support each other or we lose. Real simple. No 1 state or even group of states can go it alone. Can you say confederacy boys and girls?
Thank you for your support, Pete!
Whne the battle is WON and I know I’m not running from my problems instead of facing them, Idaho is where I’m headed to.
This time they also bothered the FUDs so maybe they will do more than watch.
Remember VOTE in 2014, they can paint what happened in Colorado as a temper tantrum all they want but removal of a majority of them should solve the problem.
If it’s not classified as an assault weapon, it will be classified as a sniper rifle. Those are on the chopping block next. BTW what is a “sniper rifle?” How about your scoped bolt action rifle.
Andrew Cuomo screamed in apoplectic derangement “NOBODY NEEDS TEN BULLETS TO KILL A DEER!!”
They make you think they respect the “rights” of hunters. Until someone screams in apoplectic derangement “NOBODY NEEDS TO HUNT!! WE HAVE SUPERMARKETS!”
Would the new law ban the Taurus Circuit Judge if it has a rifled barrel? I would love to see one of the politicians defend that decision.
So, when you say you’ll “fight”, you mean you’ll continue to loudly complain and object. Because, distinctly missing from your rant was that you’ll actually use your guns for what they are intended.
Fire the first shot, Henry. Otherwise it’s just empty rhetoric. I see a lot of voting from the rooftops type comment here but nobody actually follows thru. The rest of us will continue the fight from the sane side.
+100
fight from the sane side? your rights are gone, you agitate and complain with no hope of victory and you call that sanity. doing the same thing over and over…seeing your rights disappear year after year and that’s sanity?
wow!
I get it solomon. You hate California. I really do get it. But you question the sanity of those that would fight for their rights? If I wore the chains of slavery I would continue to seek freedom. Is that insane?
When will you quit struggling for your rights? Or would you start? Or do you live in a small island of freedom that others before you fought for and dispense snark at the rest of us still fighting?
When that small island shrinks more, and with the government we have now it’s gonna happen, will you fight or just quit?
Don’t you see? They don’t care how much you complain as long as you keep following their rules. That’s what you call “sane side?” Besides, you’re the Californian… I would assume you’d want to handle your own business.
Here we go again Henry. The classic formula for defeat. We all stay on our little patch of ground and ignore our neighbbers plight. Let California go it alone. Let your state go it alone. MAIG, barry and bloomberg win. POTG lose.
jwm, why would I bother starting a fight on your behalf, when you’re clearly not interested in actually fighting? And, by you, I mean gun owners in California.
Your so brave sitting behind a keyboard. What have you done to fight for the rights? Oh, that is right, most likely nothing. You want people to start shooting up the streets while you would sit back in your arm chair and do nothing. Your talk is cheap
Pascal, talk of resistance may be cheap, but pleading for liberty is worthless.
Henry, you don’t seem to get it. I’m not asking for you or anyone else to fight for me. I don’t want you in front of or behind me. I want you and all gun owners beside me. We don’t win if we abandon each other.
I contribute money and effort to support nationwide efforts to defend our rights. That’s all I ask from all people who believe our rights are in danger.
If we win the 2a fight, we may well have one the war. But if we say, I live in Florida or Texas or Ohio so fvck those guys in California then we will lose this fight. And lose it within our lifetimes.
If we win this fight the right way nobody will have to fire a shot. If we fragment and lose this fight then any revolution or rebellion will fail as we’ve proven we can’t count on each other.
If this is so important to you that you can condone violence why should a difference of geography make any difference at all? Or is this simply a case of ‘do as I say not as I do’?
jwm, I’m totally with you there. My point was only that “complaints” mean nothing to politicians. If continuing to object is as far as we’re willing to go, then they’ll never heed us. The prospect of violent resistance must always remain an option, even thought it’s not Plan A. At the very least, we owe them the opportunity to back down when confronted with the true cost of their authoritarianism.
Henry, I’ve never taken violence off the table. But I have seen great violence and anarchy. It must remain the absolute last option. We’re not there yet. 2014 should tell us how close we are to the last option. If the grabbers gain ground or break even we may have the reality of a nation that needs to be divided. Balkanazation would suck, but it may be the only option. If it comes to that I plan on taking as many as will go with me and bugging out to Texas. From there I’ll regroup and pick my next move.
You try to enact change by talking, I’ll cover you 😉
Vive la Resistance!
…the first nut-job that votes with the “ammo box” is going to completely collapse all our efforts.
Just like those “first nut-jobs” at Lexington and Concord, right?
…wow, I really don’t know how to respond to that comment other than to quote jwm: “Fire the first shot, Henry. Otherwise it’s just empty rhetoric.”
And if I did “fire the first shot”, what are the odds that you’d join the fight? I’m guessing very low, since you obviously believe that actual resistance is insane. And, since that’s the case, why would I bother fighting for you?
I think you would last seconds after you fired the first shot. Perhaps minutes. And fire at whom exactly? Another keyboard commando…
Fight for yourself, since you seem to think everyone else should.
To the CA gun owner, the term “fighting for your rights” will have to change, very soon you are going to have to draw a line in the sand and invoke the 2nd on the tyrants in your state.
If this IS the way you and others feel, head for the supreme court. I believe they have a precedent set in the last 10 years (considered recent) that should almost guarantee a win. THEN VOTE .. republicans are just as bad as the democracks about gun control .. they trade a vote or an abstain to do things like get themselves off of Obamacare .. Personally, if the candidate has been in orifice for more than three terms, VOTE THEM OUT .. PERIOD.
Robert Seddon
TTAG has not blogged this, but read the link. Wyoming Gov Matt Mead is pumping the gun control agenda. If you believe your gun free state of Wyoming will stay free, think again. The civilian disarmament complex is everywhere and complacency is the enemy. See link
http://tinyurl.com/lkgkp7b
I just read about this last night. I was surprised. Wyoming? I just applied for a job there too. I am trying like heck to get out of IL, but at least we are steadily and surely moving in the proper direction.
If you are a gun owner in CA I’d be worried. This will go to the courts, but how long will that take and how many are willing to register or give up their legally owned firearms in the meantime. This is a blatant gun grab by a bunch of over-zealous fascists that are supposedly elected to do the will of the people. The 2nd amendment is very clear, and yet they use any and all excuses to infringe.
This is what happens when you have “Super Majority” I do not democrats any more than I do Republicans. None of the interest of the people they are just following party dogma. A divided government is best because then both sides have to actually compromise or nothing gets done which in many cases is better than doing “something”
CA is a lesson of what the Super Majority can do. Wyoming will be quietly screwed if they know it or not.
It’s time for organized, mass disobedience, a la Ghandi. And MLK. What can they do if everyone refuses to play? If farmers and ranchers can or will no longer send their products to market? If the taxpayers don’t?
If it were me, I’d pull up stakes and move to a free state.
Money can only buy so much.
John
Correct me if I’m wrong here John. But don’t you live in Illinois? Did you flee the state or stand and fight?
You don’t think John is fighting? Then what is this website?
http://www.gunssavelife.com/
Damocles, jwm’s point is he’s questioning John’s advice to pull up stakes and move when that’s not what he did in his own state. Californians (some of them) get a little irritated when people continually wish it would just fall into the sea. I feel similarly when people say that about Florida.
What Matt said.
Just when you think it can’t get any worse, Cali proves that it’s the Mount Everest of stupid and the legislature is still reaching for the summit.
They are very smart. They are fulfilling the list. It’s almost done.
The only people that are dumb are the ones that allow this.
That’s what I said.
Over at arfcom, you brothers in arms in MA are telling the tale that MA not having enough national spot light and using the Boston Bombing as fodder will be doing their own disarmament parade
– 7 round magazine limit
– forced sale of lawfully held pre-ban magazines
– one gun a month
– one magazine a month
– mandatory liability insurance
– banning of “large capacity” firearms (almost all semiautos with the capability of accepting a 10+ round magazine)
Sure, some of this is for political headlines, but some will pass.
The DNC will go state by state for whatever they cannot get done at the Federal Level. And because collectivism says you follow without question, they will do without question or hearing the people.
– 25% tax on ammo and firearm sales
I son’t care what MA passes. I’m out of here asap.
Agreed…. Thank You Ralph!
People my climb Mt. Everest but it in it’s self does not change per say. Only the garbage on it, and the weather surrounding it.
It isn’t over until it is over…..I’m with Kestryl.
So, he is going to complain until nothing happens? Good job…
You know that a court case can take a life time? Meanwhile you are defenseless and subjugated. On top of that, judges aren’t on your side, they are the government.
In California the line appears to be draw at confiscation. I strongly doubt that though.
You are only as defenseless as you allow yourself to be.
California is a meaningless state to me.
If it were up to me Id force it to secede from the rest of the United States.
All its good for is bringing down the rest of the country with its wackco lifestyles failing economy and attitudes of the residents.
oh yea, Jay, it’s AAAAALL Us.
Florida doesn’t have any alternative lifestyles at ALL…. Certainly not enough for the official tourism website to have a Gay & Lesbian landing page 😉
http://visitflorida.com/gay_and_lesbian
Admit it, people who “don’t care” about and leave the states where the good NEEDS to be done, are doing way more damage than the “Wackos” that actually get all the blame.
move
The biggest issue in California is that our lawmakers and government in general have rejected reality and replaced it with their own. Look at Feinstein and Boxer in D.C. Or Senator Yee who for the first time had bills pass… This is the guy who tried to say Video Games are not Art and have the First Amendment changed to reflect his beliefs. Not to mention the amount of redundant laws. Hopefully the good people of California will start doing something. But we have a epidemic here. The sheer amount of people that have NO IDEA what goes on here in this state from a legislation all the way to not even knowing who the governor is… My mother is a state worker and still thought Schwarzenegger was in office. Or my friend who is a marine and firearm owner and had no idea these laws even passed. And didn’t believe me when I said they did.
A perfect summation of the liberal democrat political philosophy of life.
“We keep you alive to serve this ship…row well, and live.” ~ Quintus Arias
Governments can’t grant you your rights, they can only take them away.
The neo-Roman Left are betting that you would rather be chained to an ore,
a slave to the ship of state, than face being tossed overboard in your chains.
Uncertainty, anxiety, chaos…this is how these social anarchists grab power.
It’s also how they keep it. They’re not here to solve any problems, if anything,
they’re here to agitate and make them worse. There is much profit in chaos.
If you submit, they win. If you fight back, it gives them a reason to crush you,
and they win. To the social anarchist Left, spreading chaos is a win-win.
I feel like these pictures always have a lot of Lugers in them haha. Must be a lot of them in the wild.
Adapt, flee, or die….
That said above, there is something that is lacking here and it is called “crowd sourcing”. This is a new internet paradigm and it allows groups of people that share the same beliefs to have very strong impacts on National issues. The politicians are scared to death of it.
I saw it work brilliantly in the case of George Zimmerman just recently. It got so bad that the prosecution was reading that website daily and even mentioned it by name in court. So much information came from all involved that the defense had a much easier time that it would have had by themselves. It was a sight to behold.
Crowd sourcing needs direction though. People’s ideas must be channeled, evaluated and turned into research that members close to the information can then dig into. FOIA requests are funded. The dirt that can be uncovered is very smelly, and powerful. This is how you fight the fight these days. And don’t think for a minute the other side is not doing it.
The only way to defeat these people is to expose them, to shine a very bright spotlight on them 24/7, put them under intense sunlight. Sunlight is an excellent cleanser. And always maintain the stand: “THE TRUTH HAS NO AGENDA”.
Well, we need to remember that there’s only one thing to do about it…..
MOVE.
Oh, I don’t mean Californians, I mean all the REST of you!
SERIOUSLY
talk to the boys at your local gun club, or your range buddies, split an apartment a few ways, get your asses into the state. Then, when the next vote comes, suddenly there;s MILLIONS more gun-owners voting for some REAL change.
I mean, you’re always telling US how EASY it is to just pick up and relocate if we REALLY care about our rights, so SHOW US! Stop acting all superior, put your money where your mouth is, show you care about LIBERTY AND JUSTICE FOR ALL and
COME
AND
FIGHT.
Otherwise, shut the F*$^! up (and send a check to CalGuns)
I like your style.
I’ll second that. Best rhetorical judo move I’ve seen in a while.
Bravo! Wisht I’d thunk it first.
You’re overlooking one important detail: it’s much, much easier to move out of California and find a decent job than it is to move into California and find one…
I will be sending a check to CalGuns, though, so they can get a lawsuit moving on the new CA AWB. It should be easy enough to get that piece of garbage struck down, which will go a long way in the fight against cosmetic features bans elsewhere.
+1
That would be actually, kind of awesome. California is so big, there’s plenty of room at least.
I suggest turning your lead ammunition in to your nearest elected official 1 at a time….preferably at a velocity greater than 2000 fps.
Friends in Cali, keep your powder dry. Maybe the courts will overturn this. If not, I fear that Ruby Ridge 2 may happen.
Please publish links of groups who will bring the legal challenges so we can donate like we did for the CO recall.
This.
The game has been to throw the full weight of national (or international) resources into a local contest, pocket that win, then move on to the next target. When it isn’t a plumber and some grandmothers against Bloomberg, MAIG (Who are totes independent of Bloomey, and aren’t at all a paid front.), the local, state and national Democratic Party, & etc. look what happens. We don’t even have to match them dollar for dollar, just find good people on the ground and back them a little.
Tire their volunteers, drain their money and make them show their messaging and burn their smears, in CA. That’s stuff they can’t use somewhere else.
Pull the manufacturing, and tell them why:
– You’re trying to destroy the market we sell into, and taxing my business to fund it.
– You’ve effectively criminalized what our company makes. I don’t want to be part of a criminal enterprise, no matter how wrong-headed I think is your law that makes it so.
And most important, make them keep burning resources in places they think they’ve already won.
One other step, contact manufacturers, and tell them to please not sell to California governments. We need to get our side supporting our cause. I look at California most days as a lost cause, but my GOD was willing to spare Sodom for fifty righteous people, we can fight for California if for no other reason then that it keeps our own states from becoming scorched earth.
Personally i think our whole political and social system needs an overhaul from politicians that serve themselves and the special intrest groups lining their pockets to the tweens that can tell you every member of every boybands name age height favorite color and favorite food but cannot tell you which amendments are the bill of rights. Change does not happen all at once but slowly over time California is not lost it will not be lost until POTG there give up as long as they fight there is a chance for victory and i will be doing my best to support them from Kentucky.
I am sorry but California is already lost…..
If you continue trying to use the same tactics as you have been. As someone said earlier your actions are nothing but a continuous delaying action at best. You will not win that way. In this war over your rights you are on the defensive against a much larger force. In order to have chance you need to start increasing your ranks. You need to be using these “delaying actions” to buy time to massively increase the number firearm owners, and more importantly the numbers of pro 2nd amendment single issue voters.
Some recommendations I would suggest, start shooting clubs at as many colleges as possible. Have them compete against each other, and attempt to keep as much control over the club within the club. If a college refuses to allow there to be a shooting team, set up one anyway even unofficially. (one of the reason you would want schools that do allow a shooting team to be set up as little control as possible is so they can not prevent the colleges that can only have “unofficial” teams from competing in any competitions) With a shooting team presence on most campuses those that are already interested in shooting can much more easily reach out to others in order to bring them into the shooting field
Second use social media to reach out more to reach the younger generations. For example Richard Ryan is a pro gun YouTube content creator that knows and even takes out some of the biggest YouTube persons (like fredieview and others) Maybe try using him to set up some large shooting events aimed at getting 18-30 year olds who have never been shooting to the range. How many times have you heard stories of someone that had never shot a firearm or really had an interest in shooting become hooked to shooting after the first range trip, or even after the first shot. (great example every body should know Colin Noir)
And a little bit advise Keep these things free from any political leanings besides pro 2nd Amendment topics, in order not to drive off interested people. If you cant keep other political topics from being discussed as well than an unofficial libertarian leaning going to be your best bet not to drive any one away.
I just thought of this… you know the liberal crowd is always hollerin bout ban guns for the children. how many of us are pro 2a because we want our children to enjoy the same freedoms we enjoy and more and we want them to enjoy a world at peace which cannot be realized without being fought for and defended from those that would wish to destroy it? How come we never put that in our press releases?
QUICK, Tell me how many Gay and Lesbian friends I have. You seem to know, obviously.
How many of my Gay friends are happily married to their highschool sweethearts? How many are Virgins? Please, do tell me, oh expert on my social life.
To the numb scull that say “it’s 2013 get it together” because someone blamed the deviants of California, I say to you ” get your head out of your ass. Since when does the passing of the calendar mean that we loose morality along with the passing of time. I’m case you don’t see the reality, California has been the leaders in progressive change and they are paying for it.
California is certainly in turmoil because of its population of Mexicans, Asians and Gays. If you don’t get it let me help your un-discerning mind understand.
The amount of uninformed voters sway any election, which is why the Democrats cling to illegals, gays and minorities. Uninformed, uneducated people come from all over the world to America to escape their former country where the had no voice and were not allowed to cast an opinion. The grew up believing that their governments were every thing and they are nothing. They come to a free country and live in sort of a Stockholm syndrome. They do not know how to read between the lines of scumbag Democrat politicians. They hear there sweet words and along with there belief that America is great because of its government fall like a mosquito at a picnic. What they don’t understand is its the American resolve that build America, not its self-centered agendas, so yes the problem with California is GAYS, MEXICANS, VIETNAMESE, ANS THE ENTIRE UNINFORMED MELTING POT CALLED PROGRESSIVES. THE IRONY BEING THAT DEMOCRATS NEVER MAKE PROGRESS FOR IT CONSTITUENCY, ONLY FOR THEIR GREEDY POLITICIANS. WAKE THE F— UP, IT’S 2013
niceguns,
Anti gunners LOVE people like you. Your cartoon conservatism and simple ignorance confirms their picture of the typical gun owner. Do the movement a favor and shut up.
I’m sorry to offend you, how could I have known you were Gay. Who should understand the homosexual thought more than you. Denial is a dangerous thing. By the way, Keep sticking your head in the sand and let others be outspoken, you are exactly what anti gunner want, Bleeding hearts and Guys who are girls and girls who are guys, complete confusion. you are confused.
Look Ma, it’s a token racist! Glad you could come here and blame all of us minorities for problems created by other people. Last I checked plenty of WHITE people vote Democrat too. So they’re not part of the problem too?
Ooooh, but those “illegals” (read: people who speak Spanish), gays, and Asians. THEY MUST BE THE PROBLEM.
But hey, if you want to reinforce the mainstream media stereotype that owning guns and being hateful toward non-white ethnic groups goes hand in hand, knock yourself out, “niceguns”…
(eyeroll)
Signed,
Me, a 4th generation American of Chinese American descent, grandson of a WW2 veteran, taxpayer, and a gun owner. Born in Oakland, CA.
The likelihood of Kalifornia solving its problems politically are practically nil. There are only three choices now; the courts, a constitutional convention or disobedience. None are good.
ArmedVizsla, the fact that you refuse to discern the truth does not mean it does not exist. People like you should shut up, because your gutless hiding doesn’t help, Its destroying the country
I think for some states… like CA, NJ, NY, MA, Ect…. non-violent civil disobedience is in order. Your state is a “may-issue” (aka only the rich, politically powerful, and friends of judges get CCW)? Conceal carry anyway. It IS your second amendment right. If your state does not allow you that right then they can either make it so you can reasonably get the permit or they can secede. Magazine limits? Get whatever magazine you want. An “assault weapons” ban? Get a flash suppressor, pistol grip, and folding stock anyway. There will be martyrs, but I have a feeling this is the only way to make progress. By following these unconstitutional laws you are telling politicians “I will complain, but if you take away my rights I’ll just sit down and accept it.” Don’t play their game. We have innate human rights.
Blah! Blah! Blah! Endless debate. Preaching to the choir ad nauseum! Why is Kalifornia even a talking point? Face it, ladies: It is a lost cause. This is so for a very simple reason: PRO-2nd AMENDMENT VOTERS are OUTNUMBERED!! Kalif., like the lower NE states, NJ, Maryland and Ill., are controlled by a party that CANNOT, and WILL NOT be voted out of office. Think about it for a minute: Does anybody, with half a brain really believe that there will EVER be a pro-gun majority in the legislatures of these states? You’re dreaming!! Icing on the liberal cake: The last presidential election reveals that it has now become mathematically IMPOSSIBLE for a Republican to EVER get elected president again. Sorry folks, but this is the reality. Best you can do is move to a gun friendly state. We are NOT losing our country…….We HAVE lost our country. Deal with it.
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