Screen capture by Boch via YouTube.

Tallying up 31 months without a single homicide-free day, Chicago’s criminal community continues to keep the city’s mortuaries humming along. In fact, the city has totaled 482 homicides so far in 2022. That’s more homicides in a single city in America than 31 entire states reported in all of 2020, according to the Department of Justice.

While all murders are homicides, not all homicides are murders. Take, for instance, the case of a man who was sucker-punched by a big, burly bully while waiting to pay at a liquor store in the West Garfield Park neighborhood.

Security video shows the victim getting his CPU reset by a powerful blow to the head from behind as he paid for his purchase. Moments later, the victim returned to his feet. On his way out of the store, he pulled a pistol and when his attacker turned to look at him, the victim fired at the attacker “multiple times” according the the media report.

The sucker-puncher attempted to get back up but didn’t make it out of the store. He was later pronounced dead at a local hospital. You can see the uncensored full vide here.

That’s not a shooting most prosecutors will call justified self-defense. Chicago police haven’t identified the suspect or made any arrests yet. If it’s like 86.41% of the rest of the homicides so far this year in Chicago, they won’t.

Meanwhile, The Chicago Tribune reports on the prolific violence on the Windy City’s streets this way . . .

He beat up and robbed a man who was doing pizza deliveries. Then they became friends.

Their journey to friendship began in the most unlikely way.

On a snowy night in 2013, 22-year-old Ed Daniels Jr. jumped out of a red Ford Taurus on Chicago’s West Side with four men in tow. They beat up 56-year-old Guillermo Diaz — who was delivering pizza — and took all his money. Daniels was arrested that same night.

Nothing like burying their heads in the sand at the violence all around them. Perhaps that’s their coping mechanism. Either way, for the rest of us, Chicago simply isn’t safe.

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179 COMMENTS

  1. I didn’t see any great injustice committed. SOB walks up and decks you for no apparent reason. His life is forfeit. Maybe this doesn’t meet the strict criteria of legal self defense, but it looks right.

    • It should meet the standard but someone will make an issue about it. Its time to hold these demented people accountable and quite frankly it doesn’t bother me to see the guy die. If he did it to this other guy without provocation just think of how many times he may have done this on the street.

    • If someone walks up and stabs you it is attempted murder and if you do not die and can defend yourself the use of deadly force is justified even if your assailant’s back is towards you, etc. Same holds true for a sucker punch which can kill you, leave you brain dead, etc. Perp did not hit and run, instead he hung around so the threat for more bodily harm for the already very rattled victim remained present and real therefore the perp received what he legally deserved IMO.

      • Wrong, that will get you put into a prison cell in all 50 states. The threat must be a viable threat in that the threat as Ability, Opportunity, and intent. Since in this video example the “victim” walked away (had the ability to escape) only to turn around and draw his firearm and then shoot a man that was standing away from him and not attacking him, that is murder. Your example of the threat with a knife that stabbed you is another example that would land you in jail. If the threat is moving away from you or has their back towards you do not have the necessary criteria to use deadly force as the person standing with their back to you does not have the immediate opportunity to cause you harm. Just because you are fearful does not give one the legal right to use deadly force. Many people are fearful of Clowns, they can not shoot all Clowns they come in contact with unless the Clown shows ability, opportunity, and intent.

        • I would say the attacker turning around would be indicative of intent to return and continue the attack. Especially if I were lying on the floor, just having been sucker-punched.

        • Incorrect medic. Any halfway fit adult male can kill you with a hard enough blow to your temple. The fact he had already done it and was about to do it again means the shooting is justified.

          No one has the right the clock anyone in the dome in aggression. It’s lethal force. There’s a big misunderstanding that an unarmed man cannot be shot. It’s not true. People get beaten to death with bare hands everyday.

        • If the threat is moving away from you or has their back towards you do not have the necessary criteria to use deadly force

          Simple, if he’s walking away yell “hey asshole” and when he turns to give you a second helping for your “stupidity” empty a magazine in his dumbass…. Oooops, “feared for my life”.

        • At this point we don’t know what led up to the sucker punch. If the shooter somehow provoked the sucker punch, that might change the way we look at this whole encounter.

          Assuming the sucker punch was unprovoked, it does not appear that the man in the white shirt represents a continuing threat to the man in the black shirt sufficient to justify deadly force. That still would not make the shooting murder however, as the act appears to done in the heat of passion rather than premeditated. This would make it manslaughter.

        • I don’t care if it’s legal, it’s still right. Even if they had beef the guy who got hit was facing away, not engaged, and got sucker punched in the back. There can be no justification for that no matter anyone may have to said anyone else before.

          Outcomes like this are the only way a$$holes will learn.

        • I’m guessing you aren’t actually a Medic, or you would have seen what posterior cephalic trauma can do to people. Where is Crimson Pirate, he’ll back me up on that. And @Kyle, that is an incredibly salient point sir.

        • Not all states have Duty to Retreat, and many have Castle Defense that includes anywhere you entitled to be.

        • Wrong, that will get you put into a prison cell in all 50 states.

          Not necessarily true, as a resident of a “stand your ground state” AND a disabled veteran in THAT exact scenario (with the exception of waiting til I was up and out the door) I could have dropped that asshole while fearing for MY life. Stay down wait for the cops, call your lawyer and request transport to the hospital for treatment of head, neck and back pain don’t say shit, let the video and your lawyer do the talking. It’s not just the “sucker-punch” from behind it is also what your head comes in contact with when you go down.

        • Glad the sucker puncher died (assuming he hit an innocent stranger). Legally, it was probably, well, not legal to shoot, but it would probably go down a manslaughter.

      • Debbie W,
        I suggest you go to the website “Law of self defense”
        Attorney Andrew Branca discusses self defense law applicable to all 50 states.
        Yes, the shooter was the victim of a potentially deadly force attack.
        The attacker then ceased the attack and withdrew.
        Commenter Medic 28 is correct.
        Legally when the attacker withdraws (by turning around) you cannot initiate a second confrontation in revenge.
        Your window to use deadly force in self defense opens and closes in seconds.
        In this situation the shooter has lost the required elements of innocence and imminence as the original attack is over.

        While my sense of justice is satisfied when the shooter killed that thug, he better hope the police don’t find him, as he is on very shaky ground with that revenge attack.

        • Docuduracoat wrote in part:
          “Your window to use deadly force in self defense opens and closes in seconds.”
          More like as little as a fraction of a second, though sometimes longer.

    • It’s not self defense at all, but… I don’t care. Not caring here.

      The sucker-puncher attempted to get back up but didn’t make it out of the store. He was later pronounced dead at a local hospital.

      Good. I like a world where if you randomly punch someone in the head, you might get immediately shot. I like it.

    • It’s not a matter of justice, unfortunately, it’s a matter of what the law says and how woke the prosecutor is.

  2. Just like Paul Harrell says: “The bullet was caught by the T-shirt on the back of the target”. You would think in a place like Chicago you would grow up knowing not to start up with people you do not know.

    • You would think in a place like Chicago you would grow up knowing not to start up with people you do not know.

      But the LAW says that guy should not have a concealed handgun, if you can’t trust your victim to be a law-abiding citizen then what can you trust?

  3. “Victim” was 19 years old according to the video..
    Question-Why is a 19 year old buying alcohol?

    • Maybe he was buying a pack of gum, a pocket comb and a pint of Old Harper but he forgot his ID in his other pants…

        • I agree Chris T in KY. I’m tired of this double standard for adulthood. If you’re not smart enough to understand the affects of alcohol at 18, how can you help pick the next president at the same age? If you aren’t mature enough to know what smoking will do to your body at 18, how can you be mature enough to take hormone blockers at 10? If you aren’t responsible enough to buy a handgun at 18, how is it that we’ll let you join the military and die for your country at 18?

          Pick one damn age for adulthood and make it universal across the board.

      • Legal age for alcohol and tobacco is 18 in my part of the world.

        That’s would work IF Chiraq was in YOUR part of the world.

    • fyi
      Ferguson Missouri Michael Brown, was 18 years old when he shoplifted tobacco. And later tried to murder a police officer, who tried to arrest him for shoplifting.

      • Just to clarify: Michael Brown didn’t shoplift, he committed strong arm robbery, assaulting and battering the store employee. And he was walking in the middle of the street when Officer Wilson flagged him down from his patrol car and told him to not walk in the street.

        Wilson was not responding to a robbery call, but Brown thought he was, which was why Brown attacked and punched Wilson in his patrol car and attempted to grab his gun. Brown’s punches fractured Wilson’s eye socket, and his grip on the gun prevented Wilson from firing more times in self defense. Brown retreated, Wilson got out of the car, and then Brown charged him. That’s when Wilson fired in self defense and stopped the threat.

  5. It will be interesting if he’s eventually charged.

    It did not look like a legit self-defense shoot to me, but the eventual outcome doesn’t bother me in the least.

    The world is better off with the sucker-puncher not in it…

  9. “…”482 homicides so far in 2022.

    The problem lies in Indiana; loose gun controls allow illegal guns to flow into Illnoise, and Chi-town, unfairly reducing violent crime in Indiana. There should be border checkpoints all along the Indiana/Illnoise border, with instant deportation back to Indiana, where those illegal guns will go unsold, and crime will rise in Indy, to match Chi-town.

    • Is it? If your kid sucker punched someone in your suburban ass neighborhood and got shot for it, would your opinion of the person pulling the trigger be the same? Murder is murder, man. This was NOT self defense.

      • This was NOT self defense.

        No, it was awarding a “stupid” prize to the asshole that played the “stupid” game.
        If my kid was such a punk that he had to sucker punch someone from behind I’d say whatever he got he deserved…
        Not murder, maybe Man 1…

      • So Montana, what if the person who got hit died? What would your opinion be then? Because I’ll guarantee you you know at least one person who could easily kill someone with a blow like that. Thankfully that punch was absolutely atrocious. I’m actually not claiming he deserved to die for it, but I don’t feel sorry for him either.

      • If my kid was stupid enough to go around committing battery and got shot, it would be a natural consequence. My own sister committed battery, got beat up for it and went to jail. I didn’t shed a tear for her stupid choices.

      • Montana Actual,

        Consider a very similar parallel scenario:

        A punk surprise attacks a woman and proceeds to rape her. After his release, the punk pulls up his pants, fastens his belt, and walks 10 feet way where he stops to look at a vase. While he is standing there looking at the vase with his back to the woman victim, she pulls out a firearm and shoots him.

        Is the woman’s action a murder? Technically speaking, it may very well be. Is the woman’s action justice? I would argue that it is. And there is not a jury in the world that would convict her.

        • The problem with comparing that hypothetical to the included story is that we don’t know the backstory to the Chicago incident. Life didn’t begin at the beginning of the video. Other things could have transpired. What if the shooter had previously sucker punched the dead dude’s little brother? What if he had sexually assaulted his sister? What if he had previously bullied him? What if he deserved that sucker punch? We can’t determine what is justice because we may not know the entire story. That’s why gun owners have to be careful about getting involved in third party disputes.

          Regarding your hypothetical, there was a similar story in the news recently. I think it was posted here. A lady went out of her way to kill a guy. She claimed prior sexual abuse. She may not have been prosecuted. I can’t find the story.

      • Bullshit. A blow with a fist to the back of the head (particularly in the area at or slightly above c6-c7) is most definitely a potentially fatal blow . . . it IS “deadly force”. Deadly force is permitted to defend AGAINST deadly force in all 50 states. Now, the shooter may (probably will) get prosecuted, but pretending a sucker punch in the back of the skull is not “deadly force” just shows your medical ignorance.

        • LampOfDiogenes,

          You and I are on the same page.

          If a violent criminal just tried to shoot someone in the head, still had his/her gun in hand at his/her side (pointed at the ground), stepped a few feet away, and was simply looking at something with his/her back to the victim: is he/she still a credible threat of death or grievous bodily harm? In my world: yes.

          How is that scenario which I just mentioned any different than the topic of this article? As long as the sucker puncher was still within a few feet of the victim, I believe the sucker puncher was still a credible threat of death or grievous bodily harm.

        • Sorry if I misinterpreted your comment. A sucker punch to the back of the head (any traumatic injury at or near the brainstem) can cause death – often nearly instantaneously. As I said above and below, I don’t know (and none of us do) what happened before or after the video clip, which might be relevant to determining murder, manslaughter, or valid self defense. We simply don’t have enough information. The one thing we DO know, from the video, is that the sucker punch was “deadly force”.

      • If your kid is sucker punching people they deserve to get shot. You don’t punch people unless you are willing to die for those actions. It’s a pretty simple concept you can’t seem to grasp.

        What’s next? Breaking and entering? What’s the problem, they are not in danger, only there to steal your things and leave.

        People like you are the problem and why we have people who think this kind of behavior is alright.

      • There goes Hannah Montana, spouting off about shit she/he/it has no clue of again.

        If someone sucker punched you in the dome, would you just take it? If that same person then came at you again, you would just stand there and take it again?

        I doubt it.

        There is no law that says you must play fisticuffs because you’re attacker is “unarmed”.

        No one is unarmed. Bare hands and feet kill thousands of people a year.

    • Would have looked better if he’d shot the asshole while still on the floor then could have claimed fear for his life

  14. Another problem i see with the “good guy” is that he pulled his gun from the bag instead of his holster.

    • A problem how, exactly? Off-body carry is a choice, and while we can disagree with them about whether it’s a good idea, lots of people choose to do it that way.

  18. Completely agree Dennis. Swift street justice is ideal. And I’ve been in all those chit Chiraq hoods…

    • “An armed society is a polite society. Manners are good when one may have to back up his acts with his life.”

      ― Robert A. Heinlein, Beyond This Horizon

  19. I suffered a head injury by way of an unjustified and potentially deadly sucker punch. I have only vague memories of what happened next. If I had not been struck in the head and suffered that trauma nothing would have happened.

  20. quote———Either way, for the rest of us, Chicago simply isn’t safe.———quote

    Of course its not safe as states with lax laws ship in thousands of second hand guns into Chicago as verified by two Chicago Studies and by Law Enforcement stats in numerous homicide tracings of weapons. An Iron Pipe Line has been identified by the ATF that ships in thousands of second hand guns to big cities with tough laws making such laws totally useless. Its pure insanity.

    No civilized nation on the planet permits such madness except in Capitalvania where the Far Right consider life cheap and expendable.

    Every gun sale should be vetted and every gun owner should be required by law to have safe storage of deadly weapons. These laws have proven track records in other countries. In Switzerland that is awash in weapons they have 20 times less gun homicide rates than in Capitalvania which now is running rivers of blood and carnage by the hour. In Japan they had just 1 death by gunfire compared to the madness of Capitalvania where 40,000 people a year are gunned down in a river of blood and carnage.

    Capitalvania is so uncivilized its normal to let people die in the street like dogs because they cannot even afford old fashioned life saving drugs like insulin. Again thank the gangster criminal Republicans for such unnecessary deaths which on average amount to 150, 000 people dying because they cannot afford life saving drugs or even affordable preventable health care. This does not happen in civilized Socialist Countries like Europe, Japan, South Korea, Taiwan and even believe it or not” in many 3rd Word African countries who have lower infant mortality rates than in West Virginia. Shocking beyond belief.

    Any American these days that says “I am proud to be an American” is obviously a member of the ignorant and depraved Far Right. There is no guaranteed health care, there is no affordable drug care, vicious gangs can buy all the weapons they could ever want and maniacs get assault rifles ever day. Its a nation gone completely mad. And to top it off the Far Right support a depraved ex-President that tried to establish a one party Nazi dictatorship and will vote for him again if given the chance. They scream they want him dictator for life.

    Its to detailed to go onto here but Capitalvania has already gone down the same road to destruction the Roman Empire did over 2,000 years ago. History does indeed repeat itself.

    • WOW: THAT was a Bonafide RANT, good one moron… Glad you could find a couple of “studies” that flat out, unquestionably PROVED that pro-gun STATES are shipping ALL of their old, used and unwanted guns to Chicago… You do understand how stupid shit like that makes YOU sound, right?

      “They scream they want him dictator for life.”

      Guess you missed the whole Braindead thing with the Satanic/Nazi backdrop huh, only things missing were a swastika and a pentagram…

        • Southern,

          Well, since he is DEFINITELY trash, that is axiomatic, is it not? His mama has been trying to kick him out, and get her Internet and laptop back, for years.

          Have you noticed that most of our trolls are just flat-out LIARS??

          Prince Albert, the Fake-Limey Ponce, is neither British nor an “ex-military firearms instructor” (even the British military isn’t THAT f***ed up!).

          dacian the demented never went to college (or flunked out, early on), and knows literally jack squat about firearms, isn’t the age he claims to be.

          Why do they lie???

      • More rhetorical questions? Hell, that numbnuts can’t tell you his name. He is as stupid as he sounds.

    • Remove the twenty counties run by Democrats that are the source of the majority of the murders in the country, and “Capitalvania” is as safe as Switzerland.

    • The dacian screed reads exactly like Soviet propaganda during the Cold War. Almost word for word.

      The little racist insurrectionist never fails to parrot propaganda.

      • Betraying his “education”. Wasted his life on a revolution that never happened. How would things turn out if was making capital instead of reading flawed 19th century descriptions about its “evils”?

    • dacian, Maybe if they would just make killing or murder illegal, then they wouldn’t have to worry about who has guns?

    • dacian the demented dips***,

      ” . . . states with lax laws ship in thousands of second hand guns into Chicago . . . “. ‘Zat so??? Then why don’t THOSE states have the same crime/murder rates as Chitcago, you lying sack of canine excrement????? Perhaps, just PERHAPS, the uniform Dimocrat/Leftist/fascist rule of Chitcago has SOMETHING to do with it.

      You not only remain too stupid to insult, you appear to strive each day to increase your stupidity,. And you are succeeding. To quote Dean Wurmer, “Fat, drunk, and stupid is no way to go through life, boy!” Too bad that’s all an uneducated, ignorant clown like you isn’t capable of anything else. Must suck hard to be a college dropout, “educated” one. Does your mama know your using her computer again???

      • LampOfDiogenes, Dacian is part right. He’s so close to the other half of the truth that its infuriating. The problem in Chicago is of two parts. The first part is that gun control there has stopped law abiding citizens from being able to defend themselves. The second part of his equation is the only bit he wants to talk about. Their gun control HASN’T stopped criminals from bringing guns in and their Justice Department won’t keep criminals locked up.

        Whether this shooting is justified or not, the problem in Chicago is that a victim of violence being able to fight back is almost non existent making little to no deterrent for criminals.

      • “. ‘Zat so??? Then why don’t THOSE states have the same crime/murder rates as Chitcago,

        Did you not understand what you read? IF THOSE states are shipping ALL of THEIR excess guns to Chiraq they don’t have enough left to run around the streets killing folks willy-nilly… (hope I don’t need to point out SARCASM)

      • To the Lamp that went out in his head.

        Quote—————- Then why don’t THOSE states have the same crime/murder rates as Chitcago,——–quote

        As usual you make wild generalizations that are so poor they do not even make a point as a good generalization would. But I am sure that is way over the head of a high school drop out.

        In reality many Conservative big cities and states do indeed have high crime and murder rates and those that have slightly lower are either much lower in population size and also usually have more decent higher paying jobs. But again a high school drop out would never look at the stats on anything.

        Try again Hill Jack you flunked out again.

        • and also usually have more decent higher paying jobs.

          So, you ARE referencing RED cities which do have much lower crime rates than those “stellar” blue cities that YOU admire so much… You ARE the weakest link…

        • dacian the demented dips***.

          “But I am sure that is way over the head of a high school drop out.”

          Hmm, big talk from a guy who never graduated college (probably didn’t even ATTEND college), addressed to a guy who has four degrees, you lying sack of s***.

          “In reality many Conservative big cities and states do indeed have high crime and murder rates . . .”

          REALLY???? Name me ten. Go ahead, I dare you.

  22. Aint nothin’ but a G-thang. A G-thang being bleeding out on a liquor store floor in a $7 white tee and basketball shorts over “disrespect”.

    Lol no sympathy from me for scumbags like that

  23. First line under the video:

    Police said just before 4:15 p.m. a man was inside a liquor store in the 200-block of North Pulaski when he was approached by an unknown offender who pulled out a gun and opened fire.

    What the he!!? They make it sound like nothing occurred before the shooting.

  24. I being a demented and awful person would like to see a closeup of the criminals face when the first round landed

  25. “mutual combatants?”

    That guy was carrying Israeli too, I don’t think this one’s gonna pass the self defense muster.

    I realize that street justice works differently but he would have been better off to wait long enough to be some place there wasn’t cameras with absolute certainty.

    I don’t think that he’s got a leg to stand on for a self defense claim personally. Then again will he be prosecuted for it? Goodness knows considering their kinder, gentler “equitable” DA’s office.

  26. Not Sh!tbird’s first sucker punch but definitely his last.

    As he lay bleeding out, the last thought in his addled mind was: “I really f☆cked up this time”.

    • “As he lay bleeding out, the last thought in his addled mind was: “I really f☆cked up this time”.”

      Rather than quoting Dave Chappelle, the last thought was likely, “What the hell just happened?”

    • No this particular idiot did not regret his decision he was trying to get up to continue fighting the guy he sucker punched. Sure he learned nothing and did not understand why he got shot. These are the people you are dealing with.

  28. Gee, cities are so cool and fun. Homeless on every corner, drugs and needles on the sidewalk, violent mental patients packed in shoulder to shoulder, everything costs more, 24/7 noise, not a star in the sky.

    But cities have a lot of good things too like brown people to serve vaguely ethnic food to you and your white young liberal professional friends and that’s inclusive.

  29. What a shock!! The People’s Democratic Socialist Republic of Chitcago, with the most draconian gun laws outside of HI, CA, or NY, has a gun violence problem. Probably has something to do with the Lefist/fascists that have been RUNNING that third world s***hole for half a century. This be my shocked face.

    Play stupid games; win stupid prizes. They voted for this, and, as H.L. Mencken said, they deserve to get it . . . good and hard.

  30. So, I guess this is what bringing a sucker punch to a gunfight looks like.
    Unfortunately for Mr Suckerpuncher he chose a victim that went ‘next level’ on his a$$.
    Well, live (for a few more fleeting moments) and learn.

  32. To me it looked like one gang banger (with a side kick in black) sucker punching a member from a different gang for being in the wrong territory, plus nearly instant revenge.

    • can’t know. more likely random, as in off yer meds. goes on quite a bit lately except most of them don’t get shot.

  35. I’ll ruffle some feathers with some truth, and I’m gonna be troll-y about it to sink the point home. If the following offends you, good, it’s meant to. I’m putting aside the subtle tactics and taking out the 2×4 to beat you in the head harder than the guy who got shot in that video.

    ===

    Look at all the sheep in this comment section bleating away in furtherance of the Lefts position without even realizing that they’re doing it. Lori Lightfoot is laughing her ass off while Marcuse sings your praises from Hell. A few dead bodies and the 2A community is suddenly full of people who will abandon their principles at the drop of a fuckin’ hat to purchase a little bit of “safety” on credit by giving away their liberty. Worse, they’ll give away that which is not theirs to give: the Liberty of others.

    Is it pathetic and sad or an example of how well manipulation works on people who pay no attention to the world and then do as they were taught and lie to themselves to feel better?

    Either way, it’s a nifty trick to get you to sell yourself down the river while engaging in moral preening. P.T. Barnum ain’t got shit on the modern Dems. You’re on a plantation and can’t even see it.

    And now you’re wondering why I’d be so mean, hurting your feelz and stuffz.

    Because you’re falling for the same trick Hitler, Stalin, Mao and others pulled and I bet you think you know some history. This is a tried and true tactic because you fall for it every time.

    Decide solution that no one wants but increases your power. –> Create problem.–> Public demands solution. –> Provide prepackaged solution you couldn’t sell before.–>Enjoy increased power.

    You guys are asking for a police state a la China and you don’t even realize that you’re helping .gov erect it. Hell, you’ll probably knowingly vote for it when given the chance.

      • Yeah, strych9 usually makes sense but this sounds like a drunken rant. And he’s talking about comments I don’t see.

        • I don’t tend to pick on people by name and I don’t drink or use other substances. I’d suggest that when you see something you find “odd” that you should default to asking questions rather than jumping to conclusions.

          But, since my comment worked as designed (sorry about that hook in your mouth, hope the bait was tasty enough)…

          Look at the people ^up there^ saying things like “I don’t care about the law” or “there’s no injustice” or other various forms of emoting about this situation.

          They gotcha by the balls yet you don’t see it. This is how Hitler’s people built the Gestapo. Eliminate the cops who won’t follow orders, create chaos, people say “Damn what’s right, we need order!” and voila! a police state, just like you asked for. This is what Mao did and the CCP still does (on a smaller scale because they already have most of the control).

          When you say “Damn the law!” in a situation like this what you’re really saying is “Damn the rule of law” and that’s code for “Damn the Republic”. I rather doubt that most of the people saying this are 5th columnists. I suspect they’ve been tricked into emoting an irrational position without considering the consequences.

          Can’t see it? Well, your adversaries certainly do. They’ve written very long essays, even whole books on how to maneuver you into exactly this position and then capitalize on it. They’ve been doing this at the level of school boards for decades and getting away with it. I’ve been pointing this out for 20 years. This is just a bigger version with more serious consequences.

          Which should give you pause. Not only are these people, skilled, sociopathic, highly manipulative and well funded they’re entirely unscrupulous. Kill you? Sure, why not? You’re a terrorist, afterall, right? And they already know they can drone Americans without due process and not face consequences other than applause.

        • “Sure, why not? You’re a terrorist, afterall, right?”

          To avoid anarchy, demand the shooter’s head on a platter?

          I’d say, if anything, selective enforcement of law is straight from the same tactics book as Alinsky.

          And doesn’t Alinsky recommend doing what you accuse your enemy of doing???

    • Man, I don’t know what you’re smokin’ but THAT bullshit diatribe probably gave dacian a “stiffy”… That was a pretty broad blanket to cover a handful of morons, you should probably reread that screed after you sober up and we’ll await that apology… Anyway, grab a nap, take a pill and it will all look better in the morning…

      • If you got mad then you were the target audience. I told you that up front.

        Now, stop emoting, start paying attention and then start thinking.

        Or don’t. But don’t complain to me when your feet hit the woodchipper.

    • TLDR

      I put your opinion on par with Dacian. You are equally clueless but so is most of TTAG so you’re in good company.

    • Strych, I would argue the law, as you or I know it, or should I say, *knew* it, doesn’t exist anymore.

      Rule of law, especially black letter law, while a preferable way to run society is all but dead in this country. Sure, at the SCOTUS level, it may still be applied, but consider the following.

      1. Police are either forced or too afraid to do their job. Source: 2020 riots and selective enforcement of laws since.

      2. Prosecutors simply prosecute those they don’t agree with, and simply don’t prosecute those they do agree with.

      3. Judges are political.

      4. Juries don’t know the law.

      5. The media will judge you guilty or innocent based upon your politics.

      6. The court of public opinion weighs more power then the actual courts.

      So you can’t blame people for cheering on a Robin Hood these days. Justice is on its way to being something that is going to have to be done personally. Or you’re simply going to have to bend over and take it.

      I’m certain jurisdictions, yeah, you could still play by the old rules. But in places like Chicago? Hell. The kings men there are the law. And the kings men decide who is guilty and who is innocent. And the kings men are criminals, leftists, and the media.

      We simply don’t live in the country we used to 10, even 5 years ago.

  36. aaaaaand that’s a life sentence. Stupid. Especially in Chicago. This is what a big ego looks like. He could have walked away, collected himself, asked “wtf” and then gone about life, but nope. Yea, you got sucker punched. Yea, it’s an illegal act and threat to your life technically. But you collected yourself, stood up and started walking away while two other people got involved to separate you from the attacker. Then, in safety, you decided to murder someone no longer posing a threat to you. They did not charge you again. You stopped and made the conscious decision to murder them for hitting you. There was attack taking place at the time, it was over. Now if you stood there in the door way wondering wtf just happened and were rushed again, that would be self defense. But this, was murder.

    • In fact, you can see the dude try to fight back but the other guy is in the way. I wish the camera had audio, cuz I’m willing to bet the dude didn’t get “sucker punched”, he probably had a loud mouth. And I agree with strych9… or, well, part of the drunken rant at least – it’s funny seeing this forum not even aware of the fact you idiots are basically calling for mob justice by saying this is justified. Pathetic.

      Everyone in the store looking at the dude that got punched after he is at the door like “finally, get the fuck out dude”. Not that anyone deserves to be hit like that, but sometimes, yea… they do. Better late than never.

      Still, murder. Not self defense. Not justified. Both are scum despite what this comment section thinks like one shooter just “took out the trash”.

      • And I agree with strych9… or, well, part of the drunken rant at least – it’s funny seeing this forum not even aware of the fact you idiots are basically calling for mob justice

        Funny, I thought he was talking about you…

        • it’s funny seeing this forum not even aware of the fact you idiots are basically calling for mob justice

          Oh, look you did get part of the main point of my “drunken” rant.

          The other point is that the Left wants you to call for that and they want people to do it and midwits screaming “facts over feelings” will fall for it 99 out of 100 times.

          “In order to ensure the security and continuing stability, the Republic will be reorganized into the first Galactic Empire! For a safe and secure society!”

          This game’s not new yet the Right mostly doesn’t see it. Many abandon their principles because, really, they don’t have any. Enough of that happens and you get a police state. Now the only question is who’s going to control that police state.

          It’s not you and it’s not people who like you either. How do you feel about one-way train rides?

        • it’s funny seeing this forum not even aware of the fact you idiots are basically calling for mob justice

          Not about MOB justice, but I can assure You if some dumbass smacks me in the back of the head like that the stupid will drain out of him as fast as the blood from the several 10mm induced ports in his body, you call it what YOU like I’ll call it life and death… You might FEELZ like the smartest person in the room but when you get to THAT point you become dacian. You’ll find yourself on the one-way train ride LONG before I will, (hint) they won’t get me on that train alive and when I go out, I won’t be going alone. Enjoy your little safe and secure, head in the sand life.

        • What YOU would have done, and more importantly HOW you would have done it was NOT what was done here. End of story. Your “feelings” and more importantly, opinions, are irrelevant. It’s murder. What you describe COULD be self defense. THIS INCIDENT was NOT self defense.

          How many seconds passed after the hit and what happened during that time IN THIS INCIDENT? Or, as the vaguely worded article puts it “moments later”.

        • First of all, I NEVER said it was self-defense, in fact somewhere up there I believe I called it “possibly Man 1″… If you want to bring irrelevance into the conversation you should take a deep hard look at the drivel you manage, which could hardly be considered earth shattering.
          It’s cool if you all want to play “dacian for a day” I guess everyone is entitled to an attack of stupid from time to time (yeah even me)…

        • So, you’re bound and determined to help tyrants seize power because someone on the web said something that struck a nerve? You’re dead set that if something happens to you you’re gonna go to prison or get blasted into the hereafter by the cops because someone on a website gave you unvarnished facts in what you consider to be an impolite manner?

          Because, you know, that’s extremely mature and totally not emo at all. Because when I think of “adult behavior” making grand claims of planned self-immolation for no particular reason really tops the list.

          If I didn’t know better I’d simply tell you to “Glow harder”.

          However, since I have read what you have to say quite a bit I’ll say this: “Calm down, think a bit and fight smarter rather than harder because I know damn well that you can do so”.

          As for the rest, this has sweet-fuck-all to do with mob justice.

          It has to do with what, at this point, should be an obvious long-term and widespread agenda of provoking wider and deeper civil unrest as a justification to crack down on political adversaries and use every tool of the state to do it. How you die doesn’t matter to them. Don’t believe it? Just look at the documents out of the UK right now on how they’re planning for civil unrest this winter. Civil unrest they’ve created the cause for and which they steadfastly refuse to address. Germany’s the same. Ditto the Netherlands.

          This is about optics at this point in time. Yeah, sounds stupid but that’s how you control a mass of people, you prime them first and you do that with optics controlled by propaganda. If you know the other side is working the optics you counter that by not being what they say you are. Then when shit goes sideways there’s a much better chance that the majority are on your side, or at least don’t have strong feelings against you, rather than cheering your oppression/demise.

          Once shit goes nuts people will divide themselves along lines they basically understood before things hit the fan. They always do. You want those lines to be drawn as favorably to you as possible. That’s what this is about.

        • You want those lines to be drawn as favorably to you as possible.

          If that means kissing THEIR ass then I’ll take my chances, I’ll draw my own line with a lot of other like-minded individuals. You feel that survival is more important than personal pride that’s your business. So far, you’ve out posted me about 50 words to one, so I guess you are the winner, this back-and-forth bullshit accomplishes nothing, and you’ve not said anything that has made an impression on me, maybe they’ll line you up against the wall next to dacian and Minerva… Better a corpse than a slave…

        • Personally, MAXX, not calling for “mob justice” at all, simply noting that a “sucker punch” to the back of the head IS “deadly force”, by definition. The shooter will likely be prosecuted, and MAY, depending on the circumstances beyond what we see on the video, be convicted of something. But immediately calling it “not self defense” in categorical terms is legally incorrect, and factually stupid. Use of deadly force is permitted in defense against deadly force EVERYWHERE in the US. Now, there are limits . . . some states impose “duty to withdraw”, require that the force used in defense be “equivalent”, make distinctions around “heat of the moment”, etc. That’s for a judge and jury to decide. To categorically state the response was NOT “self defense”?? Based on what? What are the laws applicable to self defense in Chitcago? What happened before and after the video? I don’t know, and neither do you (unless you were an eyewitness). All I’m saying is all the categorical “that’s not self defense” nonsense is both medically and legally bullshit. It may not meet all applicable requirements of Illinois law, but again, that’s for a judge and jury to sort out.

      • When I seem drunk the the reason is because I’ve connected a bunch of topics you aren’t well versed in and I don’t care to type out 20 pages of background information so other people can play paint-by-numbers.

        Or maybe I strung things together in a manner designed to elicit a response. I mean, FFS, this OP even came with an explanation in the first paragraph and people are still confused… makes me wonder what happened to that “armed intelligentsia”.

        Or… should I retract my long-standing claim that TTAG’s average commentator is at least two sigma to the right of the average Breitbart comment section inhabitant when it comes to intelligence?

        • Maybe you’re just an inarticulate moron who thinks vomiting up word salad is a substitute for saying something meaningful. And again, stop flattering yourself; if nobody else will give it to you, then you’re simply not entitled to the praise.

        • Flak over the target. Hence the first paragraph where I called this.

          “It’s easier to fool people than to convince them that they have been fooled.”

          It’s extremely tempting to roll with emotion and simply say “Shoot that asshole”. That’s why it makes such good bait in the trap that’s being set for you.

        • cyberballs with no life, what makes you qualified to read the mind of the shooter? Because that’s what counts, and he just had a massive hit to the brain. Maybe you should quit quoting Star Wars and pay more attention. Seems like you can’t stand not having the last word, either, lol.

        • “…Seems like you can’t stand not having the last word, either, lol.”

          How apt.

          You see, I’ve been here far longer than I care to admit, and Strych is among the very rarest of the TTAG’ers who comment – Pretty much every time he goes off on a rant, it’s well worth the time to read and contemplate on what he’s written.

          Please, feel free to ignore or mock him, those know what he offers are grateful he spends the time he has here in TTAG…

        • strych9,

          I sometimes (often?) disagree with you, but . . . you are seldom outright irrational. I agree, “mob justice” is NOT a goal to which anyone (except Leftist/fascists) aspires. (See my response to MADMAXX, above.)

          IF a judge and jury found that the actions of the shooter were within the law as an act of self defense, would that change your answer? I was very careful, even though I BELIEVED he was guilty, not to call OJ Simpson a murderer before his trial. He was acquitted. He lost his subsequent civil trial for “wrongful death”, meaning that one jury found the evidence didn’t meet the “beyond a reasonable doubt” standard for criminal prosecution, but another found it DID meet the “preponderance of the evidence” standard for civil liability. The correct analysis is – OJ Simpson killed his wife and her lover, but is not a murderer. I still think he is guilty of killing his wife, but I can’t call him a murderer.

          These distinctions MATTER.

        • i’ve known plenty of hard drinking diabetics. it ain’t pretty; i suspect this does not describe you.
          oh, and you left out the swedish nuance party.

      • Lol this guy will never get caught and his actions were fully justified. Just because someone mouths off does not mean you start punching them. The craziness that comes out of your mouth keeps getting worse.

    • Y’all are playing by the rules to a game.

      A game which has changed. The rules you speak of mean little anymore.

      I don’t celebrate this fact. But I do not deny it.

  37. What if…. People don’t start no $h!t and there won’t be no $h!t?

    I don’t have much sympathy for the guy who’s DRT but it seems the shooter is a white guy. If so it’s probable he’ll be apprehended and treated to more scrutiny than the typical Chiraq shooter.

    Takeaway: stay dafuq away from Chicago.

    • How about a general rule? If your local liquor store has to keep all items secured behind a wall, then it’s past time to think about relocating. Check your local store, and act accordingly. There are much better places to live.

  41. See my original comment. It still stands. Maybe they had history, or not. Maybe it started verbal, maybe not. Mr. Suckerpunch started the violence.
    No audio so maybe there were more threats. Mr. Shooter may have had a long walk home. Don’t know don’t care. Legally self defense? Probably not. Street justice? Definitely yes. Act like a thug get treated Iike one.
    Of course it’s what the left wants. They could clean it up but don’t want to. It happens there everyday. Read the article with the video, doesn’t nearly describe what I saw.

    • At this point Sh!tcago is little more then a “Grand Theft Auto” server come to life.

      No need trying to understand the why.
      It’s just a day in the life of a ‘Sh!tshow Sh!tcago’ player.
      The politicians they support condone this behavior because it keeps them well funded and in control.
      Don’t worry Sh!tcago citizens (shitizens? 🤔), the next round of funding into progtarded social engineering programs will fix all this disfunction. 🤪

      • Shitizens of Shitcongo. Sounds right.
        The dem controllers have been shitting on them for what about 100 years ?

        • Exactly.
          At what point do they wake up and say ENOUGH!

          They just keep catching all the turds being dropped on them.

  42. A few observations. First, a zealous prosecutor who is not supportive of the right to self defense will argue that a further attack was not eminent at the moment the defender fired. Second, shooting the “unarmed man” will almost always result in a prosecution strictly as a matter of political cover. Finally, this is exactly the result which we should expect from slack prosecution street criminals. People will simply take the law into their own hands as the criminal justice system fails.

  44. Ok, so I’ve seen only the video linked in the article, so I have only that perspective. Looks to me like he wasn’t swinging a closed fist. He either had something in his hand, or it was an open handed slap. It really looks like a slap. It’s not clear that the shooter fell down flat, let alone was knocked out. Boch wrote, “Moments later, the victim returned to his feet.” Not unless the video was edited to remove those “moments.” Am I wrong? If not, then all y’all are approving the shooting of a slapper. And even if I am wrong about the strike, he still had no justification to shoot the guy after he got up, began to walk away, and then turn around in the doorway, when he was well on his way to safety, and shoot the guy who had returned to the counter. We shoot to stop the threat, and only if shooting is the only way to stop it. If the slapper and his homies were chasing the shooter down the street, then yeah, maybe the threat was continuing, but they are not even making for the door.

    Many more reasons that this was a bad shoot, all noted by strych9 who has it down pat.

    • An open hand slap over the ear will rupture the eardrum and has an immidate negative effect on equilibrium. This was a common tactic taught to MPs a few decades ago. A great tactic to neutralize a serious threat, will put guys on the floor that are much larger than the slapper.

      WAG…..
      The guy taking the liquor store floor temperature challenge in the vid may have been attempting to inflict that injury but failed.

      • Yes, your eardrum damage point has merit, but that alone doesn’t justify a lethal response. I could easily be wrong, if other video and/or testimony paints a different picture. Prior history, gang stuff, who knows what all. My take, based on this video, is that A wanted to diss B, so A cuffed B upside the head and then went to the counter. B fell down, immediately got up, slunk his way to the door, went outside, turned around and hauled iron, and shot A from across the room, while outside. If those indeed are the facts, then it wasn’t a good shoot.

  45. Unfortunately this guy will go to jail, and stay there. But the other A hole will never sucker punch anyone ever again. Good Riddance.

  46. I call Chicago ‘Chi-raq’. My fiancee on the other hand, she calls it ‘Sh!t-Congo’. I cannot disagree with her. It’s just one of dozens of Commiecrat-run “blue sh!tholes” that are crumbling into chaos a little bit every day!

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