NFL pat down (courtesy dalje.com)

“The National Football League has implemented a new stadium policy that would ban off-duty police officers from carrying guns into games,” dfw.cbslocal.com reports. “According to the NFL memo, ‘off-duty officers who attempt to bring firearms into an NFL facility will be denied entry.’ But a Texas state law overrides the NFL policy. As long as officers attending the game check in at a specific gate and inform Security where they are sitting – they can have their gun.” So . . . Texas carry law trumps NFL gun ban policy. I wonder if there are any other states where the same is true, which have chosen to capitulate to the almighty dollar. I mean, NFL. I also wonder if any state has the cojones to say “Our taxpayers helped fund this stadium. They have the right to keep and bear arms. That right doesn’t end at the stadium doors.” I doubt it [see: $ above]. “The NFL says there are enough security personnel at stadiums to handle problems without needing armed off-duty police.” Or on-duty armed citizens, apparently.

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75 COMMENTS

    • I recently attended an event at a public university, and when I got to the parking lot, certain sections were blocked off so you couldn’t park there, but . . . . . they were charging a mere $5 to park in THEIR designated areas. I asked the gate guy why I couldn’t park on public property for free & being a good little statist soldier, he was nice & just said “Sir, I don’t know – these are the areas designated for you to park.” I had other people in my vehicle & didn’t want to make a huge scene, so I reluctantly paid the $5 & parked where they said. The blocked off parking lots were empty, btw.

      Abuses of power are occurring all around us, and I’m as guilty of frequently ceding to it as the next guy, but it’s time we started demanding accountability from our elected & non-elected public officials who receive & spend taxpayer money.

      • Yeah boy! One can NEVER have too many cops. I appreciate you coming out on behalf of the Police State!

  2. That’s right, you morons. Tell all the off duty law enforcement officers not to carry their guns into the stadium so, if non-law abiding citizens decide to break your rules and manage to smuggle in guns, all the bad guys have deadly weapons and all the good guys paid to save your life can stop them with their fists.

    Or just hope you have enough security on the premises that, you know, the security can get to the location as quickly as the bad guys can start shooting people.

    I. Am. Amazed.

    • Who cares? If I, or any other citizen can’t carry in a stadium, then off duty porkers shouldn’t either.

      • What a stupid response and typical of the most destructive of the pro-gun movement: instead of trying to find common cause with cops and convince the public that lawful citizens should be able to carry you have this divisive idea that “well they shouldn’t have their rights, either!”

        • WHERE IS the “common cause” with thugs that SWAT the wrong house? Shoot the dog? The kid in the diabetic coma? The kid who answers the door with a Wii controller, and is shot dead? Cops are thoroughly militarized now; where is this “common cause” with roided-up halfwits a short time out of combat duty in Iran, Afghanistan, wherever?

          Their behavior has declared that they feel no “common cause” with us. The ones who pay their salaries. To shoot us down for no reason.

  3. Carrying is irrelevant to the greater story on this.

    Can average folks still afford to buy a ticket to see these games?

    Tickets for a family of 4 + parking + concessions = 1 Mortgage payment for most Americans

    • The bigger question is: Considering the NFL’s stance on firearms, even if you could afford it, why would you consider spending any amount of money on them?

      I vote with my wallet, as all supporters of Liberty should. Groups like the NFL only care about money and withholding that money is the only way to effect change.

    • “Can average folks still afford to buy a ticket to see these games?”

      I think the answer is “rarely, if ever”. I know I can’t afford to go anymore. I think the last game I went to was the second year FedEx Field was open. So, 1998, And it was getting out of my range then. Average cost is $79 a seat. Can’t find how much the cheapest seats are. I think they were $35 back then, and parking alone costs $35 now.

  5. It isn’t that there is a problem inside the stadium.

    IT’s the lousy neighborhoods you have to park in / walk through to get to and from the events is where you need your piece.

    John

    • If you go to your team’s away games at Philadelphia or New York (well, the Meadowlands), you actually DO have a problem inside the stadium, as soon as the locals figure out you’re rooting for the other team.

      Getting the crap beat out of you for being a visitor is a very, very real danger.

      Especially if it’s a division game.

      • This happened to my daughter at a Bear’s game. She is a Packer fan and some Bear fan ran up to her and punched her right in the face. What a manly man was he.

        • Sorry this happened, Bill. I actually didn’t know the Bears fans were like that, also. The drunk, cowardly POS. So: Philly, the Meadowlands, Oakland and Chicago are unsafe for visitors. How about making the sh*ts who DO come pay enough so that it’s the same gate as a full house?

          A few years back, it got so bad in Philly – people would start tailgating at 8 in the morning, and be drunk out of their skulls by game time – that they set up a jail and a magistrate in the lowest depth of the Vet. Judge too! They arrested, arraigned and sentenced ne’er-do-wells, and locked them up in the tank beneath the stadium. Until they could be moved later in the day.

    • Here’s the rub: if it is so safe inside stadiums that patrons don’t “need” to be armed, then even if patrons are armed they will never actually need to draw their firearms. And if patrons never draw their firearms, there is no impact to safety.

      Walking to and from the stadium, on the other hand, is an entirely different matter and quite possibly one of the most dangerous environments that average citizens will ever encounter. Even worse, a smart criminal will know that fans walking to the stadium MUST be unarmed — making them easy pickings. THAT is when citizens truly need to be armed.

      So my response is, “Screw you NFL. If you refuse to care about my well being both inside and outside your stadiums, I refuse to support you.”

      What I cannot understand is how the NFL figures that losing about 10% of the marketplace is good business. They might say to themselves, “But we are filling up the stadiums.” Suppose that is true: they could charge even higher prices if there were increased demand for their limited number of seats.

      If I were running the NFL strictly on a profit basis (with absolutely no concern for civic duty or the well being of my patrons), I would have to ask what is more profitable:
      (a) prohibiting concealed carry and losing revenue associated with that decision while paying slightly lower insurance premiums and possibly avoiding a payout for a gunshot injury lawsuit.
      (b) allowing concealed carry and increasing revenue on every seat of every game (due to higher demand causing higher prices and filling more seats if some were previously empty) while paying slightly higher insurance premiums and possibly paying out a gunshot injury lawsuit.

  6. Hope the NFL nips this in the bud. If we can’t carry, the cops shouldn’t be able to either. All or nothing, no one rule for them and one rule for us.

  8. Guards follow protocol and area plans.

    Those things are planable to work around. AnI unidentified individual carrying a firearm is impossible to plan for to a certain extent.

  9. I just wanted to say “Thanks” for spelling “cojones” right…but since I’m here, I kind of fall to the side that says cops carry guns for the same reason I do–for self-defense and defense of others. And to note that they have no more of a legal obligation on the “defense of others” end than I do. So if they can carry, I should be able to carry. I am glad that Texas is standing up to the NFL pansies, but she should go the whole hog IMHO and say any licensed CCL holder can carry too.

  10. Just another reason in the very long list of why NFL stadiums should not be taxpayer funded. Billionaires and there toys should not be subsidized by people who don’t participate.

    Several multi-year studies have been completed that showed no significant financial gain to the local area that the public funded establishment existed.

    Just more croni-capitalism. Here are just a few examples:

    http://www.dailyrepublican.com/stadium-understated-cost.html

    http://www.imakenews.com/cppa/e_article001083889.cfm?x=b11,0,w

    http://www.akdart.com/sports.html

    http://www.newswise.com/articles/view/?id=35549

    Best solution; don’t go to the games.

  12. So special privileges for cops and private corps not being able to set their own policies? Normally these things wouldn’t gain praise around here. Consistency be damned I guess. (And yes I know stadiums are funded by tax payer money.)

    • “… and private corps not being able to set their own policies?”

      Can private corporations set a policy that calls for molesting children, raping women, and murdering patrons? Can private corporations set a policy that absolutely prohibits law enforcement on their property — even to retrieve a murder victim and investigate the murder? Obviously not.

      I get really tired of people who say that corporations or private property owners can do anything they want. That is entirely incorrect. As a society we give up just a teeny tiny bit of “freedom” (to harm other people) in exchange for the ginormous benefits of society. Any private corporation or property owner who requires that patrons, visitors, employees, etc. check their well being at the property line are not operating within the confines of society. Instead, that corporation or property owner has established their hostility toward individuals and their well being even though those individuals have indicated no intention to bring harm to the corporation or property owner.

      We should NOT defend the “right” of corporations or private property owners to harm or facilitate the harm of citizens.

  13. I follow the advice to avoid stupid people doing stupid things in stupid places. Pro sports arenas fall squarely in that description. Generally any place where I risk being trampled by panicked mobs is to be strictly avoided!

    • That’s a good reason to buy a top-row ticket. The field looks the size of your doormat from up there, though. But I once had a great view of a flyover of F-18s and a C-5A, though. Until I involuntarily ducked.
      Those suckers were CLOSE. And LOUD.

    • The amount of drinking both outside and inside the stadium is kind of disturbing. There are people outside Jerry world tailgating who I am convinced have never been inside. And it’s like you have to stand up the entire game. I’d rather out drink those fools and watch the Cowboys and Texans lose from my own living room thank you very much.

    • Now that you mention it, those games DO look pretty good on TV, don’t they? For the price of a few family outings to a NFL or MLB game you can get brand new TV and maybe even a nice new recliner, and you’ll still have the TV and the recliner after the game is over, not just a ticket stub by which to remember the event.

  14. What’s good for the goose is good for the gander. If we cannot carry, neither can they. I’m tired of this crap whew cops are entitled to all kinds of special perks and not held to the same standards as everyone else.

    • Exactly. I find it bizarre that so many people are celebrating the police getting (more) special treatment.

  15. If the off-duty cops want to carry their guns inside the stadium then they should not be allowed to consume any alcohol well on stadium grounds including the parking lot.

    Lets see how many off-duty cops can forgo drinking especially at pre-game tailgate parties.

  17. Perhaps out of topic, but, when was the last time you read about a citizen legal firearm owner shooting at a truck with paper carriers in it, or killing kids in a house, or shooting a guide dog, or an individual with a cell phone, or shooting blind people, or killing a kid with an air gun within seconds? I understand the stress of being an LEO, it goes with the job, so does making damn sure before you shoot. Using a legal firearm for illegal purposes is against the law. But, law enforcement has become too lazy to know the difference. Making us all criminals is much easier. (Killers have done all or most of the above, and worse without fear of being opposed, but, remember, I am referring to legal firearm owners in defensive shootings.)

  18. If the cops were to wear their uniforms (and service weapon) anyway, who is going to challenge whether or not they are on the clock?

    • If you went to a game in Philly or NJ with a division rival’s jersey on, you would find yourself in serious fear for your life, I assure you.

  20. Frankly, if your average citizen can’t carry weapons into the stadium, neither should off-duty cops. Gun rights for all, not just special exceptions for jack-booted thugs on their days off.

  21. WA state laws preempt policies, so we got that over NFL as well. But we’re hamstrung by CPL requirements.

  23. I love my football but for a 501 nonprofit, it sure seems like the NFL pushes it’s weight around a lot.

  24. Not that I plan to stick up for off-duty law enforcement getting special privileges, but…
    Did I miss something? Does the NFL actually own the stadiums? Do they control access? Isn’t that the purview of the stadium staff/owners/city/team etc? I was under the impression that the NFL controlled content, and regulated things like rules and player/owner behavior. At which point, they can go eat a potato, to put it nicely.

  27. Re the last question, I’m pretty sure that Michigan law trumps the NFL ban. I never paid much attention to the LEO carveout, but by the letter of the law even a “normal” civilian with a CPL is allowed to open carry in an NFL stadium.

    Which is, coincidentally, about the only way I would go to a game on Woodward Avenue….

    • Cpl holders cannot carry into a stadium or entertainment venue that seats more than 2500( not sure on that number).

      Unless there is a loophole for open carry with a cpl I don’t know about…

      ..also guessing that if I don’t know about it neither will security screeners. I’m also assuming it is posted, so disarmament has legal standing….

      • CPL carriers cannot carry CONCEALED into a venue that contains more than 2500 people. The wording of the law allows CPL holders to OPEN carry in any of the concealed carry pistol free zones. There is an MSP opinion on the subject, but I can’t find the link at the moment. Even from the wording on their website regarding CPL pistol free zones (capitalization mine):

        A pistol is subject to immediate seizure if the CPL holder is carrying a pistol in a “pistol free” area. The pistol is ONLY subject to seizure if the holder is carrying it CONCEALED.

        Now, I don’t know how legally binding an MSP opinion is. And as far as I know such a case has not been successfully tried. But per the letter of the law and the Michigan State Police it is allowed…

        And I agree with you, trying it will probably ruin your day.

  28. The 30.06 clause should be done away with altogether… Being on your property doesn’t make me your property.

    • RockOnHellChild wrote, “Being on your property doesn’t make me your property.”

      That is by far and away the most excellent and succinct way that I have ever encountered to state the principle. I tried to explain this in my lengthy post above. From now on I will use your wording to start my rants.

  29. While I feel that having good people armed in NFL games is a good thing. I also see this somewhat as a violation of the 3rd Amendment to the Constitution.

  31. The NFL lately has been acting more like a quasi government agency than a club for millionaires and guys playing a kids game. When they start paying taxes like normal rich organizations then they can talk.

  32. Food for thought. Read whole thing and think before you flame me.

    True NFL tickets are expensive. But show me where in the US Consitution where any American has the right to afordable entertainment. This is a free market meaning that they can charge what they want to. If they sell enough tickets to make a profit, who is anyone to judge them. True taxpayer money goes toward stadiums, but that is more than repaid to the local economy through taxes at local bars, resturants, etc… all the local businesses that profit from having a professional team in the city.

    High priced tickets DO prohibit the typical criminals from easy access. When was the last time anyone heard of a shooting at an NFL game? Why some cities in the US deliberately charge higher prices for subway train. Not saying criminals don’t go to games, but at the prices they are paying, they are there for the game too.

    This is America, if you don’t like what the NFL is doing, don’t buy Budweiser with NFL logos on it. Don’t go to McDonalds when they support a local team. Don’t buy jerseys, balls, etc… You choose where your money (after taxes) goes. By the way who got their entire tax return back, (didn’t actually pay income tax) and is complaining here ~50% of Americans….

    For me the Tennessee Titans donate lots to the Army Post Fort Campbell and it’s soldiers, they’ve earned my business

    • “True NFL tickets are expensive. But show me where in the US Consitution where any American has the right to afordable entertainment. This is a free market meaning that they can charge what they want to.”

      Classic straw man argument. No one has claimed a right to “afordable” (sic) entertainment. And I didn’t flame you. I shot your straw man dead. OK, no, I didn’t. He never lived.

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