https://youtu.be/0ZZGFdcx3E0
Dennis Reese, the CEO of Springfield Armory, has taken to YouTube to defend his company’s reputation in the face of outrage at the gun dealer licensing law carve-out negotiated on their behalf by their paid lobbyist Jay Keller.
Verging on tears, Mr. Reese claims that he’s guilty only of delegating his fight against “bad bills” to the Executive Director of the Springfield Armory- and Rock River Arms-funded and controlled lobby group, the Illinois Firearms Manufacturers Association (which had no other members).
“He unfortunately didn’t understand the graveness of what this bill was,” Mr. Reese asserts. “We had to terminate his employment and disband the organization . . . We’re being treated as if we violated the most sacred trust (emphasis added). That really really hit me in the heart like I can’t tell you.”
Aside from the sentimental look at Springfield’s history and Mr. Reese’s defense of his supposed ignorance of the IFMA carve-out for Illinois gun dealer licensing — in a bill that includes private firearms transfer limitations — the Springfield exec doesn’t make any mention of the tens of thousands of dollars IFMA donated to virulently anti-gun politicians over the last five years.
Reached for comment (by an anonymous source), lobbyist Keller said “I did what they paid me to do.” Our source also tells us that Springfield Armory is considering suing Mr. Keller and TTAG.
Make of that what you will.
At least he’s honest about the origins of the current SA company.
Rash because in diesel fuel up to his elbows? Um. So?
Significant amount of effort? Force myself to delegate? (Pass the buck please…)
Fired him? How about some real tears?
Was that SAINT?
Ahh, the bar scene. Ownership of the fail. Ask for forgiveness.
Little late tho…
There’s actually a really easy way for Springfield to prove they didn’t know about this. If they sue Keller & he can’t provide documentation that Springfield knew what was going on, I’ll give them a mea culpa.
But if Springfield doesn’t sue, that probably means they don’t want certain things coming into light.
And them suing ttag is probably the stupidest thing they could ever do. Not only would they be suing trusted journalists in the industry and thus making a bad name for themselves, but it would open the doors to discovery motions and testimony by Keller.
I wonder what specific legal action would they base such a suit on… good luck suing someone after the fact when you should have been conducting oversight.
He, on the other hand, could sue them at this point for libel if he can prove that their assertions are false. Not like I think he would.
So suing TTAG for libel based on publicly available facts? Man what has this world come to when actual reporting can land you in court and Fake News does not
Suing TTAG? I’ll stock up on popcorn [very salty, accompanied by a lot of beer].
Discovery would probably destroy any positive reputation Springfield has left.
I didn’t write that clearly. It would be very difficult to sue TTAG unless you could prove that their reporting was either malicious (they KNEW it was false) or grossly negligent (they SHOULD have really known it was false). Also… it would have to be false!
What I MEANT but failed to articulate was that the scapegoat that these two companies are sacrificing could sue them by proving that they did know what he was doing with their money.
They won’t sue – not because of any legal merits, but because discovery would be loads and loads o’ fun.
CEO Dennis Reece will never sue.
This isn’t his first rodeo. Dennis Reece got jammed up with federal felony charges of bribery back in 1989. He took a plea deal and flipped on someone.
Apparently, Dennis isn’t even an honorable criminal. He fits right in with the slime of Illinois politics.
This is the reply I left on the video
Springfield Armory and Rock River Arms were the only two financial supporters of the lobbying group that not only suggested the carve outs for manufacturers and big box stores but also donated TENS OF THOUSANDS of dollars to ANTI gun state democrats. If they wern’t aware of what THEIR lobbyist did on THEIR dime they are totally complicit. They are trying to use the Hillary Clinton defense, plead ignorance to what your paid underlings have done and deflect with a warm, touching personal story about how they just COULDN’T be the bad guys here. NO ONE not the NRA or GOA accomplish anything meaningful with their lobbying. They got caught with their pants down trying to play both sides of the fence. This guy bought his “honor” from the NRA plain & simple. You don’t get a gold jacket unless you blow Wayne LaPiere and write him a huge check. I will from here on give my dollars to companies who actually care about the people they depend on to sell their product as well as the customers who are the end user. H&K, FN and Walther all make better firearms anyhow. The only way I wanna see this guys face on camera again is if he’s eating a nice big steaming shit sandwich…then maybe I might forgive…….but probably not.
Correct. That is just how the NRA acts.
Seems we are playing the game exactly the way the leftists wanted it played.
I burst out laughing when you said “companies who actually care about the people” and then mentioned H&K.
+1 to that. HK just wants to make a profit, and that largely comes from govt. users. Now, the capitalist in me totally supports them and their profit making ways, but I don’t mean I’m going to give them any money
H&K makes a higher quality product, and I included H&K because they definatly do right by snall RETAILERS. I know there are no deals to be had by big box stores that the little guy can’t get, wich most manufacturers give the big box deals the average dealer cant get. Also, I have been in business for years and have never ONCE heard of anyone needing H&K customer service for any reason. Kinda like how Rolex probably doesn’t have many watches come back. Also, I like that at least with H&K you know where you stand…they won’t piss in your face and try telling you its raining.
I agree with you. Once upon a time I thought that HK was a big rip off considering how high a price they charge for their modern plasticky weapons as compared to everyone else but unlike everyone else they test their products thoroughly before they sell them to the public as compared to the other manufacturers that simply dump their latest half invented nightmares on the public and they then have endless recalls that go on for years, opps I should have said “Upgrades” because some manufactures think we are all too dumb to know they are one and the same thing.
I have come to believe that not having to send your gun back for endless recalls does indeed justify the higher price you pay for HK products. I think the people who scream the loudest are always the tight fisted cheap skates that would rather carry a gun that works only sometimes or has to be sent back several times before its reliable enough to depend on, obviously they put a cheap price on their own life as it goes with their every day cheapness. Good luck spending your horded money while lying in a coffin 6 feet under.
“Mike Cabrera of Heckler & Koch Law Enforcement Sales and veteran law enforcement officer with SWAT unit experience points out that this is a gun that you do not want in the wrong, slimy hands.”
Those wrong, slimy hands would be ordinary, law-abiding citizens. Yhea, H&K is really pro-Second Amendment… Not.
You really need to google “Recoil Magazine” and “H&K”.
O2
Right – and just look at the fallout from that editor’s characterization of the HK guy’s comment.
After all, HK can’t currently sell the full auto MP7A to civilians and that has nothing to do with 2A advocacy.
Rumor is the former “Recoil” editor is now the editor of “World Of Firepower”
“You don’t get a gold jacket unless you blow Wayne LaPiere”
You just licked bloombergs @ss, you moron.
Who the fuck are you calling a moron? Don’t like the truth? Too god damn bad, change it then. You NRA brainwashed idiots are the ones who are too stupid to realise that Wayne and crew ARE the ones licking Bloomburgs ass! I bet you’d be one of the first pussies in line to turn your guns in instead of giving them the end they deserve. I wish you had to say shit like that to peoples faces like the old days, I’d give you a smack in your teeth.
Usually people who are too cheap and tight fisted to belong the NRA never cease to bad mouth it to ease the pain and guilt in their sub-conscience mind. The real facts are that even though the NRA is not perfect and does sometimes make mistakes as all humans are wont to do at times the real truth is that without them we all would have had our guns confiscated long, long, ago. They are the biggest firearms lobbyist in the U.S. and their political clout has saves us far more times than it hurt us even when they at times played footsie with both the anti-gun nuts and the Federal Government. Any Moron that would argue the point has not been following their legacy as I have done since 1962 when I first became a member and with that much history behind me and the NRA I know what the hell I am talking about.
Gun companies by and large put profit first and many times are no friends at all of their customers. Springfield got caught with their pants down and now is trying to worm and weasel their way out of it by lying through their teeth. For them the new law would have been a financial windfall as they could have raised their prices through the roof with only just a few big dealers left in the state. More dealers mean more competition and that leads to them having to give the big dealers sweet heart deals to keep them in business when smaller dealers are heavily discounting their guns for sale. Make no mistake, Springfield would have loved to have 99 per cent of the smaller dealers run right out of business.
Sorry to inform you that todays NRA is NOT the NRA of old. There are other, much more honest gun rights groups out there. I am a FORMER NRA instructor, and I can definatly say that it is ALL about revenue for them now. I will NEVER forgive LaPiere for what he said after Sandy Hook. He bent right over instead of standing tall and facing the antis and there bullshit head on. They are a lobbying group, and they do a pretty piss poor job at it. Just look at Texas, Florida and Louisiana this month alone. Three solid red states (well, at least two, florida has been ruiened by liberal transpants) and the NRA couldn’t and didn’t do diddly. The whole Idea of lobbying is to get things DONE. Not just to collect money.
Your obscene illogical rant is either based on a complete lack of character or you are a Bloomberg plant positioned here to make all of use look like ignorant redneck hicks that possess not a lick of common sense.
Mistakes can be made and are made. You don’t run a gun company and check on every detail of the work someone is assigned to do. There is no way either Springfield or Rock River would put their companies at risk even without knowing what happened to Smith & Wesson back in the Clinton days.
You way will win no battles, and will alienate the many people we need to defend the 2nd.
If you really think that what Springfield did was an honest mistake, I think you are the bloomburg plant. Lets all just yell that every time someone rightfully craps on the NRA. You sound like a triggered democrat yelling about the russians!
H&K do not have the customer’s interest at heart either, half their guns are for “law enforcement only”, they don’t give a shit about the 2nd amendment.
Reece is only teary because he got caught.
I wonder if Dennis Reece was teary back in 89 when he took a plea deal to avoid federal felony charges of bribery.
Reece fits right in with Illinois politicians. He’s as slimy as they come.
“At least he’s honest about the origins of the current SA company.”
Actually no he wasn’t.
Elmer Ballance began the process to acquire the name “Springfield Armory” for production of his commercial version of the M14 rifle in 1969. In 1971 his company, L. H. Gun Company, officially (FFL wise) became Springfield Armory, Inc.
Bob Reese purchased Springfield Armory, Inc. in the fall of 1974.
A little late, indeed.
Here’s how you restore confidence: Vocally, publicly, and repeatedly assert to the media that you will immediately LEAVE the State of Illinois if this law passes. Demonstrate that you have the fortitude to make good on your threats–actively engage neighboring states (Iowa is nice, and currently VERY Republican) in discussions to relocate.
When the law does pass, lock the doors the following day, pack up your factory, and provide relocation incentives to your good employees.
Fuck that noise.
They helped create the cesspool. Let them live in the filth and oppression they paid for.
Maybe if you bring me jay keller’s head, we can START the conversation about what else you’re going to need to do to un-fukc this mess.
and a shrubbery, one that looks nice. And not too expensive!
A path, a path!!!
Or we will say “Ni” again!
Nothing they can do will ever make up for it. I fart in his general direction. Now he simply must go away, or I shall insult him a second time.
Screw you
Either the most clueless idiot in charge of a gun company, or someone who got caught playing Illinois politics, and is really trying hard to redeem himself.
Springfield Armory is not a company big enough for million dollar+ rounding errors. If he didn’t know exactly where that cash was going, and what it was spent on, he’s negligent, and/or a fool. Either that or he has a really good acting coach.
Still undecided. But I know the optics and it really strains credulity over a 5 year window…
How do you not know this?
Sorry not buying it. Or anymore SA or RRA products. Its a shame that it came to this. I love my xdm and 1911 loaded. Was considering an m1a and possibly a saint down the road.
Suing the lobbyist i can understand. Suing ttag is stupid, you caught me with my hand in the cookie jar so its ttags fault?
That too me really seals the deal. Totally done.
Sue TTAG? Way to keep the story on page 1.
Who advises these people? Clown shoes.
Is there a firearms-related news organization that can cover the proceedings? Oh wait…
So I would presume that anybody who has posted here would be co-defendants with the suit. Pretty sure his talk means they’re really getting hit business wise. Looking forward to when employees start opening up. Or will they have a hush order & NDA with pink slips.
Let’s just find out who will have greater legal backing. Popcorn need to be refilled, but not going to have Chicago style…maybe chocolate caramel.
TTAG shouldn’t have run that SA would “sue” TTAG on the basis of an anonymous source. An anonymous source might as well be no source at all. If TTAG is going to make accusations they need to get it on record and back it up. Anonymous source might as well be “fake news” to me.
“TTAG shouldn’t have run that SA would “sue” TTAG on the basis of an anonymous source.”
Sure they should, if they truly heard such a thing.
Getting it out there now and letting SA see what kind of public reaction it brings is a helluva lot cheaper for everyone involved than letting this get to the lawyer stage before the public backlash hits. Once a complaint is served, it’s harder to back down.
Getting what out there now?
That an anonymous source said so and so? If your going to be making such a bold accusation, it should be backed with something credible. Otherwise it just appears to be flame fanning.
Assume there is a source and for whatever reason wanted to remain anonymous. Presumably for a reason he or she considers good. If TTAG outs the source they will have trouble getting people to talk to them off the record in the future. If and when TTAG gets sued they can still ask the source for permission to reveal their identity at that time.
Assume there is no source, and ttag made it up. If that then comes out later their credibility is shot.
I just don’t see a lot of upside to ttag making this up at this point in time.
Wasn’t he like the treasurer or president of that lobby group? And he didn’t know where thousands of dollars of political donations went? Yeah, right.
Yeah Dennis didn’t know where the money was going right and Hillary didn’t know where the 33,000 emails went either aren’t we sick of this type of crap yet?
He knew where every dollar went. He may not have known about the IL bill. But he knew where every dollar went. And he likely gave them contributions because they didn’t think a republican gun rights advocate would win. So they made a deal with the devil and crossed their fingers. It’s understandable, given that it’s “Illinois.”
It is IMPOSSIBLE that he didn’t know every minute detail of the Illinois bill. There aren’t that many current anti gun bills with the potential to severely effect his business, in the Illinois pipeline. It’s just not possible.
There are very pro gun Democrats in IL. In fact the only reason IL has CCW is the fight led by southern state Dems.
No, the only reason Illinois has a shall issue concealed carry law is that the Federal Appellate Court ordered it and warned that if they didn’t pass a law, the Court would order Constitutional Carry based on the Illinois Firearm Owners Identification law.
Some downstate Democrats did jump on board but only after the court order
Wrong that was the Chicago handgun ban.
Down state democrats, lead by Phelps fought for CCW for years. This is a fact please get your facts correct.
All you need is to google it.
Rep. Brandon Phelps, a Harrisburg Democrat who was the chief sponsor of the original legislation CCW
https://www.google.com/search?q=Rep.+Brandon+Phelps%2C+a+Harrisburg+Democrat+who+was+the+chief+sponsor+of+the+original+legislation+CCW&rlz=1C1CHBF_enUS699US699&oq=Rep.+Brandon+Phelps%2C+a+Harrisburg+Democrat+who+was+the+chief+sponsor+of+the+original+legislation+CCW&aqs=chrome..69i57.6589j0j4&sourceid=chrome&ie=UTF-8
Actually Bud is correct. I’m not saying Phelps wasn’t pushing for CCW, however that effort wasn’t going anywere. There was a lawsuit (Moore V Madigan) and the outcome of that was that a federal appeals court gave the state of Illinois 180 days (plus an additional 30) to enact or a CCW bill, and failure to do so would allow constitutional carry (with a FOID card).
Jay, with respect, if you’re going to call someone out as being wrong, please get your facts straight. Please look up Moore V Madigan. Yes, the handgun issue was also a court case, but not the only recent one affecting Illinois.
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Moore_v._Madigan
Fact. Downstate Dems shafted every gun owner in IL:
http://www.thetruthaboutguns.com/2017/05/john-boch/nra-a-rated-illinois-dems-voted-for-gun-dealer-licensing-bill/
If I lived in IL, I would have preferred voting for Dennis Reese than the current selection of downstate Dems. Yeah. You read that right.
Wow! This gets deeper and deeper down the rabbit hole…he better hope Rauner vetoes this steaming pile of guano. Once again thank you TTAG and John Boch. I’m not rich but I’d contribute to defend your honor. It would truly and irrevocably kill Springfield… HS Product anyone?
How can the CEO not know about a bill that directly affects his company? That just doesn’t make any sense. If he is that out of touch with the business climate he shouldn’t be CEO.
Does anybody smell what that Reece guy just stepped in smells like a big thing of BULLSHIT to me.
Geez your parents had to sell their Farm to get Springfield Armory started sounds like your father would be pretty pissed off at you for being such a schmuck and screwing his company up. You are so full of crap your eyes are brown.
Don’t believe this for a minute. These two businesses knew exactly who they were sponsoring and where their money was going they used up front this so-called group that he assembled with Rock River this Lobby group he is symbol that he paid for it he paid for the money that they used to lobby but he didn’t know where it was going bull crap that is a load of shit.
Nice Personal Touch on the video to make you feel like we misjudged those poor guys boy you must be digging deep in your marketing campaign to save your company after turning your back on every single gun owner in the United States you and Rock River both make me sick to my stomach at least you have farming to go back to you crooked bastard.
Meh, his eyes dart around too much during his confession, appeal, or what ever that was. My next M14 type rifle will be a Bula build, my next M16 type will be a home built lower/WOA upper, and my next pistol will probably be CZ.
Who makes a receiver named woa?
I would assume White Oak Armament. When Bushmaster didn’t suck.
The original Bushmaster Factory is in Windham Maine when the owner of Bushmaster sold the name Bushmaster to Freedom group AKA Remington Outdoors he signed a no-compete clause for five years after that he opened up the old Bushmaster building with all the old Bushmaster employees and machinery and called it Winham Weaponry. Not sure what white oak weaponry is?
White Oak Armament has nothing to do with Bushy as far as I know. WOA builds uppers for competition and they are also in IL.
https://www.whiteoakarmament.com/
Educate yourselves, you so called gun experts.
A professional PR person never would have let him shift his eyes so much while he was talking.
Anybody who’s had some experience and interrogation knows exactly what they look like or look for Rather as far as facial tics and uncontrolled Expressions that basically tell you you’re lying and he has at least five that I picked up on including Shifty eyes remember your mother telling you I don’t trust that guy he’s got very Shifty eyes he is the role model for this kind of character eyes all over the place not focus than any One Direction official cheek twitch you can tell he’s lying through his teeth. Good riddance to both those companies I just feel bad for the employees that will working for these two morons. If I was this guy I would feel so horrible that I did this to the people of America with my father’s company that I took over and ran it right into the ground with.
The only reason why they’re going to such extremes to make sure the gun people of this country don’t think they’re a bunch of jerkwads is simple they see their business is going down the drain shortly and they’re panicking like Rats on a sinking ship trying to Scurry to anything that will float unfortunately for them turds do float.
Wow – just Wow! At this point, the only possible thing both companies can do is spend all (I mean ALL) the money they have killing this bill any way they can even if it bankrupts both companies. Anything less is unacceptable.
If they sue TTAG, that’s the dagger.
One source, unquoted, does not make it true though.
Donating to anti politicians is enough for me to forget them. Willing or negligent involvement in the bill is more than enough.
I like my SA 1911 RO, and I’ll keep it, but never support them again.
One anonymous source, unquoted, might as well make it bogus. TTAG shouldn’t have bothered putting that in unless they it’s documented/ on record. Otherwise it’s just fanning the flames.
I can completely understand why they would pay Anti-gun leftists in the state with campaign contributions – even though I don’t agree with it. The only question that matters to me – is if they were aware of the carve out in the legislation. That is all that matters, and TTAG hasn’t proven it.
Well, since this isn’t a court of law, and is instead the court of public opnion, SA and RRA are going to have to prove to me that they were completely in the dark. There’s too much damning evidence. And the stakes couldn’t be higher. These are our Constitutional rights at stake. Playing fast and loose with my rights is unforgivable. If this passes, look for this legislation to be duplicated in other states. I blame SA and RRA. They MUST be boycotted into bankruptcy if for no other reason than to serve as a cautionary tale to other future would be sell outs.
I suggest that you go back and read John Boch’s earlier post about “what SA and RRA knew and when did they know it.” Inter alia, he claims he wrote SA and RRA back in *February* about the IFMA’s contributions to anti-gun pols, but got no response from them.
If this is true and can be documented (and I strongly suspect John B. can easily do that), it pretty well busts the argument that SA and RRA had no inkling that their lobbyist had gone rogue until after the TTAG articles came out a couple of weeks ago.
SA and RRA need to quit digging. I don’t know if all this self-inflicted damage is repairable now, but a good first start would be to acknowledge that John B. and TTAG were correct about this, that SA and RRA did in fact know or should have known about what their IFMA guy was doing, that contributing to antis and negotiating a carve-out were boneheaded mistakes that they take full responsibility for, and that they are committed to doing everything possible to fix things. Promising to pull a Magpul and leave the state if the bill becomes law would also be a way to show that their remorse is in fact serious.
The bill was well publicized, and not just by TTAG, and especially in IL. Unless Reese was literally too drunk to open his eyes, for months, there’s just no reasonable way that he didn’t know of the bill and his company’s direct involvement in the lobbying efforts for a carve out it. This directly impacted his company in a big way. People watching the IL legislature were howling about it. I knew about it and I’m in Texas, and I first heard about it from a friend who lives just south of Chicago, who’s not even a gun guy.
It’s a lie on its face.
I’m torn. My family has deep roots in Illinois, and I spent a lot of time on the family farm in Central IL as a child. We still own the farm.
I want to see Illinois companies succeed, and I certainly understand how difficult the political climate is in that state. Donating millions to liberal politicians isn’t in and of itself a bad thing. That’s assuming you don’t have any other choice (which is often the case with statewide elections) and you can find sympathetic politicians who can be persuaded to support your cause. Most (not all) politicians want to see businesses in their own state succeed, regardless of which side of the fence they happen to fall. So I don’t blame them for donating heavily to Madigan and others. I do blame them for pushing horrible legislation with a sweetheart carveout for themselves.
Continue apologizing profusely and take steps to right the wrong you’ve created, and you might win back my business. Act like giant babies and sue TTAG, and you definitely won’t.
As gun owners we are all in this together and when one group donate money to the anti-gun establishment in this country it is an outrage a crime against the Second Amendment in every man and woman who has fought to defend this country’s Constitution for the last two hundred and forty-seven years. Actions speak louder than words and YouTube videos. That’s the problem with this country you lead by example and don’t blame other people for your corrupt mistakes this will never fly with the people of the gun in this country those two companies are gone they just don’t know it yet. I plan to see Rock River Armory and Springfield Armory file for bankruptcy no later than 2018 and that’s a promise every gun owner I know is sick to their stomach about what this jerkwad and his friends from rockriver did. And we do not forget. May your company’s rest in peace.
Amen.
They claim they were not aware of the carve out. And this may be true.
Suing TTAG? Something tells me that from “one,” “anonymous” source – this isn’t going to happen. And it’s a pretty bold accusation – too bad it is from “one,” “anonymous” source that might as well not exist.
I’m waiting for the inevitable “Hitler’s Bunker” video parody that’s sure to address this kerfuffle…
Yes I would find that very comical to see this guy in the owner of Rock River in a bunker dressed in SS uniforms putting their hands in the air as they speak and scream out it wasn’t us it was the Gestapo the lobbyist work is stopped up LOL LMAO.
So RRA is running around crying fake news and SA is thinking about suing TTAG. I’ll buy their story in 3, 2, 1… Nah, never gonna buy that. What part was fake? IFMA having only two members? IFMA giving thousands to Madigan and his ilk? IFMA working out a sweetheart deal for its members when it had the chance? If it’s so fake produce the real true records of IFMA that show something different. Oh, right. Also, how could they not know? Are we to believe they had no idea the Illinois Senate was working on a licencing bill? This was not this bills first go around and it’s their home state. If they actually didn’t know about the bill that is, in my mind, a worse form of treachery. I’d rather that they got caught playing Illinois politics then them being so indifferent and lazy about our rights as to not know. Those are real tears. Those are the tears of all the money he has lost and will continue to loose as a result of him selling his integrity for 30 pieces of silver. You know he’s up shit creek when his best defense is “I care so little about the 2a rights of my home state citizens that I didn’t even follow along or check in on my pet lobby group who was selling them out” I was supposed to be filling out paperwork for cans this year you jack holes. Man what a set back. I have extra pitchforks if anybody else needs one. Im partial to the five tine forks but have others too to suit your fancy. We didn’t know? We didn’t know!?! These ain’t used cars your selling fellas.
Notice how fast he disbanded that lobbyist group I bet paper shredders were running all night long grinding up all of that paperwork showing the paper trail of that lobbyist group that he and Rock River funded I can still hear paper shredders running Non-Stop this guy is a turd and so is his company same with Rock River put them in the ground.
RRA response was pretty lame. They should have assertedly stated their case and explained the actions they have taken thus far, instead they just complained about the people who brought to light their actions.
Suing TTAG? Something tells me that from “one,” “anonymous” source – this isn’t going to happen. And it’s a pretty bold accusation – too bad it is from “one,” “anonymous” source that might as well not exist.
Sell! Sell! Sell!
The cause is lost. You need to cut while you can.
Either way, buh-bye.
These EXPLETIVE DELETED are attempting to Sue T tag question mark question mark question mark LMAO that is the biggest bunch of crap I’ve ever heard of these guys need to have their freakin businesses burnt to the f****** ground. They’re going to threaten a pro Second Amendment blog that caught them red-handed with their freaking hands in the cookie jar and they’re going to sue ttag what are they completely f****** retarded? That just nailed the last nail in their coffin door I will protest I will black ball any of their products boycott whatever you want to call it both these companies are dead to me and I can’t wait until the property becomes available for bulldozing bunch of punk-ass retards blaming a Blog that does truth and investigative journalism unlike what they do with their BS story and videos and statements release the tea tag all that crap gag me with a spoon boys you are done no more Springfield Armory no more Rock River Arms bye bye see you in the unemployment line get dirt balls.
All the different ways speech-to-text tries to render TTAG… 🙂
And yes, I’m mostly (almost) with you now. This is really starting to stink.
Before, most of this was just “meh.” Yes, Springfield’s reputation took a hit in my book, but I couldn’t summon up much outrage even though I 100% disagree with what they and/or their lobbyist did. Even if everything here is as bad as it looks, you can’t realistically expect any business to behave altruistically when their bottom line is on the chopping block.
They probably should sue their rogue lobbyist if this played out as they said. But I hope for their sake (and mine, because I own Springfield pistols and would like to buy more) that the lawsuit against TTAG is only an unfounded rumor.
Because if they sue the people who uncovered the facts, they’re going to find out just how much worse it can get. They’ll be persona non grata. Untouchable. Unclean. I’ll boycott and badmouth them everywhere forever, and so will a *lot* of people who have a hell of a lot more reach than I do.
Still, I doubt they’ll actually sue TTAG, even though they might want to. They have no leg to stand on legally, and I don’t think they’ll risk the possibility that this “little gun-rights activist website” has more loyal readers than they have loyal customers.
Exactly. If I was TTAG I wouldn’t have run it. Please see this amazingly bold accusation with no real substance behind it!
This doesn’t help. Just stop. When you’re in a hole, stop digging.
“It wasn’t my fault. I delegated too much power. I didn’t know what was happening… but I own this.” ~Dennis Reese
You paid a huge amount of money to buy a gold jacket from the NRA? That’s supposed to prove exactly what, that your selfishness and “HEY, LOOK AT ME!” attitude is a matter of pride? If I were the NRA, I would be highly pissed about what was said in this video.
You started the IFMA. You funded it. It operated out of a PO box, so who exactly did you delegate to? You WERE the IFMA. You did this to yourself. I’m glad you’re sorry, but that doesn’t fix this. You better hope this bill fails because your direct actions allowed it to pass the most difficult hurdle, the Illinois Senate. Now its set to breeze through the anti-gun House where they can sit on it until the next incoming Democratic Governor will likely sign it. That means your goose is cooked, as it should be.
Pretending to be sorry for carving out an exception for yourself and only being sorry because you were caught is disgusting to watch. Then there’s Rob, who I used to have respect for. This video just killed that too. I guess SA isn’t just cutting big fat checks to the NRA, they’re cutting them to Rob to buy his loyalty during this inexcusable BS.
Good luck with that.
The worst part of all of this is Rob Leatham playing the game too. I really thought he was a better dude, but it seems I was wrong.
Yup, I lost all respect for Rob after watching this. It’s a shame. I guess whatever they’re paying him is enough that he’s comfortable riding the sinking ship to the bottom.
F*** you MAC. How much money do you get paid for your “reviews”? You are the biggest shrill of all. I lost respect for you a long time ago.
Dang…someone’s jimmies got rustled by MAC. As MAC knows, there is tons of nice manufacturing and warehouse space in the firearms freedom loving Hoosier state just waiting for a few gun companies to occupy it. I just can’t understand a firearm company setting up or staying in states where the right is so blatantly infringed upon.
If Springfield is his big sponsor, then hes just going to bat for his paycheck, I dont know who all sponsors Rob, just that SA is his big paycheck gun advertising wise. How his personal conscience fares after this situation, yet to be seen.
IF the hand that feeds you says jump or starve, youll probably jump.
MAC, Why are your Springfield related videos still up?
Well said MAC…. Rob’s no more than a highly paid sales rep for SA now which is pretty apparent by the side-by-side walk he’s taking with the CEO. Oh, and by the way, the gold jacket is really more of an expensive status symbol relevant to the NRA and means nothing outside. Very few companies are true financially vested supporters of the Second Amendment. A short list of companies that have actually DONE something to show support like Ruger, Brownells, MidWayUSA, Henry Repeating Arms, just to name a few…. SA and RRA are simply trying to save their own asses and keep making money. Too late for that now!
Keep in mind Bill Ruger screwed over gun owners years ago supporting Bill Clinton’s assault weapons ban.
and then Big Bill died and the company turned around, the end. Cool story.
And when your better-half ask you while you’re standing in an unemployment line just tell them that your boss was a complete moron and a turncoat a traitor to his Constitution and his country and you were stupid enough to work for him and boy I tell you did that work out for you guys playing both sides against the middle that is some low down crappy business skills you guys are going to fail miserably and when you do the people of the gun won’t miss you.
The look of desperation ?
Well, just imagine the desperation his production employees are now feeling, watching this slow-motion train wreck destroy their lives and the lives of all those who depend on them for that paycheck.
*shudder*
Yeah, yeah. “Unintentional.”
“You keep using that word. I do not think it means what you think it means.”
If this whole mess was “unintentional” and a truly a surprise to SA, then when they were first informed about it, wouldn’t they have immediately said “whoa, what the heck is out lobbyest doing? We gotta get to the bottom of this NOW.” Heck, if that was true, wouldn’t they be thanking John B. and TTAG for bringing this disaster to their attention?
Nope. Instead, they (and RRA) first ignored it, and then repeatedly tried to disparage the messenger. Only after they realized that they customer base was in full revolt did they decide try and fight the bill — which may be too little, too late.
Ask yourself: what’s more likely:
1. SA truly didn’t know what their lobbyest had been doing FOR YEARS, or
2. SA’s recent protestations are just a cynical fig leaf for them to try to salvage their business after getting caught.
To me, #2 is the obvious conclusion, and makes the instant PR video all the more disgusting. How stupid do they think we are?
Bottom line: I think SA and RRA are toast. I feel bad for the employees, but as far as management and ownership are concerned, they brought this on themselves. If it’s any consolation, SA and RRA will probably become case studies in business schools of how NOT to manage a PR disaster.
Just having some experience in judging and reading people’s expressions I can tell you for a fact this guy is not being honest and is boldface lying. Also he jumps around a lot especially when he’s talking about that lobbyist group that Rock River and his company started he very quickly said that they fired the one guy and disbanded that lobbyist group how much you want to make a bet if ttag digs into that lobbyist group and what they’ve been up to for the last five years that they’re going to find a whole lot more of this same crap guaranteed. The reason for me saying this is really simple when he’s talking about that group being disbanded it was very quick short sweet and he went on to the next subject the next sentence very quickly like he didn’t want to stay on that topic very long his eyes shifted and focused off camera for a slight second and he had multiple Twitches in his face he was showing deception and nervousness when talking about that group of lobbyist. We need to have the guys here at e-tag dig into that lobbyist group and see exactly how long this group has been doing what they’ve been doing and what exactly that they have been doing I have a feeling that this Joker has been playing both sides against the middle for the last five to ten years or at least while Obama was in office
Of course it was an unintentional mess. They intended not to get caught.
Thst “getting caught” part, always screws them up. I’m glad that TTAG and others publicized this because the traditional gun rags wouldn’t.
“Stupid is as stupid does.”
This is a shining example of the classic “Are you stupid, or are you a liar?” game.
Either you’re grossly negligent and therefore unsuited for your job, or you’re a bald-faced liar who is unsuited for your job. There are no other options.
Well if you’re gonna start suing why don’t you help the cause and sue Hillary and the DNC for losing the election causing a decline in sales. If the LUberal media has taught us all one thing, it’s that shifting focus to some totally ridiculous off the wall made up fake news, is how you draw heat off yourself and onto someone else.
I can cast my lot with John Boch and his well-documented research . Or I can believe a guy once charge with bribery.
Hmmm. Let me think…
They better hope Mr. K doesn’t break bad on them.
“…the Springfield exec doesn’t make any mention of the tens of thousands of dollars IFMA donated to virulently anti-gun politicians over the last five years.”
To me this is a much larger problem then “the bill” because it’s true that, in that instance, they may not have known exactly what their lobbyist was doing until it was done. OTOH, doing this for years “without knowing” where all that money was going strains credulity to the max. Getting caught once with dope in your car? Sure it might have come from someone else. Getting caught with dope in your car repeatedly makes me think you’re the one doing the drugs. Even if you’re not doing drugs you’re still stupid enough to hang out with people who repeatedly leave their drugs in your car and that’s a sin against common sense and intelligence in and of itself.
“Our source also tells us that Springfield Armory is considering suing Mr. Keller and TTAG.”
Suing TTAG for what? Pointing out what you were knowingly or unknowingly doing? As I said, I might be inclined to even believe that you didn’t know about “the bill” until after this deed was done in your name. That’s a significant oversight but that kind of thing does happen and it doesn’t mean you’re a bad guy. It just means you put your trust in the wrong dude.
If OTOH, you really were ignorant you wouldn’t be thinking about suing TTAG but rather would have dropped RF a note thanking him for bringing this to your attention and you would realize that it’s your own failure to oversee your lobbying minions that brought this sad state of affairs to your doorstep. [You also, very likely, would have handled this completely differently than you have.]
The simple fact is suing TTAG makes no sense. If you knew about this then you have no good name for TTAG to have sullied. If you didn’t know about this then, via your own ignorance/incompetence you’ve sullied your own name and TTAG just pointed it out. Either way, I don’t see the case.
There’s an old quote about how you can do a lot with a bayonet but that you can’t sit on one. If you’re actually thinking about suing TTAG, I suggest you go sit on a bayonet while pondering the meaning of that quote.
Hey guys, I’m just a normal gun loving guy like you, except when I’m not. Don’t listen to the clear facts, listen to what I’m saying. “I did not have sexual relations with that woman”! Wait, wait, “that depends on what the meaning of ‘is’ is”….. GTFOH Dennis we’ve heard all that political bullcrap before. One good thing about the Clintons is they let us understand the language of political spin.
Here’s the problem, until Libseys, Elliott Bros, Davidson, and all the other big wholesalers stop ordering from Springfield and RRA they will not learn their lesson. Once the wholesalers bail out those two companies will be done. I hope all other manufacturers are learning that sacrificing gun rights for tax breaks and exceptions is a losing proposition over the long term.
Reese’s apologia reminds me of an old Andrews Sisters song:
I didn’t know the gun was loaded
And I’m so sorry, my friend
I didn’t know the gun was loaded
And I’ll never, never do it again
So let me get this straight, Reese admits guilt and assumes responsibility, but he wants to sue TTAG for exposing his scheme?
Sounds like they’re going full Fire Clean.
His lawyers will love this video if he’s really planning litigation, I would make a copy before it gets deleted.
Pretty much so.
“I did it, but let’s blame SOMEONE ELSE!”
Yep, that’l get everyone on our side, pronto.
I took the “lawsuit” bit with a grain of salt considering who it was from. There will be no lawsuit.
I think you’re right. If they actually are considering one (who knows…), they’d have to realize that even winning would be a loss. Their reputation would take a potentially lethal hit.
I don’t need to editorialse beyond the first post I made here on this issue . They are both dead to me and always will be .
Putting lipstick on a pig just portrays it as a bigger whore .
Like I said before actions speak a whole heck of a lot louder than words. And his actions in this video say a million words about him being untruthful and downright fake and also don’t want to forget blaming a lobbyist group that works out of a PO Box basically works out of Springfield Armory and he didn’t know what they were doing.
Is this guy admitting he is grossly incompetent?
This is rather like the guy the cops find standing over what’s left of his best friend with an “unloaded” gun.
Could have done without the corny music.
There is still a way to make this right. Dump your personal fortune into overturning the passage of the bill. If you succeed in fighting it, accept the blame as your own, sell the company and move on. Let someone else redeem the SA and RRA names. That can’t happen with the current SA/RAA at the helm. Let the employees and lower management keep their jobs and continue to rebuild the company reputation.
If you fail to overturn the legislation, accept the fact that through either your negligence or stupidity you have struck a blow against the 2nd amendment rights that has resounding impact against both your customer base in Chicago and Americans nationwide. Make immediate plans to relocate your companies to a more gun friendly state, apologize to your former employees, and once the company has relocated resign.
Um, too late. The only chance of stopping this was in the Illinois senate. The house is controlled by subhuman, filthy Liberal Terrorists™. Now, they can just sit on the bill after it easily passes the house until another treasonous democrat gets elected governor if they believe it will be vetoed now.
Continued…
You fail to understand or accept the gravity of your actions through stupidity/negligence or straight out greed. Folks can’t accept the lies and half truth excuses you offer in the same way they would not accept the behavior of former SecState Clinton after she got four good people in Benghazi killed. This responsibility is yours. This legislation exists solely because SA and RRA let it. You took my money as a customer and used it to fund legislation that is diametrically opposed to my legal rights. That can’t stand, you can’t dodge this…
I like how they took the opportunity to showcase two of their newest dud products.
Well. It is really obvious why they did it guys. They didn’t believe a republican gun rights defending candidate would win. So they gave their money to the leftist Devils in hopes that would influence their decisions on anti-gun legislation.
Unfortunately for SA and RRA, I think their fate is tied to this bill.
Shifty eyes are shifty when he’s talking about the IFMA at 2:00.
And still no words on political contributions to anti-gun pols.
Tell the truth Mr Reese. Thats the first step. Then stepdown.
So this fella thinks by pushing out an expensively produced video that we’re simply going to forget this betrayal?? HAHA…! He’s just as bad as any Hollywood actor thinking soft music and “pull on the heart strings” family background story will work! Dude, you F’d up! And I can tell you that your father is spinning in his grave over what you have done!
So reading the comments here was very entertaining. We’ve got people who think that the legitimacy of his claim is determined by how much his eyes shift and move around. Which is comical. We’ve got people here that actually believe a lawsuit will occur on the basis of virtually nothing. Nobody is questioning why they contributed to anti-gun politicians in a state where only anti-gun politicians are elected. Nobody is questioning whether their contributions to anti-gun politicians was exclusively for their companies’ sake or that those contributions were intended to help all gun owners in IL. And. Nobody has any definitive proof that the manufacturers knew about the carve out/bill while simultaneously also holding that people should be treated innocent until proven guilty.
Thanks guys.
I agree, while I know I will surely get heat from this.
I can’t believe how a lot of the commenters on here don’t see how their reaction to this event is so similar to reactions we get from the liberals every time Trump makes a move.
Some of these comments seem blurted out in anger without any real thought.
Example: “You should just go bankrupt and disband the company”
Reality? Lets see you build a company up by pouring your entire life into it, surround your family into it and then make a mistake and turn around and throw it all away.
There are a lot of complex issues at play here, I don’t believe its as simple as some suits walked up and said “hey Springfield, want to donate money to anti-gun lobbyists and vote for this bill that makes shit worse?” “sure, what the hell”
But that’s how its treated here.
I would be more inclined to believe Keller tried to do damage control during a time when he thought Hillary was going to win and things would get real bad real fast and he believe this could salvage some type of control rather than lose it all.
Not the best plan in the world, cant say it was the worst either.
But to believe that SA would sell them selves out for such a small gain, doesn’t seem right.
Think about it, that carve out doesn’t really gain either company all that much, we’re only talking Illinois here, where gun restriction is high to begin with. So why risk so much for so little?!?!
That’s my problem with this whole thing.
You could make these same claims by saying, why does Henry arms stay in New Jersey, the most anti gun state there is, why do they keep giving the state business?!?!
If they were true 2A supporters and pro gun, they would move the business to a pro 2A state.
So that must mean Anthony Imperato is an anti gun traitor.
Well, no. Should we stop buying Henry rifles because they are made in Jersey where gun rights go to die? That will show Jersey we mean business…… no, no it wont.
Driving SA and RR out of business will do more damage to the gun economy than this bill would. This bill services the state of Illinois only, SA and RR service the whole country.
Was there a muck up, yea, does running them out of town on a rail fix it? no.
As for the anonymous tip, WOW, look how many people here jumped right on that and didn’t read it correctly.
Once again, no proof what so ever to back up that statement but it didn’t stop readers from wanting SA burned at the stake for it.
Reading through these comments is like reading through liberal trash, its all emotion driven with very little factual input or any real useful means of improvement.
Now, with that said.
Don’t bother telling me I’m anti gun, or a troll, or a liberal loving idiot.
I’ll fight until the death for our rights and freedoms, but I won’t trample down others fighting along side me in an effort to send a message to the opposing side.
One person commented to me before that this kind of “threat” to the 2A by SA and RR should be met with violence and we should kill the CEO’s to prove a point.
That kind of talk is the reason we get call crazy gun toting madmen and it needs to stop.
This is well said.
Great writing but none of it addresses the real issues. Those are:
1. This was first tried on May 27, 2016 by the IFMA (that means Reese of SA and Larson of RRA) and it didn’t make it. That was first reported here on TTAG and I provided the direct links to the Illinois Legislature that confirms it.
2. John Boch approached Keller in January 2017, before the SHOT show, with this very question and Keller blew him off.
3. John Boch then wrote and asked both Reese and Keller in February 2017 if they were in fact going to withdraw their opposition to the Bill in February 2017. Both Reese and Larson ignored him. The Bill just passed through the Senate Committee without opposition from the IFMA (it passed by ONE vote which was a Republic who was clear to do so because the Firearm Manufacturers no longer opposed the Bill and on to the Senate floor where it passed.
4. I also provided links to the IRS 990 tax returns for the IFMA which disclosed that the IFMA had been supporting rabidly anti-gun Illinois politicians like the Senate President, John Cullerton, for YEARS. Not chump change either, Cullerton got $10,000 per year for multiple years and other anti gun Democrats got separate payments of $5,000. again, FOR YEARS.
Dennis, is that you?
The inability to make direct eye contact and maintain it is a common trait of people literally “searching for the truth” in their brain. It is an involuntary movement that indicates someone is in the act of lying. Ask a police detective. It’s science.
TTAG reported a source saying that a lawsuit is possible. Doesn’t matter what the source was, of course it is possible. I think it had been brought up before in the comments sections of a few other articles. It will fail, but reporting it is a good way for SA and RRA to gauge the consumer backlash of such an action. Pro tip…bad idea.
Making political donations to anti-gun politicians so they don’t run you out of business? Websters defines that as blackmail. The POTG aren’t dummies and we seem not to take kindly to that type of behavior. I just bought an upper from BCM in Wisconsin, an Aimpoint PRO from SKD in Missouri, run an Anderson lower from Kentucky, and would love to get a Lee Armory AK from Copper Custom in Indiana. Move to an adjoining state and stop letting anti-freedom politicians extort you!
Since the heads of SA and RRA were the founders and officers of the lobbying group there are only two possibilities. 1. Collusion with anti-gun politicians or 2. Ignorance of what a lobbying group you founded and ran was doing with your contributions. Either one fails to absolve you of guilt.
LOL! Thanks. It happens to me sometimes too – when I drink too much coffee.
BINGO or when facing bright ass camera lights that blind you. Yes even in daylight they use bright lights and a big fancy screen to reflect as much light as possible into the persons face.
Nope. This is an anonymous source informing you that the sky will be green today.
Ah…but I looked outside and saw the sky was blue and I don’t believe you. Just like I looked at the list of officers on the board of the lobbying group and saw the names of RRA and SA management and don’t believe them either.
Well, I’m also an anonymous source that sometimes tells people that certain companies are going to sue blogs and journalists. I’m sure you’ll believe that.
Some of your comments are pretty rude, this is an actual person trying to make amends for an error that happened on his watch. We have all made mistakes in our life, and I for one don’t think this was such a grievous error. I know you are all anonymous posters here online, Dennis is not and you are insulting him to his face while hiding under a cloak of privacy. He is taking responsibility, he has “learned” his lesson (even if it was force fed by some of you), but please people refrain from insulting him, he is a person, he has friends and family that will be reading these comments. How would you guys like it if you screwed up at work and then the whole internet shits on you? An error was made, he is doing what he can to make it right, now let’s move on and accept all the good that they do as well.
Ron Ron Ron… First, I am not an “anonymous” poster.. My name: ‘first & last’ is placed right there for all to see as are quite a few others but that is not the issue here. Can I assume by your post that you might also believe that Hillary Clinton should get a pass simply because she’s been a victim of her delegated underlings bad behavior or betrayal?? Dude..! You need to wake up and smell this rose for the rotten flower it is! The man is running damage control! Why? Because of a bad decision HE made! He and RRA own this lobbying group! They are the ones who spent the money to protect “their” personal interests! That is the issue we all have here. A simply apology and a well produced video WILL NOT FIX THIS!
He took responsibility, made a mistake, didn’t realize what he was doing at the time he did it, whatever excuse you want to make. Regardless, it’s over, it’s done, lesson learned and I promise you it won’t happen again. And in answer to your other question, I honestly couldn’t care less about Hillary’s emails either. People make mistakes in life, he is trying to correct it, a man shouldn’t be judged by one error, everyone deserves a shot at redemption.
Ron is correct.
As for the Hillary comparison, what she did affected the nation and national security as a whole, while being paid to represent us using tax dollars.
What SA and RR did affected only Illinois and was done by a private company.
I bought a Ruger, does that mean that I am anti gun because I supported a company that messed up in the past?
No, the purchase did more good for the pro gun movement than it did harm.
We need to be mature adults on this.
One of the first things you learn in Engineering school is that no matter who much good work you produce in your life, one failure can end your career because that is all people will remember you by.
That’s why Engineers build everything 2-5 times stronger than it needs to be.
Same goes here, lets forget all the good SA and RR have done over the years and the millions of firearms they made that help support the backbone of our 2A, lets throw that all out and burn his company to the ground because he mucked up and may have ok’d not fighting against a bill that might stifle gun purchases in a state that restricts gun rights to begin with.
Get real guys.
Fighting against Dennis instead of helping bring him back into the fold is un-american, this isn’t who we are.
We don’t put hard working Americans out of business because of a poor decision, we build them back up, help them see the error of their ways, and mold them into an even greater ally for future fights.
Ahh, I see the social media spin meisters have gotten to the office and joined the party. Props for the effort, that’s why you get paid.
Results? Well, zero for me, but I used to be a guy who told corporate tales, so that vid rings as hollow as his soul.
UnAmerican? Forgive and forget? That’s hilarious. Get your crisis managers on the case, sell lies until the population loses interest, hopefully they move on to another target. Go right back to doing the same things that got you in trouble in the first place. I will give that he is smart enough to listen to apparently competent crisis management. I don’t think anybody’s gonna buy it though.
16V seriously? I don’t agree with your opinion so I must be a paid shill? You have no logical come back so therefore I must be paid? I honestly hate people like you much more than I hate what SA did. You can go screw yourself, not everyone thinks what they did was a big deal, not everyone thinks it was a Judas move. Accept it and don’t be such an ass
Money makes people do strange things. Makes people hate others just for having their opinion and having the unmitigated gall to voice it. Trying to understand your angle but the level on vitriol makes me think you stand to lose finincially from the demise of SA or RRA. Just my opinion…go ahead and hate me for it.
Ron R,. No I don’t think you’re a paid shill because you disagree with my opinion, but because your statements mirror those that one hires a crisis management team to spread. Perhaps you haven’t examined the evidence, or perhaps you need to get a bit more jaded.
Dennis, is that you? Is Ron R. kinda like your Anthony Weiner (Carlos Shockwave) pseudonym?
The inability to make direct eye contact and maintain it is a common trait of people literally “searching for the truth” in their brain. It is an involuntary movement that indicated someone in the act of lying. Ask a police detective. It’s science.
TTAG reported a source saying that a lawsuit is possible. Doesn’t matter what the source was, of course it is possible. I think it had been brought up before in the comments sections of a few other articles. It will fail, but reporting it is a good way for SA and RRA to gauge the consumer backlash of such an action. Pro tip…bad idea.
Making political donations to anti-gun politicians so they don’t run you out of business? Websters defines that as blackmail. The POTG aren’t dummies and we seem not to take kindly to that type of behavior. I just bought an upper from BCM in Wisconsin, an Aimpoint PRO from SKD in Missouri, run an Anderson lower from Kentucky, and would love to get a Lee Armory AK from Copper Custom in Indiana. Move to an adjoining state and stop letting anti-freedom politicians extort you!
Since the heads of SA and RRA were the founders and officers of the lobbying group there are only two possibilities. 1. Collusion with anti-gun politicians or 2. Ignorance of what a lobbying group you founded and ran was doing with your contributions. Either one fails to absolve you of guilt.
Not a grievous error? You’re OK with the State stealing 5-10 thousand from FFLs other than big box ones? The sponsors admit they expect to force FFLs out of business. I think this is the same bill from last year, except with the carve-out.
Cry me a river Dennis, if you’re so damn adamant about our 2A rights what on earth were you doing to stop this bill?
Maybe pay attention a little, they are currently fighting against it. But he isn’t an all powerful wizard who can wave a wand and make all the bad guys go away.
Question is, what have YOU done to help?
Who else thinks Ron and Bob’s last name is Reese?
Gentlemen, RRA and SA have either through active collusion or willful negligence sold their souls for 30 pieces of silver. The penance for such an act must be paid. To most people, Ruger and SW paid their penance through new ownership and both now sell products that they once helped ban. To some they haven’t paid yet or never will pay. SA and RRA can’t expect everyone to forgive them in a fortnight.
Because we aren’t a bunch of sheep and are using reason and logic instead of pitchforks and hate we must be aligned with the company and or Dennis? Great logic. I am a reasonable human being who has made mistakes in life and I am sickened by the display of hate being shown here for one of the leaders of the gun industry. That is all, simple as that.
Dennis, the old false dilemma schtick ain’t gonna fly.
To imagine that there are only two choices, yours of course which is replete with “logic” and “reason” and others whose only recourse is with “hate” and “pitchforks”. You sound a lot like a snowflake anti-gunner, judging anything which isn’t in complete agreement with your opinion “hateful”.
Simply put, many people have used logic and reasoning (note the lack of air quotes) to come to the conclusion that they are simply not ready to forgive and move on. They can see that the IMFA was comprised of only SA and RRA and don’t buy these excuses nor do they appreciate both companies ham-handed false contrition.
Comparing what SA and RR did to Judas selling his soul is why these types of arguments are pointless.
I’m a Dodge guy, but if I get a Ford rental car, that doesn’t mean I sold my soul for 30 piece of silver to Ford.
Maybe get off your High horse and come down to reality.
Hope and pray you never make ANY wrong decision in your life and everyone around you turn their backs against you for the rest of your life because of it.
At lease Dennis has employed thousands of people for years, what have you done with your life?
Your argument about being a Dodge guy driving a Ford has no relevance here. That is a personal choice brought on by simple personal preference. I have one for you though. I know a guy who worked for GM for years until his job was given to Juan in Mexico. He will never ever own a GM or Chevy vehicle again. He was personally harmed by GM’s decision and has decided he can not forgive them. Do you demand he forgive them? Are you so interested in controlling others that you demand they forgive and forget on the same schedule as you? Are you not aware that there are many companies who will fill the gap in terms of pro 2A funding and support if SA and RRA go away? Are you that interested in insulting gun owners own ability to make decisions for themselves? Do you get a paycheck from SA or RRA?
I have made plenty of mistakes. Forgiveness depended on the person and the offense. I have forgiven many people (try to forgive all but that doesn’t always work out) depending on the person and the offense. But I have learned at least that I can’t force forgiveness on others nor can I bend them to my schedule of forgiveness.
I have done tons of things, like serving 6 years in AFSOC, raising two kids, being a good father and husband, all of which are bigger and more important thing than the title CEO. If you aren’t a good father and husband and can’t teach your kids the right way or help your spouse do the right things then all the good you do as a CEO means nothing.
And at least I haven’t screwed over all the gun owners and small FFL’s in Illinois.
It’s too f@@@ing late. It’s already passed the senate, because of them. Now the bill moves to the house that is infested with subhuman, filthy Liberal Terrorists™. If they want, now they can just it on the bill till the next treasonous democrat is elected governor if they even think there’s a chance it would be vetoed now.
Nothing to add here except to note that this video violates the first rule of holes.
For all the haters out there. A simple question. Are you all going to buy anything from the big box stores any longer? Dick’s, Scheels, Bass Pro, Cabela’s, WalMart or Gander Mountain? Seems as though they have the most to gain by closing the Local Gun Stores (LGS). Yet know one is saying a word about them. Holding 2 manufacturers responsible,to fight the Illinois machine alone seems rather unreasonable. Quit separating a company that has successfully fought the anti-gun establishment for decades, and consider who and what is really at risk here. SA will retain my support. I KNOW, I have seen them fight for 2A rights for years.
Uh, the issue is that these two manufacturers created and funded a lobbying group for their own benefit. They then claimed they knew nothing about what the lobbying group was doing, the very same group that they both created and funded with no other companies’ help, when this law was passed. Now both companies are shifting blame to the journalists who proved they complicity.
In case you didn’t understand what’s going on.
Who cares about what retailers you buy from? This is about manufactures, that rely on customers to buy their products, taking a HUGE dump ON those customers.
SAI and RRA have to be a couple of the most incompetently led companies there are. Neither one builds/imports a product that isn’t already available from other companies, so why even risk playing footsies with anti-gunners? Any expense that would have “burdened” them with the passage of the original bill could have been written off as a business expense. They should have stayed out of politics, like most companies should, and kept their wallets and mouths shut. They obviously didn’t do a financial risk assessment. Wonder what hurt more, the $50K each they spent for their carve out or the potentially millions in lost sales?
I wonder how many people responding to this thread have never made a mistake or failed to think through the unintended consequences of their actions. Or at least, would never admit to it.
Does the magnitude and scope of the consequences enter into your thought?
Forgetting to brush my teeth this morning probably has pretty low consequences for me and almost zero for anyone else … unless I’m headed for a job interview in which my major halitosis loses me the position.
My family could, and I hope would, forgive me for the mistake; but it wouldn’t change the consequences.
Asking for forgiveness is not the same as asking for no consequences to their actions. (Criminals tend to do the latter, if you ever listen to sentencing hearings.)
To Dennis Reese and Chuck Larson:
I really do believe you both that this was not intentional and was a mistake. But that doesn’t matter now and I’ll explain why.
As the CEO of a company, everything that your company does, whether accidental or intentional, is your responsibility.
As the leading members of a trade group, everything that your trade group does, whether accidental or intentional, is your responsibility.
In light of this and your subsequent failure to take responsibility and own what you’ve done, I call on you both to resign. That is what responsibility looks like in a situation like this.
Your own personal failures are now tied to your companies so you may very well take down your companies if you don’t resign. If you do take responsibility and resign, then some trust is restored and maybe your companies can earned back the rest.
Your customers want to trust your companies again. Your continued presence will make that very difficult.
Please take responsibility and help move things forward. Let the people of the gun fight the real enemy instead of you and your companies, and let your workers support their families.
– A Disappointed Customer and Informed Second Amendment Supporter
That sounds all fancy except the part where you want someone to give up on their entire life’s work due to a lapse in judgment.
He didn’t poison his workers or make a company decision that resulted in the loss of life.
I believe asking for either CEO to give up his company for this judgmental error is laughable at best.
wow…..
Your idea that this is just “judgemental error” is laughable. There is no way SA and RRA didn’t know what they lobbying firm was doing, no way in hell. The only way the two CEOs who were ON THE BOARD of the lobbying firm were ignorant of what was going on is if they ordered employees to not directly tell them the proceedings, ONLY so they can cover their asses.
Resignations won’t work. They MUST sell the companies to folks that have NO relation to them. They can sell or go bankrupt.
As said previously, I bet TTAG would love to be able to run discovery on RRA and SA. If there’s a lawsuit that would greatly increase the odds of it happening. My advice is sell out now while your stuff is worth what it is. S&W and Ruger have both recovered from their gaffes, but under new management.
It’s more the, at the time, new ownership that turned S&W and Ruger around.
Honestly, I think I believe him. I’d like to see some proof, but as a person who runs a much smaller company, I can see how something like this would happen.
I, for one, am done with Springfield Armory…
They can’t backpedal, sue or “buy” their way out of this. Personal financial interests in the gun industry should not ever come before protecting our rights
Our source also tells us that Springfield Armory is considering suing Mr. Keller and TTAG.
Well it may be in Mr Keller’s best interest to turn over all the email communication he has had with SA and RRA and let TTAG publish them.
As for the whole, “You sure have a nice blog there, I would hate to see anything happen to it” threat, I don’t think that would bode well for them. Doubling down on attacking your customer base would be suicidal and desperate.
They could do it though since wounded animals are the most dangerous of all.
Sue TTAG?
If that does not say scared of the truth what does.
Springfield could not be handling this worse.
They have dug a grave I do not see them getting out of and I am ok with that.
“Our source also tells us that Springfield Armory is considering suing… TTAG.”
way to read the room, SA.
Are all gun manufacturers pulling their weapons from the ” big box stores? We know SA and RRA did not lobby for them. Did the big box stores pay anybody, or show up at the capitol in Springfield yesterday? How unusual these 2 manufacturers get ambushed the first day of the NRA show. Who is shallow enough to believe SA & RRA is behind this. Couldn’t be a lobbyist or big box store sell out??? Oh wait duh!!! That would seem to obvious. These 2 companies have fought more anti gun in Illinois that’s any others. Can’t believe how shallow some of are 2nd amendment supporters (if they are real) are, may be outsiders pretending, so they may stir our pot. I will not join the dividers so they may conquer. Wake up sheeple, you are playing into the anti gunners hands.
Uh…http://www.thetruthaboutguns.com/2017/04/john-boch/springfield-armory-rock-river-arms-trade-opposition-to-illinois-ffl-licensing-scheme-for-carve-out/
what? they divided the gun community when their lobbyist signed off on this legislation that puts onerous requirements on the little dealers and raises the bar for market entry.
Oh look, a brand new screen name riding in to spread disinformation and spin. An angry, anonymous, last ditch effort won’t salvage any goodwill, Mr. Reese. Just give up.
I see the SAI and RRA apologists have found this thread.
Near tearful video coupled with vengeful threats to sue? Piled on top of a mountain of anti-freedom facts? Give it a rest, pal. Zero credibility. Stick a fork in him. He’s done.
We seem to be on the same path as Bloomberg and Clinton . Do you all think it matters to the left who is behind shutting down gun business, US or they?
we lose either way. If I’m building a berm and my neighbor is throwing dirt at me,my berm is going up and I win.
They have apologized ,now we have to watch what is done going forward.
The cave-in for a carve-out aside, I still won’t trust these guys after they donated to anti-gun politicians. Even though there are no guarantees that any company won’t do the same thing, I won’t spend my money where I know for certain it went to a bad cause.
Yeah the politician excuse that I didn’t know what my giant money donations were going to is not an excuse. I don’t buy it. They got caught screwing gun owners to carve out their own protections, all the while screwing the little guy and the gun buyer.
Any man with a sense of family and honor. A knowledge of heritage and the struggle for success. He perhaps would delegate to a smooth talker. A con man. Anyone can be duped. I think a lobbyist would have to be a con man. A person with no honor.
I believe you Mr. Reece.
Dennis – You need to stop. Really. I’m sure that you’re a nice, family oriented, employee-centric kind of guy. You F’d up and you F’d up bad. There’s nothing you can do or say that will make this OK. You should quickly do the right thing by your employees and staff. There’s no sense in putting yourself and your employees and family through months of going bankrupt and being (one of the) the focal point of the crap storm that isn’t going to subside before the company is valueless. Take some time off and build another bigger, better company if you want at some point in the future. This is the best advice you are going to get anywhere this week or maybe this month.
This is so sad.
I was just about to buy a brand-spankin’ new Springfield M-14.
Always wanted one, now I’ve got the cash but I’m averse to spending my hard earned money to support Reese and his incompetent or nefarious activities – its gotta be one or the other.
Reese and Springfield are either completely oblivious or believe the general public is.
Get a Bula. It will cost you more but will have a forged receiver, not cast, and it won’t have to go back to the factory for the fabulous “life time warranty” that SAI has to offer to fix their broke stuff leaving the factory.
http://shop.m-14parts.com/Bula-Defense-XM21-CBR-with-Carbon-Fiber-Chassis-XM21CBR.htm
There are companies that make M14 type rifles also.
It seems gun folks are as inherently ignorant as motorcycle people. They gladly attach their own kind to the point of death just to prove some ignorant point. Motorcycle folks like to attack their own if they drive a different brand or sue a trailer. It’s Lord of the Flies in both camps. When the right to own a firearm is effectively destroyed, look back and see all the work you did to destroy those that would have been your ally.
How’s that saying go, “With friends like those (SAI & RRA)….”
I saw this on “Springfield’s video” youtube comment section. Apologies if already posted but it is interesting…
http://www.upi.com/Archives/1989/03/16/Salvador-based-Army-colonel-indicted-on-bribery-charges/5406606027600/
Prosecutors cleared the way for the indictment last month when Dennis Reese, president of Springfield Armory Inc. of Geneseo, Ill., who alleged arranged the payoffs, pleaded guilty to lesser charges and agreed to cooperate with investigators.
LOL!!!! If this site had likes or thumbs up you’d have thousands of them. Seems that poor ol’ Dennis is familiar with bribery and payoff schemes.
PS This link should be the first post anytime he is mentioned.
Preach it from the rooftops, MJ!
All of this “play dumb” bull-caca is why it’s over for Springfield. I really can’t conciously spend any more money on this company, even though I like their products. End of the line for me as a customer.
As it stands now, Springfield Armory will have to make serious efforts for a number of years before I would consider purchasing one of their products. I’m sure many other consumers would agree. However, if SA were to sue TTAG or any other gun blog, I would not only never purchase one of their products again, I would contact publications that run their adds urging them to stop or lose my business as well.
Reese is in pieces.
Rock Island Auction put up a web page opposing the bill and it shows some info from state Senator Neil Anderson, and a video. http://www.rockislandauction.com/oppose-illinois-sb1657/
They have been good in the past fighting for the second amendment when they gave all that money to the NRA-ILA called the Freedom Challenge.
I know this response is a couple days late, but… you DO realize that we’re talking about Rock River Arms, don’t you? Not Rock Island Auctions, whoever they are.
You’re moving in the wrong direction, Mr. Reese. It is highly unlikely that you will convince this community that you have clean hands. The best you can hope for is that we will believe you created a self-serving institution and then looked the other way, or were asleep at the switch. So, quit talking about heart shots, utter your mea culpas, and tell this industry how you will pay a meaningful penance.
Gary Walters
GunIQ LLC
“Green jacket, gold jacket… who gives a sh_t!”
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