TTAG T&E guy and former DHS Risk Analyst Nick Leghorn is to statistics what NRA Ambassador and Scott Trade stockbroker DeAnne is to fresh-faced friendliness. So I had Foghorn cast his eyes over Fairleigh Dickinson University’s firearms-related survey [via foxnews.com]. “It’s in the ballpark,” Nick pronounced. And out of left field. To wit: “nearly a third of registered voters — 29 percent — believe an ‘armed revolution’ might be necessary in the next few years in order to protect liberties.” It sounds crazy, but with some 150 million Americans exercising their Constitutionally-protected right to keep and bear arms (maintaining ammo supplies that eclipse those of the U.S. Army), it just might work. God forbid it should ever have to.
“God forbid it should ever have to.”
And God forbid it never happens.
For as horrible as the human toll of World War 2 was, would rolling over in fear of the sacrifice and allowing Hitler free reign over the world have been a better choice?
The founding fathers were smart guys. They knew that government, no matter how many checks and balances held it in place, would inevitably, every single time, eventually devolve into tyranny. It’s simple human nature, and the nature of power. That’s why they put the 2A right after the 1A. When words fail…
What would have been so bad about Hitler ruling Europe? What did he do which was so bad, which the US itself didnt do? And before you get your panties in a bunch and scream ‘muh holocaust’, try to remember how we dealt with the native americans.
And if the founding fathers knew that all along, why were 1A and 2A amendments rather than being part of the original constitution.
No government should be “ruling” any region. To rule is to oppress.
“And if the founding fathers knew that all along, why were 1A and 2A amendments rather than being part of the original constitution.”
Because of opposition from people who thought that the people’s rights should be explictly spelled out in the U.S. Constituion. It was assumed that there would be not need for written guarantees of human rights under the Constituion because the Constituion limited the scope of the national government’s powers such that it would have no authority to regulate speech, religion, press, etc. However, there was almost unanimous demand for amendments to the Constituion after the First Continental Congress to protect freedoms from government power. So, in order to get the Constitution ratified, the Bill of Rights were added to the Constitution.
What would have been so bad about Hitler ruling Europe? Do you actually think he would have stopped there? how about systematic elimination of every jew, catholic , christian etc.in order to achoeve the perfect race… I am trying to temper my judgement on you because everyone should be able to express there opinion. However in the future please spend an hour of your time learning your history. Hitler had no intention of stopping in Europe. He had already taken over Africa etc.
We’re due for a blockbuster movie about Concord & Lexington.
Story by James Cameron, explosions by Michael Bay and soundtrack of course by Hans Zimmer
That’s a GREAT idea. But have get it done before newage Hollywood thinks of it/bastardizes it.
They’ll bastardize it by having guys run around with hand cranked gattling muskets and all sorts of other stuff we didnt know existed then.
To be honest I fear this outcome. I don’t want to see armed conflict, really, I don’t.
What I do see is an attack on liberties never before seen. Not just 2A, but all across the spectrum.
I ask myself how can we change course. I just don’t know. I love this country, and the people in it.
Daniel,
It is pretty much unavoidable — world history is our guide. I saw an interesting summary somewhere:
There are basically two kinds of people in the world. One group consists of people who want to be left alone and free to live their lives. The other group consists of people who are basically bullies — they want to tell the other group how to live their lives.
And because the first group are “live and let live” kind of people, they put up with the bullies and give ground until they finally have had enough and then push back with fury. Of course the bullies don’t want to give up on a good thing so they continue on their path. Once it starts, the resulting conflict doesn’t end until one side or the other prevails.
I wish it were different.
that has the ring of truth to it, I know I completely fall into the live and let live camp, even when my rights aren’t being infringed, and sometimes I get so pissed at these damned statists that I just want to hoist the black flag and stomping out tyranny.
Both sides are bullies, the right does not want to give away your life to POS gangbangers though, Randy
“Both sides” comprise one side.
It’s like freedom of religion not being limited to the freedom to be whatever kind of Abrahamic you want to be.
There are a lot more religious choices out there, and “live and let live” is a political philosophy outside the “two sides” with which we appear to be stuck.
Well put, sir.
If you think this “is an attack on liberties never before seen” than you must have a rather shallow knowledge of history. See the Harlan County War for just one example where the military grabed guns from civilians, or the case of Schenck v. United States where the SCOTUS unanimously agreed that the government could arrest and jail people for distributing leaflets protesting the WW1 draft without violating their 1A rights.
“I ask myself how can we change course. I just don’t know. ”
You might start by changing your party affiliation from D or R to L….
That number seems higher than I would think. Maybe people are waking up from the past 12 years of civil liberties infringements. Lets hope people will vote accordingly to fox the problem.
I think the high percentage can be attributed to differing definitions of “liberty”. Some people are almost certainly including liberties such as: freedom from want, freedom from responsibility, freedom from being offended and freedom FROM religion.
Well, aren’t we a smug bunch! We’re live-and-let-live, and if anyone disagrees with us, it’s because they enjoy bullying people! How many of you live-and-let-live types agree with these statements:
-Decisions about abortion should be between a woman and her doctor.
-The Supreme Court was right to strike down the Texas law banning sodomy.
Ron Paul doesn’t agree with either statement, btw. A bully?
A couple days ago, a five-year-old fatally shot his two-year old sister in the chest with a rifle that he had gotten for his birthday. I think that whoever gave him the rifle should stand trial for reckless manslaughter. Does that make me a bully?
BTW, I know a lot of lib’ruls. I don’t know a single one who’s a bully, or who enjoys telling people what to do. Incredible but true.
Howard,
I am definitely a “live and let live” person. Here is some clarity for you:
In the case of the five year old boy who accidentally shot and killed his two year old sister, I am 100% if favor of our criminal justice system prosecuting the parents for an appropriate charge such as child abuse or child endangerment. Why? Because the parents’ negligence violated the “live and let live” idea (which caused the death of their child).
As for abortion the conflict is about the life of the unborn baby, not about telling women what to do with their bodies. One side claims the unborn baby is a “tumor” and the mother can therefore do whatever she wants. The other side claims the unborn baby is a human being with just as much of a right to live as a 1 month old infant. So if you subscribe to the “live and let live” idea, it is wrong for a women to abort a baby because she doesn’t let the baby live — just like the parents who, through their negligence, didn’t let their two year old toddler live.
And yes, Mike, I’m sure there are a lot of people out there who are ready to start an armed insurrection to protect their freedom from being offended. And let’s not forget the atheist militias training in Vermont. BTW, how do you have freedom of religion without allowing freedom from religion? Do you say everyone must have a religion, but it can be whatever they want?
I hope not, but just like the United States treats other nations, I refuse to take any cards off the table.
Iv been saying this for years, its sadly the only likely way anything will get done to actually benefit the common (meaning non government elitist) people.
There’s alot of NON government elitists out there as well. It’s ok to be pissed off. Just know who you should be pissed off at. The 1%ers are counting on supressing your wages to the point where by the time the masses figure out who the enemy really is they can’t do anything about it. I don’t care how much guns and ammo you have stocked up. Erik Prince and Xi will mop the floor with you because they can afford too.
I keep saying this again and again. Big city liberals rule the elections in this country because of re-redistricting and electoral college rules. The conservative backbones of most states get hung out to dry as a result. This is what needs to change. No longer should electoral colleges vote all-or-none in elections. The resulting change would be dramatic.
“Might be needed” … might would not have been the word I would have used, hate to say it but “will” is the word I fear.
If there is another civil war, I’m plan to be on the side with the most guns.
An E-Mail from my friend and fellow pilot;
My boys and I have talked about this a lot. At 74, I’ve pretty much gotten all the time on earth that was due me when I was born. I hope I would be willing to die for my family, my church (I’m a Salvationist), and my country (specifically the 2nd Amendment, which I believe protects all the other Amendments) when the time comes.
I don’t know what I will do when I must make that decision, but I’m steeling myself for that decision. I take POST training courses even at my expense regularly, and practice regularly.
-m-
My answer to my friend:
I will be standing at your side, WHEN and IF the revolution does come to happen. As Charlton Hesston said “From MY cold dead hand”
If the “Black Shirts” come to take the tools of LIBERTY, they will take the People of Liberty next.
History repeats itself, all it takes is the WRONG leader of the country, it has happened before and will happen again.
WE THE PEOPLE are not immune from DICTATORSHIP……..
JF
WILL you stand with us?…………..
“29 percent believe an ‘armed revolution’ might be necessary in the next few years in order to protect liberties.”
They’re the optimists. The other 71% know it’ll be necessary.
I’m afraid the other 71% are only concerned about whether the mall is open yet.
yes, this is a sad reality. Most people just don’t give a damn because they have no appreciation for freedom or what it really means.
Drones, Patriot Act, National Defense Authorization Act 0f 2012, Homeland Security and gun control. Police who act like Sturmabteilung (SA Brown shirts).
Homeland Security purchased 1.6 BILLON rounds of ammo for what? I see they are purchasing another 200 million rounds.
I will not go quietly into the night!
I’m almost positive that’s nearly the same percentage that supported the revolutionary war back when the country was founded.
I hope that another civil war won’t be necessary. Such a thing would be disastrous in the short term, no matter what good might ultimately result. But ever since the 2000 election, when the Supreme Court ignored the constitutional process set up for doubtful elections, followed soon after by the War on Terror, fought in so many ways against America’s own citizens, I’ve had the sense that we are already engaged in the preliminary battles of a war between freedom and control.
Consider healthcare reform, as an example. If the government existed to offer a help up to those who need it, the reform would have been to create a guaranteed healthcare program based on income for anyone who wanted to participate, with no requirement to change anyone’s plan who wanted to stay with the status quo. But instead, the control freaks had to tinker with the whole system.
Or look at the proposed background check law. Rather than creating a simple go/no go list of people who had gone through due process and been found wanting–namely felons and the dangerously insane–the control freaks insisted on something filled with potential for abuse (intentionally so, likely) and primed to create a registry.
The inescapable conclusion is that people who demand vast control aren’t acting out of an interest in the public good. Whether they wish to exercise control that they feel is lacking in their lives or they want someone else to regulate their lives for them is more than I can say. What I do know is that unless we can reign in such people, the day will come when these opening skirmishes that we’ve been fighting will turn into a full-on hot war. That, or we’ll sink into the twilight of our civilization.
Regarding background checks, you sound like one of those control freaks yourself. 2A and the supremacy clause does not bar them from owning firearms.
It may happen soon than later if Adam Kokesh gets enough people to follow him. He is trying to organize an open carry march on Washington DC for the 4th of July. I see that ending really well….
https://www.facebook.com/events/252728144871259/
“How can people with small arms hope to win a fight against drones, tanks, and cruise missiles?” Hey, those button pushers have to have barracks to sleep, they gotta get chow, and they gotta have utilities to power their computers, they gotta have fuel for their machines – all of which is supplied by the civilian sector. The soldier in the field won’t fire on their aunt, dad, cousin, or sister. If their parents raised them right, they’d likely follow / join the oath keepers anyways. A revolution to preserve the constitution would probably have popular support of the military anyways. Just a musing and an opinion.
“How can people with small arms hope to win a fight against drones, tanks, and cruise missiles?”
I don’t know. Let’s ask the Taliban.
The “success” of the Taliban in Afghanistan must also be measured in terms of tens of thousands of Taliban dead and tens of thousands more little jihadis being popped out by enslaved Muslimahs. They grow ’em faster than we kill ’em, and surviving afterward is a matter of indifference when jihadis love death more than “infidels” love life as they look forward to a virgin-saturated paradise.
The Taliban are out there sowing murder but individually aren’t the same persons as their replacement is immediate & continuous. That’s a tactical advantage but only a collective one.
The oath keeps are irrelevant. They only have ~10k members and most of them are veterans or retired. Even if we were to assume they were all active duty, it would make up less than 1%. And if their parents raised them right, they would have gotten jobs in the private sector and paid for their education themselves, rather than sucking off the tax payers tit.
And no a revolution would not have the popular support of the military, they have deliberately killed more American civilians than any other organization out there. They launched airstrikes utilizing explosive and chemical ordinance in the battle of blair mountain, and burned 2 women and 9 children alive in the ludlow massacre. They will even attack veterans such as the 1932 bonus protests; even when directly ordered by their commander and chief to cease their assault, Gen. MacAruther refused.
The military itself will be targeted. Most red blood republicans need to look beyond the bumper sticker slogans and see what’s really going on. They’re being played by the likes of the Koch brothers among others. The original Tea Party was a response to corporate control of the government by way of the East India Company. If we continue down this road we will at best have an oligarchy. At worst a benevolent dictatorship, and the only debate will be if the adjective applies. Either way your guns WILL be controlled I promise you that.
Economy collapse, given our current course, will likely occur before we quite get to that point. End result not likely to be much different but with mass starvation in the cities (blue/leftist/sheep decimated).
If 29% agree how high is the real #? Who answers a phone poll honestly?
It’s coming. I don’t really want it to come, but it’s coming. The writing is on the wall.
To those who say that the we cannot stand up against the might of the US military or the Federal Government I have this to say: Don’t impose your own cowardice upon us.
AS I note, it’s not urban metrosexuals who own the guns: http://guardamerican.com/index.php/blog/38-protect/619-1-3-of-country-expecting-armed-revolution
I’m with Daniel Silverman on this. The thing to realize is that the elites lerv chaos.
It works for them. We must not be played.
I wipe my ass with polls. Got no use for them. If and when the time comes, I’m ready.
It’ll happen it’s just a matter of when. I don’t see it as a civil war more like another revolutionary war. Don’t you think that when it happens the puppets will question why? That’s all it will take to open more eyes to the oppression and tyranny. Eventually the enlightened will outnumber the corrupt and restore the freedoms our founding fathers gave us.
Jesus Christ RF, why did you leave out the other part of the poll which said
“Only 38 percent of Americans who believe a revolution might be necessary support additional gun control legislation, compared with 62 percent of those who don’t think an armed revolt will be needed.”
http://publicmind.fdu.edu/2013/guncontrol/
Doesn’t fit his agenda?
I with those above hope it never goes to armed conflict. I would advise nullification pursuits, and defensively prevent enforcement. Evil prospers when good men do nothing.
PLEASE … PLEASE…… Talk to your representatives , and DEMAND an end to “Citizens United”. We need a constitutional amendment that says contribution to political figures MUST be individual citizens…..NOT corporations or unions. Fear not the government, but FEAR the corporation controlling the government. Corporations WILL bring back the days of the company store…. Some day you will have to pay a TAX to have a garden and grow your own food. IT WILL HAPPEN …..money begets more money!!! Corporations already control the media, they are tightening their grasp on government, and they soon will have all the necessary technology to monitor citizens, so the next thing will be the sacrifice of your rights…..that includes firearms. A corporate entities primary reason for existing is to make money, and that means doing anything in it power achieve those goals. We in a time a excess, so PLEASE……. look into citizens united…….this is bigger than just the right to bear arms.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Citizens_United_v._Federal_Election_Commission
“God forbid we should ever be 20. years without such a rebellion…”
“The tree of liberty must be refreshed from time to time with the blood of patriots and tyrants. It is it’s natural manure…”
“And what country can preserve it’s liberties if their rulers are not warned from time to time that their people preserve the spirit of resistance? Let them take arms.”
– Thomas Jefferson to William Stephens Smith in reference to Shay’s Rebellion, Paris, 13 Nov. 1787
Jefferson acknowledged that Shay’s Rebellion was “founded in ignorance” but none the less, served the useful purpose of reminding the leaders that the “people preserve the spirit of resistance.”
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