On Wednesday, a Cobb County, Georgia grand jury indicted three men in the death of Ahmaud Arbery. Greg McMichael, Travis McMichael and William “Roddie” Bryan face malice murder, felony murder and a host of other charges for their respective roles in the homicide of Mr. Arbery.
Many have seen the video detailing the killing of Arbery on that fateful day.
The National Review has the story of the indictments:
A Georgia grand jury returned an indictment of nine charges against the three suspects in the murder of Ahmaud Arbery, Cobb County district attorney Joyette Holmes announced Wednesday.
Holmes said that 64-year-old Greg McMichael, 34-year-old Travis McMichael, and 50-year-old William “Roddie” Bryan face malice murder, four counts of felony murder, two counts of aggravated assault, false imprisonment, and criminal attempt to commit false imprisonment…
The gears of justice have ground slowly in this case. The incident happened back in February.
The McMichaels claimed that Arbery resembled a suspected burglar in their neighborhood, and drove to confront him. The shooting, captured on live video by Bryan, drew national outrage, and led to the arrests of the suspects in May….
That wasn’t a smart move on the part of the McMichaels, especially while brandishing firearms. They claimed self-defense at the time, but that will be a tough sell to any jury.
The fact that the McMichaels both had guns, including at least one long gun, and Arbery wasn’t armed will make their claim difficult to make with a straight face. Especially when all of the disparity of force elements favor the dead man, not the McMichaels.
During testimony earlier this month, Special Agent Richard Dial said that Bryan told him Travis McMichael allegedly called Arbery a “f***ing n*****” after shooting him in the chest. The autopsy report showed that Arbery was shot three times and did not have drugs or alcohol in his system.
No matter the outcome of the criminal trial, the defendants in this case will likely lose everything in the ensuing wrongful death suit. And any evidence presented of racial bias component in the shooting will taint their claims of a righteous self-defense.
The moral of the story: the safest, most prudent move is to never confront a suspect if you can avoid it, especially in a property crime. The situation can quickly escalate into a deadly force encounter and prosecutors and juries generally don’t look favorably on killing someone over mere property.
I don’t think there’s much “allegedly” to McMichael’s description of Arbery. He posted on Facebook that he should have “blown that f***ing n***ers head off” along with a history of racist rants.
Further evidence has come out damning them, including the fact that Arbey had tried to get away from prior to the camera rolling.
It was a modern day lynching, without the rope…
I’m pretty much an old time southern cracker nearly 60 years old and those 3 guys belong in the Georgia death house.
A stupid game deserves a stupid prize…
Turn off your cameras ! If you happen to record something bad —you could be charged with murder. More stupidity from leftards. The Mc Micheals seem to be guilty of murder. But the guy recording the video has been charged ? By that measure all reporters that record criminal acts should be charged with that crime.
Fed up, he is being charged because he participated in rounding up the victim in the first place. we are seeing the end of the encounter, but they had chased him down and box him in at least twice before, and he participated in all three encounters.
I will be curious to see how this all plays out at trial. I’ve been kind of withholding having an opinion on this myself after the media spin on a lot of DGUs. That said guys in a pickup truck boxing someone in like that who aren’t cops seems really really sketchy.
The one question I really did have was there was a claim floating around the police told people to call these yahoos if they saw anyone. Was that real or a hoax? That would seem to open the PD up to a lot of liability.
It’s still proof that it’s better to transfer the liability to the police if they’re still functional in your part of the world no matter what the outcome or the actualities are of this.
So words can do physical harm now? What’s the ballistic coefficient of a racial epithet? Should we be worried about the incident where an alleged robber was being confronted and grabbed the alleged murderers weapon or should we troll his internet history for words that hurt muh feels?
“So words can do physical harm now?”
No, but they certainly reveal motive.
Yeah, words are harmless. I dont know how many people Hitler personally killed but his words motivated a lot of others to kill for him. Same with Stalin, Mao, and others. Words reveal motives as Ralph said. They also reveal the person’s heart.
Don’t hurt my feelings ! Criminalizing words is rediculous BS. If you can’t handle getting your feelings hurt – stay in mommy’s basement and play your video games . Grow up , grow a pair , get a life ! If you believe words can hurt , Joe Braindead will enjoy getting your vote for stupidity.
The moral of the story is also to not be a racist murdering a55hole scumbag.
. . . or you might get caught.
Oh and don’t hang out with murdering a55hole racist scumbags.
@ John Boch | Jun 25, 2020
This is just a view on this
[QUOTE]
The moral of the story: the safest, most prudent move is to never confront a suspect if you can avoid it, especially in a property crime. The situation can quickly escalate into a deadly force encounter and prosecutors and juries generally don’t look favorably on killing someone over mere property.
[/QUOTE]
The above quoted moral is flawed. Enter in the following type of property crime, thieves that steal parts:
1) Complete wheel/tires combination
2) batteries
3) air-bags
4) catalytic converters
5) the entire vehicle
from vehicles parked on the public street, parking facilities and private as well; in broad day light. The local police average response time to a non violent crime (on a good day), is five to fifteen minutes. The career-thief is aware of this response time and is -in- and -out- long before the first responder arrives. The thief quite often returns to the same area after a period of cooling-off, then strikes again.
Granted your post did state
“never confront a suspect if you can avoid it” <– with focus on the word -if-.
That said, it would really be challenging to not have a discussion, at whatever safe distance possible, with the actor(s)\perp(s). In contrast, the case you are directly commenting to/on, these college-graduates took time to:
1) get tools,
2) chase or pursue,
3) then engage an unarmed individual; ultimately taking his life.
Compared to the example I've provided, given the local LEO's average response time to a non-violent crime during Covid19, with the early releasing of inmates who have already been convicted of !!! violent felonies!!!, etc.
I would be hard pressed to not have a discussion with one, or more, criminal actors about a high-dollar non-vanity item that they were obviously stealing.
paging pwrserge…
Greg admitted he did not see Arbery enter the home and commit a crime. Travis admitted to intentionally shooting Arbery with his pump action 12 gauge. Roddie admitted he knows Greg and was trying to help him that day.
They are going away. They admitted their crimes to the police thinking the white police department and DAs will protect them and their white neighborhood. They forget it’s election year and they are not rich donors.
Their white supremacy was exposed in their social media posts and private conversations. The neighborhood is full of racists just like them.
they’re civilians…acting like vigilantes…doesn’t look good for them….
Yepper…The 3 knuckleheads are in the crapper.
So you are convicting a man for murder when his crime was recording a commotion that happened in his neighborhood!
The man admitted to felony crimes that led to the murder of a innocent black American during his regular jog through a white neighborhood near the water. He lied to the world saying he didn’t know the McMicheals and he didn’t try to stop Arbery. The evidence on the day of the murder shows the truth, but that evidence was being hidden from the public by corrupt DAs and police department. Hence why Roddie couldn’t answer questions on TV when he scheduled interviews and his lawyer is trying to get the trial over with right now before more evidence comes out against Roddie. They tried to get a plea deal to testify against the McMichaels but the government found more evidence damning Roddie and exposing him as a white supremacist who loves Nascar, Trump, etc.
The white supremacist posts, the confederate flag, the Don’t Tread on Me flag, the military stuff, the Trump stuff, the blue line stuff, the NRA stuff, is overwhelming their chances of a not guilty conclusion because they are the stereotype embodied in three men who shot a black man for jogging through their white neighborhood.
I would not be surprised if Travis gets executed.
I don’t know Georgia law, but, in most places, you can’t claim self-defense if you instigated the situation. You punch a guy, he pulls a knife, you shoot him, you go to jail. A guy pulls a knife, you shoot him, you go home (possibly after a trial).
It depends if your “instigation” was lawful. If you are a shopkeeper and you attempt to detain someone upon seeing them try and steal your merchandise, you don’t have to stand there while they shoot you in response. That’s what the defendants here will try to claim- that they were acting lawfully to try and make a citizen’s arrest.
For reasons that have been explained many times, that defense is almost certainly going to fail.
They did not claim citizen’s arrest. That was the fiction of the corrupt white male DA in his five page letter defending the three white men. Greg admitted to the police he did not see Arbery enter and leave the home and he did not know Arbery outside of a security video he saw from Larry English.
Why do people continue to make a false argument when the first hearing has made everything clear using evidence? Did you bother to watch the preliminary hearing?
Even the lawyers for the criminals, who claimed in public that their clients were not racist, admitted their clients say racist things and have racist thoughts when they were in the court room. Pretty much saying it’s not a surprise considering the history of the country and that state.
Travis is screwed. He admitted to purposefully shooting Arbery with his pump action shotgun and there is video showing him raise the gun as he demanded Arbery to stop running. That’s life in prison as a minimum mandatory sentence.
I bet Travis is pissed the same law and minimum mandatory sentence advocated for by the Republicans to be used on black males is being used on him. He now has to fight to stay off the injection table.
Greg will turn on his son to save himself from life in prison where black males will rape and kill him eventually.
Cue that commie trash pwrserge letting everyone know why in his opinion this was a ‘good shoot’.
No. This was murder, plain and simple.
Damnit c’mon. It’s like beetlejuice. Don’t invoke his name on this shit.
Pwrserge
Pwrserge
Pwr……alas I cannot do it.
Although, on this issue, PWRSERG was wrong, and stridently so, I liked him and read his posts when he was not troll-hunting (I skip those debates). I wish he was still posting.
Powerserge is a troll and probably a paid Russian troll at that. The guy is a complete liar and probably not even in the US. He left subtle hints like his rant about Dallas being a small liberal town in Texas. It was pretty obvious he had never been in the US.
Thebsonttag,
Respectfully, I disagree. Not intending to be argumentative. I simply disagree.
Ah the Russian troll stuff again… Must be getting close to election time again. Sure seems like the lefty handlers are disseminating the talking points.
Serge is not a Russian troll. He lives in Illinois and even got trolled by some a-hole who recognized him. You ARE a troll. And a poor one. The Georgia klan boyz are dead meat…
We used to have a saying in high school “he who smelt it dealt it.” You must be a Russian troll.
By the way Serge is a Ukie, not a Russian.
Jeremy S is willing to post the locations and logon devices that posters use on TTAG, he could tell us exactly where pwrserge is posting from.
Nonsense. You may be a Russian troll since I’ve never seen your name before and the trolls have a habit of just showing up, but pwrserge was not. He was just full of shit and probably racist.
Someone recognized PwrSerge? Does he really look that much like his avatar????
@Serpent_Vision
Yes, that was me. Sergei is a complete loser of a man. In spite of being an engineer, like a real one, the dumb asshole spends his free time trying to be an internet tough guy on comments sections such as this one. He eggs people on and tells them to go and kick out antifa here, and kill people with Zyklon B there, but when asked why he won’t go claims that he is far too disabled from his six month service in the Muhreens. Yes, you read that right, six months before the fat fuck got chaptered out. I tend to think his fat ass just couldn’t pass pt after boot. The reason he won’t go is the same reason why he doesn’t win any 2-gun events like the one he taped himself trying. It’s because he’s fat, bald, and generally unfit to be in combat. He also thinks himself a constitutional lawyer, though it’s pretty obvious that anyone that doesn’t agree with him has no constitutional rights, according to him. In effect, Sergei is a fat, bald, loser that’s pushing 40. Not that his age has anything to do with it because he was this in his 20s. His anime waifu will never be real, and even if she was, she’d be disgusted by him. So no, he looks nothing like his anime daddy avatar. He looks more like the antagonist of an NTR hentai, though I’m sure he hasn’t seen his own penis in years so that’s where the comparisons end. Please remember to mock him next time you see him.
Wow, now I feel bad for Sergei.
He wasn’t a troll. Right or wrong, he backed up his arguments with logic. I don’t get why debate is so scary for people.
I get a kick out of these pansies having their rhetorical hands full with one guy, tag teaming one guy and still having a hell of a time, kinda embarrassing fellas…
Dude, agreed. He was never a troll. I like reading what folks around the US and world have to say about guns (technical, historical, political, law, self defense, competitive sport, LE, Mil). Heated debate is good. There’s a lot of unique perspectives shared here. But when I see lots of name calling I skip over those comments. Ain’t nobody got time for that.
He comes and goes, when the mood hits him…
I haven’t noticed pwrserge around here lately. I guess the Georgia thing was a final straw, that thread hit 500 posts
Pwrserge = Derek Chauvin
Explains a lot
You may be right, we’ve never seen them together in a photo.
Think his view on the GA event would be different if the jogger were white and the morons in the truck were black? I do. The guy isn’t particularly bright and he definitely bases his opinion in part on the races of people involved.
His legal knowledge is laughable.
He is too busy trying to turn America into a CHAZ.
Dickhead’s been awful quiet lately
Pwrserge is a douche and a walking contradiction. I like hearing old soviets like him give themselves rope to hang themselves when a person tries and talks crap about libertarians and only ends up demonstrating they know jack and sh*t about them.
Just because someone disagrees with you over the shooting of a “jogger”, doesn’t mean the person is “commie trash”.
I agree my friend. I disagree with people here, at TTAG and elsewhere, all time. I am constantly accused of being commie trash. Nothing could be further from the truth. I wave the good ol’ red, blue, and white on Declaration of Independence Day too, just like every other United States of American.
Eric Swalwell 2020
If you want a scumbag dealt with, don’t bother calling 911 first.
“you can’t claim self-defense if you instigated the situation” – And it’s important to know when the line of “instigation” is crossed. A lot of people tried to trot this out in the Treyvon Martin case because Zimmerman “Left his vehicle”. Instigation is not merely what precipitates events (otherwise all parties would be guilty of instigating for merely leaving the house that day), but what crosses the line into criminal behavior. Instigation occured when they brandished their firearms, made threats (while demonstrating the means and ability to carry them out) or attempted to restrain Arbery (I’m not certain as to the actual detailed sequence). After that, Arbery’s actions became legitimate self defense, which the other men (or at least one of them) then escalated to homicide…made unjustifiable due to their instigation.
In my everyday life, people work and socialize together regardless of race, ethnicity, or religion. People are friendly and cooperative. My work teams are diverse and everyone seems to enjoy each other’s company.
When my wife and I walk in the park (every day), black people, white people, Hispanic, Asian, Muslim, Indian/Pakistani (yes, I know they are Asian, also), almost everyone smiles, waves, and says hello (some folk are shy and won’t make eye-contact).
When I read the harsh, bigoted words of the McMichaels, they seem far from my experience. It amazes me. I hope they are an aberration.
Haven’t spent much time in south Georgia have you?
None.
I’ll recount one story. In 2002 I worked the Georgia elections for Diebold Election Systems. I was assigned to Wheeler county where I worked directly for the Judge. A great big fat man. Maybe 500 pounds no lie. Nicest guy. Bought me lunch every day. Literally threw a speeding ticket in the trash can next to his desk. I asked him if he could do that since it was given to me by Ga state troopers. He said “they have to bring you to my court. It won’t make a docket. That’s it”.
I was moving a couple of voting machines from where they had been dropped off to the space they had given me to work in when the judge came out and saw me. He said “son, why are you moving these heavy things by yourself?” I said “I’m the only one I have.”
He said “son, I’ve got about 40 head of ni###rs across the street in the jail. I’ll have some of them help you.”
I declined. That man was the law in Wheeler county. If you came up before him and you were black, you were screwed. Not talking 1950’s or 60’s. 2002.
Klaus VS,
That is a disturbing story. Eye-opening, but disturbing.
I hope that judge is long retired.
“I hope that judge is long retired.”
At 500 pounds and 18 years later, I’d say the chance of him being still alive are slim to none… 😉
One of the things I learned on that gig was about how county officials get paid. They listed about 5600 county residents. Alamo, the county seat had about 1700 if I recall correctly. There were 2 other little “towns” of maybe 500 each. A coupe of wide spots in the road with maybe a 100. And a few hundred scattered around the county. The math didn’t work.
I asked the judge about it. He told me they counted the private prison there with 2200 “residents” of the county and he got paid X amount per inmate, err, resident of the county.
Or any place else. The only people on this earth who are not “racist” are suicidal whites afraid of being called names by communists.
I get where you’re coming from, but I it’s the exact opposite now.
Calling yourself a racist is “woke.” It’s an important step to realizing that you are wrong for being born.
I’m not racist, never have been.
jwtaylor,
The fact that you go out of the way to deny that you’re a racist, actually means that you’re a racist. Sorry, thems the rulez. /sarc (well, not really, which is the sad part)
Language games … again.
Everyone has prejudices. Not everyone is a racist, but the moral relativists and diversity experts are trying to brainwash everyone into believing the lie is true.
hard to see how a jury can do anything but convict….this ain’t 1950…..
There will always be racists. There will always be people that talk like this. You can’t legislate away racism. What I can’t stand, is when the media and political activists pretend that this is how the majority of white people act. They do this in order to cause fear, division, and white guilt. They do this for the sole purpose of gaining power. If anything, those actions will INCREASE racism, which benefits them.
Dude,
Well said.
are you the caretaker at the “it’s a small world” disney attraction?
LOL!! Sounds like it, doesn’t it!
But, what I described is accurate. I like living here, but need to move somewhere less expensive for retirement…if that ever happens.
Using the N word in a sentence does not make one racist.
Black people will never be equal until one of them could be in the barber shop or construction office scenes in Gran Tourino and no one get upset about it.
He kicked those cops ass straight up and down drunk as hell and then stole their own weapon and used it on them, that’s some straight-up Valhalla shit, screw you cancer
I would ask if you read the post, but I’m not entirely sure you’re on the same planet.
Perhaps you’re thinking of a different group of heavily armed white men murdering a black man? I can understand how that’s not a particularly specific description, these days.
“I can understand how that’s not a particularly specific description, these days.”
It happens much less than you have been brainwashed to believe.
Using 2016 numbers, 3499 Whites were killed that year. Blacks committed 533 of them or 15%. With 42 million blacks in the US, that means for a 100,000 population of blacks you will have 1.2 murders of Whites committed by blacks..
In 2016, 2870 blacks were murdered. Whites committed 243 of those killings or 8%. The White population is 197 million. For a population of 100,000 Whites you will have .12 murders of blacks by Whites.
Here are the 2016 murder stats. https://ucr.fbi.gov/crime-in-the-u.s/2016/crime-in-the-u.s.-2016/tables/expanded-homicide-data-table-3.xls
If you expand the numbers to include all acts of violence, it is just about the same. In 2018, 3,581,360 acts of violence were committed against Whites. Blacks committed 15.3% of them, or 547,948 act of violence committed by blacks against Whites. Again, using a population of 100,000 blacks you have 130 acts of violence against Whites committed by blacks.
Blacks had 563,940 acts of violence committed against them in 2018. Whites committed 10.6% of those violent acts or 59,777 acts of violence against Blacks committed by Whites. Again using a per capita of acts per 100,000 you get a number of 30 violent acts committed by Whites against blacks per 100,000 Whites.
Put another way, every week in the US, blacks commit 10,537 acts of violence against Whites. And every week, Whites commit 1150 acts of violence against blacks.
The violent acts data is here in chart 14. https://www.bjs.gov/content/pub/pdf/cv18.pdf
Most violence is intraracial. When it comes to interracial violence it is overwhelmingly committed by blacks against Whites.
Now tell me how facts are racist.
CM,
Thank you for the analysis and the link.
that case may well have a different outcome…juries tend to side with the cops…..
I get the father and son indictments. What I haven’t seen is the evidence concerning Mr. Bryan, other than the filming of the incident, which according to him, he wasn’t associated with the other two guys. Maybe there is more evidence out there that I haven’t seen and him being there is highly circumstantial to indicate he was involved. I just haven’t seen anything directly connecting him to the other two guys.
DKW some of the evidence comes from the shooter himself who was talking a lot after the incident and stated that Bryan “had tried to block” the one shot “in with his vehicle” but that “he just ran around him” previous to the filming.
There a lesson there.
I think I’ll defer to the grand jury on this one. There’s a lot of weird stuff going on by his account… it doesn’t sound like he was just a bystander. From what I understand the state’s position (i.e. the prosecution) is that he was involved in the whole thing and tried to block off or chase the victim before the shooting happened later down the road.
The reason I’m inclined to think there’s more than smoke is that unlike the father and son there wasn’t really any outcry for him to get arrested.
The guys will be very popular fellows in The Big House. They need to keep a supply of vaseline handy. Seriously, these guys will likely find the rest of their lives spent in protective segregation.
“these guys will likely find the rest of their lives spent in protective segregation.”
They are probably in favor of segregation.
They will be heroes to others. The old man will probably be in a geriatric ward. Junior might need a few friends.
A friendly word of advice to our reading audience:
If you are jogging down the road, there are two armed guys in a pickup truck driving 3 m.p.h. just ahead of you, and they are staring at you, immediately run away — preferably at a right angle to either side of the road. (If they are going to chase you, force them off-road where their vehicles will have a more difficult time following you.)
I am not blaming nor shaming the victim. I am saying that his decision to run up to that pickup truck was extremely foolish and likely cost him his life. Don’t let that be you.
As a trained professional I agree with your assessment but most people are going to just react by running in the opposite direction.
Back during the Zimmerman case I pointed out that his mistake was retracing his steps. If he had even gone back on the other side of the street Martin probably would have missed him.
GBI testimony indicated Bryan had actually hit Arbery with his truck earlier in the chase, blocking him and forcing him to turn back towards the McMichaels.
Bryan had edited that part of the Chase out of the video clip he put on Facebook but GBI retrieved it from his computer.
They also found fibers consistent with the victims closing on the truck.
At one point Arbery almost escaped the subdivision but the two trucks were able to corral him and force him to turn back into the subdivision where they later cornered him.
Apparently he tried to run away several times but they and the third guy kept cutting him off and intercepting him.
I wonder if he considered calling the police.
No need, the police was already called by the guys who planned to lynch… wait that doesn’t make any sense!
I haven’t been following this closely,I haven’t even read all of the articles here. What is the evidence that Bryan’s participation amounted to murder?
The evidence is not released as it is going to trial. The allegation is that he was also trying to kidnap (er… “detain”) the victim and was part of the whole conspiracy, much like the father who also did not pull the trigger.
I fully expect the video recording guy to sing like a canary and testify for the prosecution for a reduced prison sentence.
He might get 15 years, out in 10…
Another asshat prosecutor trying to squeeze blood from a turnip to make his career. The “Jogger” attacked an armed man and tried to grab his gun, then got shot for it. Anything else is 100% irrelevent. There’s a reason there weren’t any charged till the corrupt lawyer managed to squeeze testimony from another party by threatening an absolutely baseless charge.
You mean attacked an armed man who was the aggressor to begin with, right?
Yeah, the man with the gun felt so threatened he got out and brandished his gun instead of driving away.
You should keep your day job, sir. Cause as an attorney or expert witness, you’re logic plays better for the prosecution than the defense.
Nanashi,
So, no possibility that Arbery grabbed that gun because he felt his life was in danger? I would have felt threatened in that situation, especially given the racist attitude of the armed men.
Grabbing the gun might not have been the smart play, but he could easily have thought his life was in danger.
It seems more complex than you are making it out to be.
That being said, I often agree with you…but not this time.
“The “Jogger” attacked an armed man and tried to grab his gun, then got shot for it”
Exactly. The video even shows the supposed victim attacking the guys in the truck, and that’s the evidence against them?? Pretty weak.
False, the entire video first shows Arbery trying to get away. One the McMichaels continued to detain him they became the aggressors. The aggressor cannot claim self defense.
And the “Jogger” is the aggressor. Having a gun does not make one the aggressor, and to claim such would be a horrible blow for gun rights.
At the very latest the clock started ticking when Arbery attempted to evade and they came after him. That is when you can be certain that the McMichaels became the aggressors. Nothing they did after that can be considered self defense. The aggressor can never claim self defense.
And do you know why McMichael Senior never left the vehicle? It was because the lazy F**k lost his right to carry because he blew off his required training. He would have been guilty of illegal carry as soon as his foot touched the pavement.
“And the “Jogger” is the aggressor. Having a gun does not make one the aggressor, and to claim such would be a horrible blow for gun rights.”
Having a gun doesn’t exculpate you, either. Nor does it give you any right to lynch someone.
Imagine this counter-factual: if the decedent had a firearm and was being chased down by two armed strangers, one of them brandishing a shotgun, do you think he would have had no reason to shoot them? If I were in his position I sure as hell would have.
@tdiinva
McMichael senior never “lost his right to carry” he lost his arrest powers when was was an investigator for the DAs office he got a waiver that allowed him to keep his job because the DA spoke the POST commission on his behalf. In my research he couldn’t attend he required recertification because his wife was getting cancer treatments and he was in financial crisis as a result. It’s no excuse at all but context helps.
Spoke to the POST commission*
I really don’t get how anyone could reasonably come to he conclusion Arbery was the aggressor… McMichaels was standing by the driver side, with the door open. Arbery ran to the passenger side, putting the truck between them. The camera moves as Arbery is running around the passenger side away from McMichaels, and when we see them next, they are both moving from the front of the truck from the direction of the passenger side towards the drivers side.
The ONLY logical conclusion is that McMichaels ran around the front of the truck to intercept Arbery. If I am trying to get away from a guy with a shotgun, and he comes at me with it, I’m grabbing the gun. Saying it’s Arbery’s fault is setting up a no win situation for him. He can’t turn and run the other direction, because the guy with the camera is part of the crew chasing him. If he runs to the driver side where McMichaels was, he’s running toward the guy with the shotgun. If he runs around the passenger side to put the truck between them (which he did), and McMichaels runs to the front of the truck to intercept him (which he did), you’re blaming Arbery for running at McMichaels.
Seriously, that is this is the moral equivalent of throwing a punch, and then blaming the guy you hit, saying it’s his fault he ran into your fist.
Correct. And that isn’t even bringing into account that they were chasing him and intercepted him numerous times after he tried to “jog” away.
Should have been a defensive gun use.
“I really don’t get how anyone could reasonably come to he conclusion Arbery was the aggressor…”
Something tells me what the video guy has to say on the witness stand may clear that up…
“Arbery is running around the passenger side away from McMichaels, and when we see them next, they are both moving from the front of the truck from the direction of the passenger side towards the drivers side.”
Sorry but that’s incorrect. Arbery made a looping left (about as hard a left as someone can make running at that speed) as he passed the truck to engage McMichaels standing in front of the driver side headlight. It really is clear in the video.
That said, I agree that doesn’t make it self defense since they had put Arbery in a position where he most likely believed that he was going to die anyway and invoked in him the “fight or flight response”. He had tried flight and it failed so he decided it was time to fight. The three of them need some serious prison time. Bubba et al will do nightly Deliverance style “squeal like a pig” on the shooter if there is any justice in the world.
the best that argument can do is get them a reduced sentence….maybe….
It’s people like you that make me think we need an IQ test before allowing anyone to post something online.
I’m pretty sure that the respective media outlets have not seen all the evidence, thus do not have the complete story. Based on the portions of the video that I have seen, I am of the opinion that you will not find 12 people in the state of Georgia who will return anything other than a guilty verdict.
I am also of the opinion that if I’m wrong, and these 3 are some how found not guilty, we may have a second set of riots on our hands.
Rioters should be SHOT ON SIGHT .
“I am also of the opinion that if I’m wrong, and these 3 are some how found not guilty, we may have a second set of riots on our hands.”
That’s definitely not a reason to convict and, frankly, rioting is illegal and should be dealt with accordingly.
riots are immaterial…this case will be decided on the basis of the law…..
Good! Now, about that district attorney who tried to play it off.
The problem I have with the “Racist/Racism” term is that it’s been used so often in the last 20 years or so, that I’m skeptical of it’s application. Like the “Boy Who Cried Wolf,” politicians, the media, and various groups have raised that hue and cry so constantly, that I no longer believe it. I’m sure that I’m not the only one in this country who feels that way.
I was a victim of Affirmative Action in the late 80’s while studying at a University. In spite of being a 4.0 student, and a tutor for the University in several diverse subjects, I was denied entry to the program I worked to enter, for two years. Meanwhile, Minority students were being accepted with lower GPAs, and failing many subjects, that I ended up tutoring them in (about 70% passed with my aid, a better than average rate in the Tutoring program). All in all, this proved to me that “Racism” works both ways. It’s no longer about qualifications, it’s about your ethnicity.
The McMichaels overreacted to a situation, that they should have had the sense to avoid. Once they had notified LE of the crime, they’re civic duty was over, and that’s where they should have stopped. Now, one man is dead, and 3 others may face incarceration. Four lives ruined because three didn’t t stop and think before acting.
“The problem I have with the “Racist/Racism” term is that it’s been used so often in the last 20 years or so, that I’m skeptical of it’s application.”
Bingo. Thanks, Leftists, you have managed to cheapen an accusation of racism to the point of absurdity. They have irretrievably damaged race relations in the United States.
I would say (sarcastically), “Nice job, assholes”, but something tells me this is exactly what they want, and if it takes destroying this country, they will have no problem with it…
Nailed it.
following was ok…but they took it to a whole other level….
I don’t know all the facts and I’ve said two things from the beginning here. This is for the justice system to sort out but, damn, does this look bad for the two dudes in the truck. They literally turned themselves into a South Park caricature.
I really don’t much care what happens to them. Stupidity is a horrible affliction and for these two it might be terminal. This whole thing is a clusterfuck they could have avoided by actively decided not to avoid.
*but
How about the guy filming it? Any idea of how that translates to a murder charge?
My understanding is that he’s being charged with Felony Murder, which in Georgia means he was an accomplice to a felony crime that resulted in a death.
The kind of law where you can charge a getaway driver for a death in a robbery gone wrong even though the getaway driver didn’t plan on killing anyone or even actually kill anyone.
That’s what I got out of it but I haven’t looked real deeply into this particular case. Ralph, being a lawyer, might be better to ask.
I wonder if they intentionally over charged him just to get him to plea to something. I’m not saying he isn’t guilty of anything, and I’m no legal expert, but it does seem like a bit much. I doubt he knew anyone was going to get shot.
Everyone who has ever been charged with felony murder has the same line “I didn’t know he was gonna shoot no one! We was just gonna steal some pringles!” Well, when you go rob someone and your partner shoots him, you’re screwed buddy. That’s just what the statute was created for.
Or in this case: when you chase a man down and try to illegally “detain” him (there is no such thing as ‘citizen’s detainment’ in Georgia) and the idiots you’re in cahoots with shoot him, you’re screwed.
Might be a plea or might just get a lesser sentence. But I’m betting his actions fit the elements of the crime.
Since Roddy joined in late, I doubt he know the father and son were armed. He is definitely much less culpable than the father and son so I hope he makes a deal and gets probation. He probably was told Arbery just robbed a house or something by the father/son and had no idea what he was getting into. moral of the story, mind your own business.
It doesn’t. It’s purely for a race baiting attorney to squeeze testimony out of him to make his career hanging the other two.
If there was only some videos and a law that can get him charged with being an accessory to murder during and after. Oh wait! It’s the same law you loved when brown and black people get busted for violating.
Mmm… Sweet minimum mandatory sentences that send all the thugs to prison for life. We don’t need these animals roaming free to hurt Americans. If only we could execute them… Oh wait… We CAN! That’s way better than deporting them back to Europe.
It doesn’t…expect that to go away….
For those that rely on fake news corporations to spoon feed them.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=AYW4VmwqT7I&t=52m0s
The McMichaels need a short rope and a long drop. End of story.
Why don’t they don’t show the McMichaels in their high school cap and gown?
You don’t wear a cap-and-gown for a GED.
LOL
These three guys will be in good hands once they hit prison, especially when the DC Blacks find out what they did.
Perhaps they will get protection from the Aryan Brotherhood, but protection typically comes at a price too. Either way, there won’t be a lot of social distancing, that’s for sure.
Even if they get the death penalty, death sentences often take years to carry out, and they will be begging for the sweet needle of death long before then.
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