Charleston, WV Mayor Danny Jones must be a fan of the Talking Heads. Specifically, the song Crosseyed and Painless, wherein the singer complains that “facts don’t do what I want them to.” In this soon-to-be-famous clip, Jones finds himself teetering on edge of the anti-gun rhetorical abyss. He flails about like a cartoon character trying to prevent the inevitable plunge off the proverbial cliff. While I’m no fan of any bill that restricts Americans’ natural, civil and Constitutionally protected right to keep and bear arms, the Mountain State’s new gun law is almost worth it – just to see Jones come a cropper in this lopsided “debate.” Almost. But not quite.

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99 COMMENTS

  1. In truth the bill in question, SB 317, is a good bill that stops cities in the state from making their own laws infringing on citizens gun rights and brings them further inline with the laws of the state. It also allows civil lawsuits to be pursued against cities for money damages if they were to infringe on a citizens 2nd amendment rights.

    • And like all the other civilian disarmament straw man arguments, “Blood in the streets!” etc., he totally ignores the fact that the majority of states have gone to this exact form of state pre-emption of local ordinances in order that their residents who now have (unconstitutional) state licenses/permits for concealed carry do not have to have law degrees to know where they can and cannot carry in each different city or county in their state.

      He is all up in arms about how terrible this will be for his city while ignoring the fact that all over America the same pre-emption laws have been passed and life goes on. Does he really believe that previously no one with a concealed weapon ever walked past that seventeen year old watching the door at a state rec center?

    • After growing up in GA and watching the liberal media make fun of the South. I had to check the old Mason Dixon line map to see where this idiot hillbilly is from. West VA is North of that line. I’m just a little more proud today for being from GA after watching this knucklehead. But it isn’t just him. This program is idiotic. Maybe I am spoiled because Atlanta is a big city and our local programming is a little more professional than this. I linked a video a couple days ago that was from this show showing the host getting his liberal ass handed to him by the WVCDL President. So I guess they aren’t all dumb hillbillies.

      • West Virginia was the #1 worst state to live in US in 2013 in multiple lists, has some of the worst education in the country, lowest average income per resident, and highest obesity rate.

        If the country itself were not so damn beautiful there I don’t think anyone would care if the whole state went up in smoke. The only impact on the rest of the world would be a little less coal.

        • Easy there. If you have never been here you should watch what you say. Our state has far more to offer than coal as well. We have recently experienced a surge in energy prodiction thanks to the shale gas boom. Rigs are popping up all over the place, as are processing plants and countless other related Industries. We are also one of the nation’s largest chemical producers, with dozens of factories sprinkled across the state.

          Perhaps you could cite your sources. I’ve found my home state peaceful and have an amount of freedom I feel I would not find elsewhere. We look out for our own and have lower violent crime rates than most other states, although like many other states drug problems do plague some areas.

          The poor education you speak of is in rural areas, like where I grew up. Lack of quality teachers, and the inability to fire poor quality ones thanks to the union, has primarily been the cause. Larger metropolitan areas like Charleston, Huntington, Morgantown, Wheeling, etc have considerably better schools and often have private school options. They’re larger tax base means more money to pay teachers, attracting the best and leaving the rest for the poorer areas. My original home county however had one choice, the county’s consolidated high school. A single school for an entire county, and still with only about 800 students. Even with amassing all the education resources into one school, we were not offered, mainly due to budget issues, the great benefits larger schools in metropolitan areas could muster.

        • Nick has the right of it. Not everything in West Virginia is terrible.

          In my experience, there are some good firearm training facilities in the state. And drive through windows on liquor stores! Plus, West Virginia does jailbait really well.

      • “West VA is North of that line.”

        Not really. If you go by the line that marks the southern border of PA, then only the northern panhandle is north of it. If you go by the line that divided free and slave states, the whole state is. Just because they left the Confederacy to join the Union doesn’t mean they are north of the line.

  6. John Unger (D) Berkeley
    There is a D behind this mans name yet, he seems to be the R in this debate. I mean that I hear, is some common sense coming out of his mouth. He may warp my whole preconceived notion of what a democrat is! Is he not a member of the partei?

    • There are lots of pro-2A gun lefties and Democrats, just like their are plenty of anti-2A Republicans. The parties just do whatever they can to get votes and money. If it would get them more votes, the Republicans would not care about the second amendment, and Democrats would change if they could get more votes.

      • Some Republicans care about guns and are real defenders of the 2A.

        Some Republicans don’t care about guns and will do anythiing to get a vote or a
        campaign contributioin.

        Some Democrats really care about guns and want to melt them all down and burn down the 2A.

        Some Democrats don’t care about guns and will do anythiing to get a vote or a
        campaign contributioin.

  7. The elected official in the middle seemed to have some difficulty keeping a straight face. That was a good laugh!

    • He is an journalist and an anti-gun one to boot. There is an video of Mr Keith Morgan head of the WVCDL taking the journalist in question down a peg or ten.

      • I think he’s talking about the man in the physical middle, ie Mr Unger, not the moderator on the show.

      • The moderator (the Journalist) may be anti-gun… but in light of this Mayor who was having a conniption, he was actually DEFENDING that bill. Any other time though, he’d probably take points against it too.

  8. I sympathize with Mayor Jones. Clearly the law is too complex for him to understand. It needs to be simpler so criminals can understand and abide by it.

    • Wow, now that is a really profound observation!

      If the Senator who championed the bill and the Mayor (and apparently his team of attorneys) cannot figure out what the bill means, how is the average Joe supposed to know what it means?!?!?!?!?

    • I suspect the criminals and their criminal defense attorneys understand the implications of this new law much better than the mayor and his political/corporate lawyers do.

      In addition, this law was not intended to fight criminals or criminal behavior, it was intended to prevent municipalities and counties from passing arbitrary anti-Second Amendment laws that turn law-abiding citizens INTO criminals for not knowing and following the obscure gun control laws of each city or county they might pass through.

      It should be painfully obvious to everyone that passing a state law that recognizes the Second Amendment right of their citizens to keep and bear arms is pure window dressing if the local communities still have the ability to enact and enforce laws that make you a felon for exercising that right.

      • “I suspect the criminals and their criminal defense attorneys understand the implications of this new law much better than the mayor and his political/corporate lawyers do.”

        I have a feeling his lawyers (city lawyers) understand it fine. It is probably a case of him saying “This is what I want it to mean, explain it to me in a way that it means what I want it to mean.”

  9. I’m so scared! Those mean gun-nuts, that evil NRA! Now I can’t arrest them when they bring those scary weapons of mass destruction into the REC centers. MOMMY! I want my mommy! WAAAAA!

    • In regards to new legislation, lawmakers stopped asking “does the punishment fit the crime” long ago. Locking up people and ruining their lives for the sake of “doing something” is more politically expedient than actually addressing aggressive crime in all it’s various forms.

    • I know seriously.

      That should be a felony!… We got lawyers interpreting this! Felony!
      What about the grass! We need to arrest them on the grass!
      Rec Center lockers! We don’t have lockers! We have to buy lockers!?
      This should be felony!

      New campaign slogan for Mayor Danny Jones -> Vote Mayor Danny Jones, Felonies for Victimless Crime

      In all honesty though, the Mayor is right. The law basically treats people with a concealed carry license as regular people instead of instant felons. This is why the mayor is all huffy about it. It is clear to me he feels people with firearms are inherently bad and should be arrested on spot and charged with a felony. I’m glad that the bill was voted on 92 to 4 in favor. Its clear mayor Danny makeafelonofyou is a slim minority and has no respect or regard for the second amendment or the gun culture.

      Here is the bill in question: SB317:
      http://legiscan.com/WV/text/SB317/2014

      And the part the mayor was concerned about giving gun owners a little credit instead of making them instant felons:

      §8-12-5a. Limitations upon municipalities’ power to restrict the purchase, possession, transfer, ownership, carrying, transport, sale and storage of certain weapons and ammunition.
      (a) The Except as provided by the provisions of this section and the provisions of section five of this article, notwithstanding, neither a municipality nor the governing body of any municipality may, by ordinance or otherwise, limit the right of any person to purchase, possess, transfer, own, carry, transport, sell or store any revolver, pistol, rifle or shotgun or any ammunition or ammunition components to be used therewith nor to so regulate the keeping of gunpowder so as to directly or indirectly prohibit the ownership of the ammunition in any manner inconsistent with or in conflict with state law.
      Nothing herein shall in any way
      (b) For the purposes of this section:
      (1) “Municipally owned or operated building” means any building that is used for the business of the municipality, such as a courthouse, city hall, convention center, administrative building or other similar municipal building used for a municipal purpose permitted by state law: Provided, That “municipally owned or operated building” does not include a building owned by a municipality that is leased to a private entity where the municipality primarily serves as a property owner receiving rental payments.
      (2) “Municipally owned recreation facility” means any municipal swimming pool, recreation center, sports facility, facility housing an after-school program or other similar facility where children are regularly present.
      (c)(1) A municipality may enact and enforce an ordinance or ordinances that prohibit or regulate the carrying or possessing of a firearm in municipally owned or operated buildings.
      (2) A municipality may enact and enforce an ordinance or ordinances that prohibit a person from carrying or possessing a firearm openly or that is not lawfully concealed in a municipally owned recreation facility: Provided, That a municipality may not prohibit a person with a valid concealed handgun permit from carrying an otherwise lawfully possessed firearm into a municipally owned recreation facility and securely storing the firearm out of view and access to others during their time at the municipally owned recreation facility.
      (3) A person may keep an otherwise lawfully possessed firearm in a motor vehicle in municipal public parking facilities if the vehicle is locked and the firearm is out of view.
      (4) A municipality may not prohibit or regulate the carrying or possessing of a firearm on municipally owned or operated property other than municipally owned or operated buildings and municipally owned recreation facilities pursuant to subdivisions (1) and (2) of this section: Provided, That a municipality may prohibit persons who do not have a valid concealed handgun license from carrying or possessing a firearm on municipally owned or operated property.
      (d) It shall be an absolute defense to an action for an alleged violation of an ordinance authorized by this section prohibiting or regulating the possession of a firearm that the person: (1) Upon being requested to do so, left the premises with the firearm or temporarily relinquished the firearm in response to being informed that his or her possession of the firearm was contrary to municipal ordinance; and (2) but for the municipal ordinance the person was lawfully in possession of the firearm.
      (e) Any municipality that enacts an ordinance regulating or prohibiting the carrying or possessing of a firearm pursuant to subsection (c) of this section shall prominently post a clear statement at each entrance to all applicable municipally owned or operated buildings or municipally owned recreation facilities setting forth the terms of the regulation or prohibition.
      (f) Redress for an alleged violation of this section may be sought through the provisions of chapter fifty-three of this code, which may include the awarding of reasonable attorneys fees and costs.
      (g) Upon the effective date of this section, section fourteen, article seven, chapter sixty-one of this code is inapplicable to municipalities. For the purposes of that section, municipalities may not be considered a person charged with the care, custody and control of real property.
      (h) This section does not:
      (1) Impair the authority of any municipality, or the governing body thereof, to enact any ordinance or resolution respecting the power to arrest, convict and punish any individual under the provisions of subdivision (16), section five of this article or from enforcing any such ordinance or resolution; Provided, That any municipal ordinance in place as of the effective date of this section shall be excepted from the provisions of this section: Provided, however, That no provision in this section may be construed to
      (2) Authorize municipalities to restrict the carrying or possessing of firearms, which are otherwise lawfully possessed, on public streets and sidewalks of the municipality: Provided, That whenever pedestrian or vehicular traffic is prohibited in an area of a municipality for the purpose of a temporary event of limited duration, not to exceed fourteen days, which is authorized by a municipality, a municipality may prohibit persons who do not have a valid concealed handgun license from possessing a firearm in the area where the event is held; or
      (3) Limit the authority of a municipality to restrict the commercial use of real estate in designated areas through planning or zoning ordinances.

    • Well it is only obvious that the way to make “Gun Free Zones” work is to let the Bad Guys know that ignoring the signs makes you a felon. I’m sure that knowledge would have prevented scores of mass-murdering spree killers.

  11. Excuse me, off topic I know, but was there a post about the NRA collecting names prior to this post in which I commented on or am experiencing early onset?

    • They were putting together mailing lists. Of people that were already NRA members.

      Oh, man. So scary and conspiratorial. Or not. Again. Still.

  12. And they say we’re nuts, indeed!

    So, where’s all this “honest and open” discussion that the civilian disarmament industrial complex’s precious sock puppets are always droning on about? All I see is a shouting match between him and his host, and even though the host himself is in fact one such lackey, even he’s not buying it!

  14. Wow. Danny must have had a few cold ones before he went to the show. Maybe a variety pack of cold ones, short and strong, tall and fruity. He had himself a good old time.

    “You’re not a lawyer – you don’t know what you are talking about!”

    “I can read…”

    The mayor isn’t a lawyer either. Funny Funny.

    How embarrassing.

    • …and is that lawyer defining “is” for the prosecution or the defense? Better check.

  18. The mayor of Charleston has to answer to lots of retirees who moved out there from DC. He has to deal with the steady breakdown of mayoral power. Now if he were a professor, those two punks who think the law makes sense would shut up to defend their final grade.

  19. This was absolutely hilarious, and paints a perfect picture of the gun grabber playbook.

    Whine, raise voice, whine, whine, whine, paint guns as evil, whine some more, mention lawyers, raise voice to shriek status, mention lawyers again, claim its for the kids (if no traction make them poor, if still no traction bring in minorities), whine some more, cross arms and pout.

  20. I cant even put in to words the disgust that I feel for people like this guy and the Malloy video from the other day. How is a young guy like myself supposed to keep the faith in our politicians when they all are idiots and push their bogus agendas on us while having no idea about that which they are speaking?

    I vote but fear it is all in vain, because any politician that seems decent gets pushed out by their own party or never really had a shot, or in some cases (eg. Robert Sarvis ) appears to be a shill to steal votes from the republicans.

    My words continue to fail me but the anger I feel about the people running the show continues to build like bad heartburn. It’s almost like in these cases ignorance would be bliss…until it no longer is, because at least if I didn’t know the people running this country were such ignorant jack a**es I wouldn’t be so angry about it.

    Most people either don’t care about freedom or think you are a tinfoil hat wearing weirdo if you do care. Like in the VA gov. race, almost everyone I know was completely disgusted by Cuccinellie because of some sex law and abortion law nonsense trumped up by the media.

    So instead we get stuck with Clinton JR. Is it too much to as for people to not speak about things in which they are completely ignorant? Is it too much to ask for a politician that seeks to support the Constitution, and stay out of the way of everything else?

    • Hold on to that anger, but turn it into positive action. Become involved – grassroots level or whatever suits you.

      Not that you aren’t already involved in such things.

      Also consider: your vote DOES matter when pooled with many others. YOU cannot outspend your foes, but you can pool your money to do so. Etc.

      And, I’ve got to say…it is very cool to hear from a “young whipper snapper” that is passionate about this stuff in an articulate, self-aware way.

      You give me some faith in the future.

    • How is a young guy like myself supposed to keep the faith in our politicians

      A smart young guy knows that he should never have faith in politicians.

      Most pols don’t care about you, the nation or the Constitution. The care very deeply about power and money. Or both. And I’m talking about their power and money, not yours. Never yours.

      So vote. It’s important to vote. But keep your eyes on the bastards.

      • Ralph, I guess that’s kind of my point. How can I vote for someone while having no faith in them that they are who they say are? The first election I was able to vote in was Either Bush Jr. or Kerry. Both equally bad in my opinion, second was Mccain or O (If I remember correctly) Mccain turned out to be very bad as far as fundamental rights go. I sucked it up and single issue voted for 2A rights because that’s most important to me, and I believe our country as a whole. After that, and I may get flamed for this, I voted libertarian which may have been a bit idealistic, but I have been known to cut off my nose to spite my face in order to keep with my principal. I know you say to keep an eye on politicians, and I do. However it seems nearly impossible to get them out once they prove they are terrible for this country, case in point our current POTUS. The damage they do is equally as difficult to undo, if not impossible (how many laws get repealed each year vs. passed.)

  21. What strikes me as funny is that the Mayor’s indignation seems to center on this idea, that seems to spring from his own imagination, that the State Legislature gets to exclude guns from the capitol but he doesn’t get to exclude guns from city hall. In other words, that he would no longer get to be one of the elite who gets a monopoly on armed violence. He thinks he’s being kicked out of the ‘in’ crowd.

    Which goes to show this isn’t really a debate about gun rights vs. gun control, and never has been. It is, and has always been, about who has the right to go armed and who must be controlled.

    • You have properly identified the situation. The City of Charleston had a handfull of gun laws that were grandfathered in. The rest of the state has decided that they want to remove those laws (waiting period, monthly limit, and municipal facilities). They city wanted to retain their local control vs. the rest of the state wanting consistency. This is a classic state vs. local power play. When the city realized they were going to lose it all, they tried to save face and give up the 2-waiting and limit, in order to keep the 1-municipal facilities.

  28. This azzhat is typical of the gun hating crowd. If you disagree with them, they’ll shout and curse at you and insult you until you shut up, because emotionally charged invective is far more important to them than facts.

  30. I think I would have flat out told him “you don’t have to be a lawyer to read plain English and comprehend it. Maybe you do Mr Mayor”
    I love guys like him. They make the bad guys just look idiotic.

  33. The host was against the bill, but seemed to do a fair job wanting to stick to actual facts. The mayor really was very stupid.

    • Yeah, wait until he see’s himself on TV and realizes what a total jack ass he made of himself.

  34. “Are you a lawyer?” Jones is a tool. While the show’s host may not be a lawyer, the Senator he was debating (actually pissing and moaning too) is a Rhodes Scholar, more than capable of putting together decent legislation and understanding that legislation without a law degree.

    Out of all the cities and towns in my home state that I visit and travel to, Charleston is without a doubt the one I feel less safe in.

    • “In my many years I have come to a conclusion that one useless man is a shame, two is a law firm, and three or more is a congress.” – John Adams, Continental Congress, 1776

  35. This video makes my HEAD HURT. >,,<

    This is the face of the anti-2A movement right here. Pinhead politicians like this all know in their hearts that if anyone ever gets a CCW permit they will IMMEDIATELY run to the nearest public place and start throwing boxes of bullets are children. You can't convince people with this level in insane anti-logic. It's so ingrained in them that they can't hear how insane they sound anymore.

  36. Let us see if the Mayor used all the gun grabber techniques:
    # Deny everything the other person says regardless of the facts — check
    # Shout down the other person — check
    # Insist that you know better than the other person — check
    # Subtly insult the other person — check
    # Claim that the other person is doing the bidding of the NRA — check

    Yeah, I would say that covers all the bases.

  37. I’m lost. Were both of the other guys named “Bray,” or is “bray” the new bro? I feel old.

  39. Mayor Danny Jones is the perfect example of a #GunBully !

    Yep – let’s seize the latest hashtag from Moms Demanding Hoplophobia and use it to show what bullies they are against law-abiding gun-owners.

  40. That is the quintessential Liberal amygdala hijack right there. When facts counter to the Liberal’s delicate feelings and existing notions try to make their way into his brain, his amygdala flags those facts as “flight! fight!” and he starts to act out.

    This is all primitive reacting. Like a rabbit watching a coyote making it’s way right towards him.

  41. I think we all need to kick in on a new pair of pants for the good mayor…I am quite sure he soiled himself. Poor guy.

  42. The 2nd amendment is the only amendment that we’ve allowed gov’t to eliminate in certain areas. When you enter a school…are you no longer in the United States? Because part of your constitutional rights were left at the door…

  43. OK…I have been working Pro Gun causes and issues for 20 years and this is the FIRST time I have seen two DEMOCRATS destroy a REPUBLICAN with pro gun logic.
    I dont really trust either party but most republicans are pro gun. I am amazed this guy didn’t stoke out.
    He was running the typical liberal gun grabber argument:

    1. Ignore the facts right in front of you.
    2. Yell NO! NO! NO! when the facts are shown to you.
    3. Blame someone else (NRA) even if they have nothing to do with it.
    4. Ignore the fact that nearly all of the State legislature voted for the law.
    5. Make idiotic claims with no basis in fact.

    So…we need to all descend on Charleston ….Open carrying everything we have and watch his head pop off…Lol

  44. It should be a felony to carry a gun in a school, a rec. center, municipal building. etc.etc.etc.

    Wow, this is W. Virginia? I guess they haven’t heard of Newtown, or Virginia Tech. I would love to ask the irrational Mayor, one question. What common sense gun law protects you while your cowering under your desk? When Evil comes to kill your kids, does the GUN FREE ZONE that made you feel so safe, now change to a KILLING ZONE. You bet it does.

    It’s the DEMOCRAT party that is coming after your gun rights folks. If your a gun owner and a democrat voter, then you really have to explain to the rest of us, how you can pull the lever for these band of fools.

    I am a one issue voter. I vote guns every time. If you get the 2nd amendment, then you probably understand the idea of a constitutional Republic!

  45. I agree with Mayor Jones, the state shouldn’t ban guns from their property or buildings. Jails, prisons are the exception. And maybe court rooms for special cases.

  46. Meltdown of the month! That was worth watching. “You’re not a lawyer! I’m not a lawyer, either, but I know what it says, and you don’t!”

  47. What a friggin blowhard. I was expecting (not hoping, mind you) the throbbing vein at his right temple to just go ahead and burst, spraying gore across the bill who so struggles to understand. If Foghorn Leghor was in politics… But, no. I suspect Foghorn dug guns.

  48. Then again I have met some pretty, interesting, gun owners. Were they nuts, no, they weren’t. Jus eccentric.

    I d say most anti gun people typically make some comments that strike me as literally insane. But some people who don’t like guns can sometimes say things pertaining to firearms that, even though completely wrong, don’t make them look crazy.

  50. To all who discuss party policies regarding my state. I would like to inform you that the democrats of this great state have a different view on some subjects than their national counterparts. They are the old world democrats, not the new progressive left wing nuts that currently occupy DC. That said, make no mistake, they are far more corrupt than anything that goes on in DC. For gods sake, the Lincoln county sheriff was arrested on election fraud, and a judge in Mingo county was involved with their late sheriff in a drug ring and coverup. It only came to light after the sheriff got shot.

  51. Oh my goodness, he absolutely lost his mind from the get-go. Even when they introduced the two guests he was staring straight ahead and refusing to make eye contact with the host or the senator.

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