Time is your enemy in a self defense situation. You have to have a round in the chamber.
yeah, with no hammer it’s sketchy to keep one chambered in the pump. i trust the safety though.
Only the effeminate use safeties.
Here you are.
tsbhoa, there’s a hammer. It’s inside the receiver. You can see it when it’s at rest against the rear of the bolt. Most safeties only block the trigger. A hard bump will make them go boom.
The only reliable “safety” is an alert and well-rehearsed handler…
Kinda like carryin a knife you have to sharpen before use!
Always!
Striker or hammer…it doesn’t matter.
Noted constitutionalist, firearms expert, and criminal-n-chief sniffer and Kamala boob groper….. 🤣 Joe Biden Says ‘Who In God’s Name Needs A Weapon With 100 Rounds in The Chamber’ At Human Rights Dinner.
Lol that’s a big chamber. Not sure how that would work exactly.
Fyi if this turns into a poll, i do not carry one in the chamber. Just never have been comfortable with it. I’m sure I’ll get flamed but
You don’t carry one in the chamber?! Horrifying! Heretical! Harrumph!
Enough flame?
Seriously though, you do what you are comfortable with. Personally, my shotgun chamber is empty, but my carry piece chamber is not. So I’m both, I guess.
No issues with that practice….. oh right flame and shame and whatnot.
AQ- off hand the only weapon I can think of that ‘might’ qualify as a multi chamber weapon would be the Korean Hwacha (not real sure that is the correct spelling) although technically that was a multi barrel device.
Those 12 gauge flechette rounds. How many flechettes in one of those? (Answer: Seems to be only about 15. How’s Biden going to accomplish his goal?)
^THIS^
All day long.
All six chambers are always loaded.
Ditto except the Uberti. Load one, skip one, load four.
The .45 Colt might be a little easier on the ears than the .357s, so there’s a decent chance if you break in I’ll shoot you with that first.
Well. Luigi should’ve been carrying a good Italian gun ……. like Beretta 92 ……… with one in the pipe.
prosecutor: “loaded and cocked?”
Roster: “it won’t shoot it it’s not loaded and cocked”
If you are not comfortable with one chambered in the gun you carry then your carrying the wrong gun. Carry something else.
I’d make an exception for holsterless pocket carry, but that’s not exactly ideal under any circumstances.
Before following the “leaders” I suggest firearm newbes learn to carry unchambered before venturing into something that may create a trip to an ER, etc…and cause the leaders and their advice to head for the hills.
Seems sensible to me
I agree. A person should be comfortable carrying a firearm in general first.
If you aren’t confident enough to carry with one in the pipe. You’d best not carry at all. Because the time you waste trying to rack the slide will get you killed. Considering most out in the world, self defense shootings happen in under 5 seconds.
I carry chambered, but I tried out racking one in on presentation when I first saw that this was still a thing. I found that with a little practice it only took about a 3rd of a second longer than just a regular draw, about the same difference as appendix versus hip carry.
The greater concerns, in my opinion, are the likelihood of either needing a one handed presentation or the increase in malfunctions. In around 200 live fire presentations I had about 12 failures to go into battery, which is way more than I would ever find acceptable.
12 out of 200 not going into battery. What was going on there? That seems high. I need to rethink my strategy if the cookie crumbles like that
“I carry chambered, but I tried out racking one in on presentation when I first saw that this was still a thing.”
Aside from the “safety” deal, wouldn’t it really suck if you found out during your DGU that you needed one more round to end the threat?!
This👆. Chances are if they’re not comfortable carrying chamber hot, then they don’t have enough time behind the tool to be carrying for defensive use. Competence breeds confidence. Get trained correctly and put the time in. Also, be realistic in your own capabilities including force options and tactical applications. Your hardware regardless of how it’s carried, must be controlled with the proper software internally.
Uh… sorry but that’s just dumb. You think you’d have a better chance of survival if you don’t even have a weapon than if you have to take 1/2 second to rack the slide?!?
If a nutcase is banging on my front door i think I’ll have time to rack my slide. I mean i see your point but not everything is gonna always go down in the blink of an eye. In those cases i guess i wished I’d have had one in the pipe.
If you are not comfy with a loaded chamber, get a 1911 clone, carry it cocked and locked.
That is proven safe since 1914, or thereabouts…
Grip zafety blocks the trigger, thumb switch blocks the sear, and the half cock notch can prevent a drop-fire if the first two are off when the gun is dropped.
Or get a quality DA revolver.
IMO, end of story. Empty chamber is fine, if you are on offense, or part of a unit. Loners in bushwhacker country are already at a severe tactical disadvantage. Why make it worse?
it wouldn’t let me respond to the one where you actually asked the question, so I’ll answer here.
I think the reason I had so many failures to go into battery was that I was pushing speed as much as I could and using a sub compact carry gun, at the time I was carrying a Khar PM9. With the thin, short slide it was hard to get a consistent grip at speed and sometimes my hand would slip off early and jam the round. With a larger gun and a slightly less aggressive presentation you could significantly reduce those malfunctions, but it will still have a much higher failure rate than starting with one in the chamber.
I still think you are better off carrying unchambered than not carrying at all, as long as you practice often and know the drawbacks, but consider a DA/SA or a revolver, the benefits of carrying with one in the chamber demonstrably outway the risks.
I’d hope my opponent was a believer of the empty chamber idiocy.
The issue us the idiocy of striker fired guns with no safety. It like carrying and sp101 with the hammer cocked.
A RSBH is completely safe carrying it cocked. Just as safe as a Glock anyway.
The pic appears to be related to handguns. It depends what the application is. Since we’re probably not talking about SA revolvers, and really about Handguns for defense, always be chambered. Don’t do that “Israeli carry” nonsense, when too many factors can be against you. Proper knowledge, mindset, training and skill maintenance is a life-long discipline. So stay up to date. If it’s drop safe and operating properly, then proper handling should negate any mechanical issues. However, there’s a reason why “cruiser ready” conditions require a cold chamber prior to both ARs and shotguns being deployed into a “primary” ready to engage status. These are not drop safe. Therefore, these longguns should not be standing by chamber hot. Just a reminder, cuz y’all already know this; when extracting a live round from an AR chamber, the Primer will have an indentation already left on it from the firing pin. Not in modern defensive handguns.
Empty chamber isn’t how I carry, but I tend toward letting folks make their own decisions. You know your own skill and comfort level, as well as your own environment.
Damn that made alot of sense.
I always carry cocked & locked but gotta have a manual safety. I wouldn’t mind not having it but my private parts feel better knowing it’s there.
It sure sounds to me like New York wants to make FFL’s rich. No one will be able to do much of anything without going through one and there aren’t many options for competition to we have government creating something of a monopoly. Aren’t there laws forbidding this?
@Prndll “Aren’t there laws forbidding this?”
The dems only care about laws they create and feel no obligation to obey.
Well yes, but actually no.
Safe.
Wonder what they would say about my century old (1920’s Navy shipyard surplus) hand mill. No CNC or other electronics. All adjustments are mechanical/manual/analog.
Probably be horrified you can do most tasks of cnc to similar quality without having potentially traceable internet history. Saw your post below great job getting a hold of that and hope it has served purposes that make my appointed leadership rage.
Breaking! US Supreme Court issued an order in Vanderstok/Blackhawk case involving challenge to Biden/ATF’s “Ghost Gun” regulations.
Islam kills two Swedes in Brussels. Reported as vengeance for the boy.
The entire argument about “safeties”, or carrying with a chambered round, basically boils down to the user keeping their damn trigger finger off of the trigger until ready to send a round down range. I’ve seen no stats, but I have to believe that the vast majority of negligent discharges by persons carrying firearms happens during holstering/re-holstering, when they jam their piece into the holster with their finger on the trigger.
Aside from that, other cases of the “gun going off”, like the Rust incident, or kids playing with a loaded gun, are almost undoubtedly a situation where the “shooter” actually, and unconsciously pulled the trigger.
Quail, Ducks, Dove.
Hunt enough of those and you can rack a slide as fast as you can release a safety.
This is why I oppose the Mushroom Kingdom’s attempt to ban Fire Flowers
Cambered round depends a lot on what firearm and what the possible situation is.
My 1911 is always carried cocked and locked. Any of the revolvers I carry are hammer down on an empty chamber. Long guns get a round chambered when going into action. Back in my Paramedic days I saw several dumbassed accidents with hunters climbing through fences or climbing into tree stands to wander around with a round in the chamber while in transit to or from sites. If there is someone determined enough to hop the fence or bust the gate, get past the loud mouthed dogs, and still try to enter any of the buildings here on the homestead, it’s likely I will have time enough to load in a magazine or rack the slide or lever.
Only the ready weapons have ammo in the magazine on the long guns. Those that may be needed to deal with the usual varmints around a farm. Hogs, coyotes, etc. 12 gauge and AR 15 and the old marlin 22. Anything else is in the rack locked down with ammo stored nearby.
Time is your enemy in a self defense situation. You have to have a round in the chamber.
yeah, with no hammer it’s sketchy to keep one chambered in the pump. i trust the safety though.
Only the effeminate use safeties.
Here you are.
tsbhoa, there’s a hammer. It’s inside the receiver. You can see it when it’s at rest against the rear of the bolt. Most safeties only block the trigger. A hard bump will make them go boom.
The only reliable “safety” is an alert and well-rehearsed handler…
Kinda like carryin a knife you have to sharpen before use!
Always!
Striker or hammer…it doesn’t matter.
Noted constitutionalist, firearms expert, and criminal-n-chief sniffer and Kamala boob groper….. 🤣 Joe Biden Says ‘Who In God’s Name Needs A Weapon With 100 Rounds in The Chamber’ At Human Rights Dinner.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=JpS7TrULtFA
Lol that’s a big chamber. Not sure how that would work exactly.
Fyi if this turns into a poll, i do not carry one in the chamber. Just never have been comfortable with it. I’m sure I’ll get flamed but
You don’t carry one in the chamber?! Horrifying! Heretical! Harrumph!
Enough flame?
Seriously though, you do what you are comfortable with. Personally, my shotgun chamber is empty, but my carry piece chamber is not. So I’m both, I guess.
No issues with that practice….. oh right flame and shame and whatnot.
AQ- off hand the only weapon I can think of that ‘might’ qualify as a multi chamber weapon would be the Korean Hwacha (not real sure that is the correct spelling) although technically that was a multi barrel device.
Those 12 gauge flechette rounds. How many flechettes in one of those? (Answer: Seems to be only about 15. How’s Biden going to accomplish his goal?)
^THIS^
All day long.
All six chambers are always loaded.
Ditto except the Uberti. Load one, skip one, load four.
The .45 Colt might be a little easier on the ears than the .357s, so there’s a decent chance if you break in I’ll shoot you with that first.
Well. Luigi should’ve been carrying a good Italian gun ……. like Beretta 92 ……… with one in the pipe.
prosecutor: “loaded and cocked?”
Roster: “it won’t shoot it it’s not loaded and cocked”
If you are not comfortable with one chambered in the gun you carry then your carrying the wrong gun. Carry something else.
I’d make an exception for holsterless pocket carry, but that’s not exactly ideal under any circumstances.
Before following the “leaders” I suggest firearm newbes learn to carry unchambered before venturing into something that may create a trip to an ER, etc…and cause the leaders and their advice to head for the hills.
Seems sensible to me
I agree. A person should be comfortable carrying a firearm in general first.
If you aren’t confident enough to carry with one in the pipe. You’d best not carry at all. Because the time you waste trying to rack the slide will get you killed. Considering most out in the world, self defense shootings happen in under 5 seconds.
I carry chambered, but I tried out racking one in on presentation when I first saw that this was still a thing. I found that with a little practice it only took about a 3rd of a second longer than just a regular draw, about the same difference as appendix versus hip carry.
The greater concerns, in my opinion, are the likelihood of either needing a one handed presentation or the increase in malfunctions. In around 200 live fire presentations I had about 12 failures to go into battery, which is way more than I would ever find acceptable.
12 out of 200 not going into battery. What was going on there? That seems high. I need to rethink my strategy if the cookie crumbles like that
“I carry chambered, but I tried out racking one in on presentation when I first saw that this was still a thing.”
Aside from the “safety” deal, wouldn’t it really suck if you found out during your DGU that you needed one more round to end the threat?!
This👆. Chances are if they’re not comfortable carrying chamber hot, then they don’t have enough time behind the tool to be carrying for defensive use. Competence breeds confidence. Get trained correctly and put the time in. Also, be realistic in your own capabilities including force options and tactical applications. Your hardware regardless of how it’s carried, must be controlled with the proper software internally.
Uh… sorry but that’s just dumb. You think you’d have a better chance of survival if you don’t even have a weapon than if you have to take 1/2 second to rack the slide?!?
If a nutcase is banging on my front door i think I’ll have time to rack my slide. I mean i see your point but not everything is gonna always go down in the blink of an eye. In those cases i guess i wished I’d have had one in the pipe.
If you are not comfy with a loaded chamber, get a 1911 clone, carry it cocked and locked.
That is proven safe since 1914, or thereabouts…
Grip zafety blocks the trigger, thumb switch blocks the sear, and the half cock notch can prevent a drop-fire if the first two are off when the gun is dropped.
Or get a quality DA revolver.
IMO, end of story. Empty chamber is fine, if you are on offense, or part of a unit. Loners in bushwhacker country are already at a severe tactical disadvantage. Why make it worse?
it wouldn’t let me respond to the one where you actually asked the question, so I’ll answer here.
I think the reason I had so many failures to go into battery was that I was pushing speed as much as I could and using a sub compact carry gun, at the time I was carrying a Khar PM9. With the thin, short slide it was hard to get a consistent grip at speed and sometimes my hand would slip off early and jam the round. With a larger gun and a slightly less aggressive presentation you could significantly reduce those malfunctions, but it will still have a much higher failure rate than starting with one in the chamber.
I still think you are better off carrying unchambered than not carrying at all, as long as you practice often and know the drawbacks, but consider a DA/SA or a revolver, the benefits of carrying with one in the chamber demonstrably outway the risks.
I’d hope my opponent was a believer of the empty chamber idiocy.
The issue us the idiocy of striker fired guns with no safety. It like carrying and sp101 with the hammer cocked.
A RSBH is completely safe carrying it cocked. Just as safe as a Glock anyway.
The pic appears to be related to handguns. It depends what the application is. Since we’re probably not talking about SA revolvers, and really about Handguns for defense, always be chambered. Don’t do that “Israeli carry” nonsense, when too many factors can be against you. Proper knowledge, mindset, training and skill maintenance is a life-long discipline. So stay up to date. If it’s drop safe and operating properly, then proper handling should negate any mechanical issues. However, there’s a reason why “cruiser ready” conditions require a cold chamber prior to both ARs and shotguns being deployed into a “primary” ready to engage status. These are not drop safe. Therefore, these longguns should not be standing by chamber hot. Just a reminder, cuz y’all already know this; when extracting a live round from an AR chamber, the Primer will have an indentation already left on it from the firing pin. Not in modern defensive handguns.
Empty chamber isn’t how I carry, but I tend toward letting folks make their own decisions. You know your own skill and comfort level, as well as your own environment.
Damn that made alot of sense.
I always carry cocked & locked but gotta have a manual safety. I wouldn’t mind not having it but my private parts feel better knowing it’s there.
Always Condition One…
Yup.
NICS Checks For 3D Printers?!
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=o66N68iP16w
Does this mean that anyone in New York that sells computer would be required to be an FFL?
That might be interesting to see how Apple would react.
LOL
No one but gun stores can sell iPhones (and how many gun stores are there in New York?).
Bigger issue is it would also require the check for cnc machinery. Yeah we are going to have another year of stupid in the legislature. https://www.nysenate.gov/legislation/bills/2023/A8132
It sure sounds to me like New York wants to make FFL’s rich. No one will be able to do much of anything without going through one and there aren’t many options for competition to we have government creating something of a monopoly. Aren’t there laws forbidding this?
@Prndll “Aren’t there laws forbidding this?”
The dems only care about laws they create and feel no obligation to obey.
Well yes, but actually no.
Safe.
Wonder what they would say about my century old (1920’s Navy shipyard surplus) hand mill. No CNC or other electronics. All adjustments are mechanical/manual/analog.
Probably be horrified you can do most tasks of cnc to similar quality without having potentially traceable internet history. Saw your post below great job getting a hold of that and hope it has served purposes that make my appointed leadership rage.
Breaking! US Supreme Court issued an order in Vanderstok/Blackhawk case involving challenge to Biden/ATF’s “Ghost Gun” regulations.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=MBjyPfow4zA
Illinois landlord stabs 6 year old boy to death, injures mother, motivated by Israel-hamas conflict > https://apnews.com/article/muslim-boy-killed-chicago-landlord-will-county-5135dea218326d6e639a996564d9369e
Usual suspects – Man arrested at Memphis, Tn, Applebee’s with 162 firearms stolen from gun store, drugs > https://www.actionnews5.com/2023/10/16/man-caught-with-gun-stolen-southaven-store-applebees/
Islam kills two Swedes in Brussels. Reported as vengeance for the boy.
The entire argument about “safeties”, or carrying with a chambered round, basically boils down to the user keeping their damn trigger finger off of the trigger until ready to send a round down range. I’ve seen no stats, but I have to believe that the vast majority of negligent discharges by persons carrying firearms happens during holstering/re-holstering, when they jam their piece into the holster with their finger on the trigger.
Aside from that, other cases of the “gun going off”, like the Rust incident, or kids playing with a loaded gun, are almost undoubtedly a situation where the “shooter” actually, and unconsciously pulled the trigger.
Quail, Ducks, Dove.
Hunt enough of those and you can rack a slide as fast as you can release a safety.
This is why I oppose the Mushroom Kingdom’s attempt to ban Fire Flowers
Cambered round depends a lot on what firearm and what the possible situation is.
My 1911 is always carried cocked and locked. Any of the revolvers I carry are hammer down on an empty chamber. Long guns get a round chambered when going into action. Back in my Paramedic days I saw several dumbassed accidents with hunters climbing through fences or climbing into tree stands to wander around with a round in the chamber while in transit to or from sites. If there is someone determined enough to hop the fence or bust the gate, get past the loud mouthed dogs, and still try to enter any of the buildings here on the homestead, it’s likely I will have time enough to load in a magazine or rack the slide or lever.
Only the ready weapons have ammo in the magazine on the long guns. Those that may be needed to deal with the usual varmints around a farm. Hogs, coyotes, etc. 12 gauge and AR 15 and the old marlin 22. Anything else is in the rack locked down with ammo stored nearby.
Comments are closed.