Chris and Nick have it bad for the SIG P320. Apparently our readers did as well based on the enormous amount of submissions in our P320 contest. And, based on the number of various P320s SIG brought to our recent media day(s), they’re just as excited. For those who don’t know, the SIG P320 is a brand spanking new pistol that deviates from the norm in the same way the P250 does, with the trigger pack being the serialized part. This allows the user to change calibers, grip size (diameter and length), and slide length. And while our boy Chris loved the DAO hammer fired P250, the market demands a striker fired gun and SIG has delivered. There’s been a lot of talk in the comments sections of every P320 article about how that level of modularity isn’t exactly necessary in this modern world, a viewpoint I think is slightlyshort sighted . . .
While at SIG SAUER for two days, I had the opportunity to run the P320 in a variety of shooting scenarios and I came away very pleased with the platform. Since the trigger is the serialized part, it’s the only common feature among all the different configurations of P320 that can be made. I think that’s a wise design consideration as the trigger is one of the most important part of any pistol platform, a point we’ve belabored in the past.
The feel of a trigger is something that can change from model to model. My trigger on buddy’s XD(M) 4.5 feels different than my XD(M) 3.8 Compact. Not necessarily worse or better, just different. So when I practice a ton with my XD(M), then pick up a 4.5, there’s a small learning curve as I adjust to the new trigger. From that perspective, the P320 makes a ton of sense for those who really need two different pistols (full size and carry), but want to keep the feel of the trigger consistent among them.
Before I get into other items of consideration, a little more on that trigger. I tend to be harsh on that subject. I think it’s horrendous that a manufacturer would ship a $1000+ AR 15 with a gritty “mil-spec” trigger. I’ve brutalized the S&W M&P stock trigger, telling prospective buyers that they should factor the cost of an Apex kit in the purchase price of any new M&P. I think the GLOCK trigger is too “snappy” on the reset, and the XD(M) a bit mushy. If that was TL;DR, I’m picky about my triggers.
With that out of the way, I think the P320 has one of the top stock triggers I’ve ever tried. There’s a minimal amount of takeup before you hit a wall. Push through that — and a slight amount of grit — and you’re rewarded with a glassy break with a touch of overtravel. I didn’t bring my trigger test gauge with me, but I’d ballpark it in the 6 pound range.
The reset is definitely not as tight as an Apex, nor as close to the break, but its not too terrible. And unlike a GLOCK which forces your finger forward with a spring-assisted reset, the P320 lets you know the trigger has reset, but doesn’t mess with your mojo in doing so. Overall, a really good package. I’m certain it could get better, but unlike most guns I test, it isn’t the first thing I’d want to change.
Speaking of change, the world’s your oyster when it comes to swapping out components. Fancy a compact? Grab a compact grip. Like a full size? Go big. Small hands, big hands, average sized hands can all have their grip of choice.
“But Tyler, the Gen 4 GLOCK, S&W M&P, FNS, and XD(M) all offer replaceable backstraps”, you say. True, dear reader, they do and and they’re better than nothing. But the 320 grips that were made available to us seem to all have totally different profiles. The “small” stock is truly small all around, and in all the right places, whereas the large grip is universally large instead of just a small profile with some thick bits tacked on. That’s great for large- and small-handed shooters alike as they don’t have to compromise their comfort to get a fairly custom-feeling gun.
The thing I’m most excited about in regards to the P320 is its use for range days with new shooters. An opinion that Nick, Jeff Creamer of SIG, and I all shot the breeze about over dinner. Nick and I try to take new people shooting as often as possible, and as such have started to amass a collection of pistols some in the mainstream media might refer to as an arsenal. All this just to expose a new shooter to as much as possible during a 2 hour outing.
Not that I don’t enjoy owning a large variety of pistols, but sometimes I just need to show people the difference between 9mm and .45, compact and full size. So the ability to take a large case to the range with everything I’d need to accommodate a gorilla-handed linebacker who fancies a full-sized .45 or a small-handed lady who wants to try a compact 9mm is huge.
As a standalone pistol, I think the 320 does an admirable job of being a polymer framed striker fired pistol. I agree with Nick’s assessment that the bore axis is too high, but it isn’t obtrusively so. It’s “higher than I’d like” not “too high to function.” As a full-sized 9mm with the small grip, I was accurately and quickly shooting steel plates within a hundred rounds or so, a fact Leghorn can attest to as I beat him in several steel challenges while we waited around for the other writers to finish up class.
Viewed through the lens of its modularity, I think SIG has a true winner on their hands. The 320 can be whatever you need it to be with the quick swap of a few components. That’s a huge benefit for an owner who conceals a compact 9 during the summer, but wants to move to a full-sized version of the same gun for the winter. Or an owner who initially wanted a .45, but finds that 9mm ammo is cheaper, more plentiful, and easier to shoot. Or for the owner who tries to take new shooters to the range a few times a quarter and wants to be able to maximize a new shooter’s exposure to as many types of pistols in a short window of time. The P320 can do all that in a tidy little package.
I have yet to handle one of these, but at one time I was considering a Sig 2022….until I picked one up. It felt like a tall, heavy slide slapped on a very light weight frame…giving it an odd, “nose heavy” feeling that I don’t get from a GLOCK, XD, or M&P. Is that not the case with the 320?
Have you ever had a chance to hold a 250? The 320 is the same gun with a different trigger.
I wish they would come out with a single stack version, but that would break all the compatibility that they have now.
Also has anyone compared the trigger on this verses the Steyr L9-A1? I felt a Steyr in store and it was the best out of the box striker trigger I’ve ever tried.
Yes. The SIG trigger is decent but nothing to rave about IMO, the Steyrs have better triggers. It does come down to personal preference a bit too though. For instance, I’m a big fan of the Walther PPQ trigger which has a light, clean break, barely any overtravel and a super short reset, but to get to the break you have to pull through a lot of take-up, which some people don’t like.
Though I’d still say both the Sig and Steyrs have better out of the box triggers than the Glock, M&P, XD/XDm, or FNS.
Can you switch it to 22lr? And yeah, I’ve got the ammo to feed it…
No, 9mm, .40S&W and .357SIG, with .45ACP coming later in 2014.
Damn… Would be cool, but I don’t really have a need for it now.
Asdf, please try a ppq and a vp9. Both have great triggers
Oh, yes–please try the Walther PPQ trigger. The press and reset are just amazing. Leaving aside the ergonomics of the grip, which are highly personal, the trigger makes a compelling case for this pistol.
It bears repeating, the modularity is not necessarily for US shooters.
Apparently some European countries, not sure which, have a limit on how many handguns you own. If the trigger pack is the serialized part, then no matter how many grips or barrels you own the P320 is still “ONE” handgun. Thus it allows owners to switch between calibers and size as needed.
Sometimes we tend to be a little US centric in our thinking, but the P320 design solves a huge issue for some Euro-shooters.
True that, then again most pistols are pretty modular from before (just change the slide assembly and magazine). That is also the reason why “system guns” are so popular. Not only because it eases registration but also because you can have one good stock + trigger (and in some cases scope) to go with different calibers. Check out the Blaser guns (wish they would make something that takes g3 mags).
3 countries I know off the top of my head. Germany, Italy & France.
The modular serial number piece is a stroke of smart forward thinking by Sig. Sure, right now it’s a gimmick, but just wait until Hillary and her cronies get into the White House and let some future scumbag shoot up another school.
Yeah, this idea is born in europe where licensing/ownership is so restrictive, it allows them to own “multiple” handguns under only one registration. This makes tons of sense given out current political climate. There is a general industry push to modularity. As the saying goes, “in the land of the blind, the one eyed man is king”. Historically receivers etc are grandfathered in, so this is a perfect logical end point for the future of firearms in whatever legal climate we may find ourselves in the future, short of outright banning and confiscation of all projectile weapons.
What’s sad is the fact that this problem has already been solved before they’ve even thought of putting up the legislation, but they will try. Again. Still.
People take it for granted but if other brands had their own modular systems like SIG just think, us here in Komiefornia could use that 1 serial number subframe and plop it into any of the same brand’s frames/slides/sizes/calibers/ etc…
Our “Safe handgun list” is a JOKE and we only have access to a fraction of whats out there. If this was designed and adopted earlier we could have the USA frame glock or a OD Green XD instead of only black etc. This could of been a game changer making the stupid “Safe handgun list” pointless.
A BIG advantage with the 320 for us here in the backward-land of NJ is that with one Permit to Purchase (required for every pistol purchased and which takes anywhere from 30 to 365+ days to get) is it’s modularity. One permit and we have multiple configurations to shoot.
Yeah, the NJ restrictions have got to be among the worst. The permit to purchase, once granted, is just that – meaning if you buy a 45 ACP and later decide you’d rather go with a 9mm, even if you trade in your 45 you need another yet another permit to purchase for the 45. Over the years, I needed five permits to settle on just two guns. Sig is on to something here, but I expect the legislators will react eventually to anything that makes life easier for law-abiding gun owners.
Tyler…. as a trigger snob myself, I am curious as to your opinion on this vs a Walther PPQ.
I am in the market for a polymer 9, and this is at the top of my list along with the PPQ (M1 mag release) and XDM3.8 compact (the one with two different grip/magazine sizes).
Never put my finger on one sadly. Can’t say. I EDC that XD(m) 3.8 and I really like the trigger a lot. It was the primary reason I purchased such a heavy “compact” gun.
So in your mind does the optional smaller size of the XDM3.8 (with flush mag) outweigh the mushiness of its trigger compared to something like the Sig P320 (the compact version looks about Glock19 sized)?
Yeah. I actually like it a lot. Its kind of like a lighter DAO trigger in that you just pull and pull and pull and then it breaks. But its light enough that it works.
Have you read my full review?
http://www.thetruthaboutguns.com/2013/07/tyler-kee/gun-review-springfield-armory-xdm-9mm-3-8-compact/
The thing that always bugged me about the 250
was the size/caliber exchange cost just $35 less than a new pistol. So changing from .45 to 9 cost more than the new entire pistol by the time I bought mags in the new caliber.
Well, economically speaking it’s not really fair to calculate the cost of magazines in with the gun. If you do that then every gun ends up costing an unbelievable amount AND that cost changes based on the place and the time you buy the mags. Mags are really more an accessory cost not a gun cost. But I guess thats my opinion and how I justify my bills at the end of the day.
I think the real question here is does the 250 (or 320) plus the cost of a conversion cost more or less then buying 2 comparable pistols. I am saying, does a 320 full size 9mm and a compact .45 conversion cost more then buying a Glock 17 and 30? Or some similar combination.
When I went to order the caliber change it did not include any mags with it so to be of use you have to figure in mag $$ unless
they changed & include mags. A 17 & 30 base price about $1000 normal retail. The 250 buying 2 mags about $1150, roughly $1000 for whole guns 2 full units. When I priced them in May.
I would be interested in knowing where you get the high prices. I purchased my P250, February of 2012. The 2Sum kit. Full size and sub compact, with night sights for $424. I purchased a 40 cal exchange kit for $185. This week, I saw an exchange kit for $160 online.Grip frames are $35. Magazines are $40, sometimes on sale for $30.
All my magazines and grip frames will work on the P320 platform.
Currently the P250 compact is on sale for $339.
Through August, Sig has a promotion on 2 free mags and gun bag with purchase of pistol.
Locally twosum is $750
The basic 250 is $459
Swap kit is $399. Most ffl’s charge $50 & up for transfer. Every dime of MSRP is charged plus. Tax in the county is 11% store in city 12.5%. One ffl charges $25.00 for transfer. Glock 21 is $649 for a gen 3 $689 gen4. A used 2022 9mm 1mag is $450. Used .40cal 250 $475. In this area it’s actually cheaper @ gun shows. I have a 2022 .40 backordered right now. Used 229 or 226 north of $700 all no night sights. LEO & Dept price is not much less only 1 distributor services the small guys the big box stores are the best price. None of the FFL’s will even talk to you if you mention the net.
I am sorry that you have to deal with such high prices at or LGS. But, it looks like their prices are insane on all their guns, not just the SIG. A Glock for $689? You can get Gen4 Glocks for $539, no LEO Discount, around here.
You’re talking about cost avoidance. 35% less for another caliber and if a spring breaks, you’re down two handguns. I’d rather spend the extra 35% for separate equipment.
MidwayUSA has P250 Caliber Exchanges is multiple different sizes and calibers, comes with a magazine IIRC for around 250-275… where were you getting a whole pistol for less than $400? (you said $35 dollars less, did you mean to put %?)
That being said, because I can, I would probably get two of these, a compact and a fullsize just because it would be nice to be able to chose which one I want and grab it out of the safe and go, or at most slap a slide and barrel in my caliber of choice on the frame size I am wanting, grab the appropriate magazines and go without having to pop the trigger out of the frame.
Again, that’s because today I still can go to the store and buy 2 or more pistols (in one sitting if that’s how I’m feeling). As has been stated 100 times over in this thread, currently in US this is nothing more than a cool gimmick. Where this pistol was born, another pistol is either not an option or prohibitively difficult to obtain. So it doesnt matter the cost of the caliber exchange kits over there, they are the only option in some cases, if you want multiple handgun size/caliber options. It will become more (or less) relevant depending on how our political climate goes heading in to the future.
I think the Sig 320 is a great idea, in fact, I think it IS the modular gun I THOUGHT the XD was. My only question is this: Why? Considering that it has all the same modularity and the same bore hight as the Sig P250, why would you choose to buy the striker fired version over the hammer fired version? After all as long as I can remember, I have been told that the main advantage of the striker fired pistols is the ability to lower the bore axis because there no longer needs to be space for a fulcrum to allow the hammer to rotate. So…. why bother? The 250 has the same streamlined external safety free design. I just feel like I’m missing something here.
The draw to striker-fired handguns is usually that each trigger press is identical.
The P250 is DAO. I have handled one in a LGS. The trigger pull is consistent and surprisingly light for a DAO. Also, I am not clear on the 320 striker system but, in the 250 you get the famed “second strike capability”. Of course, as opposed to a Glock where once the striker falls the slide has to cycle to charge the striker again. With the 250 you can just keep pulling the trigger and the hammer will rise and fall again and again. Is the 320’s striker system DAO like the 250?
The 250’s trigger is ver consistant and nice so once again that is not a gain in the 320.
No have to dump the round. The p99 has restrike I really like it in both 9 & 40 if it did not have that paddle mag release. One of the pd’s carried SW99 until glock gave away .45gaps. Sold them off for $175 to the officers that were issued then to a dealer. Friend traded me his for a .380 back-up. Bought the other from dealer $350. Local pawn shop has the SW for$850 well used & abused.
The 250 has a really good trigger but people don’t like it because they don’t know how to shoot double action.
My 250 one of the first 1,000 has a DAO trigger pull that measures 10.13 pounds on my pull scale since it’s a double only finger gets tired. Mine also has a very gritty feel after
100 rounds. It is a safe queen that was a b’day present from my late Aunt, otherwise I would have traded it.
You’re not exposing new shooters to different guns if all you do is introduce them to different parts of the same gun…
The Glock triggers are too snappy, really? I guess someone forgot to let me know that fact. I have been shooting Glock pistols since 1992. I have never short stroked the trigger on one. I cannot say the same for M&P pistols, with their vague triggers. No pistol is perfect, but my Glocks have never failed me and I am well armed with them.
Holy high bore-axis Batman!
There is nothing like a high end manufacturer 1911 trigger :). And the design is over 100 years old….
OK, I’ll take that back. A well gunsmithed S&W high end revolver is a joy to shoot as well, but only in single action mode.
sig p320, their entry to the MHS. no more and no less.
So if I pony up the scratch for one gun with two frames/ calibers, how will I John Woo through windows/doorways with pistols akimbo? Clearly the only option is to buy two guns.
All this talk about high bore axis is silly. The P320 is a tack driver and is very controllable.It has one of the best triggers of any poly/striker gun, standard night sights, and the ultra reliability Sig is known for. I have a P320 and love it. I took a friend of mine who just got a PPQ to the range to compare how well we shoot with each others guns. After an hour of shooting my Sig, he sold his PPQ and got a P320 for himself. I think this gun is a game changer.
See, now that’s something. If this gun’s shootability is superior to other offerings and the price is so competitive that it out Glocks GLOCKs, I may be interested, especially if it holds it’s own against he PPQ. I’ve not handled a 320, but routinely consider migrating to the PPQ platform.
I absolutely do not care the gun is modular. In a contrived future, the modular nature of the thing may be desirable. Reality being what it is, I honestly couldn’t care. That may be whistling past the grave yard, but in reality if they clamped down the laws preventing the acquisition of new my finances would likely improve and I’d spend more time shooting what I have. Every feature I read on this pistol spends more time trying to convince me the modularity I don’t care about is something I should care about and should be reason for me to elevate it over other semi autos when I’m more interested in “does this out shoot the competition, heads up?”
I thought that having a hybrid holster I could change out kydex bodies on was a real selling feature, but the truth is that in the morning, it’s not worth the effort.
I too love my 320, but it pinched my trigger finger to the point of forming a blister. After having my gun smith work on the shape , no joy. I just installed the apex trigger, wide and flat. What turned out to be my most accurate gun is now even better, my finger likes the new trigger too. For $48 it was a real bargain, it took me 10 min to install. Phil
One thing you don’t mention and that is going to be a problem is the availability of the components. The P250 has been around for years now but you can’t find the grips. Only the full size and compact 9mm versions have shipped from Sig and they are hard to find.
Sig needs to get the caliber exchange kits and grips out into the market so people can take advantage of the modular design. Nothing is worse than adopting a platform and then not being able to get the components. That platform will then be abandoned for a product that can actually be acquired.
EAA witness is also modular just change tops. 9, 40, 45. Decent trigger.
The one thing I am doing is going to one brand & model, purchasing spare parts i.e. springs, extractors, firing pins anything liable to break since if the hitlerites get in office or even supposed conservatives that switch sides (L. Graham) forget new manufacture you’ll see parts becoming few & far between. Have a S&W used magazines are now $80.00 up from $30 last year new.
Any reason yesterday’s article about layoffs at SIG got deep-sixed? Heard the scuttlebutt was about bad machining on the new X series, a missed deadline and an order returned from a foreign customer.
There were some inaccuracies that are being better researched, and we’re waiting for a response from SIG. We didn’t kill it, we just delayed it pending more info. Stay tuned.
Thanks. I was hoping that wasn’t the case but wondered. I’m a P250 owner and want to get a P320 soon…and I hate polymer guns. SIG is on to a good thing here and is driving innovation, which is nice to see out of one of the industry heavies.
Now, if they’d just make some of the PM400’s in 300BLK that they have listed on their website, I could add another SIG long gun to the collection.
The MP5 copy in semi is not the greatest work I have seen but it was sales reps sample. Don’t see it as a co. saver. Same w/320 too little too late for the LE market, they have pushed hard for the 250 in LE market last 2 years still the sig departments I know of still use the 229, 226 or 220 in order of preference.
I wonder how this trigger and ability to swap grips stack up against the new H&K striker fired pistol?
Oh man, here come the Glock cultists ripping a new polymer striker fired pistol (especially a Sig), they sound like fan boys quoting ‘Highlander’ or something…’There can be only one! Waaaah! Waaaaahh!” Oh, and that ‘high bore axis’ crap? That is the SINGLE most irrelevant characteristic of a handgun, anywhere, anytime. It’s about a relevant as whether the grip screws are hex or slotted. A stupid point to make. Anyone who is very well trained in pistol shooting can fire a Sig, Glock, Beretta, Colt, whatever, quickly and accurately. If a “shooter” tells you a Sig’s bore axis is too high, he’s a closet Glockophile. Having a barrel less than 1/2″ higher on pistol than another is NOT a failure of design or inhibitor of functionality or accuracy. It’s a whine by a Austrian pistol worshipper who’s trying to sell you on his plastic, striker fired religion….
I think you’re right. I shot the USP 40 and the Beretta 96, both high bore axis and the Beretta kicked like a mule. I don’t think bore axis has anything to do with it.
I owned a P250 2-Sum for about 18 months. I tried to get used to the trigger on the 250, but just couldn’t adjust to the long – and I mean long, but smooth trigger pull. If I shot my Glocks and CZ’s and then picked up the P250, my accuracy was horrible. It just felt like everything was out of time. (I don’t blame SIG Sauer for my lack of marksmanship; obviously it’s an individual training deficiency and trigger pull preference on my part.)
I was very sorry to trade the 2-Sum because I’ve always believed that the modular concept had merit and marketability, and the gun itself was very comfortable and attractive for a polymer pistol. The deal breaker was the P250 trigger. I’d like to try a P320 in the near future, and I hope this project is successful for SIG Sauer.
I’m not happy with my new Sig 320C 9mm. After a few hundred rounds, the spring guide rod starts protruding past the barrel tip, and when I switch in the threaded barrel from my Sig 250C-TB, the gun shoots okay, but when I add on my Gemtech Tundra SV suppressor, nearly every round stovepipes. The spring tension is off. Sig says both these things are “normal”, and they have not yet developed a Sig 320C-TB model, as if Glock 19 has a separate model just for suppressed fire. Ridiculous! Sig should fix them both under warranty but won’t do so unless pressured by Sig 320C owners.
I am irate at Sig for not having a threaded barrel available for the compact. It clearly shows it on their website and while I know suppressors aren’t everyone’s cup of tea, I use one often so that I don’t have to wear ear plugs AND I don’t annoy my neighbors. A threaded barrel is clearly shown as an option on Sig’s website for each size of the 320. But again…Sig just gives the runaround that none are available at this time. If that’s the case, they should take it off their website. I would not have bought the 320 if I thought I would not be able to shoot it suppressed.
Has this situation been resolved? I am looking at the P320 carry specifically for a suppressed pistol (with Osprey 9). If there is still an issue getting the barrels or with the spring tension I would love to know ahead of time! Thanks!
TONYVIDAL: Suppressors are finicky and sometimes need to be worked in for each firearm they are used on. Even LaRue, one of the most highly sought makers of AR-15’s only guarantees that their rifles will work with Surefire suppressors because of the variances in suppressor design.
Change out the recoil spring with something lighter and it might work more reliably. As you play more and more with suppressors you will see a lot of these kinds of malfunctions and this kind of trial and error resolution will become second nature.
TEXASRAIDER is right on. People who complain about high bore axis are parrots and don’t spend enough time at the range actually shooting. If you practice enough to get good with pistols, you can shoot any well made pistol accurately.
RETIRED LEO is a troll.
***END***
I love the P320, what I hate is with the full size you lose 4 rounds if you get it in a 40 cal instead of the 9 mm. The 9 mm holds 18 rounds and the 40 cal holds 14. I know 14 rounds is still a lot but 18 rounds is sweet. With most guns you only lose 2-3 rounds when going to the 40 from the 9, but with this one you lose 4, seems like a lot.
I’m not sure there’s any real advantage with the 40 over the 9. I think it just boils down to personal preference. Great gun! I wonder if the 40 shoots as accurately as the 9?
Just have to say that I’ve shot Glocks have a S&W Shield 9mm. Read reviews and videos and held first hand many of all the manufacturers pistols. Seems awfully funny that almost every video that you see with a Glock comparison to another pistol the Glock is always modified. The Sig feels the best in my hand and has the best trigger feel just my opinion and we all know what that means.
Comments are closed.