H&K HK243 / 293, c German Government

It’s been said that H&K isn’t the most customer friendly company when it comes to the civilian market, but a recent filing with the German government reveals that the (nearly) bankrupt H&K has received approval to export a new rifle based on the G36 design for the U.S. market. Designated the HK293, the rifle will come in a variety of configurations… as soon as Uncle Sam gives it their stamp of approval. Needless to say we’ll be watching for this at the SHOT Show in a few weeks. Make the jump for the proposed specs . . .

Short rigid shaft Long, rigid shaft
Model Run length
without fire dampers		 Total length
short rigid buttstock
folded		 Total length
short rigid shoulder rest
be folded		 Total length
with long rigid shoulder stock
unfolded		 Total length
with long, rigid shoulder rest
be folded
C HK243
HK293 C
(Compact)		 228 722 502 746 502
K HK243
HK293 K
(short)		 330 811 604 837 604
S HK243
HK293 S
(Sporter)		 420 912 694 938 694
L HK243
HK293 L
(Long)		 480 972 754 998 754
Adjustable shank – Type I Adjustable shank – Type II
Model Total length
with length-
adjustable buttstock folded and fully
extended
(convex /
concave
shoulder contact)		 Total length
with length-
adjustable buttstock folded and fully
inserted (convex /
concave
shoulder contact)		 Total length
with length-
adjustable buttstock
be folded		 Total length
with length-
adjustable buttstock folded and fully
extended		 Total length
with length-
adjustable buttstock folded and fully
inserted		 Total length
with length-
adjustable
buttstock
be folded
C HK243
HK293 C
(Compact)		 646/632 606/592 502 772 700 502
K HK243
HK293 K
(short)		 818/804 778/764 604 862 790 604
S HK243
HK293 S
(Sporter)		 920/906 880/866 694 964 892 694
L HK243
HK293 L
(Long)		 980/966 940/926 754 1024 952 754

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117 COMMENTS

    • Because it’s an HK. For some people that’s all the justification they need.

      And a lot of the younger new shooters that play video games see the G36 as an upgrade over an AR because of their games. And perhaps some people just want variety.

      • I gotta agree with the video game perspective. I think that’s the main reason I’m interested. If its junk or over $1300 I’ll just keep saving for a AR. I’m betting it will be $2k plus min you I havent read anything other than the ttag post yet.

        • @ropingdown And that’s exactly why I won’t be getting one. I can’t justify spending that much on a rifle with so many other expenses. That and if the woman found I spent thay much on a gun lets just say it wouldn’t be a good thing.

    • Exactly my thoughts, a novelty more than anything…if people have money to burn, then by all means go for it.

    • Why would you buy a gun or barrel from a company that uses 1 in 7 barrels? Seriously, its stupid. Shilen only does 1 in 8 and DD thinks they’re so smart by doing 1 in 7, its so premium!

        • I’m not sure if it’s because this site draws from a population of novice and uneducated gun owners, but I have noticed an increasing number of commenters (and unfortunately, writers) who lack even a basic understanding. Some of the content here makes the general discussion section on Arf.com look positively brilliant.

      • And what exactly is wrong with 1:7? It is military spec, because it can stabilize the heavier stuff. If you want to spend your days plowing through cheap 55gr ammo, then go ahead with a 1:9 or 1:8. But if you want longer range accuracy, or to shoot premium ammunition, or to retain accuracy in wind, then a 1:7 gun is just the ticket.

        Not to say that 1:7 is the best, or any other twist rate is the best, but different twist rates are all necessary, depending on how you plan on using your gun.

        • CA,
          The 1:7 twist was needed to stablize the slightly longer and heavier SS109 bullet. Unfortunately it overstablizes that flying icepick and takes away any hope of getting any yaw. No yaw = reduced lethality when using these tiny bullets.

      • Chase,

        Please develop more experience prior to providing us with your “expert” opinion. The 1:9, 1:8, 1:7, 1:7.7 etc. twist rates all have their legitimate uses depending upon a number of factors which primarily include barrel length and bullet weight.

    • Because rich snobs need a HK brand to make there noses BIGGER. ID take a A2 rifle or a M-4 carbine any day over this piece of junk. Remember HKs motto: Were HK and you American gun owners SUCK!!!

        • Yeah, because someone who’s screen name is hkfan definitely doesn’t have any bias when it comes to this topic. Maybe instead of just calling everybody stupid, you can support your opinion with logic or facts.

        • Did you not even read the post I was replying to? That person should be called out as stupid. Let’s keep the bar high.

      • It was used as almost the exclusive weapon on Stargate Universe, which is also the reason I’d be interested in having one, but not at the price HK wants for it. I think I’ll stick with my AR-15s and call it a day.

  4. ‘Nearly Bankrupt’ is a stunning fate for a company that charges such outrageous prices for their guns, magazines and spare parts. Their previous civilian G36 was a ridiculously expensive range toy, permanently crippled to limit it to obscenely overpriced single-stack magazines.

    We’ve been hearing for a couple of years (from HK) that customer service is going to be a priority, but I’ve yet to see it. This could be a step in the right direction, but only if it’s seriously competitive in price. If it can’t undercut the Tavor, they might as well not bother selling it at all.

  5. Sure, it looks cool, but will it blend?

    Seriously, does it do anything my AR doesn’t that will justify that HK price? Each to his own, though, and I wouldn’t kick it out of bed.

    • I think that’s the better point. Not everyone is in love with the AR, and there aren’t a whole lot of 5.56 options out there right now. I have an AR, and I like it, but I wish there were more options out there(many more in the past few years) Sure the AR is a great choice, but it is not the end all be all that some people claim it is. I really like the G36 conceptually, but price will be a major factor. If they think too highly of their weapon pricewise as they have done in the past, then they are absolutely going bankrupt.

      • If you don’t like the American AR-15 but still a 5.56mm rifle there still alternative which are not over PRICED X10000000000000000000 like any HK weapon is. Id say Mini-14, AUG, Tavor, XCR, AR-70, ARX-160, and AK-101.They would be ALOT cheaper and better alternatives.

        • Not to mention the SCAR, Galil and Saiga 223. There are SO MANY 5.56 choices out there that aren’t ARs. You just have to look.

  8. Unless it’s built in the USA, it’s going to have to abide by the same import restrictions everyone else has.

    SL-8 2.0

    Also

    $3k+

  10. I have not owned any HK rifles, but their handguns are fantastic. There is no other handgun I would trust to go to war with than the HK45 or P30 (the sig P226 a close second). In my experience much of the hate comes from anger and frustration that the high cost makes it prohibitive to purchase for most people. Unfortunately, extensive R&D and quality control/testing isn’t cheap.

    • i don’t have an issue with the pistol cost i understand that quality costs money. but the Mr556 was way over the top it is a nice piece but everyone really wanted a HK416. HK is still my go to piece in the LGS

  11. HK handguns are one thing, some of their older models are works of art. That abortion of a rifle on the other hand…

    • This six year old blog post wasn’t accurate then and it isn’t accurate now. It’s a lol inducing article that consists of bitching about not being able to afford to purchase HK products.

      Seek guidance elsewhere.

      • HKfan: I used to want a USP so bad. I *knew* that anything HK was going to be cool. I’ve seen and handled HKs. I *would* take one – if I could afford it or one of them was given to me. Sticker shock! HK is not blue-collar friendly for prices – I got family, car payments, and the mortgage thing (unlike the gov’t, I have to live within my means!). Their availability is too low, the cost is too high. How common is a NIB HK magazine at a retail store – they *could* be lost in all those reasonably priced 1911, GLOCK, Beretta, SIG, Ruger, CZ, and hell, even Taurus magazines; but I don’t see any HK mags. That said, I can’t justify the cost when compared to other products.

        You were calling out that the article was written 6 or so years ago. HK designed the G36 in the early 1990’s. Looks like they had 20 years to go: oh hey, let’s try that civilian segment. And that was after the AWB expired, the 2008 frenzy, and the 2012 re-election/newtown frenzy…and *now* they are going to toss that puppy on the market?

        If they put out a reasonably priced weapon at a competitive price point with great customer/warranty service, good selection of accessories, and a cool looking tshirt, I’d give them a shot.

    • Wow, how clever and original. I’ve never heard that before. (except in every post that has ever mentioned HK)

      • Sir, do you own any HK products? If so, please specify the issues you are experiencing and I can see if I can help you or get you an appropriate contact to resolve the issue.

        Thank you.

  16. HK needs to make semi auto MP5 clones in the USA for big $$$$

    Price them at $1000 and they will sell truckloads of them. Seriously they should create a factory here in the states that does the final assembly needed and just crank the suckers out.

    Easy way to dig out of bankruptcy. So it will never happen.

    • All the roller guns, really. And if it gave them more competitive pricing, the handguns as well. Pretty ridiculous to intentionally leave the world’s biggest civilian market on the table.

    • If I can buy at a relatively decent price a Sig, an AK, and a Tavor, then it tells me HK sucks in at the very least, understanding how to do business. The laws may be stupid and overly complicated, but other companies manage to work around them and get their products to market at competitive prices, and people buy them.

  18. looks like H&K might actually be forced to arms to civilians due its shitty financial situation that was probably brouhgt on by not taking full advantage of the HUGE civilian market. kinda funny.

    I still think HK doesnt like the 2nd amendment , so i refuse to buy any of their overpriced products from them out of spite and patriotism.

  19. Well, this is good news for those of us everywhere who have been looking for that perfect prop to go with our Starship Troopers halloween costume.

  20. I own a bunch of HK stuff . I wanted a Mr556 but the price was crazy I ended up getting a custom wilson instead, it was a little more but i felt i got my moneys worth. As far as HK goes the main issues i have are Prices are too high Sig Sauer is just as nice . They take forever to get stuff to market When they do it is never in stock and is over priced and this is coming from an HK fanboy.
    How much with this be ? 5k I think i would rather have a Christen Arms carbon fiber reaper . How long ? i waited for the mr556 for 3 years before i said screw it and got the acr instead . Maybe if HK realized how big the civilian market is that they seem to hate, they wouldn’t be in this predicment How in the hell can a top flight gun company in 2013 go bankrupt. HK get some stuff out the door, price it right, treat the civilian great and your money issues are done. if you can’t do that so long been nice knowing you and this is coming from someone who loved you now i just tolerate you because i have too.

    • Why do you have to tolerate them? Are you experiencing hardware issues that you can’t get resolved? If so, I may be able to help you.

      • Thanks for the offer Never had an issue they just make it so hard to get what i want they make you hate them . i really think they do everything they can to make sure i can’t buy their product . They are dead reliable i wouldn’t pay the price if they weren’t. Now if HK is not in stock i don’t lose any sleep i just get Sig Sauer and i have been very pleased with their pieces. Everything i have would be HK, but in their price range their are a lot of good choices and if your stuff is never in the gun store how am i supposed to buy it. That being said i still wish i could have a HK416 but that will never happen thanks HK

  21. I’m honestly interested if it is priced competitively.. I have great reservations on that front though. The 416/MR556/M27 are exceptionally clean cut ARs with a price to match. My ARs are lego sets so the 416/MR556 doesn’t fit in. This would be a buy just to have a G36, nothing more, it doesn’t out perform competitors.

  23. Don’t like their stuff. It’s well made but not that comfortable to shoot. Also, their pistol mags are low capacity and a horrible ripoff.

    • You are right about the mags hard to get and too expensive with long wait times you would think they were smart enough to realize how much they could make off of magazines if they would just make them available

    • I find HK handguns to be the most comfortable, least felt recoil of any handgun. The mags cost what they do because they are bulletproof (!!) and built to last. R&D and testing costs money.

      • “I find HK handguns to be the most comfortable, least felt recoil of any handgun. The mags cost what they do because they are bulletproof (!!) and built to last. R&D and testing costs money.”

        You might want to add boy to the end of your name. I am a big fan of many HK products but get a grip. I have a lot of experience with handguns and HK’s in particular. Even first gen Glock 21s had less perceived recoil for me and a lot of people I shoot with, the consensus is they were nicer to shoot. It got zero votes for being a softer shooter. The HK’s in .40 are just ridiculously bad in this regard. The current gen 4 Glocks in .40 recoil like a 9mm. Then the Gen 4 G21 is a cream puff for rapid fire training unlike a similar HK, it is not even close. I have extensive use with both and I just kill the HK times consistently with the Glock.

        The first uncomfortable HK’s to shoot in .40? Forget about it they sucked. The HK mags are no more bulletproof than many other high quality let less expensive brands that don’t charge more to just label it with HK. I Love and have owned or had extensive access to a lot of the firearms HK makes and I do like some of them overall but there are so many better choices for handguns for myself and many others. See what I did there, some people can pick something besides your beloved HK and it will work for them better. Just because it works for you doesn’t make everyone else wrong for choosing something else that works better for them, likely a lot better.

        It is fine that you think HK handguns are the end all handgun for you, but for me and many others they are not comfortable to shoot and I can run any kind of course much faster with 3 other brands of pistols just off the top of my head. Fanboyism is such a terrible thing, filled with ignorance.

        • I guess you missed when I said “I” find the HK to be the softest shooter. You are of course entitled to your own opinion. On my end, the agents I shoot with find the hk45 and p30 to shoot far nicer and more accurately than the G21 and G19. In terms of ergonomics, we find HKs to fit the diversity of hand sizes better than any other make.

          The Glocks are certainly not bad handguns, we just prefer HKs.

        • I didn’t miss the “I” part at all and didn’t contradict myself. I have associates with varied ranges of experience that say No thank you to the HK pistols. I am glad you and other like your HK handguns but the fanboyism for them throughout this comment section is silly and a bit over the top for what it is worth. I mentioned Glock but it isn’t even the handgun I am most proficient with or own the most of. Just an example of one that is just as legit of an option as an HK as are other quite a few other handguns.

      • Go shoot a (German made) Walther PPQ, then come back and tell me why I need to pay twice as much for a pistol (P30) with a worse trigger, that is harder to maintain, but has better marketing.

  25. I have ARs and I have TB SL8/g36 conversion. I will say this. The are about equal in recoil and accuracy, the G36 runs MUCH cleaner and is very balanced (assuming you have a G36 profile bbl). It compares in blance to a Colt SP1. They are both easy to take down. The AR is light years ahead in after market parts

  26. I am far from an HK fanboy and am not all that enamored with black rifles in general, but the photo of that rascal gives me a significant tingle. Easy to imagine picking it up at the range and working through several scenes from Aliens… and I’m just not normally that kind of a guy.

  27. Wow,the HK fans really came out swinging on this. Personally, I’ll continue to limp along with my Franken-AR and my Walther. Whether I suck and HK hates me or not, none of what I can (or want to) afford to own from them feels good in my hand. That said, the first sub gun I ever fired was an MP-5, which felt excellent.

  28. You know, people keep whining about “HK horrible customer service this…” and “HK too expensive that…” but who here hasn’t made a frivolous gun buy before just because it was fun?

    Personally, after shooting a G36 at the Scottsdale Gun Club, I know that regardless of price I’ll be picking one of these up. I’m not an HK fanboy, but it was without a doubt a fun rifle to shoot.

    My “go-to” will still be my AR, but this would be really fun to add to the collection.

    • Darren M: “but who here hasn’t made a frivolous gun buy before just because it was fun?”

      For the price HK’s go for, you could make SEVERAL frivolous gun buys…and still be able to get a couple boxes of ammo!

  29. 30 years ago HK offered me a job at the san fran SHOT Show, they were a viable Design and Mfg Co. back then but when I was told that once hired I could Never expect horizontal transfers with-in the Co. I passed.
    This looks like a poorly designed AG implement

  31. Take a G36, make it semi and keep the price reasonable and I am in. If it is imported with a bunch of hokey crap then no way. The great thing about an AR is I can make it look and feel exactly like an M4. It is what I want as that is a weapon I might go to war with.

    We really need to start fighting the sporting purpose idiocy. With the rise of 3 gun and service rifle competitions the test needs to go away. While I don’t think there should be any sporting purpose test whatsoever, we need to start somewhere. That could be the initial wedge.

  32. This looks like a decent enough attempt to gain an edge in the US market (pic rails-a-go-go, AR-style magwell and release, AR mags, etc), but I have yet to see the price point. That said, their civvie-legal 416 upper alone runs over $2K, no way is this thing going to come in under $3K.

    On top of that . . . I kinda liked the smoother, classic look a little better. But that’s just personal taste.

    Although it looks to me that someone in Oberndorf is tired of TommyBuilt Tactical cutting into “what should be HK’s profits.”

  33. HK is ten years too late to the party, nobody cares about the G36 platform any longer except for maybe some latin American armies. German soldiers are even clamoring to move to the 416.

  34. I’ve owned H&K products for about 20 years. I can’t speak to the quality of their customer service because I’ve never needed to use it. I’ve also never had a malfunction of any sort with any of their weapons. Their new rifle isn’t exactly my cup of tea in re its appearance, but it will probably appeal to the youth market – at least that section of it that has $3,000+ to spend. I fully agree with a previous post that says H&K should produce a semi-auto 9 mm MP5 for the U.S. market. The .22LR clone of the MP5 is selling like hotcakes, so it shouldn’t take a master’s degree in marketing to figure out that the 9 mm version would sell just as well, if not better.

    • “I’ve owned H&K products for about 20 years. I can’t speak to the quality of their customer service because I’ve never needed to use it. I’ve also never had a malfunction of any sort with any of their weapons.”

      And this is why HK products cost what they do.

      • Agreed. Few, if any, other firearms manufacturers spend as much time and money on engineering and testing as H&K does. My EDC is a P7 PSP and it worked flawlessly right out of the box (and the box was almost 30 years old when I bought the pistol). I have nothing against any of the other brands mentioned in this string and I own several of them too.

    • I personally would snap up an actual civilian legal H&K mp5 (even with a 16inch barrel) faster than hkfan snapped on pretty much everyone in this comments section. Assuming of course it didn’t cost an arm and a leg, which it probably would.

  35. Isn’t this the G36, that (according to some reports from german military) “loses” it’s POI when heated? One number I’ve seing is POI shift of up to 2 ft at 100yards….

    Wasn’t this the base for XM8 that did not pass the triels over here?

      • I hear the barrel is mounted in the composite, instead of steel. Heat makes the composite malleable, hence the wild POI vs POA shifts. Wouldn’t expect a POS rifle from HK but here we are :).

  36. i really doubt 1st time semiauto buyers are the target audience in mind for this rifle, but people of the gun seeking alternative options, or to simply add to one’s collection. (this would look great in the safe next to my hk93 and my ptr 91).

    this is a cool new design that will get alot of attention considering that there are SO many ar’s out there.

  37. I have agree with all other people if HK price point to high on rifle not gone sell well. If can only use over price Hk parts accessories that can only get from them not make people want buy it. With older HK guns you get parts accessories for with out going HK. I real do not think bring rifle in USA gone save HK becuase simple fact to bring in counrty they brought version flop on market frist did send thrill up any body leg. Compare competition out there gone hard press find any one gone find rifle more unique than what out there. Same company sell 416 rifle what new rifle gone compete againt.

  38. “I want a super accurate, super reliable, hell and back twice gun, but Im going to complain about the price”- pretty much everybody on this website.

    • LOL. This pretty much sum up this and every blog/thread on this site. I can’t wait to read reviews of high end optics on here 🙂 “why does this S&B cost so darn much. my weaver does it all at a tenth of the price!”

  39. Id like a real semi auto G-36 be fun to collect a full collection of German military rifles of the 20th and early 21st Century. But $3000 for this crap??? come on no rifle really cost this much your paying 2500 dollars for HK crap name. I hate the rails real German Budenwher rifle DO NOT have this quad rail crap on there weapons, nor do they have a Magpul copy stock on them. They have a vortex style flash hider not a A2 style flash hider. SO this is still off spec like the SL-8 was. SO buy another G-3 or three for three grand this is still a waste of time.

    Remember: Were H&K and you American gun owners suck.

  40. You can’t really compare it to the AR, you have to remember their are a lot of gun owners out their with lots of firearms, AR’s included, that want some variety.

    HK bashing aside I never understood why that company didn’t cash in on all their fan boys. If they made all their video game porn guns available at reasonable prices, and cranked them out in mass they would sell a ton of them. The prices they ask are nuts when you consider that most HK models are built to be cheap, like the G3 and MP5. I would never pay good money for a cheap stamped gun, even with the happy switch.

    Imagine how many semi auto MP5’s they would sell at $1k each, or how many G3’s at $800 or PSG1’s at $2k, etc. They would be the richest gun company in the world.

    This is a perfect business example of a company that advertised and had brand cachet to really pull profits from a market; than pretty much gave it the middle finger.

    FN is pretty much doing what HK should have done, but they don’t have 20+ years of video game and Tom Clancy brand recognition yet.

    • Last time I got Sturmwaffles they didn’t come with any syrup. They were also really damn crunchy, which the syrup definitely could have been helping with.

      Someone please take this abomination of a post and turn it into something actually good.

  43. I have no desire to own this rifle. That being said I own an HK USP Tactical and it is my favorite polymer pistol compared to my Glock and my Springfield XD. I have also met the HK guys at the 2013 SHOT show and they were nice. They even let me fondle an MP7 and took pics of me holding it. Now what I really want to see is a new civilian legal MP5 clone. Maybe something like the SP89. That I would buy for around 1k, and then SBR to make into a semi MP5K. Having shot an MP5k full auto I have a irrational desire to own one.

    I also harbor no hate towards HK. On the other hand I do not worship with blind devotion like some firearms version of a BMW fan boy. I do remember that they did import rifles and MP5 clones before the original assault weapons ban. I was too young, now they cost too much.

  44. I’ve really liked the design of the G36, not to mention MR556 when released, but have steered FAR CLEAR of H&K due to their outrageous prices. If this one is priced well, I might as well jump on but it seems like a waste of money since I can just pimp out my MK118 even more. 🙂

  45. How I hear people complain, Lets put it this way, Depending on what country you are in may determine what you can and cannot have. Like me for instance, I am in Canada, as much as i would like an AR, it is arbitrary for me to own one when i can only take it to the local range and back because it is a restricted firearm. Where as from the looks and stats i suspect this to be a Non-Restricted firearm there for i can take it out side of the city and use it. That noted I only have a PT Job with fairly low income so affording something that’s $2k is a little difficult. On that note. Pretty well any MSR in Canada(west) is pritt near 2K+ As one brought up is ascetics, I will buy a firearm for what it can do, However I do want it to look nice and to me I find this HK appealing. All comes down to preference. how about every one stops bitchin about it until they get one in their hands.

  46. This weapons platform is a hundred years ahead of the m-4 in every respect, from its engineering, to its material, from its design, research and development. This company has been producing top of the line firearms for decades, for combat, not internet fantasy trips in your mothers basement. Everything about this rifle is what men in war time environments crave, its light weight, piston operated, unique with its disassembly, it actually works in the sand, snow, rain, the ergonomics, charging ambidextrous, the trigger, barrel, the stock can fold, extend, and lift for proper cheek weld, the rails are plentiful, the magazine is stellar, just like the sig 550….:}+)…I will buy one in black…

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