Zephen Xaver via Highland County Sherriff's Office

Yesterday at 12:30 p.m., officers responded to a 9-1-1 call from inside a SunTrust bank location in Sebring, Florida, about 80 miles south of Orlando.

“I have shot five people,” the caller stated. According to reports, there were only five people in the bank at the time, and 21-year-old Zephen Xaver forced them to lie on the ground before killing them. In response to his call, a SWAT team arrived to find that Xaver had barricaded himself inside the bank, refusing to come out. The SWAT team stormed the building, after which Xaver did surrender and is now in custody.

“I’m heartbroken for my son,” said Josh Xaver, Zephen Xaver’s father, who lives in Indiana. “I’m heartbroken for the victims.”

“He wasn’t raised to be like this. He’s always been a good kid. He’s had his troubles,” he said without giving details, “but he has never hurt anyone ever before.”

He said Xaver moved to Florida about a year ago. Neighbors as well as public records report the same, saying Xaver arrived in Sebring last fall with his mother and moved into a pre-fabricated home four miles from the bank. No one answered the door yesterday night, and police searched the home.

Next-door neighbor John Larose said Xaver kept to himself, but he could sometimes hear him yelling late at night while playing video games.

According to ABC, Xaver was briefly employed as a trainee prison guard at Avon Park Correctional Institution and resigned on January 9 with no reported disciplinary issues.

A press conference is scheduled for 11:00 a.m. EST today, after which we should have some more updates.

Here is a video of Xaver’s court appearance today, in which it is announced that he is being held without bond on five counts of felony capital murder:

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121 COMMENTS

  1. “He’s had his troubles,” and the video game yelling. Repressed anger issues? Did the people he shot die or do we know yet?

  2. Two pearls of wisdom when you are out-and-about:
    (1) Be armed.
    (2) Be alert.

    Those pearls of wisdom just might save your life.

      • I find it hard to believe that of five random people in Florida, none we’re armed. Fake news apparently.

        • There were only 5 people in the bank. They may well have been all staff and for them it was a gun free zone. I’ve walked into my local bank during the day and been the only customer there at the time.

        • I don’t think making some customers uncomfortable was the issue. I think it was a rationalization.

          Bank robberies – following the Jessie James days – and before this one were peaceable affairs. The robber’s motivation was to get money. He had no animosity toward the bank’s employees or customers. If the teller did just as the note says: “Put money in the bag and nobody gets hurt” then there would be a small insurance claim and no dead bodies.

          If there were an armed bank guard then there was considerable risk of a teller or customer getting shot. Big insurance claim.

          Banks and their insurers had to think about the odds and the relative consequences. The bank had no legal duty to maintain armed guards to protect customers. There is no OTHER prudent decision aside from foregoing armed guards in a bank lobby.

          Today, the situation might have changed. The news media wants to promote gun violence in the news to promote gun-control laws. To create a Utopia, you have to break some eggs. If some of those eggs are bank customers, so be it. These customers are no different than the school kids shot-up by crazy people.

          The foregoing creates a bees-to-honey situation where crazy people will find any populated venue to shoot-up and get rewarded by 15 minutes of fame.

          If the foregoing reasoning is valid, then the relevant question is: How is a bank different from any other retail business? Any other “public square” venue where there are lots of unarmed victims who could be shot in rapid succession?

          If we cannot distinguish banks (or schools, or country & western concerts) from other retail/public venues then there is a new game afoot. The media fostered it, and will be committed to sustaining it. Once the genie is out of the bottle, . . .

        • Most of the banks here in central Texas have armed off duty police on site. At least the ones I frequent.

    • You forgot skill. Have the skill to use your tools. Having a gun with no skill to use it effectively means nothing.

      • Bullshit. Mind set beats ‘skills’. We’ve seen countless stories right here on TTAG of folks past 70 with little or no ‘skills’, at least one had never fired a gun til his moment of truth, winning their fights.

        • @jwm Annnnnd another chair borne ranger who knows nothing about winning gunfights. I’m sure your post count will save your ass right? Yawn….

      • All the skill in the world won’t save you from the golden BB.

        It may come as a lucky round when all the cards are in your favor, or it might just be the day when an armed incel with hurt feefees or fiending methmonster randomly ruins your day, your sidearm is secured elsewhere, or you’re plain caught unawares.

        Bad luck and fear can be somewhat ameliorated by training; but training does not equate to skill, and bad habits can make it all moot.

        • That’s true, and would be a concern if you are facing a shootout several times a week, sooner or later the buffalo’s gonna eat you. But for most of us non-operators, we may face the situation once in a lifetime, maybe not. If you are skilled enough to win 90% of the time, you are pretty safe.

  3. Another mysterious ” Lee Harvey Oswald type” …A disenfranchised Democrat? Another Patsy from the Deep State? Post TRUMP-matic Derangement Syndrome? Schizophrenia, bipolar disorder, etc…Is this a case for Big Government to abolish ALL Constitutional Rights in America in the name of public safety….? Absolutely NOT !

    • If he isn’t an ardent Trump supporter it’ll take a long timefor the MSM to give it one line on P 37. On the other hand…

      • ….if he used one of those uber-deadly ‘assault rifles’,
        it’ll be all over the news for weeks!

  4. With colder temperatures come heavier coats. And those heavier coats mean it could be a LOT harder and take a couple seconds longer to quickly draw a handgun for self-defense.

    For that reason, I recently started testing a shoulder holster. My idea is that my coat can be somewhat unzipped and I could draw quickly without having to wrestle a heavy coat out of the way. That could be the difference between life and death in a situation such as occurred at the bank where this scumbag murdered five people.

    • This is Florida, even inland it was at the most cool. True we tend to wear coats while northerners walk around in shorts but yesterday was in the low 70’s there. I was at Highland Hammocks park which is very close to Sebring when this happened. No hint there was anything happening, we heard it on the radio on the way back home.
      Now we will get to hear day after day this murderers name and all about him.

      • I miss the edit button, talking to the wife as I typed and did not read before send. It’s Highlands Hammock state park. Lots of trails and not many mosquitoes there this time of year.

        • My mother was from Avon Park and we visited a number of times when I was a kid. Highlands Hammock is a great state park.

      • KenW,

        Cold spells where morning temperatures are in the upper 30s or low 40s with windchills in the 20s occasionally hit even the Deep South. Don’t people where heavy clothing/coats in those conditions?

        • If. Its under 70 degrees here. Only super seniors wear a coat. Heck if it’s 85 here they wear coats. Me. I’m still in a t-shirt when it’s 40 degrees. I personally look forward to mid Jan. Every year. It’s the only time I actually like being here.

        • You pretty much only need a jacket about 4-6 weeks a year in Florida, max. And that’s broken up over about 3-4 months. It’s honestly not enough time to bother changing up your carry routine, or what northerners call “winter carry”. There is no winter here. There’s spring, summer, fall, then spring again. Having lived in multiple different climates I can tell you a day in January here can be as warm as the middle of summer in a place like Montana.

    • I’d not be overly concerned with the clothing if you’ve done some “rehearsing” at all. My first reaction (I hope) would be to seek close cover to unholster and use to my advantage as a tactical position. I’d hope anyone who had time to move would do so if only to gain a second or two, which can be a lifetime.

      • Craig in IA,

        I agree if we are talking about a typical bank robbery.

        Sadly, in this case, I think we are talking about a spree killer whose sole intention is to murder as many people as quickly as possible. I believe we need the ability to draw and deliver hits to the attacker as quickly as possible in such a scenario.

        Remember, if the attacker has any skill at all and is at contact distance, he/she could easily deliver a fatal wound to two people every second. Thus, being able to draw one second faster could quite literally save two lives.

        • He told the five to lie on the floor, they probably thought it was a bank robbery and complied.
          Typically the bank would be robbed and the victims left alive. A bank robber would not want murder charges added when caught.
          This guy is a dangerous nut intent on killing. Difficult to defend against.
          They also said that only five people where in the bank which makes me think they were all or mostly all employees probably not allowed to carry.

        • KBonLI,

          Yeah, sometimes you are pretty much screwed no matter what you do.

          The only consolation that I can see in such a scenario is this:
          (1) If you are moving while drawing, there is a fair chance that the spree-killer misses or imparts non-fatal wounds which would enable you to (hopefully) incapacitate the spree-killer even though you did NOT have any advantage of surprise, cover, or distraction.
          (2) Even if the spree killer manages to impart fatal wounds to you, there is still a good chance that you will be able to impart incapacitating wounds on the attacker before going unconscious and dying. In other words, even though you may not be able to save yourself, at least you may be able to save other lives before you die — which would have happened (in this case) even if you did nothing and complied with your attacker.

          As we have stated on this forum many times, a self-defense handgun is NOT a magic talisman that guarantees you will prevail over every attack. Rather, a self-defense handgun is an excellent tool that gives you many more options and a much greater probability of surviving an attack.

    • When drawing from a shoulder holster, people typically point the gun at the people behind them, the people beside them and at their arm. “Never let the muzzle cover anything you are not willing to destroy.”

      If you wear your coat with a half open zipper to be able to draw from a shoulder holster then you can do the same to draw from a IWB or OWB holster, or just open the zipper completely.

      Instead of coming up with yet another carry method for which you need training and lots of practice with, how about doing the carry method you already do right? The amount of cover garments plays no role in how to clear it with both hands, when carrying IWB or OWB. Just don’t use clothing that is too tight. Train and practice that draw with the clothing you usually wear. That’s it.

      Lastly, watch the Active Self Protection YouTube channel to learn how to behave in such situations. You never draw on a gun that is already pointed at you! Seek cover or concealment or use a moment of distraction to draw!

      • Charlie Foxtrot,

        All good points.

        I was thinking of the shoulder-holster solution for times that I want to wear snow-pants or a snowmobile suit which utterly eliminates the option of carrying a handgun in my every-day holster on my belt — or in any holster on any belt around my waist for that matter. And, after thinking about, I was thinking of how that could be useful even without snow pants when wearing heavy coats, especially if working outside where having your coat totally unzipped is NOT an option due to cold/snow.

        Let’s be honest, there is no option when wearing heavy winter clothing that is as good, easy, and fast as when we are wearing light clothing. Every “solution” for heavy winter clothing will have drawbacks.

        • FYI: I am a skier and pocket carry a Glock 26 in my ski pants in a DeSantis Nemesis holster.

        • Charlie Foxtrot,

          A Glock 26 in your ski-pants pocket is a decent solution for two-bit thugs or a coyote who decides to cause you trouble on the slopes.

          In my particular case I have to deal with three large German shepherd dogs across the street that keep getting lose and going after people. Ideally, I want to have my large caliber semi-auto handgun (with 15-round double-stack magazine) available if those dogs decide that “today is my lucky day”. My other options are along the lines of a sub-compact (single-stack magazine) semi-auto in .380 ACP or 9mm — which I am concerned might not be enough gun for multiple BIG German shepherds.

          • Glock 26 9mm with 12-round magazine and one in the pipe has 13 rounds. That should be enough for three large German shepherds. One can always carry a 15-round or 17-round backup magazine. Alternatively, Glock 29 10mm with 10-round magazine and one in the pipe, and a 15-round backup magazine. Going single stack or .380 makes no sense given your arguments. What are you carrying in that shoulder holster anyway?

        • YGBSM! Snowmobile? The Duke showed you decades back! Winchester model 1892, .357 Magnum. Scabbard across the tank.

        • Charlie Foxtrot,

          I normally carry a Smith and Wesson M&P40 full-size semi-auto pistol (with 15 round magazine) on my hip. I ordered a shoulder holster for it but the holster itself is too small for the pistol. So, for now I am carrying a .357 Magnum revolver (which has a 7-round cylinder) in a properly fitting shoulder holster because that is all that I have on hand.

          Obviously, I should have more than seven rounds to fend off two or three large German shepherds in a full-on attack. Equally obvious, seven rounds of .357 Magnum sure beats a single-stack sub-compact .380 ACP or 9mm pistol.

    • I’ve found that I can’t comfortably belt-carry anything larger than a Mexican Tokarev, and my hips/waist makes anything riding there sticks out like a hockey stick, or dig into my ribs like Kobayashi with tapeworms. This is compounded by winter layers, and presents the accessibility problem.

      Out of desperation I rigged up a soft nylon full-flap shoulder rig for my Makarov; with a small semi-rigid tool pouch, pelican-foam inserts, scavenged straps & D-rings, and based it on the USGI M9 system, sans magazine carrier. It’s adjustable enough to be worn over a light jacket or hooded sweater, or cinched down to ride tight under arm / against the chest.

      When I get into a vehicle or confined space, I found it naturally will swing to the front, a quick tug tightens it higher, easily accessible, and also allows me to carry things trapped under my left arm without touching the holster.

      Aside from it costing nearly nothing, and distributing the weight of a Makarov & extra magazine (or multitool) well, it’s out of sight even under an unbuttoned summer shirt. But my winter gear consistents of my old DCU field jacket and issue quilted liner. Because the liner has big armpit steam vents, I can keep the straps under the wooby, but the pistol rides between the buttoned liner and jacket. I’ve been practicing the draw with this configuration, it works well enough to not need swiping or rummaging for a pistol, and I almost forget it’s there usually.

      There’s a lot going for shoulder holsters, especially when they’re leather and worn under a classy vest or vintage Acapulco shirt.

  6. I wonder whether SunTrust policy is GFZ. This sounds like a situation where maybe the outcome may have been different, if only someone else had been armed.

    My condolences to the families.

    • GFZ specifically ban beretta 92s, all others seem to be ok.

      But in all seriousness, would anyone really point the finger at you for violating a sign for shooting a gunman who just shot 2 people and is taking aim at a 3rd?

      Unenforced GFZ just means make sure no on sees it until it’s go-time.

      • No, but they’ll point the finger at you every other time. What happens if you suffer a medical emergency (about as likely as this happening) and the responding paramedics find a gun on you?

        • @ Hannibal:
          Well, assuming both events have equal odds of occuring, I’d much rather have paramedics find a gun on me than be left defenseless in a place that advertises itself to criminals as being undefended. Wouldn’t you?

    • This bank couldn’t have been a gun free zone because he had a gun. Unless, you’re saying that criminals don’t respect rules?

    • Media has them all stirred up and ready to tear out each others throats at the drop of a hat. Look at Covington, kids were pretty much minding their own business, media changes the narrative and now they have people who don’t know the kids or care, wanting to rape and kill them (woodchipper). Media keeps this crap up much longer and people are going to start to DEMAND the end of the FIRST AMENDMENT RIGHT of the media to print or even say what they want without extensive licensing by the government. And when that happens the media is going to deserve all the blame for it going this far, not that they’re going to ever admit it.

      • RT still gets paid for hosting advertisements, right?
        If so (and since journalistic integrity is no longer a thing), then I dont think the media wont give a hoot whether the government tells them what to say or if it comes straight from their asses, so as long as they get paid. They’re whores, you see.

        • Edit: I dont think the media will* give a hoot.

          (Where. The hell. Is the Edit feature? C’mon TTAG).

      • I stand by what I wrote earlier. The natural inclination of modern people when trouble hits is to call on the government to “do something”. Doesn’t matter if it makes the situation worse in the long run. Right now the media is setting themselves up to be controlled by the government because largely of their increasing bias of anything not left wing. Sooner or later some politician is going to propose issuing licenses to networks based on their speech content meaning more government control over the first amendment. And what politician doesn’t want more control of something?

    • This kinda shit happened in the 90s too. And the 70s. And the 20s. The thing is, you just hear about it more now. Even in the 90s, you didn’t hear about news from around the nation unless it was major news. Now you read and hear about almost every single crime that occurs. The biggest misconception these days is that “things are so crazy now” or “the kids are all fucked up now” or “the worlds going to hell.” It’s actually always been this way. And, it will always be this way. Even in 10,000 years when we’re an intergalactic empire and have technology beyond our wildest dreams, we will also have murderous space pirates.

  8. I am sorry for all involved and their familes. I do believe that the evil video games and movies have alot to do with vulnerable, impressional minds. The Lord warns us about the dangers of immersing one’s self in certain situations and keeping undesirable company. I have no doubt he is a victim of this illness through the enemies desire to do acts against God. With that being said, no amount of gun laws, conviscations or ammunition rationing would prevent an evil act from accuring. Any individual can use a pipe a knife or even a comb as a weapon if used properly. Gun Free Zones are always easy targets.

    I believe educating young minds more about personal consequences for ones actions is extremely nessasary in schools. I also truly believe OPEN carry is the greatest deturant to defusing a potential hanus act. I am armed with the Holy Spirit, conscience and my Sigsaur. I support our President and the NRA.

    • You’re joking right? Let’s ignore every study that proves otherwise some of which show that video games are actually helpful.

      Too many gun owners are stupid

      Don’t blame the gun, it’s an inanimate object! It only does what the person holding it commands it to do.

      Blame the Video Game instead!

      Wait hold on…. I have a phone call… … …. … sorry about that. It was Tipper Gore she was wondering if we could also blame rock and hip hop music, especially metal music, especially twisted sister.

      Can I jus go ahead and assume your a boomer?

      • Your mistaken, I’m a professional musician. I am a metal lead guitar player and a vocalist. I am a iron horse riding, God bless the USA proud Christian. I know right from wrong because I was taught it from my parents and through my education. You and only you can control yourself. I am careful with what I watch, listen to and the people I choose to befrend. It’s never too late to try to prevent the next tragedy.
        Oh I used to play Nintendo back in my youth.

        • lol ah, and grandpa said the same thing about your music. And comic books. And the “think of the children!” scares continue back forever.

      • Actually, there is evidence that violent video games and media can desensitize and influence behavior. Especially in those already at risk. Read Assassination Generation by Dave Grossman.

        • Yea and there’s even more evidence that they don’t, and evidence that they lower violent tendencies by giving them a safe outlet.

          Why believe some and not others?

        • Agreed. Dave Grossman’s life-work presents a dilemma for us. Consider the following propositions:
          1. The Army wasted millions of dollars paying Grossman for his training of soldiers to shoot enemies; or,
          2. Grossman has a point about training young men with video games.
          Pick one.
          I find it hard to pick #1.

          We PotG should give some careful thought to the violent video game issue. There APPEARS to be a 1A issue – created by SCOTUS – that bars legislation restricting the sale of violent videos to minors. Does that mean that the 1A is sacrosanct?

          What an idea! That a right in the BoR can’t be encroached upon at all, no matter what. Does that apply to the 2’nd . . . 10’th? Or, does it apply to the 3’rd . . 10’th?

          Alternatively, is it Constitutional for states to legislate about videos and guns sold to minors?

          Should progressive states such as California be allowed to limit sales of violent video games to children? Should they be allowed to limit sales of guns to children? Can we have a common-sense discussion about these questions? Or, is one of the questions off-the-table?

      • JMR,

        Here are some facts:
        (a) A violent video game all by itself will not send a well-balanced person out to harm others.
        (b) External conditions do influence and inspire us.
        (c) Pile on enough negative influences long enough and and a person will go out to harm others.

        So, it is factual to say that a violent video game in conjunction with several other negative influences will drive a person to harm others. That does not rise to the level that we should ban violent video games. What it does mean is that responsible people should discourage friends/family members from playing violent video games if they are in a dark place. (And those same responsible friends/family members should also do their best to help him/her out of that dark place.)

        Even then, we will often have no idea that a person is in a “dark place”. I had a close friend when I was about 19 years-old who gave ZERO indication of any thoughts of harming anyone. And yet one day he snapped: he overpowered a young girl, tied her up, molested her, kidnapped her, contemplated killing her, and eventually decided to drop her off (without further harm) on the side of a rural road. It was only later that I learned how his case was typical: several negative influences piled up in a short enough time and he cracked.

        That is why I stated in a previous comment that it is wise to be armed and alert when you are out-and-about: you never know when someone (or even some animal) is going to try and harm you.

        • You’re not telling me anything I don’t know. And you’re not disagree with me, you’re saying pretty much the same thing.

        • Someday we may be able to interdict killers before they kill by scientific means, until then I will remain constantly armed. If someone comes through my door with murder on his mind, my gun will be in my hand before he reaches the top of the stairs. The ONLY prevention which complies with the requirement for due process is the armed individual. The Sheriff is not legally able to save you, but *you* are.

    • “I do believe that the evil video games and movies…”
      At first, I thought you were being sarcastic. Do you realize how many young boys and men play those “evil” video games? If the games were the cause, we would have millions of these situations every year. Like do you even math bro?

      • Clearly, heavy metal rock and roll with the rhythmic satanic beat is the root of our violent culture. Screaming guitar solos from Les Paul and Stratocaster guitars causes boys to become angry killers and girls to become promiscuous prostitutes. Electric guitars and basses should be banned, and everyone should play Banjos fiddles and mandolins just like God intended.

        Even rock ‘n’ roll artists themselves are often criminals and pedophiles, look at Jerry Lee Lewis or Gary glitter.

        Blame it all on Chuck Berry and sister Rosetta Tharpe.

    • Just with regards to the open carry, if a deranged person with full intent to kill others (and later perhaps himself) walks into that bank, sees 4 seemingly unarmed victims and you with your open carry piece, is he going to think “ah, maybe ill go crazy another time” or “hmm, ok you get to die first”.

      From what I surmise, the only time open carry deters a crime is if the criminal is unarmed, has weak resolve and fears for his life. Perhaps that was the case in the past, but not so today.

      You do what you want to do, it’s your right. But if you hid that Sig, you have the element of surprise as an advantage, and in that situation you could use all the advantages you can get.

      Just something to consider. Stay safe and God Bless 🙂

      • That sinario comes up in our gun safety course all the time. However if several people open carry that’s a huge deturant. If the individual wants to die through suicide by others there’s not much you can do. I would rather take a bullet while protecting a young baby and it’s mother or other innocent individual that cannot defend themselves.
        It’s a thin line but I do believe God is in control and his reasons are his reasons for why things happen as they do. Bless you and your family.

        • Steve S.,

          While I agree that Mr. Spree Killer might have decided not to embark on his killing spree in that bank if he had seen that everyone was visibly armed, that scenario will never come to pass.

          At best we might get to a point some day where one out of every eight adults in public are armed. Some of those adults will NOT be willing to carry openly visible handguns.
          That being the case, I encourage you to work on solutions that are actually achievable in the real world.

          If you want to carry openly, by all means do so. If you want to encourage others to carry openly, by all means do so. Just realize that open carry will never be widespread enough to significantly deter/stop spree killers.

        • @ Steve S:
          After some consideration of what you said, i think it boils down to how many others open carry, conceal carry or neither.

          Assuming the vast majority of people open-carry because they are willing and able to do so and are extremely unlikely to experience an event that would make it easy for one to steal their obviously-displayed weapon, then ok i see your point and agree to an extent (an issue i see is that if everyone open carries, then a killer might forgo the obvious “shoot everyone” plan and adopt an alternative, like plant a bomb without anyone realizing and watch it detonate it at a safe distance or use a long-range rifle in an open-air environment. Allowing a killer to pick the obvious route of using a gun within pistol range at least affords you some time to respond. Not much you can do if a bomb goes off or a sniper sets up post).

          If you live in a place where many carry concealed or do not carry at all, you risk standing out and being targeted first. Just as how a cop is more likely to notice and pull you over for speeding if you are the only one doing so, but if every driver is doing so as well, then there’s saftey in numbers.

          And if you get singled out and targeted first, theres little you can do to protect others. You getting shot isn’t going to satisfy a deranged killers bloodlust, he’ll continue to shoot that mother and her child. It’s sort of like that airline safety “put your oxygen mask on first before helping others” rule.

          You do you, it’s all a calculated risk afterall, so as long as you are aware of the risks.

      • Did someone mention open carry? We apparently did not have anybody carrying at all, a prerequisite to open carry/CC considerations.

      • On the OC/CC debate, here is what I think.

        Under the most optimal of circumstances I don’t expect more than 40% of American adults to carry, whether openly or concealed. At that point, the deterrent effect will be pretty nearly maximized (e.g., maybe 95% of what it would be if every adult carried.) People who just aren’t interested in carrying an extra 1.5 lbs of weight around will free-ride on those who are willing.

        If 4 out of 10 are carrying, then 2 out of the 5 in that bank would be carrying. And, in this neighborhood, 40 out of 100 would be carrying; in this city, 400 out of 1000 would be carrying.

        Now, suppose 1 out of 4 carry openly while 3 out of 4 carry concealed. The criminal/crazy/jihadist will take note of how many people in this city/neighborhood are openly carrying. If no one carries openly he will surmise that only a few carry concealed. But, if a few carry openly then likely more are carrying concealed.

        Let’s suppose that none of the 5 in the bank carried openly. The crazy would nevertheless surmise that there is some likelihood that one of them was carrying concealed. He’d draw this inference from seeing that a few people in the neighborhood/city carry openly. That inference MIGHT have deterred him.

        I think there is a rationale for some open carry and more concealed carry. It’s not a mutually-exclusive proposition. We ought to STOP talking about the OC/CC debate as though there is a total advantage to one over the other; or a net advantage to one over the other. Rather, there is some advantage to EACH and it is this mix that is desirable.

    • Oh my! I guess I am bound to turn into a massive killer based on your rules. Why just this morning I smashed, shot, and blew up over a hundred zombies (not the Democrat kind), as well as a dozen or more mole miners, a half dozen death claws, and a couple of savage bears.Somehow, despite my bloodthirsty career of killing, I have never had any desire to take a gun, or a bomb, or a truck, or a jug of gasoline, and use it to cause death and suffering.

      Please stop blaming anyone or anything but the evil killer for this sort of mayhem!

  9. Sounds like another psycho whose family hid from the truth, now it’s too late to do anything about it.

  10. Noticed that the parents aren’t together, and we have no idea how long that has been the case. Yes he’s an adult now and most people do get through a broken home situation without becoming murderers. But this does seem to be common thread with this type.

    • That does not give even a hint about which came first, the chicken or the egg. If a couple has a child with serious defects, they do not get to take it back for a refund. The existence of such a child could nuke a good relationship, with not a damn thing either parent could do about it.

      • “Yes Timmy, it ‘is’ your fault that your mother and I are getting a divorce, you little shit.”

  11. Why do you, TTAG continue to show the faces and names of these people? Like the rest of the media you also know that the studies show this increases the likelihood of copycats.

  13. Looked up story on SunCoast news and he has a history of a mass murder threat and his ex-girlfriend reported him to the authorities as being dangerous and hating people. The shirt he is wearing above has the Four Horsemen of the Apocalypse on it in a larger photo. Probably should have been lobotomized a decade ago.

  14. questions:

    .medicated?
    .momma’s soy-boy, no dad
    .met requirements for purchasing?
    .GFZ?
    .authorities knew of “actionable” events, did nothing?

    • “authorities knew of “actionable” events, did nothing?”
      Serious question. What should they have done, taken his guns? I thought about all commenters here were firmly against that?

      • no confinement, confiscation, or anything else without due process – FU & your red flag/commie fag law

        • You completely missed his point: WHAT do you suggest? It sure is easy to say “they should have done something!” and then declared “they shouldn’t have done that!”

          What concrete thing do you think they should have done, assuming that they thought he was potentially dangerous but had no specific crime yet committed?

        • Well, I’m not certain who “they” are, but I think it would be completely constitutional for authorities to publicize that this could happen anywhere, at any time, and that serious people should be armed and ready to stop it. How about DAT?

        • m,
          Are you saying that he should have been arrested and tried? On what grounds? You never answered the original question. You just cussed me out for no reason like a brainless fool.

  15. If this feminized, dying society of ours wants this shit to stop, march this freak out to the gallows on the town square next Friday and hang him by the neck until dead. Leave his body to rot.

    But we won’t. It’s “not who we are” or some other Liberal horseshit.

    • I hear you. It certainly is who *I* am. When I was a kid, somebody did this and he was executed within a month. Today we deliberately delay for an additional 20+ years, so that we can argue that there is no disincentive in the death penalty, because everybody has forgotten the event. This is deliberate, my ideology trumps your security.

  16. Living with momma,quit his job,yell’s at video games and likely has a history of psycho drugs. And a loser white boy. Yep…BREAKING:ILLinois bill to ban guns holding over 10rounds,ASSault rifles and semiautomatic shotties introduced! And whatever else the demoncrat scum think of…😡

  17. I don’t go in the bank, or in a stop and rob without my gun on my hip. When the bad guy tells you to lie on the floor, attack with whatever you have, because he is going to kill you.

    • Precisely. Also when he wants to tie you up, search you, on and on. Do your business and leave, start fucking with anybody and it’s on. And if I go down, I want the guy beside me to be able to pick up my gun and keep trying, the idea of a gun which cannot be fired by anybody but me is STUPID!!!

  19. After conviction he should have a week to try an appeal and then be shot in the back of the neck, soviet style, cremated, and forgotten.

    • No, his ashes should be placed in a urinal trough at the Super Bowl so everyone can piss on his ashes.

      But I agree that killing him publicly would be an incentive. We have gotten too weak. This man neither fears God nor death, because he knows the government is gutless.

  26. Please tell me we’re not wasting tax $ to keep this guy around for the rest of his life, does Florida have the death penalty? Put him down and save a few bucks.

  27. I told a bank teller I am familiar with, “I can’t believe I can carry a gun into this bank,” her reply was “,If we didn’t , and someone couldn’t defend themselves the bank could be sued.”

  30. Loooooong response time from cops who assumed they were dealing with a robbery and decided to play negotiator games. The entire “mass shooting” sounds like it was accomplished with five bullets into the heads of five compliant and helpless victims. Who needs high capacity clipazines when the unarmed victims will literally lie down for it?

    Armed citizens don’t lie down.

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