Unofficial-no-guns-allowed-sign-courtesy-The-Truth-About-Guns

A TTAG reader writes:

“Have you ever been so anti-gun that you took off a sign, flipped it over, put ‘No guns’ on the back, and put it back? That’s what my mayor’s doing. And he only did it because 1) I open carry at my local bank and 2) the bank manager refused to put up a no guns sign after a cop who just HAPPENS to be the mayor’s son told him he should. This is one reason why I open carry: to expose anti-gun politicians.”

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62 COMMENTS

    • I know the guy, and he’s employed by the town. It’s a small town with small-town politics in a state that says we don’t have a right to work. I hope he doesn’t get fired for this.

      • Yes but what does that sign say and what force of law does it have?
        Like in Illinois that sign would have no force of law. And what is it doing, making a parking spot NO Carry?
        WTH is it… need more info. State at least. Is there state level preemption, etc,

      • Then he should run for mayor. So many people are willing to whine and cry yet on election day they don’t show up. When it comes time to challenge someone at the ballot box, it’s crickets.

        • I would love to, if I wasn’t only 24 and didn’t live outside the city limits. Additionally, I don’t know the right people. Yet.

        • The only valid excuse is that you don’t live within the municipality. Age, not a factor. Not knowing the right people, not a factor. Yep, there are always excuses as to why people don’t step up and run for local office. I guess it’s just easier to complain.

      • Well, whether it’s a “Right-to-Work” or “At Will” state, they can pretty much fire him any time for any reason, as long as he doesn’t have a work contract or the reason is listed as a “protected class.” Right-to-Work doesn’t mean you have a guarantee to employment, it’s something that relates to unions.

        • Reading this post and comments without knowing the whole story, I would conclude that the town is owned by one family, and I would bet there is a fair level of corruption on the other side of the curtain. If true, winning is not assured, and the journey is going to be painful. For me, I would try to get some help from one of the many NRA’ish type organizations…and find another job.

        • Talk to your brother man. Tell him it’s going viral on the internet and it could bring the town a lot of bad press.

        • @Natty: Too late, it’s already on the internet. The guy was stupid for sending that picture and those exact words to so many people on Facebook. All he can do is hope the mayor doesn’t find out or ask Robert to take it down.

          I know it isn’t my place, but I’ll ask Robert (or Nick or Tyler or whomever) to take it down. I like the guy, even though he’s a bit of a hothead. I don’t want him fired.

        • As a TN resident stationed outside of TN..”ugh…” I know this maybe pointless in your situation but…

          (3) (A) If a sign is used as the method of posting, it shall contain language substantially similar to the
          following:
          AS AUTHORIZED BY T.C.A. § 39-17-1359, POSSESSION OF A WEAPON ON POSTED PROPERTY
          OR IN A POSTED BUILDING IS PROHIBITED AND IS A CRIMINAL OFFENSE.
          (B) As used in this section, “language substantially similar to” means the sign contains language
          plainly stating that:
          (i) The property is posted under authority of Tennessee law;
          (ii) Weapons or firearms are prohibited on the property, in the building, or on the portion of the
          property or building that is posted; and
          (iii) Possessing a weapon in an area that has been posted is a criminal offense.

  7. Hey call me crazy if you want.
    What if Luke White, Mick1187, and “A TTAG reader” are the same person. They maybe a Bloomberg operative? What is this town? Who is the mayor?
    To take the other picture, did A TTAG reader have to break the law and trespass to get on the other side of that fence topped with barbed wire?

    • “Crazy if you want.”

      The TTAG reader took those photos at his place of employment, which had no sign before he open carried at the bank. He wasn’t trespassing.

      We haven’t posted the mayor’s name or the town because we don’t want him to get fired.

      • Defacing a sign like that may be a crime in your locality. Ask the DA to prosecute A TTAG reader’s employer? Is the mayor a member of Mayors Against Illegal Guns?

      • A TTAG reader writes:
        This is one reason why I open carry: to expose anti-gun politicians.
        Mick1187 says:
        We haven’t posted the mayor’s name or the town because we don’t want him to get fired.

        Why the heck not?

  8. Is the mayor of that town really authorized to just “make up” gun regulations, deface city property, and “repurpose” parking signs to ban firearms in a particular area? That sounds a little odd. Is there an ordinance about it? Did the City Council, or whatever you have there, meet and discuss it? Are there minutes of the meeting, or did the Mayor just go out there with a wrench, a stencil, and a can of spray paint and make his own sign?

  9. I run the sign shop for the township I work for. I always resurface the same side of the sign that way there in just a blank side on the back.

    Not that it has anything to do with this post. I just wanted to point out how unprofessional the sing guy is.

    • Making a sign like this is unprofessional — or at least pointless.

      Love your comment, by the way, Troy!

    • But if it’s concealed, which it has to be, then how will they know?
      If you’re talking about carrying a rifle into a bank, then yeah. Stupid is as stupid does.

    • Ummm… No. There’s nothing in the law about carrying in a bank. Unless they have the proper signage (30.06 sign in english and spanish in easily readable lettering at least 1 inch font. At ALL entrances).

  11. Without a local ordinance authorising the mayor to unilaterally create gun-free zones, the sign carries no force of law. Some of the local pro-2A folk should get their picture taken around the sign, open carrying, and send it to the local media.

  12. Sorry for being late to the party. I’ve been at work and had to take a dinner break to use my personal phone.

    Yes, I’m the one who sent it in. Some of the people in my town will know it was me, and I know that word will likely get back to those in power that I sent this in.

    Yes, I open carried at the bank. I have done so since I got my handgun carry permit in 2013. I have not had a single complaint from anybody, customers or tellers, and I have a recording from a manager saying so.

    I started this job in November of last year, and there was not one word in any of the paperwork regarding weapons. I said “Sweet, a job that actually recognizes and respects RKBA.” Not so. In my ignorance of policies that didn’t exist, I carried my only pistol in the only way I carry it while wearing my work shirt and jacket. I was asked not to do that during my first month of employment, so I stopped. Another message from the mayor was that he didn’t want any firearms on the property, which I followed even though Tennessee state law specifically protects vehicle storage. I thought it was over after that. I’d also like to point out that I have never carried at work. I’ve worn my holster because I didn’t feel like taking it off and I was up here by myself and couldn’t scare anybody, but it was empty. I didn’t feel like pushing it after the bank incident.

    That is, until a conversation with the bank manager last week. He told me that a cop had come in and told him he should put up a no guns sign because “Just anybody could carry into the bank.” The bank manager said no. The next thing I know, this sign is up at my workplace as well as city hall. No word yet on other locations. This is almost two months after I started leaving my work shirt and jacket off as requested.

    I haven’t posted the town name because, as always, more information comes to light. I thank my family for not posting that info, too.

    Mick was right, the officer was the mayor’s nephew and not his son. A small distinction, but a distinction nonetheless. Additionally, the sign was pulled from storage and modified, not flipped around. I apologize, not for sending in this gat tip, but for sending in incorrect/incomplete info.

    The incorrect part has been handled, but the incomplete part is next: I do not know whether this was done via board ruling or executive fiat. The town’s minutes should tell me which.

    My stepfather called Robert and asked him to take down the article for fear of me getting fired, and my brother even emailed ttag to ask for his comments to be removed. I appreciate them both, but Robert was right when he said no. Robert, Nick, Dan, Tyler the smelly smeller, don’t take it down. Please post updated info (nephew and sign, even the full story if you want), but don’t remove it from your server. Let me live with the shame of sending incorrect info.

    My holster business hasn’t taken off to the point where I can just quit and carry at that job (aka “home”), but I don’t have a family relying on my paycheck to eat. Getting fired won’t be the end of the world.

    Watch this space for info on the minutes, Armed Intelligentsia. And thank you for any and all support.

    Edit: if I had sent this entire story in to Robert and company first, a lot of you would not be eating drama popcorn right now.

      • If I had the most popular gun blog on the intertubez, then I might not want some random stranger advertising his personal business on my blog.

        If RF gives the OK, I might send a writer a holster or three and have them write a review on it. That seems like the right way to do things, as opposed to using drama for my personal gain.

        • No need for reticence — you mentioned it in passing, and people are interested enough to specifically ask you for more information, so you’re good to go. I might be in the market for a new holster myself, and I like the idea of supporting an independent startup. Besides, guns ‘n things are what this whole place is about.

          So post the link! (Assuming you have a site to link to.)

        • Sorry for the late reply. Been at work, just got home.

          I basically run my most-amatuer-holster-business-ever off of its own MyFace page. I’m still hesitant to link it, but it is the first google result for Tomahawk Custom Holsters.

    • Thanks for the update Jake, and good luck out there. I hope there’s no backlash against you. The popcorn may rule, but personal drama sux.

  13. That sure looks like defacing public property to me, most likely just an infraction, but it should be remedied as soon as possible. Have someone NOT employed by the City write a letter to the editor of the local rag. Make a stink.

  14. I dont get the concern about being fired. Matt, Luke,

    Are you saying an employee of the town, who points out an illegal act of the Mayor, and
    tells about the unlawful advise,emt and pressure by a cop, to a business owner, based on Mayors wishes,
    should be fired?

    He11, IMHO your brother should be promoted for pointing out city corruption. Just because its a small town, apparently run by cronyism, that doesnt give anyone immunity from the law, or the responsibility to treat people fairly.

    Maybe more people need to speak up in that small town. I’m sure if the Mayor is showing this poor judgement throwing his weight around, and using his nephew to threaten people, there’s more dirt to be uncovered. Maybe the State Police investigators need to take a drive and look at the city treasury records, and council minutes, and so on. Smells like a white collar crime opportunity, frankly.

    • +1

      Get the story on the signs. Who modified them? Why? Who ordered it done? Was the city council involved? The mayor can’t just point and pick whatever he wants a gun free zone. Get the details.

      …also update your resume just in case. Also – local paper is a good idea for a story (if you eventually have one)

  16. Hmm, that’s interesting, the Mayor’s little bitch got his panties in a knot.

    … Must be a really small town for the reader to be this well informed over the details.

  17. One question: does the sign meet the requirements to be a legit Gun-Free Zone sign in that state?

    I don’t see any numbers on that identify what statute this is.

    • Maybe. All that’s required in TN is the circle/slash symbol, but it must be “displayed in prominent locations, including all entrances primarily used by persons entering the property, building, or portion of the property or building where weapon possession is prohibited” TCA 39-17-1359 (b)(3)(c)

  19. Small town politics do get nasty, watch your 6. And definitely follow up, being sure to take this to county level. This sounds like an elected official using personal bias to the detriment of the municipality in which they are working. And be sure to have all your personal and business ducks in a row, this also sounds like the kind of backstabbing a$$ who will come at you sideways and try to destroy your life in retaliation.

  20. Another update:

    Dropped by City Hall. Asked for the minutes. Was told to have a seat and wait. The Mayor Himself™ walked out and asked if there was a problem. I told him that, as a city employee, I need to stay abreast of things.

    He said that “If there’s a problem, I need to know about it.”
    I said “I won’t know whether there’s a problem until I read the minutes.”
    He said they’ll have the ones from December’s meeting for me later and I’d have to come back. January’s won’t be approved until February’s meeting.

    That seemed a little fishy to me, but I left. I’ll be back tomorrow.

      • Jon, the minutes are basically a transcript of what takes place during a meeting. Citizens can get a copy and read about what took place, what votes were taken, who voted for what, etc. without having to sit through what are sometimes multi-hour meetings. Being a City Administrator I sit through more of them than I care to, but ya do what ya have to when it’s part of your job description. One of the perks though is that all staff that have a valid MO CCW can carry concealed at work. Elected officials could already carry concealed on and in city property (except when municipal court is in session) and we were able to convince the Board that it only made sense for staff to be able to protect themselves as the Board could. I’ve been very lucky and the mayors that I have worked for have all been good, upstanding 2A and Constitution loving individuals. I think if I ever get a mayor like Jake has I’ll be dropping my resignation letter on the Board just as quick as I can write it up and get it distributed. A city is only ever one election away from anarchy. Sorry for the long winded reply Jon, and good luck to you Jake.

    • Jake, make nice with the City Clerk. If she (or the occasional he) can’t or won’t get you a copy of the minutes, you’re right, something is very fishy. Good luck to you.

  21. signs need laws and ordinances to back them up. Antigun signs in some states can be drawn with a crayon and in other states must conform. No sign means shit without a law to back it up.

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