It Should Have Been a Defensive Gun Use: Morgan Freeman’s Granddaughter Edition

1. R.I.P., and may your untimely death weigh heavily on Morgan’s mind.

   • That’s an awful thing to say (type).

     • Not making any assertions about the truthfulness of the claims, but this is the step-granddaughter that Morgan Freeman was purported to have had a romantic relationship with.

       • Yeah, I heard about that. People spreading ugly rumours like that have a special place in Hell waiting for them.

         May the late Miss Hines rest in peace…and I only wish that New York would become more like Vermont…and now Maine.

         – T

2. “‘I watched someone get murdered, and there was nothing I could do”

   Hey, anti-gun nutters. How many times must you say this before you realize the truth of it?

   • There still may have been nothing they could have done. It’d hard to defend against all attacks.
     All it takes is one stab to the heart. Maybe someone could have done something and maybe not. I know I want a fighting chance though.
     The news has released that it was her boyfriend and he has been arrested.

3. We gotta get these knives off the street!

   And end this knife violence.

   • Indeed.

     First of all, my thoughts and prayers to the Freeman family. This is a tragic example of knife violence, which is arguably much more painful than being shot to death. It could have been prevented by an armed Good Samaritan, but it was not meant to be.

     Then again, there are some on TTAG who’ve said they wouldn’t lift a (trigger) finger to help someone else in need. I find that to be tragic as well.

     • You’ll find that among any large population.

     • Be nice. 20 years ago, yes. I’m to old and shaky, and too likely to be prosecuted today, generally I plan to stand aside other than protecting myself and family.

       • You would stand by and watch a lady be murdered right in front of you and not do ANYTHING to try to prevent that?

         Here’s a thought: in a manner of speaking, by a lot of perspectives, she IS your family.

       • “the kindness of strangers to survive the assault.”
         -This no longer exists in our society unless the stranger can profit for themselves, and it was done by design to make us need the false security of the state.

         @acuur81
         “Then again, there are some on TTAG who’ve said they wouldn’t lift a (trigger) finger to help someone else in need. I find that to be tragic as well.”
         -That is a disgusting excuse for cowardice, and an excuse for showing indifference towards their fellow man.
         -It is the same indifference that a police officer shows when they enforce unconstitutional laws, which i find tragic as well.

         @larry
         “prosecuted today, generally I plan to stand aside other than protecting myself and family.”

         You would not be allowed in my physical presence after stating that you would rather watch innocent people die, because you are afraid of being victimized by the state for defending innocent life. I’m not old nor frail, and you are not an elder deserving of respect.

         You have the right as an American to say what your beliefs are, and your revelation of indifference towards innocent life should allow you to understand that we only live on the same metaphysical plane, and not in the same world.
         I would hope that after divulging your cowardice revelation in person to me, that you are smart enough to realize every second I am forced to tolerate a lesser man, it may hinder that cowards ability to immediately leave in peace. That is what freedom of association is.

   • Careful what you wish for. They have that in the UK now.

4. Either outlaw knives or get rid of the draconian gun laws in NY.

   • Knives are already outlawed in NYC.

     • So is “killing folks”, for all the good it does.

5. How horrible. I don’t know if Mr. Freeman is close to his grandkid-he’s usually pretty libertarian. RIP-and get armed…

   • Are we talking about the same Morgan Freeman? The one who went on Piers Morgan and blasted the Tea Party as racist for no other reason than they were mostly white and dared to oppose HIS black president? Libertarian or liberal? And as far as his closeness to his step-granddaughter, they were close enough create allegations of an inappropriate romantic relationship.

     • Freeman is also an unabashed gun-control aficionado. Maybe he should take solace in the fact that his beloved step-granddaughter was not shot and killed by a white police officer. THAT would have been unpalatable.

       I wonder if she had her “hands up, don’t stab” defense mechanism in place?

6. Everyone pat yourselves on the back and thank Shannon and Uncle Mike for their hard work that kept this guy from getting a gun, could have be so much worse…

   • Good thing no guns were involved. Someone might actually have been killed.

     • Or could have been killed even dead-er!

   • I was trying to figure out what “Uncle Mike’s Holsters” Mike had to do with this for a few seconds.

7. We all know the fallacy of restricting gun rights but let the family deal with their loss without our comments. If I’m the one killed on the street one day rip me to shreds for letting it happen but it wasn’t me or any of us so just shut up.

   She looked like a lovely women. My condolences to the family.

8. The question should be more of what was she doing being near this wackadoodle to begin with.
   Im sure he didn’t just come to Jesus at that moment for the 1st time.

   • We should all endeavor to avoid stupid (crazy) people in stupid places doing stupid things. But you can’t always do that. But for those when we don’t/can’t, a loaded gun is a friend indeed.

     • Since I couldn’t edit my reply. I was referring more to this animals mental condition,
       The old catch 22. How does one report a person who has shown past symptoms of being unbalanced?? Id be relatively sure this wasn’t his 1st indication of some sort of imbalance. And to what degree do others get involved??
       A conundrum if there ever was one.
       RIP young lady and condolences to the Freeman family.
       Ive read she was the granddaughter of Morgans 1st wife and they the step grand daughter were close.

   • “Her live-in boyfriend, Lamar Davenport, 30, was in the throes of a drug-induced psychosis when he came after her, police sources said.”

     • So, not guilty by reason of insanity, and he’s on the street?

       • he was competent when he chose to take the drugs.

     • What we really need to do, is spend another few trillion constructing bomb craters halfway around the world while stomping our fat, useless feet and gargling rah-rah, because people there are so bad to their women….. And make sure Bloomberg and Obama have plenty of armed protection, since they are important, after all. Unlike this lady.

9. Every time this sort of thing happens, I’ll bet the victim’s last thoughts were something along the longs of, “I cannot believe this is happening to me … I never thought it would happen to me.”

   Here is the stone cold truth: law enforcement agencies reported more than 1 million violent crimes to our beloved Federal Bureau of Investigation last year. And we all know the actual number of violent crimes could easily be double that number — there are numerous compelling reasons why victims would NOT report their violent attack to police*.

   Nevertheless, let us consider 1 million violent crimes last year and about 330 million people in the United States. That means about 1 in 330 people were victims of a violent crime. While that number may seem fairly low, it is only for a single year. What happens when you consider your likelihood of being a victim of violent crime over 60 years of your life? Now your chances of being a victim are in the neighborhood of 1 in 6. I don’t know about you, but I don’t like those odds. And remember that there are actually more violent crimes that victims never report to police so your odds of being the victim of a violent crime are actually even greater. Of course some people will have a much higher probability of being a victim depending on where they live/work (urban versus rural), their occupation, etc.

   When you look at your odds of being the victim of a violent crime over a long life span, I cannot imagine why anyone would not be armed.

   * Here are some of the reasons why the victim of a violent crime would not report their assault to police:
   (1) Victim is dead and no one ever finds the body.
   (2) Victim has a warrant for their arrest.
   (3) Victim was engaged in illegal activity during the assault.
   (4) Victim does not trust police.
   (5) Victim fears retribution from their attacker if they report their attack.
   (6) Victim wants to exact retribution themselves.
   (7) Victim fears the prosecutor will charge them with some crime.
   (8) Victim believes that police are incompetent and reporting their attack is a waste of time.

   • Good logic, and respectable reasoning. I’ve heard from 1:3 to 1:1 odds of being the victim of a violent crime. Even if the odds were 1:10, the best way to be prepared is to be armed 24 / 7.

   • I agree with the Accurate One. Good post.

     I’ll add this to your point: Even *IF* the odds were as low as 1:330 or even lower (within specific sub-sample groups), that means jack squat what it DOES happen to you.

     At that moment, your “odds” of being the victim of a violent crime go to “absolute.” In quantum mechanics, we call this “Reduction.” Once an observation happens, the odds of it happening before the observation are irrelevant (to that observation).

     The other thing, often stated in these parts, the ‘odds’ are only one part of the risk-assessment equation. Risk is odds AND consequence.

     Even with low odds, the consequences of being victimized by a violent attacker are very high.

     So, where does that leave us given your (re)assessment of the odds?

     Chances are 1:6 of being party to an event with potential life-ending consequences.

     Anyone that ignores that is a fool. That’s not saying everyone should be armed so much as simply saying that anyone that thinks all is peachy-keen and unicorn happy rainbows is foolish.

     If one chooses to not be armed, at LEAST let it be based on objective analysis of the facts and understanding of the consequences..not ignoring them and pretending “it won’t happen to me.”

     • Sorry to be so dense… “Accurate One” I just got that.

10. Tragic to say the least. Condolences to her family. Where are the anti-gunners when something like this happens? Typically silent, right ? But, what if someone, anyone, not just this victim, had a gun nearby? Perhaps this could have been stopped before she was killed ? The other obvious question: Why the HELL is this guy out on the streets walking around ? We always hear about the killers that make the headlines by shooting up in GFZs. How it was so obvious, after the fact, that they should not have had a gun, right ? But it wasn’t a gun, in this case (or any case for that matter) that caused this tragic death. It was, as always, the guy with the weapon that should not have been free to roam around in our society and harm others. What is the answer ? In this case it is surely not more gun restrictions. Which seems to show that maybe that is not the case at all. Focus on the Perps NOT the tools, you idiot lawmakers.

    • Yup. Focusing on denying weapons to the unstable is the same as saying its ok to let dangerous people wander around unchecked.

11. Must not have had any Knife Free Zone signs posted.

12. Very sad but should be used as a lesson so her death is not a waste. She had no chance, laws of the area infringe on Rights. I’d hold the lawmakers accountable.

13. I hope Mr Trump does talk about how easy it is for him to get a gun and not so easy for people of lesser means. I hope Mr Freeman does not blame the gun, instead of the person who took his granddaughter from him.

    • Considering she was the victim of a knife attack I’d find it amusing if Morgan and his liberal friends DID blame the gun.

      • My bad. Miss read the story. Sorry about that. I still hope Trump speaks about armed self defense rights.

        • Not TOO bad, we have seen before calls for gun control because of attacks with other weapons, and for assault weapon bans for attacks with shotguns or pistols, and for UBC due to attacks where the perp passed background checks to purchase the weapon.

      • I’d make book that Freeman will blame the police for slow response time, or Mayor Bill DiBlasio, for failing to provide adequate security.

14. Tragic. Prayers for the family.

    This is another example of a mentally ill person claiming the life of an innocent. The knife didnt do it, just like the gun didnt do it. The mentally ill person did it.

    The lack of sufficient mental health facilities, clear guidelines for therapists and famlies to commit ill relatives, and ongoing training for the police on how to respond is a well known problem, that the anti-gunners mouth platitudes about, but never get done.

    Imagine how much Bloomberg could be getting doing with his billions for his home town, if he wasnt off on an ego crusade to take on the NRA, with MAIG, MDA, Everytown and his latest propaganda effort- the Trace, publicly committed and admitted as seizing guns from the law-abiding.

    $1B to Johns Hopkins including $50M to Public Health there for anti-gun research. Its obscene, is what it is.

    When left-wing Hollywood types point out the hypocrisy of anti-gunners, and spend their own money advocate for help to the mentally ill, to families, and to the police, then I will listen to what they have to say about gun control.

15. A J frame in the pocket is worth 2 NYPD at dunkin’ donuts.

    • JWC, I’d say a whole police precinct.

16. What! What ! What! What! Anti-2nd Amendment, Iranian sympathizing, clueless obama-lovin’ Liberal Hollywood race-baiter, Morgan Freeman, lost his “granddaughter” (AND former lover) to a stabbing? Who cares?

    • “Who cares?”

      Any decent, non-psychotic human being that values human life cares.

      • We do. But 200,000 people die on the planet every day. Statistically literate non progressives amongst us, don’t devote a larger share of our daily care budget to someone, simply on account of them having a famous step grandpa.

17. If I don’t have a gun, I’m not sure I’d directly intervene in a stabbing. If I had a Taser, I would utilize it if I could do so in a tactically sound manner where I am not likely to die if the device fails to bring the assailant down. But in New York city, one can only carry registered pepper spray and a pocket knife. Those are not appropriate tools to stop a stabbing attack. Pepper spray will get you stabbed, a human can still stab you with watery eyes, and a knife fight is a situation I want to desperately avoid. You wouldn’t expect to get in a fist fight without getting punched, you cannot expect to engage in a knife fight without getting stabbed, no matter your expertise. There is a difference between putting my life on the line to save a stranger, as I would with a gun, and purposefully allowing lethal force to be used against me to intercede in a fight on behalf of a stranger as I would be doing if I charged at the assailant with a knife. In certain situations I would. Mass shooter enters the sole doorway to my classroom, without hesitation. My family or friends are under attack, without hesitation. I see a lunatic stab a stranger on a New York City street? I don’t know. I might just call the cops and try to remove the victim or render medical assistance if possible without exposing myself to certain grave bodily harm. It’s unlikely he’ll stab anyone else and I expect the NYPD will show up in two or three minutes.

    • Agreed. Somebody pulls a knife on me, I shoot him while backing away. I do not wave the gun around and threaten him.

18. 1) #blacklivesmatter except for Shannon and the Midget billionaire

    2) guess she is glad he didn’t have an icky gun to use against her while being domestically violent or that somehow she beat the “odds” of gun violence (instead of just violence)

    #3) granddaddy didnt pay enough $$ to the political elite for the right to self-defense

    #4) on another note, I am kinda hoping Shannon’s daughter gets that internship in NYC she wants.

19. Terrible tragedy…

20. Maybe Mr. Freeman will reconsider his extreme liberal views and the way he portrays them now that his family has been directly affected by one of those pet views, where as the rest of us have had to live with protecting ourselves for most of our lives unlike the elites like him.

    • You would think Freeman would have an epiphany, but I doubt it. Still, he must be wondering – “how could this happen in a place with strict gun-control (i know, a knife was used), and where they don’t lock up the mentally ill in an institution?

21. Oh no. I can see the headlines now.

    Let’s register all knives.
    Let’s require all knife holders to first get a background check.
    Let’s change the US constitution so that government no longer has to observe and protect the the pre-constitutional right to keep and bear arms (in which knives are are subset).

    • Won’t happen. It’s not a gun. The Moms Demanding Illegal Mayors use similar knives to prepare their quiches, beef stroganoffs, and casseroles, and they demand the right to make their casseroles! You’d think that after the movie “Psycho”, they’d know better than to allow such Dangerous Weapons (TM) in the hands of anyone other than military and police.

      And now an innocent woman is dead, by a knife-wielder…and the antis don’t seem to give a damn about that life.

      – T

22. “As for those who berate this website for waving the bloody shirt when someone defenseless is injured or killed, how do you think the antis would have reacted if Ms. Hines had been shot to death by her mentally unhinged boyfriend?”

    Just because the gun grabbers will stoop to any level and exploit any tragic event to further their immoral goals doesn’t mean we can’t be better than that. They also manipulate statistics dishonestly, and sometimes flat-out lie about established facts. Should we adopt that tactic, too?

    I’m not against using emotional arguments, as long as they’re backed by real facts, but speculating on what might have happened is just mental masturbation. Don’t we mock the antis when someone writes an article speculating how much worse some atrocity might have been if the perpetrator was better armed?

    • But wait. We have statistics of real life situations on our side in this assertion.

      Perhaps you would feel better if instead of saying what “might have happened” it is worded thus: Had she (or the bystander) been armed there is an x chance that she would not have been murdered.”

      That’s been studied. It is well documented that resistance increases your chances of surviving a violent encountered (especially woman being attacked by man) and those chances increase even further if the resistance is armed resistance.

      Can anyone say that definitively in THIS case it would have mattered? No; of course not. But…for others to learn from THIS case means it must be repeated that your chances of survival increase (rather dramatically, in my opinion about the numbers) by active self defense with a proper tool for that job.

23. Looks like New York’s gun control laws are working as planned!

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