“Police say two teens assaulted 88-year-old Delbert Belton outside the Eagles Lodge in North Spokane Wednesday night around 8pm,” khq.com reports. “Belton was rushed to the hospital where he was placed in the intensive care unit but later died. Police are actively searching for two suspects. They are described to be 16-19 in age, black males & both wearing black clothing, one was wearing a black ‘Do-Rag’ police say.” On the radio this morning Glenn Beck called for Uncle Sam to pursue the attack as a hate crime, focusing on the assault’s black-on-white aspect in the wake of the recent Oklahoma shooting (where two blacks and a white teen shot an Australian college student). Nonsense . . .
Who cares what motivated the murderers? People without a moral compass who threaten, assault or kill fellow citizens should be punished for their actions not their intent. You get into that discussion—and I’m hearing endless “debates” over marriage, education, social welfare, religion, violent videogames, etc. in regards to the Oklahoma atrocity—and you miss the point. There will always be evil people. Always.
This heinous crime highlights the need for armed self-defense. How else could an 88-year-old man defend himself against murderous teens? If the thugs had gunned down Mr. Belton, a vet wounded during World War Two, there’d be immediate calls for gun control. The fact that the man known as “Shorty” was beaten to death while defenseless should trigger calls for easy access to armed self-defense for all Americans. As they have here.
DGU? Nonsense! If two able bodied men 1/5th your age just want to have a fist fight, you give them a fist fight. Nothing harmed but pride.
I know! Politicians would say it is best not to bring a gun to a simple fistfight – someone could get hurt!
Besides, if an 88-yr old “trained killer” (i.e., veteran – for those who are not media pukes) were to shoot two “unarmed” black youths, he would have been “Zimmermanned” – arrested and tried for a hate crime.
I mean, come on, he could have just run away, right?
And I am sure their parents will testify that the two “youths” are “good boys”.
And this how America treats the people who fought to keep us from tyranny.
You got it right until that last sentence. The last time American troops fought to protect Americans from tyranny, their uniforms were gray and they lost the war.
Racist alert.
I’m going to step in here, as I do whenever I see folks scream “racist” when refering to the civil war. Anyone who claims the civil war was about slavery or racism has not looked into the civil war beyond a 3rd grade social studies class. The civil war was fought, first and foremost, for STATES RIGHTS, not slavery. Slavery was the issue the brought about the federal laws that started the cessesion movement, but slavery was not the primary reason for the war, it was the rights of the states to make laws that stand over federal intervention. And on that fact, Chris is 100% right. The North didn’t win the civil war….the Feds did….
Right you are, Chris. The War to Prevent Southern Independence was the last just war, from the Southern perspective, of course. All the wars since have been nothing but exercises in empire-building. Lincoln and his ilk were empire-building, too.
@Hobbez:
States’ Rights was a reason for secession, and the peaceful withdrawal of most southern states, but the primary reason for the war was taxes. Lincoln wanted the southern states (particularly SC with the high volume port of Charleston) to pay the federal tariff, regardless of whether they stayed in the union or not.
@Mlopilato:
If the “the war between the states was about slavery”, why did VA reject secession in the first attempt, and not secede until after the Union began the war? VA was, by far, the biggest slave holding state. And why did other border states not vote to secede at all? Answer: the war was about economics, and they were better off in the union.
Oh, no, we have just stepped into the stoopid zone.
And now we have stepped into the ad hominem attack zone.
I love the states rights argument. Boil away the fat and it basically says that the individual states have powers above and beyone the constitution. Tyranny of the majority within a given state in other words. 51% of the voters can outlaw guns, outlaw a mans right to vote or be free for that matter. Reintroduce slavery if that’s what 51% of the voters want.
Just as grabbers spread the lie that getting rid of guns will stop crime, states righters spread the lie that the cause isn’t about slavery or racism.
Here we go again with neo-Confederate idiocy,
The South succeeded because their candidate lost the 1860 election. They saw that slavery and the “southern gentleman’s” way of life was demographically doomed because of the anti-slavery views of new immigrants. Succession had been discussed by the founding fathers and they all agreed that the Union was perpetual once in, in forever. The southern aristocrats wanted different rules so they quit. I note that the State of Virginia claimed that the part of the state that stayed loyal to Union had no such right to succeed from Virginia. What does that tell you about what they really believed?
Jason:
You might want to check the Constitution. The federal government is given the authority to raise revenue through taxes. If Congress votes for taxes then the succession would clearly be an illegal act because it is a refusal to recognize the legitimate authority given to the federal government in the Constitution.
One of most pernicious lies that neo-Confederates tell is that the Civil War ended states rights. What ahistorical nonsense. The entire edifice of Jim Crow used State Rights to impose and enforce “Jim Crow” for 80 years. States Rights were codified by the 1896 SCOTUS Plessy vs Ferguson case. This was not overturned until Brown Vs Board of Education in 1953. The relationship between the States and Federal Government was the same in 1866 and it was in 1860. The ultimate cause of the Civil War was slavery and the refusal of the minority South to accept the legitimate election of Lincoln in 1860. In other words the successionists took their ball went home.
Regarding this: ” Succession had been discussed by the founding fathers and they all agreed that the Union was perpetual once in, in forever,” you like to accuse Southerners of lies, but your statement is an egregious lie. The states joined the union voluntarily and they reserved the right to secede from the union any time they wanted to. You speak of “neo-confederate idiocy,” well, for my part I abhor Damn Yankee stupidity. By the way, the word is “secede,” not “succeed.”
They joined voluntarily but that doesn’t mean that the Union wasn’t perpetual.
Had the Confederacy won it would have been a Pyrrhic victory. Having established the principle of succession the CSA would have fallen apart in short order as the divisions between various parts of the Southern Confederacy would have come to surface without the threat from the Northern States. What do you think the attitude in Richmond would have been if Texas and the Indian Territories decided to go their own way? Do you think that they would have given them a Hail and Farewell? The Confederacy would have lasted about ten years before if fell apart unless of course the central government moved into to suppress any rebellion. Judging from the attitude of Virginia toward the counties in the Northwest part of the state that would have been the most likely outcome. The Southern States succeeded because they couldn’t get their own way. Simple as that. If their guy won the 1860 election there would have been no civil war.
The reason for secession is irelevant. Secession is the inherent right of any sovereign state. Prosecuting a war that took the lives of 600,000 men was a criminal act inflicted upon the Confederacy by the U.S.A. The C.S.A. had the right to go its own way and leave the U.S.A. behind.
I am fairly sure if we lost WW2 and this became Hitlers America we would be living under some serious tyranny.
The last time Americans faught for their freedom was over two hundred years ago.
You seem not to be amenable to rational argument. If the Union or your imaginary Confederacy is not a perpetual union whether voluntarily entered into or not then such a Republic will fail as each state goes it’s own way when it decided not to be bound by collective decision that it does not ;like. When a state enters the Union it agrees to abide by the majority decision. The successionist states decided that they didn’t like where things were headed and so decided, as said, to pick up their bat and ball and go home in a snit. And they did it over their proclaimed right to own slaves. Hardly a position I would want to be associated with,
The slavers actually didn’t believe in the right of succession because they would not have tolerated it in their own confederacy. All they want to do was to maintain and expand their empire of slavery.
” When a state enters the Union it agrees to abide by the majority decision.”
The way I was given to understand it, the states agreed to follow the Constitution, which is designed to protect us from the tyranny of the mobocracy as well as the tyranny of central authority. An unconstitutional law isn’t a law.
And actually, States’ Rights could have ended slavery without a war. All a Free state would have to do would be to refuse to extradite any newly Free person. (AKA escaped slave.)
That’s what they were doing until Dred Scott came along and that gave Southern Slavers the right to go collect “their property” and freedmen as well under authority of the Federal Courts.
You misuse mobocracy. It refers to pure democracy which is prevented by Republican government. If anything it was slavers who relied on Mobocracy.
Sure, the “State’s rights” to continue slavery.
Saying that the civil war was about slavery is glib, but saying that it “wasn’t about slavery” is misleading. I always wonder how people can delude themselves into ignoring the evil perpetrated by the South as if it didn’t matter. Even if the civil war were over taxes, with slavery being incidental- which it wasn’t- the traffic, debasement, forced labor, and torture of humans takes away any moral high ground that could have been held.
This isn’t the Argentinians looking wistfully at the Fauklands, it’s Germans looking back and thinking WWII had the wrong victor. And that they can’t understand why people get upset over that.
“Sure, the “State’s rights” to continue slavery.”
Maybe, but don’t forget the other states’ right to welcome all the escaped slaves to their new home in the Free states. “Sorry, Bucko, but we don’t “extradite” free people, and kidnapping is, in fact illegal here.”
Yeah, while WWI and II can easily be viewed as two engagements of the same war, in the second engagement, the good and bad guys were pretty clearly delineated.
Had Hitler and Japan won, we’d not have even what we have. We’d all be pets, slaves and game animals, rather than just some of us.
As to the rest of this subthread, I think that instead of typing on that subject I’ll take some o’ my wood-and-steel WWII veterans and go make some holes — with a deep appreciation of their role in saving us from a totalitarian Hell.
Slavery was never abolished. It was only expanded to include everyone. Gold is the currency of Kings. Silver is the currency of Gentlemen. Barter is the currency of the poor. And Credit is the currency of the slave.
No such thing as a simple fist fight. Just ask the soccer ref. that was just killed with one punch to the head. Oh wait, you can’t. I guess it was more than his pride that got harmed.
It should’ve been a DGU. Their have been millions of people that have died from being stupid just once. This should’ve been another incidence.
While we can proclain that it should have been a DGU, the fact is the players, those doing these assaults, give no indication you are about to be hit until the second they throw the punch, too late to defend yourself.
We ae in this mess for many reasons.
1. The willful destruction of the family by the formation of a welfare state. No father figure.
2. The neutering of parental rights. You can be arrested for spanking your kids in some areas.
3. A culture that watches the news, shrugs, and goes off to bed. I would not adbocate lynching the scum in Oklahoma, but if those rats were taken from their cells by a mob. tied to a few suitable trees, and flogged with in an inch of their lives, then castrated, other thugs would go “Hhmmm.”
Simple solution, throw out the congress, we have, and impeach the supreme injustices of the court. Start there.
A DGU can depend on many factors and the ability to recognize yellow, orange and red situations early and have the ability to act upon that awareness.
+1 on your numbers 1,2 and 3 wholeheartedly agree with you.
And it may turn out that these sh¡ts came from “unbroken” homes and had fathers who routinely belted ’em.
What matters is that society offers no proper reward for their behavior.
Slow hanging, neither hooded nor bound, one at a time, preempting ALL programming. That’d make a dent.
And even were the old to go about unarmed, an armed society having largely expunged subhumans or prevented them from arising in any great numbers because of a very high mortality rate among thuggish asswipes, their safe walks to home, car or whatever would each be a de facto DGU.
We need to go about armed, sanctioning these sh¡ts with extreme prejudice and no remorse. Only in this way will those who survive be frightened into doing something else.
They’ll never be real people, caring humans, giving a damn about right and wrong, but they’ll be afraid to do what they enjoy and will have to settle for what is right because that won’t get them killed.
WWII vets should carry. Could have gone down like this guy: http://www1.wsvn.com/news/articles/local/MI53001/
Now that was a great DGU………..To top it off, the goblin that may or may not survive will be charged with murder in the death of his partner! According to the report, the Marine will not be charged.
“All humans with the skills, maturity, and morality to use a gun responsibly should carry.”
There, fixed it for you.
I don’t have words for how ugly and horrendous this murder is.
Couldnt agree more, saw this story on TheBlaze and Breitbart and got the most disgusting feeling in my guts reading it.
I agree. If they had shot the man with a gun MSM and .gov’s would have given us a solution. The solution is… the solution is…. the solution … is… “””” GUN CONTROL!””” Not morals, or ethics, education, or teaching our youths that it is not correct behavior to shoot or beat senior citizens to death.
I just can’t wrap my mind around a reason for beating an 88 year old person to death, regardless of anything that senior citizen said that could have been construed as insulting. They acted like pack animals, not people.
“They acted like pack animals, not people.”
Not like; as. Like implies imitation. These – things – ARE pack animals.
No reason at all is needed; it’s just what they do. A shark eats, and they destroy.
I disagree that they’re “animals.” Animals don’t kill for pleasure, “boredom,” or gang initiation; they kill for food and self-defense and to protect their young. Except for cats, which are the only animals (other than humans) that get off on torturing their prey. Somebody once told me that orcas and wolverines also torture their prey, but nobody brings them into their home and calls them pets.
Attorney General Holder: Whites Not Protected by Hate Crime Laws
http://araceagainsttime.blogspot.com/2009/06/attorney-general-holder-whites-not.html
These were just some more bored yoots. Give them all some free government funded Xbox and PS3’s and they will stop these type of crimes.
This would never had happened if the GOP sequester had not eliminated the midnight basketball program!
I blame George Bush!
LOL I see what you did there.
Bring back midnight basketball I say.
And free cell phones – so they can twitter to their buddies about the Xbox/ps3 party.
Call off the insane war on drugs and stop paying unmarried teenage girls to produce bastards.
That makes too much sense … I don’t think the gov’t folks will buy it.
Unmarried teen age girls were producing bastards a long time before there was profit to it.
What we need is a rule that they get no help from the taxpayer until they id the babydaddy. Babydaddy can pay or he can do public works. Lots of desert in this country needs irragating. If babydaddy makes more than one bastard he’s not supporting he gets neutered.
Yeah, but only about one per town per year, and there was some stigma attached to it – it used to be called “getting in trouble” and the whole family had to move to escape the shame.
Yet another hate crime. Any word from the Commentator-in-Chief?
“You’ve got to square up your stance. Let the left wrist control the shot. Youth golf will prepare America’s next generation of leaders.”
Currently Barry is lecturing Scranton PA on why college not only costs so much but why those who pay taxes need to keep the gravy flowing. It’s laughable that with such unemployment among youth that he would be focused on this.
Look at the two rocket scientists that committed this crime. If only they were offered 100K plus Obamacare they wouldn’t beat up old men. Ergo, it’s our fault.
It’s not covered by mainstream media – so… No.
We are going to give globalwide news coverage on a hispanic/peruvian guy shooting a mixed white/black kid, but we are not going to give any coverage on some white/black thugs beating an 88 yr old white vet to death. No story there. Can’t make a civil rights argument out of that one.
I hate to say this. If we live long enough, eventually we will not be strong enough to handle a firearm. At that point you either take your chances or make sure a younger person accompanies you wherever you go. I have to wonder if Mr. Belton still had the strength to handle a firearm.
Either way it is a tragedy and my condolences go out to Mr. Belton’s family.
That’s true. Also, as you age, your response time, reflexes, and ability to stay in condition yellow are reduced. At some point, if you live long enough, it becomes impossible to defend yourself.
We might speculate that if he was still driving and going places at 88, his body, mind,and eyes were probably good enough to carry and defend.
This is exactly why a cane with shotty was invented oh so long ago.
Even at 88, if he can walk around on his own, a .22lr Beretta or similar with 8 or 9 rounds on board would have definately sent those two packing at a high rate of speed. You think two punks who want to beat on a weak old man are brave enough to keep coming if he’s shooting at them, whether it’s a .22 or a .454? The “hey this is gonna be fun” factor would seem to evaprorate at the sound of the first shot, IMO.
Oh, excellent point. While .22 LR is not the optimum self-defense caliber, it sure is better than nothing at all. More importantly in this case, it generates almost zero recoil and even a revolver with 6 shots is nothing to sneeze at. And the semi-autos have slides that are exceedingly easy to manipulate if someone wanted to go that route. (The anemic recoil of .22 LR means a light recoil spring.)
I also agree that two punks looking to beat on an old man would not stick around to analyze the bore of the victim’s barrel or to debate terminal ballistics.
And .22 is a great caliber for killing baseball players, so it should work on yoots.
Perhaps. On the other hand, there are plenty of 1911’s out there with some very light trigger pulls.
My father-in-law is 80…and trigger pull has nothing to do with it. He can no longer slide the action on a semi-auto. For him, a single action revolver is the answer.
And don’t forget recoil.
Perhaps pop-culture has some answers…
Q: “What is the riddle of
steelthe gun?”A1:”you must learn its discipline, for no one, no one in this world can you trust, not men, not women, not beasts… This
steelgun you can trust.”A2:”What is
steelthe gun compared to the hand that wields it?”A3:”
SteelGuns break, flesh withers, but the will to fight remains.”If Obama had a son…
Technically sticking with the victim you could still say “If Obama had a grandfather that was a million times better than Obama could ever be, he would look like this victim” and still be correct, if we are talking maternal line. But acknowledging simple reality would be racist.
Obuma had a white grandfather. A marxist POS who ran around with radical progressives and thru his daughter at the same.
What’s the big deal? Another OWFG killed by a couple of black youths, nothing new here. Now, if the races where reversed, then you have a story. Move along, nothing to see here.
Every time some American punk gets someone the whole kraut war machine in all it’s terror and fury could not get another bit of rage goes on top of the pile. The US government literally does not give a sh*t about its soldiers.
Agreed. But this hero was actually wounded whipping Tojo’s boys’ asses.
I figured I’d guess the wrong theater but I also knew using period correct terminology analogous to “kraut” for the nazis would probably get the comment modded.
As a German-American, I’m deeply offended. Kraut is our word, you can’t use it.
Meh. I get laughingly called an evil ginger or some variant thereof often, because it’s funny and ok because it’s not not politically incorrect. Consequently I respect no limitations on terms placed by other groups, I find them wholly hypocritical. I just knew the J word would probably get my comment removed.
I think he was joking, parodying the whole “n¡gger is our word” meme.
There. I typed it. Neener.
Oh don’t be such a sour kraut. Couldn’t resist.
In a different article on this incident it stated that Mr. Belton was wounded in the leg on Okinawa, which pretty much indicates that he was a Marine. I certainly hope that the two scumbag assholes that felt the need to beat this gentleman to death get to meet SEVERAL of Uncle Sam’s Misguided Children and truly learn what a beat down feels like………….
If they were to end up cooling on a sidewalk or in some dark alley, no sleep will be lost on my part….
Not true. Okinawa had Marine and Army divisions in battle side by side. It was a huge battle that saw the heaviest casualties of the war for the Navy. Off the top of my head I don’tknow if the Marine casaulties were heavier there or on Iwo. Ernie Pyle was killed during the Okinawa campaign.
It’s a myth that the Marines did most of the fighting in the pacific. Macarther led a force comprised mainly of Army troops that island hopped in their own campaign to the Phillipines. And of course the Navy supported both and had their own independent operations.
“Among U.S. casualties, neither the Army nor the Marine death toll exceeded the Navy death toll in the battle for Okinawa.[32]”
Sobering thought.
“TF 56 was the largest force within TF 50 and was built around the 10th Army. The army had two corps under its command, III Amphibious Corps, consisting of 1st and 6th Marine Divisions, and XXIV Corps, consisting of the 7th and 96th Infantry Divisions. The 2nd Marine Division was an afloat reserve, and Tenth Army also controlled the 27th Infantry Division, earmarked as a garrison, and 77th Infantry Divisions. In all, the Army had over 102,000 Army (of these 38,000+ were non-divisional artillery, combat support and HQ troops, with another 9,000 service troops),[11] over 88,000 Marines and 18,000 Navy personnel (mostly Seabees and medical personnel).[12] At the start of Battle of Okinawa 10th Army had 182,821 men under its command.[12]”
The things you learn!
Either way, I hope the two jerkwad orks meet the Reaper and experience the pain they inflicted on this fine veteran……….times ten……..
Fox News is now reporting that Mr. Belton was in the Army on Okinawa………….
I have been reminded AGAIN…………….ASSUMPTION is the mother of all fvckups…………
The island campaigns were relatively short, but terribly brutal, affairs. There were far more American troops killed in the Battle of the Bulge.
Just a bit of perspective.
I don’t know where you are getting your numbers from, but there were about 19,000 US combat deaths during the Battle of the Bulge. There were 12,000 US combat deaths on and around Okinawa and 14,000 in the campaign to retake the Philippines. This is just two Pacific island campaigns out of many.
It saddened me to tears when I read this. Here was a beloved guy that survived being wounded in WWII, and built a good life for himself and was admired and respected in the community, and to die such a useless, senseless, brutal death for no damn good reason makes me extremely mad. I can’t think of a punishment vile and painful enough for the mutants that committed this crime.
What saddens me is that as a probable former marine trained in the use of full auto long arms as well as the old trusty 1911 and having seen combat in the most hellish of environments; that he didn’t have even a pocket .380 let alone that same 1911 on him when these predators attacked.
Yes, it is his own stupid fault for not carrying a weapon.
Geesh!
I wonder when Al Sharpton and his ilk will demand justice for this man? Will Spike Lee give out the addresses of the “alleged” perpetrators, like in the Trayvon Martin case?
I’m not normally a fan of summary judgement, but if they’re caught, it wouldn’t break my heart to hear they fell down a flight of stairs or walked into a door or something.
I’m thinking “head in a vice” a la Casino………….
My mind raced to the Three Stooges and a revolving door!
Concur.
Slippery slope.
With punji stakes at the bottom.
Tie ’em down, cover their eyes, ears and privates with honey and let the ants at ’em.
On national television.
I hope I don’t ever witness something like this happening or I’m going to need a lawyer. This man fought for those scumbags to live in a free country. It’s free alright, free for the wrong people and for the wrong reasons.
Those two should turn themselves in for their own sake, I bet the cops aren’t the only ones looking for them.
KEY POINT:
“You get into that discussion—and I’m hearing endless “debates” over marriage, education, social welfare, religion, violent videogames, etc. in regards to the Oklahoma atrocity—and you miss the point. There will always be evil people. Always.”
PRECISELY!!!
In spite of all evidence to the contrary, some continue to cling to the idea of the inherent “goodness” in all people and regard a very visible manifestation of “evil” to be something “shocking” and something “must be explained” by every other possible reason other than: EVIL EXISTS. IT IS REAL. DEAL WITH IT, OR IGNORE IT, AT YOUR OWN RISK.
I have some historic solutions to evil, but that’s my day job, so I won’t go into them here.
; )
I think a quick review of history will reveal that humankind is inherently evil, not inherently good. It’s up to the minority of good people to go around stomping out the evil ones, and for f#^$’s sake don’t let them get into government!
That’s kind of what I just said…
The way I understand it, Free Will is inherently good, and the only thing that’s inherently evil is the overriding of Free Will.
Many more are good or neutral than evil.
That’s why an armed society works.
On CNN they are reporting that they have made an arrest. I hope to God these little bastards get the chair. And I am a black man so don’t think I’m being prejudice. Wrong is wrong regardless of who did it.
Most recent: http://www.foxnews.com/us/2013/08/23/world-war-ii-veteran-beaten-to-death-by-2-teenagers-in-washington-parking-lot/
Sadly, the likelihood these monsters will get the death penalty in Washington is vanishingly small.
A crime like this is a great argument for bringing back public hangings.
Age discrimination, both thugs are 16. Lets hope they die as victims of prison rape. In the end, GOD will punish them far more than we ever can.
“Vengance is mine,” sayeth the Lord.
“Helpeth the Lord in His work,” say I.
“Vengance is mine,” sayeth the Lord.
“Help the Lord in His work,” sayeth I.”
So, are you saying that your “Lord” is so weak and impotent that he can’t do his job without us piles of quantum billiard balls helping him?
Nah, just that we should go back to less friendly executions.
Lethal injection is fine for a horse with a broken pelvis, but these monsters should scream for a bit. On national television.
That’d be an actual deterrent.
Where’s Al the race-baiter Sharpton on this? Why no outrage? Oh yeah, there’s no money to be made for him with this story…
Mr. Belton was probably illegally following them after they bought some skittles and Arizona…
We will all, I’m sure, soon be seeing massive coverage of this “hate crime” and public rallies and minute-by-minute coverage on all the cable news outlets of the trials.
Or not.
It’s hardly surprising how the usual race baiting suspects including Jackson and Sharpton are silent on these black on white beatings and killings – the baby killed in the stroller in Georgia, the bus beating in Florida, the killing of Chris Lane, and now this WWII veteran’s death at the hands of two black thugs. It doesn’t matter what race the victim is, the race baiters have NOTHING to say if the perps are black.
Oh wait, Jackson did finally say something: “Praying for the family of Chris Lane. This senseless violence is frowned upon and the justice system must prevail,”
“Frowned upon.” That’s it?
Where’s the outrage and rhetoric condemning the senseless violence? Why aren’t these race baiters summoning the black community to participate in suppressing this kind of violence? Guess it doesn’t fit their true message.
Read more: http://www.foxnews.com/us/2013/08/22/rev-jesse-jackson-criticized-over-frowned-upon-tweet/#ixzz2co97CZ00
And why isn’t the NRA all over this, exposing the hypocrisy of these people who want to blame gun owners and self defense laws for the violence committed by these heathens in our society. It’s not the guns, stupid. Guns are just a tool. Death and injury by fists and concussion clearly demonstrate that.
If the anti gun political and media freaks and the race baiters truly wanted to stem the violence and death, they’d go after the true socio-ecenomic sources of these crimes. But they don’t. It’s too hard, and doesn’t satisfy their political message which is designed to agitate and perpetuate control of their power base so they can remain “relevant” and retain political power.
It’s precisely because of the proliferation of these kinds of attacks in all of our communities, especially minority communities, and the lack of an effective effort to address the sources of this kind of violence, that ALL citizens must have the option to defend themselves as necessary. The Second Amendment secures that option.
Again, where’s the NRA’s out spoken outrage about the hypocrisy of this administration and it’s media and race baiting accomplices?
The NRA needs to quit acting like a bunch or old F-ing white guys and vigorously, proactively, go after the people and organizations who are perpetuating the falsehoods and myths that guns are the problem, as opposed to part of the solution.
The more I read of TTAG and its readers’ commentary, the more I get the impression that the NRA isn’t all it’s cracked up to be.
As a practicing Heathen, I respectfully ask you to use another word.
I’d recommend the following: sh¡ts, subhumans, rabid animals, monsters and “angels” -in quotes, of cours.
With all due respect to Father Brown, soe boys ARE bad.
Tragic. My condolences to the Belton family.
They don’t call it “Spo-compton” for nothin’…
When I look at that picture, you know, what can I say, he could have been my Grandfather.
This happened in Washington state? Unless he had a record or other mark on his record he could have carried a gun. He was 88, maybe he felt it was time to hang up his gun.
And just maybe, as was the case with a number of vets I knew, he made the decision to never carry a gun after he came home.
I own guns, but there are certain types I’m not comfortable with because of the memories attached to them. And I quit hunting when I came home. Personal choices which this man may have made for himself also.
Exactly WWI-II/Korea/Nam guy I’ve ever met has their ‘own thing’. Some were the swashbucklers who reveled in it, some put it all in a box and never pulled it out, some were deeply scarred and crushed by the loss of friends, most guys seem somewhere in the middle.
No one leaves the battlefield unchanged.
I’m with you on the BSiveness of “hate” crimes. Why is killing because of a hatred of a race, religion, sexual orientation, etc. any more henious a crime than murder for the old fashioned reasons? However, without pointing out the double standard of our current system, change will never come.
Liberals are going to spin this one as just another instance of “the easy availability of guns” or “evidence of systemic racism driving people into desperation” like they do for every event like this, and conservatives will spin it as “the consequences of Democrat rule” or “socio-economic factors” like they do for every event like this. There is a much stronger correlation between the percentage of blacks in a given area and violence of all stripes. Anyone with two brain cells to rub together knows it, but doesn’t want to appear “racist” – whatever THAT means anymore, these days. Wanna know why VT gets to enjoy hardly any gun laws and hardly any violent crime, or why Chicago and Detroit really are the way they are? All it takes is a peek at the Census data.
I’m a fu¢king card-carrying pays taxes and likes it Liberal, and I advocate slow hanging, or perhaps death by ands.
Guns are great, but far too good an end or these sh¡ts.
“card-carrying liberal…”
Do you mean the kind that wants to steal from the productive to support the freeloaders?
So why don’t you just go ahead and send your whole paycheck to the Da Gubmint™ such that they don’t have to rob the rest of us at gunpoint? Lead by example, and all that?
I’m more in the Jeffersonian mold.
Not owning a grader, scraper et cetera, I’m happy to pay a tithe to the county to keep the roads passable. The state provides some useful services as well, and what’s not to love about GPS, the Internet and a lot of other Federally-sourced goodies?
Government has its place, if only it’d stay the Hell in it.
I’m no “progressive,” although they are my underwriter.
So, no, then. 🙂
Thanks!
Rats. I’ve just formulated a nice elucidation of my response, then apparently hit the “cancel” button instead of “save edits.”
I do know that originally, “liberal” had its roots in “Liberty,” but it got co-opted by the “progressives,” who really aren’t all that progressive. But either the socialists stole the word, or the right-wing statists started using it as a pejorative. Or both.
I have the same sort of knee-jerk reaction to the word “values,” which to me signals a puritanical theocrat.
Bet the farm you won’t hear this story in the mainstream media.
Condolences & sympathies to the Belton family. Thank you for your service to this country, Mr. Belton. May you rest in eternal peace.
Except it’s the headline story on CNN right now?
It would be interesting if a couple of Marines go Semper Fi all over these PUNKs a$$es while in Jail or out. Throw in a few Special Forces and Seals for good measure. They slipped on their soap on a rope and hung themselves. Dang Homie
I think the calling for the DOJ to prosecute this and the OK murder as hate crimes is because we know they won’t and hopefully to shed some light on how ridiculous all this is that race makes a difference in murder when I feel the proper punishment every time should be execution.
Maybe we need a couple of white redneck versions of al and jesse and see how long they can get in front of the cameras every time a black on white crime occurs.
Oh wait, that would be racist, never mind.
Just a few more perfect examples of “Obama’s sons!
Let me suggest a correction: “Obama’s sons™!”
This proves that without guns the criminal element will still use something else.
The government needs to stop fussing about hardware and start concentrating on the criminals.
Oh yea, that’s right, our politicians and most Chief LEOs are afraid of the criminals coming after them.
Local police have taken to referring to motive in killings such as these as “boredom” – when in fact it’s usually part of gang initiations. The truth (that these killings are gang related, and generally inspired by racism) is inconvenient. So the Police blame boredom.
http://themattwalshblog.com/2013/08/22/random-and-bored-new-code-words-for-black-on-white-hate-crimes/
I guess I really do need to carry full time.
Update – they’ve arrested the two youts who brutally beat the old man to death, will likely be tried as adults:
http://www.kxly.com/news/spokane-news/elderly-man-dies-after-being-attacked-outside-ice-arena/-/101214/21574858/-/9flm7iz/-/index.html
OK, my mistake, they have apprehended one, and ID’d the second, but as of right now, he’s still on the run. 16 years old, and going around beating old people to death.
I’m sure that the Justice Department will be launching a federal investigation soon. Because after all, if Obama had a grandfather on his mother’s side, he’d look like Delbert Belton.
Where’s Sharpton’s and Jackson’s outrage over this racist attack?
Yesterday, Jessie Jackson tweeted that the shooting of Christopher Lane
was something that was “frowned upon” so what will he say about this?
Just read that Shorty was beaten to death with police style flashlights, the
ones made out of machined aluminum. It wasn’t a fist fight, or anything of
the kind. It was attempted murder even before Belton died of his injuries.
It should have been a DGU of the day, sure, but aren’t we now in danger
of missing a much bigger, and more important picture? We have teens,
who aren’t even legal adults yet, preying on the weak and the less abled.
Aren’t we way beyond a simple gun rights issue here, when this manner of
senseless, ruthless violence is inflicted on the most vulnerable in society?
We should not all be this eager to hang our gun rights hat on this story.
I think when you’ve achieved 88 years of living, you shouldn’t feel a need
to be carrying a gun. Are we really expecting that our octogenarians should
be able to fend for themselves with a gun. How many 88 year olds do you
know that are able or capable of handling a firearm safely. When once
nimble hands have become 88 years old and arthritic, handling a handgun
should be fairly low on the list of things you think you should be able to do.
Driving is 1st on that list. I doubt if the ability to handle a gun is in the top 10.
I know a few who can, but many more who cannot.
What you say is true, however we must hang gun rights on it.
In an armed society, these sh¡ts would be weeded out pretty quickly – at least for the most part.
Yes, the ugly would still occur – just as it did in any decade in which there have been humans – but it would be an aberration, not the norm.
A healthy bolus of Vitamin G and this would stop. The brazen would die and their followers would get jobs. It’d take a few years, but it is the only way, because there’ll always be evil with access to at least sticks and stones.
The Gods made us in all shapes, sizes and temperaments, but Samuel Colt made us equal in battle. We must not let that legacy die.
Strange that a man in Florida defends himself from a punk brat who attack him Obama weigh in and calls it racism. Two black punks beat a 88 year old WW 2 vet to death he says nothing. What hypocrisy.
Evil isn’t race-based. Neither should be punishment. The eternal punishment will certainly not be; only ONE way out of that one. May God have mercy on our divided nation. And may the cowards who lead our political and media systems stumble and fall.
I’m no big believer in God…but amen.
Gods, I pray thee that sense will come to those with power, and power to those with sense.
So mote it be.
Made me think of this from a long time ago, those who know will get it:
Some say freedom is free
But I tend to disagree
Some say freedom is won
From barrel of a gun
Tell me why, tell me why
Does a soldier have to die
RIP.
On the radio this morning Glenn Beck called for Uncle Sam to pursue the attack as a hate crime, focusing on the assault’s black-on-white aspect in the wake of the recent Oklahoma shooting (where two blacks and a white teen shot an Australian college student). Nonsense . . .
Wouldn’t happen anyways… Only white people are racist and the color of the victim and alleged attackers doesn’t meet the current administration’s racial profile.
The fact that the man known as “Shorty” was beaten to death while defenseless should trigger calls for easy access to armed self-defense for all Americans. As they have here.
Ayoob calls it a disparity of force. Once we have successfully disarmed the old and weak, this will become more and more common.
Regarding this: “states righters spread the lie that the cause isn’t about slavery or racism,” the U.S. is a “republic of republics.” Each state is a sovereign republic. Each state runs its own internal affairs, with no interference allowed by the other states or by the federal government. That is what “State’s Rights” boils down to. The Southern states seceded from the U.S. because they were sick and tired of being crapped on by the Northern states. Like it or not, that’s the truth. As Winston Churchill said about the Truth, “malice distorts it, panic resents it, ignorance derides it, but there it is.”
So why do we have a constitution? Why do we argue about our 2a rights which are federal rights under the constitution? If each state is an independent republic that is free from interference from other states and the feds why do we have a Scotus? Is the final appeal for redress of a grievence for a resident of the state of Texas, Texas, or is it the feds?
The states banded together and formed the federal government to act in behalf of the states in several areas: foreign relations, war, the coining of currency, and the delivery of the mail. All other matters are the responsibility of the states and/or the people. The constitution was created to control the federal government, not to control the states. After Lincoln’s War, the northern states arranged the adoption of the 14th amendment, which applied the constitution’s provisions to the states. The 14th amendment is unconstitutional because of the way it was rammed down the throats of the former Confederate states. The bottom line is the states are not bound to observe the Bill of Rights, given that the 14th amendment is invalid. Each state can do as it wishes. If a man doesn’t like the way his state does things, he is free to vote with his feet and move to another state. Regarding the Supremes, we would do just fine without them legislating through judicial fiat. Lastly, the feds do not have jurisdiction in crime and punishment, the states do. Much of what I have written today describes the way things were, not the way they are. The feds are way out of control now, unfortunately.
I won’t dispute that the feds are way out of control, but any contention that “the states are not bound to observe the Bill of Rights” is absolute crap.
This nation is a united confederation of states. If the states themselves aren’t bound to respect the natural human and individual rights of their residents (as enumerated by the Constitution that binds them together), then there may as well be no protection of rights at all.
Whatever the history and technicalities that seem to favor it, “we’re all free to oppress others in our own way, and you’re free to choose another state if you don’t like it” is not a humane basis for government.
The belief that the federal government is supreme is a supreme piece of crap.
And if his state decides he can’t leave, builds a Berlin wall?
Abraham Lincoln said this in 1858:
“Any people anywhere, being inclined and having the power, have the right to rise up, and shake off the existing government, and form a new one that suits them better. This is a most valuable – a most sacred right – a right, which we hope and believe, is to liberate the world.”
That sounds like the right way to handle such a state.
The South tried to follow his advice. They didn’t have the power but they got a new world for themselves. Wonder what would happen this time? And of course you have to have the support of your fellow citizens. Give you a goal to work towards, Kent.
It is true I am an unreconstructed secessionist. I am rooting for my state to secede from the union. We will see what happens. Where there is life, there is hope. 🙂
You forget the little deal about the original thirteen signing on to the Constitution, and any subsequent entries doing so.
Only Texas retained (among others) the right to secede as a condition of entry.
While the States’ Rights argument has some merit, as any resident of Eastern Kansas can tell you, that war started earlier and was about the Slavery can having been kicked just about as far as it could.
Here’s a counter argument: Any people have a right to rise up, and to ask the help of sympathetic foreign powers.
There you go. Slaves arose, and friendly folks from out of state listened.
No, that’s not quite how it went, but it’s closer than your fiction about the Constitution not applying to the states. What could not continue was the fiction that slaves were neither Americans nor human.
None of which has aught to do with this case, except perhaps that had the South manned up and ended an abomination on their own, or Lincoln lived and implemented a far gentler Reconstruction, or the Confederacy prevailed and the South grown sensible on its own over the next few decades, we’d likely not have our current problems with a vary particular and ugly demographic.
We’ve now let it get so far that there may be no way out. A society actually based upon a moral inversion cannot be cured.
It must be expunged, like the Khmer Rouge or La Familia.
This may not be what you mean, but I think what a lot of people don’t recognize is that the end of the civil war was a very “might makes right” situation. If the use of beating your enemy down and ramming legislation or otherwise down their throats makes you moral and just then Mao, Stalin and Hitler were great guys. Different scale from lincoln perhaps, but same principle.
I did mention “had Lincoln lived.”
His attitude toward the South was that it should be treated as an errant friend ir child, not as a conquered enemy on whom to wreak vengeance.
His successor, however, was not so visionary.
There is no black on white hate crime. That would be racist.
I’ll get my rope.
F’king sickening. This guy grew up during the Great Depression, most likely served in one of the wars, survived to a wise age….. only to meet his end in this manner?!?
I’m sure many things went through Mister Belton’s mind after being wounded on Okinawa 68 years ago. Being beaten and killed by feral animals on American soil probably wasn’t one of them. This is so sad and incredibly disgusting.
Seattle Times / AP update:
http://blogs.seattletimes.com/today/2013/08/arrest-in-attack-that-left-veteran-dead-in-spokane/
“A real man uses fists,” I seem to recall some Grabber asserting.
These creatures HAVE a moral compass. They know what’s right, but they choose to do otherwise.
Having a regular compass doesn’t mean that you only walk northward.
They deserve the worst that first degree murder on the part of “good but misunderstood teens” can possibly garner.
They knew precisely what they were doing. We know precisely what should now be done.
The libtards (democrats) only believe its a hate crime if its white on black. We owe the black community and need to ‘take care’ of them by using the state (Big Gov) to force taxpayers to pay reparations to the victims (blacks). In the name of the children.
The contards make assertions like that above.
White on white hate crime has been prosecuted, as have black on black and black on white.
It is only when the motivating hatred is racial that we pale people get squeamish about non-white on white.
I fully agree that this has to change. While we have earned our misgivings, we have paid and it it time to call a spade a spade.
As to what really happened, we cannot know unless the subhuman sh¡ts are caught and blithely admit to relieving boredom or whatever.
It really doesn’t matter, though. Even in the unlikely event that the victim started some kind of argument – an idea which I do not for a moment entertain – their actions are those of rabid animals.
They should be put down without qualm.
I really wish we had public execution in this country. Slow hanging, without hood or restraint. That’d be an actual deterrent.
Oh, and an armed society to keep things from ever reaching such a state. Ugliness happens, but it would be an aberration rather than the norm were the instigator usually shot before they could do much damage.
These sh¡ts would find another hobby.
I am referring to the libtards in media, academia, etc.., and the race hustlers (almost exclusively liberal) who play the race card like a harp from hell. This is the liberal way, and you know it.
This man was a patriot who fought for our country when we could have lost our country.He deserved to live out his days and pass on in peace as he most likely saw unspeakable things that War produces.These two need to be caught ,prosecuted and sentenced to death.The more armed citizens we have the better.Someone could have possibly come to his aid and saved this beloved veteran and put down the skanks that did this.Now they are free to do it again.So all you flaming liberals out there,go to hell!
Hang those two little pr…xs
On the Civil War you all should read some of Tom DiLorenzo’s work on lincoln, who was probably the first president to completely shred the constitution.
Does anyone find it interesting that the US is the only country that, even assuming the war was about slavery, ended it with a war?
Indeed I do. However, irrespective of who has the moral high ground, all wars end with might makes right else a stalemate.
I think the slow demise of the Constitution started with the Whiskey Rebellion, but what do I know?
Legislation and actions during War Between the States certainly did anticipate the Patriot Act, Guantanamo, war crimes et cetera.
Barbary, example killings, antipersonnel mines, rail and telegraph, aeronautical observers, mass media – the first modern war, with all that that implies.
The War of Northern Aggression,was about unfair taxes by the union against the Southern states,and keeping industry from coming to the South.Ending slavery was just a byproduct of the War.Be prepared and ready.Keep your powder dry.
I work at a “Fab” shop, that does machining on one side and welding on the other. (I’ve been known to quip, “on one side of the shop, they take big pieces of metal and cut them up to make little pieces of metal, and oh the other side, they take little pieces of metal and stick them together and make big pieces of metal” nobody’s laughed yet.) The other day, they were scrapping out about 50 pounds of fist-sized chunks of aluminum. I told the machinist, “We should be saving those metal scraps – one of these days they’re going to be money.”
I laughed.
A few weeks ago I was installing an alarm in a home in the county seat, and had to use a star drill and hammer to make a passage for a section of conduit through a stone wall.
As I was banging away, I couldn’t help thinking that I was making little ones out of big ones in Leavenworth.
Thank you very much. 🙂
Silly me. I’ve left out the best part: According to Keynesian economics coupled with the parable of the broken window, we could just keep schlepping metal back and forth from one side of the shop to the other, cutting and welding, welding and cutting, and money would fall from the sky.
Wow. That’s a scary boil-down, and while it is reductio ad absurdum, it has merit.
Yikes.
Where are Jesse and Al now,oops wrong color,also no money in defending a white man.Also what about Boobama and his could’ve been his son?Well this white man could’ve been his grandfather!And black folks always want to say that white folks are the racist ones,BS I know more black folks who are racist than I know white folks who are racist so don’t piss down my back and tell me it’s raining!Be prepared and ready.Keep your powder dry.
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