MasterPiece Arms New DS9 Hybrid Pistol Race Gun

1. That is one ugly gun!

   • Expensive too

   • Nah. Beauty is in the eye of the beholder.
     I think they are sexy looking speedsters.

     Variety is the spice of life!

   • But at least it “includes no forgings”! /s

   • There’s a market for everything, so if someone wants to make it, and someone else likes it enough to shell out $3K for it, then commerce flourishes. I say thumbs up for providing variety to POTG.

     It is a bit too “space ray gun” for my personal taste, tho. 😉

2. Something I’ve been wondering. What are the cuts in the slide for? I’ve seen them on other pistols too. Do they serve a purpose, or someone’s idea of making the pistol look good?

   • Faster slide cycling, reduced recoil, change in weight distribution are the performance claims.

     • Central, I still don’t get it. Faster cycling could be accomplished with a lighter spring. Reduced recoil really puzzles me. Removing weight has always resulted in more recoil. At least in my experience. Redistribution of weight? Okaaay… Again, in my experience muzzle weight has always meant more stability and less muzzle flip. That always translated into more accurate shooting and faster recovery between shots. If that’s the reasoning I’m putting my money on cool factor. When I was in the army we called it “eye wash.” Looks good. Doesn’t do anything. Except I don’t even think it looks good.

       • Besides, it’s only 9mm. How much recoil can there be?

       • When they say “reduced recoil” mostly what they mean is “reduced muzzle flip” which is the result of less weight reciprocating as the slide does its business. This is usually done in combination with tuning the spring and moving weight down into the frame. The gun is then bottom heavy and has less mass that moves when the gun cycles. In some cases the frame has been made even heavier than the metal that was removed from the slide so the gun really does have a slightly reduced recoil impulse too.

         Overall the concept is a gun that you can run faster because it has more tendency to come straight back at you. You don’t get as much muzzle flip when the slide moves backwards or as much dip from the slide going back into battery so the gun stays flatter relative to you meaning less time spent realigning sights to the target. Just one less thing to fight in terms of getting the next shot off with the maximum speed and accuracy.

         IMHO it doesn’t much matter until you get to the very, very top end of competition where you might run into situations where a few millimeters or hundredths of a second may become the difference between winning and losing. In that regard it’s somewhat like the idea of using a Titanium firing pin in competition rifles.

       • All good points. Supposedly the theory is the reduced slide mass will result in faster cycle time and less weight being thrown back and therefore less recoil. I think most of it would be negligible and makes for an appearance that isn’t my cup of tea. If I had 3G’s i’d be buying the Nighthawk custom Colt series 70, which is my cup of tea.

       • In every industry there’s some niche market that makes certain claims but really can’t back it up. Suckers, money, somebody pays, and someone gets rich off the gullible masses. Its like people trying to trick out cars or stereo systems. I don’t get it but to each their own I guess.

       • Strych9, I don’t know. As I said, more muzzle weight always resulted in a more stable sight picture and less muzzle flip. (Witness the weights on bulls eye/Olympic competitors.) Although, the most important factor in reduced muzzle flip is a low bore axis. That’s where a pistol like the P7 shines. It’s also the reasoning behind the straight line recoil in most modern military rifles. No, I think I’m sticking with eye wash.

       • I get what you’re saying about competition. Back when I was shooting them I won and lost on those fractions of a second. I just don’t see those (not so) cool cuts making a difference. But, hey! It’s not my money they’re spending. So, if it makes them feel better…

       • Some of it *might* (LOL) be marketing.

         Realistically, if you run the physics calculations on the slide as part of the gun it will make a difference because there is less weight reciprocating and there is more weight that remains stationary. It literally cannot not make a difference in terms of the physics. But that’s on paper.

         Does it make a difference that’s noticeable to you is the real question (followed by is that difference worth the price tag?). For the most part I suspect not, though if you shoot one you’ll probably say “Damn, this is a fine gun”. However, for the top 1% of 1% of 1% it almost certainly does make a difference because it’s meant for people where you’re getting to the point where nearly any “edge” makes a difference. For those at the very apex of skill this will make a difference. For everyone else it’s an attempt to “buy skill”. This is common with gun accessories, particularly triggers IMHO.

         But really, you see this in nearly every area where there’s a competitive streak of any kind. The very tippity-top-cream-of-the-crop start looking for an edge over the other people at their level and they find it in things like this. But we’re dealing with the final, like, 1-3% of the Pareto principle here. The problem is that someone had to go through all the rigamorall to actually make that object. Making that thing cost money and probably a fair chunk of it due to the specialized nature of the thing in question, and so now they try to sell that object as much as they can. Usually they do this by advertising it in a manner that suggests that “You can be just like your idols if you just buy product X! It’s basically Jerry Miculek’s finger in a drop-in package, buy yours today!”.

         Sort of like an *cough* acquaintance *cough* of mine. He’s that guy at the range who will tell you that a Magpul foregrip is idiotic because it’s plastic. He’ll explain in great detail how you want metal because the plastic might break if you muzzle-strike someone… *facepalm* I’m sure he does that on the regular, right? I mean who doesn’t? Personally, I throw wicked muzzle strikes on someone in CQB at least five times a day!

         Really, you see this all over the place. I’ve got well over a grand worth of extra specialized shit on my dive rig that gets Open Water Divers moist as fuck. They WANT that stuff. Gotta look PRO AF (and it does look savage, I have to admit that). Obviously the pros have it so it must be the bee’s knees, right? They don’t really like having it explained to them that it’s a useless upgrade to them because it’s specialized for a subset of skills that they don’t have and then it’s specialized for my personal use, which is the reason why I’m here getting paid and they’re here paying me. It’s funny that they don’t do this with the videographers… but these people will also tell you other things that make zero sense, like about wet/drysuit colors or pony bottles. I mean, sometimes the base logic is there but it’s been amplified enormously by hype or by what some idiot at a shop told them. Half of them want that Zeagle Ranger BCD just for that faux Ranger tab on the left shoulder. Advertising works.

         Back to the gun… Yeah, it probably works as advertised but, realistically, at the price point for this gun it makes sense for a certain very, very, very small group of people. Virtually everyone else would be better off putting the money into ammo and hitting the range. But they don’t feel that way and it’s their money so… whatever. Fools, money, parted.

       • Strych9, I understand exactly what you mean. When my ex was in university she had a physics problem. She couldn’t solve it. It involved a Browning belt fed machine gun firing a three round burst of 150 gr. rounds of the energy expended. It involved weight of the weapon, velocity of projectiles, etc. I took a look at her equations and told her you failed to calculate the energy of the recoil, multiply it times three and subtract it from the total energy expended. She said, “That can’t be enough to make a difference.” It was. It solved the equation. Another time she had a problem with trajectory of mortars. Solved that one for her too. Guess all that infantry time in the field paid off for someone.

         I also get what you mean about dive gear. The first time I walked into a dive shop and saw a Ranger tab on a BC I laughed. It was immediately off my list of gear to buy. Always used Scuba Pro. I gave up diving a few years ago. One too many body recovery. I never had more grim duty.

   • What CV said. This here is a competition/race gun so you’re correct in that you want the gun to be heavy. You just don’t want that weight moving back & forth (the slide). So lighten the slide (which moves) and add a full frame/dust cover with rails (which doesn’t move & adds weight).

   • Go learn some actual physics and then go see the benefit of the reduced reciprocating mass.

     Stop the fudd science.

     • RD, when will you guys quit running to the FUDD excuse everytime someone disagrees with your plastic firearms are the only viable weapons today. Or, those that look like they came from a Sci-Fi movie. Or a video game. I base my opinions on decades of carrying a firearm on the street. 25 of them professionally. At least that many as an instructor. The majority of them competing in matches that were realistic. Even before IDPA was a thing. Street guns. Concealed street leather. On realistic courses. One match I shot consisted of drawing from concealment and firing one shot. Done. I also took thousands of hours of training because I recognized I didn’t know everything. Still don’t. Some of that training I took to heart. Some didn’t work for me. I gleaned what I could use. Now what are your personal quals for your opinion.

       BTW, that FUDD physics class? She was taking it at a four year university. One of the best three in Florida. She graduated Suma Cum Laude. Or whatever that crap is 3.9 GPA if I remember correctly. You were educated where?

       • right? because you can’t coach sports if you never played an inning or a down in your life, right?
         here’s a clue: it’s a form of logical fallacy.
         gadsden flag yourself.

   • GF, the only thing I can tell is it let’s the barrel cool faster, well and more dirt and shit in the gunm.

   • Don’t bother with the egg heads.

     Modern sissy men think 9mm have heavy recoil now and need all the help they can get, due to their poor nourishment, degenerative muscles, and weak skeletons. Even shooting anything above 9mm or 5.56 in their presence makes them jump.

     If you’ve noticed, this is causing them to start leaning towards smaller calibers like .380, claiming the “harsh recoil” and “heavy weight” of a 9mm is just too much. And that .380 is “just as good” as 9mm.

     I’m mostly joking… but not entirely. While I’m glad the younger generation has embraced shooting semi autos, I have been amused by the amount of times I’m asked at a range:

     “Oh my god what is that?”, or “Damn that’s loud!” or “Whoa man is that .338 lapua!?” …

     When I’m just shooting not so old war horses like regular 30-06, .44 mag, or surplus WW2 stuff. They seem to be in awe that at one time men shot such “large” calibers regularly.

     • it’s not about 9mm having so much recoil.
       If you can have LESS recoil than a competitor, you want it.
       People who are competing are fighting for 10ths of seconds.

       Your argument is similar to “why do race cars have wings. I don’t understand so therefore they’re stupid.”

   • @ strych9 / Gadsden Flag / tsbhoa.p.jr….you boys peaked my interest mentioning the RANGER tab, had to watch the Zeagle Ranger BCD video…..oh boy it’s got seven stainless steel D rings, LMF’nAO

     • and it has bullet compensation drop.

3. I think it’s pretty sexy.

   *Sees price

   Something something inflation.

   • This is actually a decent price for what you’re getting here – similar guns are $4-5k from some manufacturers.

4. For some reason, when I see this I can’t help but think “Gary the Glock in drag?!”

5. does that 3″x6″ plate on the magazine make it easier to remove under stress?

   re: “ranger” tab (above). i had a down vest in high school that had snaps that said “face the north” on them (as far as i knew). the first well heeled kid that heard me say that laughed pretty hard. it was quality; stolen from a tavern at broadway and granville.
   but that company figured out to put their logo on the rear shoulder so it’s always glaring at me when i’m subjected to a queue. brilliant, and the reason i wouldn’t be caught dead in one. i am far from their targeted demographic however.

   i like the race gun, sorta spiffy.

6. I’m a little skeptical. Weren’t these guys making crappy MAC10 clones just a few years ago? You know, the ones you’d find in those city gun shops cable-tied to the counter next to the Hi-Point with $100 bill hydrodip finish?

   But $3k for a top end factory comp gun is nowhere near overpriced. Is it a top end gun? That’s the question.

   • Yes. They have since been trying to turn into a more, I guess you could say mature or advanced firearms company. I believe they even submitted a pretty decent prototype for the army SMG trials. Didn’t win but gave it a good try.

7. I have the most bestest 1911 in the world, but its .45acp. It don’t look like the most bestest until you shoot it.

8. That’s a SVI knock-off! Either they copied every little detail or bought all the parts from SVI! Don’t understand how they can call it a masterpiece when they designed absolutely nothing and just through some parts together!

9. This is actually a decent price for what you’re getting here – similar guns are $4-5k from some manufacturers.

10. Gimmick gun……keep it!

11. I want to see accuracy charts with different ranges and manufacturers. A given would be match ammo for the charts. Competitions would be rounds tuned to the gun and operator. Price good or bad is determined by accuracy.

12. Might be a good way to get into competitive shooting… bragging rights… conspicuous consumerism.

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