The New York Times weighs in, once again, on gun laws:
There are a lot of lawmakers prepared to say almost anything, no matter how nutty, in their role as worker bees for the National Rifle Association. But it was sort of surprising that the lead ranter was from Florida.
They’re referring to this:
“I hope we do not forget the pain and anguish and sense of loss felt by those all over the country who have been the victims of violence at the hands of illegal aliens,” said Representative Matt Gaetz, a Florida Republican who read a short list of people who had been shot by undocumented immigrants. Better background checks, he contended, “would not have stopped many of the circumstances I raised, but a wall, a barrier on the southern border may have, and that’s what we’re fighting for.”
And they go on to add this re: gun control:
Sigh. All you can do is keep on trying. It may not make the laws any better, but at least it’ll remind the public that some people in power are worried.
– Gail Collins for New York Times, Surprise! It’s Not Guns, it’s the…
If the Left only realized that Negotiating Rights Away,has been a ally in the infringement of the 2 nd. amendment,since 1934 and signed off on the infringements to it.
Well, well, you forgot to paste your idiotic list…
Why don’t you run for Congress and show them how it’s done, particularly when the political pendellumn is swung to the far left as it’s been many times.
You still never explain how “not compromising” when it’s all you have at the time to stay in the game would’ve benefitted the rights of all Americans, particularly the 2A rights.
So what would you have done?
Taking up guns and storming the Capital?
Assassination of duly elected officials who disagree with your opinions?
Perhaps taking out some SCOTUS members or other judicial appointees?
How about taking on the local cops- they seem to be particularly hated around here by some of the lurkers.
I’ve got it!!! Just stand there in your basement with your arms folded and claim you have the right to this or that and ain’t nobody’s a-gonna do anathin’ bout it, at least until you leave your home or someone gets wise to you.
For once- put up what YOU would’ve done in 1934. How would you have marshalled the support for what you claim was given away. Hell- just put forth your plan for the 1992-93 Clinton-era crap that’s all but neutered today. Or the FOPA in ’86. What would YOU and your proponents have done? You/they were there at the time it would seem. They don’t appear to have had any real effectiveness, then or now.
What ever you and your “pals” do, DON’T join up with NRA- we don’t need you, and your type isn’t smart enough to realize that if you really want to change something this large you need to do it from with-in. That’s what’s happening to the country, isn’t it? Of course you’re entitled to your opinion but don’t expect it to go unanswered.
It’s so easy to stand around and point fingers. Actually doing something constructive takes some real thought and effort. Your anti-NRA rants may make you feel good inside but that’s about their only effect on the big picture.
Geez, could you even TRY to sane up a little?
Oh look, newfag thinks we should all grab out ankles and bend over the the Demokkkommies.
Spot on Craig. NRA ain’t great right now but there’s nothing they would or could have done in ’34 because they weren’t political until after ’68.
Not until after the 1971 Cinncinatti Annual Meetings, actually.
Still- why don’t some of the NRA trashers put up or shut up-
Tell us your plan, what you’d have done then, what you will do today. (Burying your guns doesn’t count.)
Easy to make one-liners and to critique endlessly but IME most of those types couldn’t even name their state rep or senator, perhaps not even their US rep or House district. But they know they have a right to keep and bear arms, probably because some other Gomer told ’em so.
Offer your no compromise plan, pals. Explain how you’ll fund it, who will lead it.
Yeah- I thought so.
And THANKS for the Edit button, Dan!
NRA all the way.semper fi Maga.God bless America again
Ahem.
1. “I think it’s the shoulder thing that goes up.”
2. “30 magazine clip in half a second.”
3. “The number of these high capacity magazines is going to decrease dramatically over time because the bullets will have been shot”
4. “If it saves even one life.”
* Even if it means even more lives lost or destroyed by non-gun violence, who cares?!? At least it’s not gun violence.”
I know that I’d much rather be blown up or run over in explosive or truck violence. People dead of truck and explosive violence aren’t AS dead as those killed by gun violence, you know…
And they dare to say that it’s the NRA that makes people say crazy things. Oh, well. Soon all these crazies will kill each other off, with rocks and bats and pointy sticks, and leave the planet to those of us who do know how to be at least a bit sane.
I’m willing to bet that being killed by a pointy stick will make them every bit as dead as a gun will. Sticks killed a LOT of people, back when we called them spears.
I recently looked up statistics on weapons used in murders. In 2017 there were 403 murders using a rifle (any kind) and 696 murders using nothing more than the human body (hands, feet, elbows, knees, etc.). But to them, it’s rifles that are the real threat.
What’s unsaid is that most of the time, a firearm is only a threat to those who create a threatening situation, such as attempted assault, murder, theft, rape, etc. It makes me what kind of threat these gun grabbers are intending to create that they’re afraid that guns will be used against them because free people are defending themselves.
“30 magazine clip in half a second.”
No about 2.5 with a slide fire, but it’s not a machine gun 🙂
30 rounds with only the first one on target.
I know you think a slide fire is somehow comparable to a SAW M249. if only you could convince the pentagon they’ve been wasting all our tax dollars on belt fed and interchangeable barrels, when all they needed was a plastic sliding stock. Of course the sliding stock has no effect on accuracy. Go ahead and link the YouTube videos again so everyone can see how they don’t actually show the targets, probably because the super focused high power elephant gun .223 obliterated them into nothingness.
And then all the crimes perpetrated by bump stock owners. And we for sure know the idiot had a higher body count because the “alleged” slide fire, evidence of bolt action rifles to the contrary.
FYI the Flightline MCR upper was in contention for replacing the M249. Because it can be added to a typical AR-15 lower, when combined with a slide-fire it can easily match the performance of the M249 when fired from a stationary location with a bi-pod.
The is a reason the NRA is scared shitless of them
And on a final note a AR-15 (full auto or slidefire) fired from a bi-pod can match the M249 for about 300 rounds (3 100 round mags) before the heat issue pops up. Part of the reason the Marines are looking a ditching the SAWs. Vegas, the heat was mitigated by using a dozen rifles.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=uQ777a64tK8
And yes the side fire is a kludge. Doesn’t mean that they don’t work. The only reason they they exist is because they figured out about 90 years ago some idiot will turn a light machine gun on a crowd if there are a lot of them out in public.
And yet completely inaccurate. The “Valentine’s Day Massacre” that led to the NFA was NOT just some guy turning a full auto on a crowd. That’s today’s crazy citidiots. It was one drug gang(the drug was alcohol back then) killing off their competition.
Look it up in the history books and see for yourself.
What’s a factor of five between friends, right?
An then us pro-gun show people firing AR-15 with 2 second splits claiming that they are not at all like a machine gun when anyone with any skill can get off 200-300 RPM. All sides lie and all sides are misinformed.
“There are a lot of lawmakers prepared to say almost anything, no matter how nutty, in their role as Politicians.”
FIFY
At least we don’t have Nancy and Chuck as our patron saints.
That’s right. You’ve just got that Goofy, Lying, Commie Trump and his Guilty crew to back you up.
Way to go Dump, I mean Trump!!!!!!!!!!
You mean the President responsible for the best economy since the 1940s? The one who has kept or tried to keep every campaign promise he has made?
You Demokkkommies are endlessly amusing. Thanks to you cretins running open communists and gun grabbers, Trump and the GOP are going to sweep 2020. I’m going to enjoy watching you clowns go into another cycle of nervous breakdowns.
Now, there’s what you call Bullshit!!
So, you’re saying you believe the Dumpocrats will eliminate air travel in 10 years? And you imagine (I can’t bring myself to use the word “think” when referring to you) that would be a good idea? But you criticize others? Wow, that sounds like the definition of “derp”.
Guilty of what again exactly? Hurting your feelings? Not being perfect? What?
Guilty of what again exactly?
Don’t you read the papers? How many of his crew found guilty of lying to Congress, the American people, etc., etc., etc. He’ll become Putin’s (VP) soon enough. Trump and his crew will be in prison soon enough. Get with it man!!!
Procedural crimes are not crimes. Congress has no authority to “investigate” anything. Separation of powers much commie? Lying to Congress is not a crime as they have no authority to compel testimony. They are not a court. They are not law enforcement.
@jram, go reread the indictments. Then grow a few more brain cells.
@Kroglikepie
1. Paul Manefort: 20 counts of financial crimes, lying to Congress, under investigation for Obstruction of Justice…
2. The Russian guy Kilimnik: charged with witness tampering.
3. Little Rickey Gates: False statement and, conspiracy charges.
4. Mikie (Lock ‘em up) Flynn:Guilty for false statements to FBI.
5. Dickey Pinedo: Guilty on IOD Theft, in “ca-hootz” with the Russians and I believe he’s now serving at least 6 months in prison, should be at least 6 years.
6. How about Rick Gates’ buddy (What’s his name) van der Zwaan the English attorney for false statements.
7. Mike Cohen: Tax & bank charges, hush money, lying to Congress, campaign finance violations, etc.
8. Roger Stone: Lying to Congress, witness tampering.
9. Sammy Patten: Foreign Agent working with the Ukrain Politicos.
10. George(-I think) Papadopoulos: False statements, connections with 2 Russian Nationals.
These are only a few of Trump’s corrupt Cronies and there all trying to make a deal with Mueller’s group to reduce their sentencing. They deserve a hell of lot more time than they’ll probably receive. Mueller is being too kind to these creeps. I’m not even mentioning his West Wing Staff, his Oval Office Staff, etc. That’s why, in using Trumps’ pronouns “they” and “everybody” knows Trumps’ people always lie, because they all think that’s the right thing TO DO. Their little minds have been poisoned by Trumps’ thinking that lying is OK but, just don’t lie to Trump.
And you ask? Guilty of what again exactly? Hurting your feelings? Not being perfect? What?
Get “agoin” kid.
Alot of these people have only been accused not tried and found guilty.just because you have your nose up blasey-fords the liars skirt doesn’t make it so Mueller’s got nothing on trump.accusations and allegations are not proof.but I have found people like you will fall for anything.alas it’s really hard to fix stupidity MAGA
“Congress has no authority to “investigate” anything…”
Eh? Congress’s authority to investigate is, in large part, how separation of powers is maintained. Congress checks the executive. The founding of the country was in response to a monarch seen as being too powerful over the legislature.
@jram, perhaps you misread my comment, or are just an idiot. Go reread the indictments, most of which have NOTHING to do with Trump. Then go look up the word ‘context’ and see how you lack all understanding of it. Mueller is not being ‘too kind’ when he sends a SWAT team to arrest an old man.
Also, since you obviously have no idea how grand juries work, you lack any understanding that the length of time taken to reach these indictments with one is not a good sign for Mueller.
Kroglikepie;
Another stupid ass remark you sound just like a” jag” and I don’t mean a Marine-Jag.
These goofs have everything (indirectly) to do with the Dumpster. The GOP can’t investigate some of these goofs, because they are not allowed to; however; they can be investigated by the Mueller group. The Mueller group can take as long as they want. Remember Watergate? Took four years to complete their investigations. What happened then? Once the Committee got the goods on Nixon, who always said, “I am not a crook” had to resign his Presidency, but then got a damn Federal Pardon from Ford.
In the Dumpster’s case, if he remains in Office and the impeachment process starts, he’ll probably delay whatever should happen him for as long as he can or resign so his buddy “Yes-Sir Dense” can offer him a Federal Pardon. But now the various States where he’s scammed individuals and Companies will get on his Ass and sue him for recovery.
One would think that with all the money-laundering, real estate scams, phony donations and whatever else this Commie President has done and got away with he’d be satisfied. He had the world buy the Ass and had it made, Crooked as he is, he still wanted and wants more. It’s nothing but Greed. It’s all about Money for that creep.
It’ll take time, but the investigations on him will continue and either he’s impeached, resigns or whatever happens to this creep, I hope he will be financially ruined, by way of fines, lawyer fees, law-suites, pay-offs and God knows what-ever else they could find on him. He’ll probably have to sneak out of the Country (pretty doubtful) and go play with Putin.
If he doesn’t leave the country, I hope to Hell they put him in an Orange suit, hand-cuff him behind his back and listen to him mutter to him-self while he’s walking to his cell, “I am not a crook”, “I am not a crook”, “I am not a crook”, to meet the rest of his “Red-Winged Troll Advisors” who probably will say to him, “What the Hell took you so long”.
I sure do hope he doesn’t step on his 4 foot long RED tie and choke himself on his way to his cell. Uh, would that be a bad thing? Hmmmm, maybe not.
Have fun Trump!!!!!!!!!!
@jram
So, which is more difficult for you: reading, or living in reality? You sound unhinged and should seek psychiatric help immediately.
What Nixon did, and what Trump is baselessly accused off are not even in the same legal universe. The GOP is not prohibited from investigating anything. Not even sure where ypu made that one up from.
BTW, Nixon resigned to avoid an impeachment, not because he was forced to. I see basic history also escapes your grasp…
Kroglivepie;
Cohen, Manafort, Stone.et al…
Oh!!!!!!Oh!!!!! –Orange jumpsuits???????? – Oh!!!!!!Oh!!!!!
GS650G: AMEN.
I’m still undecided if I’ll re-up my NRA membership. Goofball statements like this make me lean toward “yea”…
I’ve said this before, in my opinion, it’s worth being an NRA member if for no other reason than the NRA makes liberals apoplectic. I won’t get into the good and bad things the NRA has done. Others have done that already and will do it in this thread as well. I’ll continue as a member because that little sticker that goes on my truck is the equivalent of a middle finger to the left.
I keep my NRA membership so I can maintain voting rights to bullet vote for people like Adam Kraut, that actually want to change the way the NRA operates. As far as additional funds, they go to SAF or state level gun rights organizations.
“I keep my NRA membership so I can maintain voting rights to bullet vote for people like Adam Kraut”
Quoted for truth
I heard only 7% of NRA voters actually voted last year yet the good guys can’t get on the board. Hmm… Sounds like NRA members don’t really give a fuck about changing the direction of the NRA, maybe they are happy with how things have been.
That’s a pretty good reason, probably the best reason.
The left akways wants to boycot, starve, strangle and dismember things they don’t like…. Israel, Chick fil A, NRA, babies…..
And coddle illegal aliens for the votes and dilution of American neighborhoods.
There’s little difference between the U.S. leftists of today and the Russian Bolsheviks of 100 years ago. The left is aiming for a two class totalitarian system of elite rulers and smurffs.
Back to the good old days of Europe.
One has to wonder if they think the ‘Green New Deal’ is nutty. They probably think that eliminating cars and airplanes and anything else that runs on fossil fuels in the next ten years and replacing it all with trains and windmills and paying for it all by printing up trillions of dollars makes a lot of sense. To them, the government guaranteeing a living wage to anyone unable or unwilling to work and taxing ‘the rich’ at 90% probably sounds like a stroke of genius.
To be fair it’s 12 years in the plan. I guess that means it’s right up until Doomsday.
Also, you forgot “retrofitting” every building I. The country other than two (two buildings in the US are 5 Star Efficient) . Which basically means demolishing nearly every building and rebuilding it to be 5 Star Energy Effiecent.
It’s really gonna piss off the Historical Societies but progress.
Nah, the master plan is 10 years, you’re confusing the fact the world is gonna end in 12 years.
I’m pretty sure that the FAQ that “didn’t say people unwilling to work” noted this at 12 years as the goal for buildings, electrical generation and pretty much everything else other than aircraft and farting cows.
Not that two years matters.
strych, it did say ‘unwilling to work’ until it was exposed and lambasted and then they scrubbed that part.
The Gov. is right. Before it was ‘revised’ it had “those unwilling to work” in it.
But that’s Leftist ‘compassion’ for you. No one should be forced to do anything, except what Leftists force people to do.
Oh, and by eliminating air travel, that effectively isolates the continents. Since fossil fuels will be no more, ships will have to be outfitted with giant LiPo battery packs, I suppose, or they can install giant Dewar flasks that take up a large volume of the hull and power them with liquid H2…
Sails, Geoff. The future of oceanic shipping is sails. Wind power uber alles!
I’m aware that it said it would cover those unwilling to work. Hence the use of “…” around the phrase “didn’t…”.
Yes, rebuilding every building in the country. AND!!! don’t forget killing all the cows so they can’t fart anymore! Brilliant! Farms are supposed to be carbon free in 10 years, but I’m guessing their forgetting to deduct all the carbon that gets absorbed by all those green plants.
Doh! I forgot free college for everybody.
Hey, Gov, tell me why tax the rich at 90% (or any %) if all you gotta do is print the money? Think it might be class envy? If so, still, why not print everybody a few billion? It’s working in Venezuela, right?
Because rich people are evil and need to be punished. Except for Steve Jobs, but he’s dead now so he doesn’t count. Even the Starbucks guy is persona non grata in the Commicrat Party now.
A lot of people support the idea of taxing the rich more, that includes many Republicans.
Registered Republicans don’t want to give up their welfare/socialist state. They want “their” big money military funded by inflation and loans to go on endless wars. They want their government health care scheme. They want their social security scheme. They want tax payer funded sports stadiums for their local teams. They want a militarized police state to do drug raids, to deal with illegal immigration issues, etc. They want government hand outs for farmers. They want government protections (in various forms) against international competition. These things cost trillions of dollars; money America does not have.
Modern day Americans love socialism. They want socialism of their variety, not to put an end to socialism in America. It’s now a fight over the loot. This didn’t sprout out of nowhere, it’s been growing underneath the pavement for a very long time, it’s now breaking through the cracks.
This independent, free market, liberty loving country you think America is died a long time ago. That country is just words on a piece of paper or simply a concept in some people’s head.
By the way, France is still protesting their corrupt government. It’s been months since the French government’s global warming policy started a revolt. You don’t really hear about it on American TV because they don’t want to inspire Americans to join together despite their differences and stand up to their corrupt government like the French are. Instead America is talking about pushing for a Green Deal (following the footsteps of the New Deal, which was an expansion of socialism/communism) and arguing about how the pretty lady (according to Republican males) is so dumb for pushing her controllers policies.
At this rate we have much more BS to experience before things have a possibility of changing, especially if another dumbass wins in 2020. We will probably end up with Kamala Harris or Trump as President. Look how stupid Virginia is with their top 3 being so problematic yet black Americans and Democrats don’t care because they got a big D before their name. Same applies to Trump with his fanboys.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=AgTn4ZM-i3o
I don’t care how right the protesters in Paris are. I’m not putting on one of those stupid yellow jackets unless it comes with working wings and a serious stinger loaded with nerve toxin.
The Polish Genocide supporting New York Times is, for once, correct. Look at all the allegedly pro-2A people that say things like “full auto isn’t needed” or “red flag laws are OK” because the NRA said so.
These “Red Flag Laws” offer a bit of a conundrum. On the one hand, there are, and have been literally thousands of posters on this site alone pointing out how many opportunities various LE and judicial entities had to stop mass shooting events all around the country due to Facebook and other social media postings; other threats perceived and actual; and fracases with mental health officials.
On the other hand, when persons in control try to take action against someone that “we’d” point out as nuts afterwards, the same people cry foul. I’m no proponent of any government infringing into my private life even as much as they already have but rather than bitch and complain, it would seem smarter to offer some suggestions from our vantage point. Perhaps encouraging POTG to just stay off social media and think before they post some incredibly stupid notions would be a good start. Not the end game, just a start.
I have to believe there are many around here who would’ve thought it wholly intrusive for someone with legal authority to intervene on Paddock, Cruz, Lanza, or any of a number of mass murderers who seemed to provide fair warning long before they first pressed the trigger. We’re the ones who should come up with, or at least offer some solutions beyond our own self-defense. If not, or if at least if we are not in the conversation beyond decrying “someone else’s efforts”, we will certainly be the losers.
Where both sides can agree is that we want mass shootings to stop. Build from there.
If someone is dangerous enough to “take their* guns” (or kill them in the process), they’re dangerous enough to remove from society, most likely via involuntary commitment to a mental hospital. That the only thing they do is to take guns means that these bills are anti-gun, and thus a violation of the 2nd Amendment. In fact, this is actual low-level, boil-the-frog confiscation.
That the NRA supports this idea puts them on the anti-2A side. With friends like that, who needs enemies?
(* And not even the guns of the person who’s dangerous. There has already been at least one case of someone else’s guns being taken because of threats by an individual who didn’t even live with the person who’s firearms were stolen.)
If you are directing your comments at me you might notice I never said a thing about taking away someone’s firearms…
@Craig
No you didn’t did say anything about taking away firearms, just “red flag laws”. My point is simple: That is what those “red flag laws” do. That’s all they do. That is why they are bad.
If they were focused on addressing behavior and/or mental illness then that would be an entirely different kettle of fish, something that I think most gun owners would be willing to support if the details are appropriate.
As it stands, they are a gun grab in the guise of addressing behavior and/or mental illness. That is why I cannot agree to the NRA’s support of them.
“That is what those “red flag laws” do. That’s all they do. That is why they are bad.”
No, they don’t have to be bad but so long as all a large number of people on this side won’t join in the conversation, that’s about all anyone inside the beltway will come up with. Spend money, do something quick- good intentions and all that. It wouldn’t be too difficult to change the direction of this and keep focus within the bounds of a person’s 1st, 2nd, 4th, 5th and 6th Amendment rights.
Again, many gun owners here and elsewhere were jumping on the “everyone knew but no one did anything” bandwagon with Cruz, et al. Now what? Just continue to bitch to the “government”, or to each other? We can do better than that, and we can change the direction from a one-size-fits-all mandate to a more specific focus. Something will be done, like it or not, GOA/NAGR “no compromise” or not. It’d be smart to join the game.
Anti-NRA Leftist trolls are out in force today.
Meanwhile NRA is busy doing this:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=8sugIjL5PtU
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=UTJVGPfxt6Y
I think what we need to do is clean the swamp, so to say. By that, I mean primary all the incumbents that are clearly crazy, power hungry, or just anti-American/anti-freedom. You know the ones, they make bold promises when they are not in power, and do nothing when they have it.
And the wild and crazy promises are out in force at the moment, although their chances of maintaining the power they have *now* beyond 2020 are close to zero.
“Sigh. All you can do is keep on trying. It may not make the laws any better, but at least it’ll remind the public that some people in power are worried.”
Name one thing you can do with a gun to harm someone that is not already illegal.
Oh, there isn’t anything. Now, explain how a new law is going to change something,
Don’t worry Florida will expand their gun confiscation orders. Give them a millimeter, they take…
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Nr-fVPaoKNI
I am unclear what Opposite of Opposite the Editorial(*), there is trying to mean…
– A membership organization shouldn’t represent its members?
– Representatives shouldn’t represent their constituents? At least not deplorable, Red State reps.
– Shockingly, politicians respond to interest groups?
– People who know anything about guns, gun owners, or violence stats are full of WrongThink? (They know the Ban All The Things! proposals are worse than useless … for safety, violence, and people doing what they like. Must be some other reason.)
– Pesky Deplorables; it’s like they think they matter.
(*) OoO-E, there is spouting Pravda On The Hudson’s party line, without a company byline. Hardly *Op*posite the *Ed*itorial.
Politicians on both sides say ridiculous things to appease their donors or just to bloviate on things they don’t understand. That said, the idea of the New York Times lecturing anyone on saying ‘nutty things’ about guns is pretty rich.
There actually have been some left-leaning publications (Slate is one) that ran columns or articles suggesting that the gun-control movement needs to pull its head out of it’s ass and start understanding the subject on which it tries to legislate (guns). From basic things like the stupid statements you hear from politicians (ghost gun machine gun 30 clips a second) to more substantial nuances surrounding current law and loopholes.
Thus far the “learn about that which you speak” idea hasn’t taken much hold.
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