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By Brandon via concealednation.org

Ehhh, we got some tough guys out there. All too often, I’ll post an article about [insert article title here] and some people will always chime in with their, “I’d get the job done” attitude.

Example Story: A story is posted about a homeowner who shoots at an intruder. The homeowner misses and the bad guy gets away.

Example Comment: “If someone broke into my house, they would have been filled with lead! Can’t believe the homeowner missed. Get back to the range!”

I know, I know. Some of you could take out an armed home intruder from across town with your GLOCK 19 while simultaneously paying for your groceries. I get it, you’re a great shot and you’ll never miss your target regardless of the circumstances . . .

But for those of us who live in the real world and look at things from a logical perspective, we understand that we may not be the best shots in the world, especially under the circumstances of a high-stress situation.

And, although someone may miss, the threat in the example was eliminated.

Obviously we want to hit our target if we’re ever forced to pull the trigger, but…

Here’s my point: I see new people on our Facebook page and website every single day, and many of these people are brand-spankin’ new to concealed carry. They’re here to learn, and some take advice (however bad it may be) from comments of others at times. If a lot of these comments pop up and are read by someone not 100% familiar with everything, they may slack a bit on training. And that’s not ok.

Sure, it’s up to each person to seek out as much or as little training as they see fit, but I’m a fan of getting as much training as possible, even if you are that tough guy. I’m also a fan of being a positive roll model, and the macho comments don’t really help anyone but the commenter’s ego.

Plus, if you’ve never had to draw your firearm in self-defense, you’re not allowed to give your opinion on how you would perform.

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62 COMMENTS

  1. if you’ve never had to draw your firearm in self-defense, you’re not allowed to give your opinion on how you would perform

    Sure they are, Brandon, although they may be wrong. Just like you.

    • Yeah, his last sentence destroyed the point he was trying to make, which, I think was a good one; there are far too many people who think just because they have a gun on, they’re a superhero.

      It’s possible the bad guy would get the drop on you. It’s possible you’ll shoot like absolute crap under the stress, it’s possible you’ll simply freeze up. A gun does not turn you into hot shit, it merely gives you more of a chance than you would have had otherwise/ It’s up to you to make it significantly more of a chance, but that takes work.

    • +1

      “You’re not allowed to have that opinion” is the battle cry of SJWs. We can do better.

    • Well, I’m guilty of not wanting a whole lot of self defense advice from someone who has never had a DGU, fighting advice from someone who has never been in a fight, pepper spray / Taser from someone who has never used a less lethal, etc. People who haven’t fought can still offer valuable information about things, such as the given effective range of a Taser cartridge, but there’s still nothing quite like experience and a thoughtful critique thereof.

      I say that as someone who used to have the invincible attitude and had tempered somewhat with age and maturity.

      Then again, I don’t ever want to be in a fight against a 3-gun champ.

  2. That’s why we have things like Optics, Lights, Laser, etc… In sphincter clenching situations, it’s much easier to halo somebody with the EOTech than to line up sights.

    • In my opinion the guy on this video is wrong. We can all use some training and refreshers once in a while. I see far too many people at the ranges handling guns in an unsafe manner. But the most important training, IMO, is the legal information. When can you shoot ? When should you not shoot ? Do you have an obligation, in your State to move away from danger or can you move towards the threat and stop it ? In you home versus out in public etc.. And how about when and where you can legally carry. Lots of legal information that the average guy has no clue about unless they have some training. For lack of information you could find yourself in a cell with the guy that was attacking you. You could also lose your life savings and your home in a civil suit, even if you were justified in shooting someone. Get some training in this area.

      • Strongly agree. The rules-of-engagement are not entirely intuitive; you have to read a book or take a course. Plenty of us might think we would be acting in good faith but still find ourselves in the hot-seat with a DA cheerfully indicting us.
        First Steps Pistol/Rifle/Shotgun is just fine if you want to shoot targets. If you keep or bear arms for self-defense the first and most important thing to learn is the lawful use-of-force.

  5. Man, I can’t remember what Booster Gold’s-metrosexual-cousin’s-hero’s name is, or even what studio..DC or Marvel, I keep thinking Wonder Man or Blue Beetle but those are obviously wrong.

  7. I can hit minute-of-bad-guy A-OK in a square range, and reasonably so on the move.

    But I haven’t really had that huge stress placed on me.

    So I really don’t know in a rubber-meets-the-road situation.

    I just practice as often as I can, and hope the hell I can make it happen when the chips are down.

    • You will do what you have to do to survive. There’s no stronger instinct. There will be time to be scared afterwards.

      • I’m a SCUBA diver. On the rare occasion I’ve found that I’ve put myself in a jam, the first thought that crosses my mind is: Relax, you have the rest of your life to solve this problem. Tends to calm me down.

    • see my comments on stress testing , It will really help ease your mind with this method of practice . You know how a 80 % free throw shooter will miss when the game is on the line or you miss that 4 foot putt on the 18th to tie or win , we have problems tying our shoes and buttoning our shirts when we are rushed . Practice timed competition training against someone else for a box of ammo .

    • It’s such a huge amount of money to spend on something that doesn’t cost even remotely as much as they charge…

      There’s a line between free-market capitalism, and elitism. I’ve yet to find any sort of “training” that doesn’t go so far over that line that they can’t even find the line from where they’re selling…

      Even if you have a hard time determining where that line is, such absurd extremes are easy to identify…

      • I have to commend you for illustratrating leftist economics so perfectly. You appear to suffer from some combination of the following misconceptions

        1) Something is only worth how much it cost (plus maybe some small percentage profit).
        2) Even if someone adds a tremendous amount of value, they aren’t morally allowed to collect payment for that value.
        3) If someone is charging more than you think the product is worth, they’re jerks for not lowering their prices to meet your expectations.

        Either the class is worth the money or it isn’t. What it cost them to put it on is utterly irrelevant.

        Now if you don’t think the class is worth what they charge, that’s fine. You should have said that instead of complaining about how little (you think they) have to pay to put it on.

        • Yep, part of the race to the bottom for prices. Folks expect services to be provided to them for damn near minimum wage and then are suprised/upset when that’s all they get paid…

    • My local range charges $80 for a three-hour class (basic, advanced, really advanced and force on force.) The ex-military instructor has been to Gunsite, etc. and is a leading Three-Gun instructor. He’s is passing on that info.
      I also shoot in pistol and Two- or Three-Gun competitions. Entry fee: $15.

    • Money is not a good-enough excuse. Many of the best trainers have written books or produced DVDs. These are usually available used via Amazon. Lots of information is also available on the internet. Anyone strapped for cash can get much of the training he needs by reading books and practicing what he’s read.

  9. Most of us don’t have the time, money or inclination to go for a weekend tacticool course. And as countless ttag posts and local news reports show us, it ain’t needed. Safely handling your gun each and every day is 99% of the battle.

    None of us is ever going to be in the Nakatomi towers taking on Hans Gruber. We’re going to be in the parking lot of the 7-11 facing the homeless tweaker who is armed with a screwdriver. And watch him turn into a puff of smoke when you pull your laser equipped death machine that you maxed out your credit card getting.

    K.I.S.S. Safe gun handling and a functional gun that you won’t mind losing to the PD.

  11. I hope that what he meant is that it is easy to be an armchair quarterback when you are not in the game. It is much more difficult to form an opinion if you have no experience. You can have a theory but that is all it is until proven in the field. I too hear a lot of talk from some who shoot quite a bit but have never faced the dragon. I can tell you first hand that it does not always go down like the book says it should. Having spent 7 years in the army (Vietnam era) followed by 5 years with the Irving PD, I have used a firearm under less than favorable conditions. Here are just a few things to think about—multiple assailants that are not always clumped together, some who do not appear to even be with the other guy, bad weather, extreme heat or cold, bad lighting, obstructions to vision, distractions, innocents in the background, guys who soak up multiple kill shots but keep fighting anyway even though they are the walking dead. I hope you get the idea. Train like it’s real and you will react like you trained, but never think it’s going down the way you planned!
    Remember, sometimes the dragon wins!

  13. “Plus, if you’ve never had to draw your firearm in self-defense, you’re not allowed to give your opinion on how you would perform.” brother you have got it all wrong. People who have been blessed enough to NOT to have to use their firearm in self defense can comment, and should. However their comment should be weighed based on what is said. It is very arrogant and self richous of you to make a blanket statement like you did. A ton of firearm instructors have never had to shoot in anger, does that mean they do not know what they are talking about?

  14. I’m reminded of the saying “Glocks make bad people go away”. Notice the quote mentions nothing about shooting or hitting them. I’ve missed so many four-legged predators on my property that my daughter dubbed me the ‘king of the misses’. My only reply has been,”They left didn’t they?” And they never came back. In the article’s example the good news is that nobody got hurt, the homeowner didn’t go to jail or to trial, and he won’t be plagued by nightmares or loss of sleep over having shot someone. Yes, it could have gone bad for him, so maybe a bit more realistic practice is in order, and that should be the takeaway for any of us.

  15. Sure you can give your opinion. Just be prepared to accept the possibility that you are wrong.

  16. I suspect paintball gamers have the advantage here.

    The first time I ambushed a human target, I missed his back, from about 6′ away, with a dart gun I could group 8″ at 10′ with. He immediately spun around, drew his gun, and missed me even worse than I’d missed him.

    Within hours, we were both dead. The guy he was supposed to assassinate got him, and the guy that was supposed to assassinate me succeeded. That was 30 years ago and I hope I’d do better now, but who knows?

    • Yeah, I have wondered about that. Seems like paintball fights might be a good way to practice accurate fire under pressure. And probably have fun in the process.

    • The thing I learned from paintball(and I recently played for the first time since I was a kid) is that, in close quarters when things were moving fast I shot a lot, and when I hit somebody it was from essentially peppering them when they were exposed. I mostly got shot in the gun, which I find interesting. Paintball guns aren’t that accurate, but I suspect point shooting happens a lot more than front sight focus within a certain range. Within a certain range and the ability to point fairly well in close quarters from muscle memory that may be all that is needed.

      Just my 2 cents

  17. Even though I’ve had to use my sidearm in a lethal combat situation I’m reserving my opinion. Unless somebody asks, I’ll keep it to myself. I’ll only agree with Brandon if we’re talking about civilian shooting boards second-guessing cops.

  18. I’ve met guys that had never fired a weapon before that when rubber hits the road they were stone cold and bad guy was DRT!
    Don’t you know a firearm makes a guy 10 foot tall and bullet proof a hero in their mind and an expert on everything just ask them they will tell you!
    The put down is an inferiority complex better than thou, Advice is like Butt holes everyone has one
    Hope they never meet a stone cold bad guy without proper preparation
    even then is a dicey proposition! what I want o know is how thy deal with the Adrenaline rush, and letdown , the the self judgement about making the bad guy a lump of chilling meat! then the law hassles!

  19. I think training is important but for some reason I know people with the KISS mindset that have taken the basic handgun safety course, maybe one or two carry classes and run circles around the guys who’ve been to every over tactic00l class on the planet. The guys that brag about going to Chris Costa, Travis Haley, and (eek) James Yeagers classes always piss me off, when they feel the need to insert their ‘infinite knowledge’ into something while some old guy or even some kid who’s primary “training” has consisted of shooting his .270 from a deer stand and plinking with his dads guns just “gets it” right from the start

  20. A gun is just a tool and its effectiveness depends on the skill with which you use it. I think there are two levels at which formal instruction is valuable. The first is at the very beginning so that you learn good habits. The second is after you have progressed as far as you can on your own. In between, dry fire at home and shoot practice and matches at a local gun club. All the tactical training in the world is of no use unless you can hit what you shoot at.

  21. I agree with every ones comments here , I haven’t ever had to shoot anyone thank God , no military or civil police experience and yet I do feel confidant I could shoot a target under stress because I have determined I will and I have trained under stress often . I also think hunting live game helps in stress target acquisition . The most efficient way to stress train is to compete with someone on timer , Compete for a box of ammo or something . twenty feet . Set time , draw , shoot , drain one magazine , reload , repeat , stop timer . Next . Improve your skills until they become natural . If you have a light and or laser , by all means , practice with them . We have all seen the video of the three NYC cops empty their weapons on a perp at 15 feet and hit only bystanders . Happens . I prefer smaller calibers myself and usually carry a PMR and I won’t miss you at 20 feet . I keep a 9 for in home protection and my shotgun .

  22. Nyet comrade. Shot from across town requires mighty Mosin, not puny plastic pistol, Rodina!

  23. Personally, having actually having to draw my concealed carry piece in anger twice, both in response to predators of the 4 legged kind luckily, (as opposed to humans), the answer is training, training, training, more training, and just when you think you’re a badass- more training. If you’re new to this, train as much as possible. When you need to use that training, it will show, I promise. Finding a place to train properly is hard to come by though.

    • This is one of the reasons I told Sara she should move to WV , $30,000.00 will still buy you 65 acres and you can include a barn , outbuildings and electric if you double that , That’s 65 acres of forest and meadows and probably a creek since we are mostly hills . I can practice shooting every gun I own anytime I want and I do . Go WVU . I got my 65 acres with barn , outbuildings , 3 miles of creek , pond , 16 acres of fenced horse meadow , electric , two wells and a house for $59,000.00 back in 89 . Peace

  24. Everybody is different. Different motor skills, different reaction times and different results with their weapons. Different brains processing situational cues under extreme stress transferred into delivering firepower (or not) at a threat. When you meet the elephant by the grace of God go ye.

    Still remember the former Navy Seal (out of the Navy a long time ago) who scored in the bottom third of an advanced handgun class populated with mostly civilians and a few active law enforcement types. I thought he’d be a ringer, but after drawing his concealed Glock was missing torso targets at 7 yards. His performance on the pop-up targets was even worse. Go figure…..

    • A good example that shooting a gun, pistol or rifle, is a perishable skill.

      I usually shoot twice a month, fifty to a hundred rounds each time.

      But when I haven’t gone for a couple months, I can see the degradation of even basic skills, let alone advanced ones, when I go back.

  25. This is the hardest, most nuanced argument I’ve had to make to someone who doesn’t understand/support gun rights and use. They think that I think that a gun is Carte Blanche for defending myself and my family, when really it is just the best option I have, outside of area denial weapons (i.e. landmines), to defend what I love. It is by no means infallible. All I want is the best available option to do that. There are no guarantees.

  26. The only real rule for gunfights is to be sure to have a gun. The second, if I had to pick, would be that not getting shot is more important than hitting your target. Both of those rules may have exceptions from time to time, but they’re normally pretty solid rules.

    Anyone saying they could hit someone who was shooting at them with 100% certainty has, with 100% certainty, never been shot at. It’s not easy to hit someone who is probably moving and shooting while you are also moving and shooting. Both of you want to hit the other, neither of you wants to get hit, and you are both working towards those mutually exclusive goals at the same time. Gun fights are not easy. It’s something you need to seriously consider when training. Learn to hit moving targets while moving. Go buy two airsoft guns and try it out with a friend in safety….

    If someone breaks into my home, my priorities look like this:
    1. Keep my wife alive.
    2. End the threat as quickly as possible, either through the intruder leaving, being apprehended, or bleeding out.
    3. Survive.

    I can’t really accomplish #1 without #2 as well. #3 is one of those things I’d REALLY like to make sure I accomplish, but ultimately it isn’t as important as the first two.

    Anyone who gets into a gun fight and nails all three of those, even if the opponent is never hit with a bullet, wins. End of discussion.

  27. if you’ve never had to draw your firearm in self-defense, you’re not allowed to give your opinion on how you would perform.
    Based on my own little incident….
    Watch out for the adrenaline dump and try to keep thinking.
    Based on what my friend who was in the middle of the Tet Offensive….
    SLOW things down, LOOK, and THINK of what you are doing.

  28. Too many folks take sentences like, “…you’re not allowed to give your opinion” literally, when what the writer means is not that he is declaring your 1A free speech rights null and void, but that you have no moral authority to give such opinions. Sometimes people are morally wrong to even offer an opinion, though they have the legal right to do so.

    And there are exceptions, of course. Even if they’ve never “been there,” I’ll bet we could surmise that just based on training alone, Jerry Miculek, Doug Koenig, Jessie Duff, etc., would probably do pretty well. But how many i-net warriors have that kind of street cred?

  29. Suck it, “Brandon.”

    I’ll make up a stat, which were it verifiable, I’m sure wouldn’t be too far off, and state that 90% or more of men age 30+ have been in at least one serious, imminently life threatening event. So they know how they responded, even if not a DGU exactly.

    I’m not arguing that everyone has ice water in their veins and is a crack shot at three a.m., terrified in the dark. What I am saying us that most men rise to the challenge. It’s not about being a mega macho “tough guy.” It’s just about being a guy.

    So how about you shut YOUR face and not dare tell others what they may or may not speak about?

  30. I train all the time, i.e., 500 rounds at.range once a week, dry fire daily, etc. Let’s say a love doing it and I can afford it. I used to be a military cop and member of an EST team (SWAT) back 25 years ago. Drawing from holster and speed shooting, I can do 4 inch groups fairly consistently. But, because I am human, I know in an a defensive gun use that my accuracy will suck and my fine motor skills will be crap. Training helps, but the human condition is always there.

  31. Most people will not kill.
    Even gun-owners.
    A most influential book for me is “On Killing” (http://www.amazon.com/On-Killing-Psychological-Learning-Society/dp/0316040932), a landmark study of the techniques the military uses to overcome the powerful reluctance to kill — in its own soldiers.
    Most men will shoot to miss. Not to kill. Maybe not consciously, but “missing” a close target may often be an unconscious choice.
    I suspect that this applies as well to gun-owners who have to draw their piece and use it.

    • Oh, please. Grossman is a total shitbird. Go read the one and two stars reviews of the link you provided.

      The man cites Slam Marshall as one his sources, for goodness sakes.

  33. I liked the article until the author said…

    “if you’ve never had to draw your firearm in self-defense, you’re not allowed to give your opinion on how you would perform”

    I encourage everyone to put in their 2 cents – fact is there are blowhards and keyboard commandos but if you think they will suddenly come to their senses and stop because you said this, your deluded.

    Everyone has an opinion, you just need to filter through a lot of stupid ones to find the good ones.

  34. Well, I know that when four Pit Bulls attacked my dog, I didn’t hesitate. I drew my Glock 30 from my IWB holster and aimed and was squeezing the trigger on the dog that was going for the throat of my own dog when the four Pit Bulls just scattered and ram away. In the moment, everything was slow motion as I was moving lightning fast, kind of peaceful and calm actually, in the chaos. I’ve been there before as a volunteer firefighter. I call it being in the zone

    Would I have done the same on a human being? I hope I never find out, but we are the end result of hundreds of millions of years of evolution of survival of the fittest. I would think I will do what is needed to survive such an encounter as all my ancestors have done.

  35. Formal training is great but less important than mindset. Mindset is what turns people into survivors. Training tempers the mindset for those tense situations, but give me a determined defender over a trained waffler any day.

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