There is a phenomenal French bakery just down the road from me. Baguette et Chocolat bakes all their patisserie from scratch on the premises. Their flaky croissants melt in your mouth. The salade Nicoise is an edible garden of earthly delights. Rocking up for lunch this week, Dan and I were dismayed to discover box-fresh 30.06 and 30.07 signs darkening their doors. (No open or concealed carry allowed.) No doubt . . .
B&C apparently made the change in response to Texas’ new licensed open carry law. So I put the question to Open Carry Texas jefe C.J. Grisham: had open carry created a backlash against gun owners? C.J. reckons gun carriers coming out of the proverbial closet are forcing hoplophobes to do the same. “Some of them will come ’round,” C.J. predicted, “and eventually remove the signs. Meanwhile, don’t blame the victim.” Good advice?
I am not Open Carrier and will likely never be. But this IS sound advice.
Better to be arguing about the mode of carrying than about carrying.
Preach it man! What we care about is that everyone be able to utilize armed self defense. When that’s the case then open or concealed becomes nothing but fashion compromising with practicality. Until then, open carry opens eyes. If what the eyes see is fear we cannot help that other than to conduct ourselves properly and politely and hope that enough of that might just cause a rethink about the initial fear response.
I have been open carrying recently (Home Depot, Walmart, Academy). It was a non-issue. People were not screaming “he’s got a gun”, nor the masses were parting like the Rea sea when they saw me coming. Even mothers with children did not grabbed their kids and ran out of the store . I suspect most if not all either didn’t care or didn’t noticed. The only one I am sure that noticed was the cashier at Home Depot. She kind of took a quick glance but did not missed a beat.
I am a retired prosecutor, trial attorney, and cop. I recently saw folks openly carrying in Kansas and four times in Oklahoma, all in Walmart. I was skeptical at first but not a single person seemed to notice at any of those 5 locations. There is an old cop saying that only paranoid people are paranoid……now if somebody walks into Walmart carrying a chainsaw that would cause concern..
The problem i see is a lot of open carriers are asshats. All the public ever sees on the news are idiots running around in baggy shorts wife beaters and work boots with an AR strapped to their back. Not everyone can afford a two thousand dollar suit but come on if your out there being the public face of a movement at least dress decently.
Pretty sure we haven’t seen that in a while. Sorry to burst your bubble…
And Robert is in Austin, a town with demographics a lot closer to the Bay Area in The People’s Republic Of Califa than the rest of Texas. Austin politics is a reflection of that. It didn’t used to be that way, but it is now.
This had nothing to do with people who open carry and everything to do with people who political carry.
Nice comment, never really looked at it that way…kudos…
Political carry… that would be 1A sybolic speech to go along with 2A rights, correct?
How about this as a tactic – If you really want what they are selling go in pairs. When you arrive with your pistol in full view in its holster, one person disarms, handing their pistol to the other who will stand nearby over-watch while you enter and make your purchase with an empty holster in full view, then leave with your purchases to retrieve your sidearm.
Political theater, good food, maximum visual impact, and nothing illegal has been done.
I think an unholstered pistol will get the opposite of a good message across.
I believe if you are un-holstering your handgun in plain view of the public and handing it to someone; someone, somewhere like Austin and Houston) are interpret that as “brandishing” the weapon. That would be “illegal”.
I’m not saying they should, I’m just saying I can that happening.
“… and nothing illegal has been done.”
Perhaps not, but your buddy holding the unholstered gat is almost certainly going to catch a brandishing charge. And that’s the best case scenario, because worst case is he ends up shot by a cop.
Might be easier to just not give your money to places that don’t respect your rights, especially if it’s just a bakery.
What means this “gat”…what is a gat? Is a gay cat a gat? Oh look at those two tomcats makin out. Good lord their friken gats….I shoved a gat down my pants and it scratched my balls, I kinda liked it.I think Im into gats, gat scratch fever.
“Gat” is a slang term for a gun. Seems like that might have been clear from context.
Gat: Old slang, meanging gun. Came from shortening Gattling gun to just gat. Was used during the prohibition era to name any gun, but specifically the thompson submachine gun, aka The Tommy Gun.
Urban Dictionary
Keep your wallet and weapon holstered and boycott these establishments.
I agree with those who say, just don’t go in there in the first place.
I AM NOT A LAWYER. THE FOLLOWING IS NOT SOMETHING I’D DO AND I DON’T SERIOUSLY RECOMMEND IT
But if you really HAVE to do this, have the holder of the weapon open a gun case. The unholsterer puts the gun directly into the case being held open for him, then the holder closes the case for the duration. Then, on exiting, reverse the process.
There might still be a “brandishing” window in there, but it’s a lot smaller than if the holder were to just stand there, gun in hand.
Fail. Cute line, though. Once OC became legal, so-called “political carry” became moot. This is about political anti-carry. Anti-guns, actually. Howsoever OC came to pass (and I don’t see any scenario where it would have just out of the goodness of the government’s heart, absent any protests and groundswell of support), it would have attracted a lot of attention. Generating that much publicity, just in the legislative phase, was bound to generate opportunities for antis to burnish their anti-gun bona fides.
These are just haters taking the opportunity of OC as a concept to make a political point about guns. There are no obnoxious open carriers flaunting their AKs at the froufrou French bakery. We saw the same phony backlash with the UT architecture dean who left because of campus carry. B.S. He’d bad one foot out the door for years and finally found an excuse. Same with these folks.
Who is the victim?
“Who is the victim?”
There are no victims, only volunteers who choose to bow to PC pressure and a certain amount of silliness of “OK if we need to put up a sign forbids Open Carry, let’s just put up a sign that forbids Concealed Carry as well,then we will be double safe”
Little do they know many handgun owners trespass by concealed carry in their establishment every day. I only give my business to places where there are no 30.6 signs like at my local Walgreens
‘
Not to mention the criminals that carry their guns concealed without licenses. Hence, those signs don’t apply to them, as they’re not ‘licensed’, and if I recall, the signs specifically say ‘licensed’ carriers.
And the courts have determined that a so-called “Prohibited person” or someone carrying without an (unconstitutional) permission slip is not required to reveal himself since that would be a violation of his Fifth Amendment protected right against self incrimination.
Criminals? With guns? Preposterous!! How could such a thing happen? I mean, it’s illegal to just BE a criminal, let alone be an armed criminal. Might as well have armed themselves with unicorn horns. But, could it be, that people, who disregard the law, will disregard more than one law? The pillars of liberal thought are build on a foundation of poorly stacked playing cards, and each card the joker
In this context the “victim” is the open carrier. The question is about the CC vs. OC debate, confused because of the pastry puns.
The standard anti-OC arguments are along the lines of:
“The bad guy will just take your gun” and “the bad guy will target you first.”
In those arguments it IS blaming the victim, claiming you are a victim BECAUSE you open carried.
I hope you informed the management of the bakery they had just lost several regular customers due to their decision. If that happens often enough the signs will come down.
I agree with this. Let them know. If they don’t know, they’ll blame the downturn on the economy or advertising or something. They need to know that it was their action that directly caused this.
And along the same lines, make sure to emphasize that they will NOT be receiving any additional business/support from the anti-gun-rights forces that push/browbeat businesses to install these signs. There will be NO offsetting revenue; they just lost part of their customer base for no rational reason (just a feelgood reason).
Good point, NineShooter. I don’t know how many people will make the decision not to patronize such a place, but suspect the numbers are not large. Therefore, it might be too subtle a clue to register with the proprietor generally. So, any polite attempt to acquaint him/her with the actual facts might be of greater value than hoping he or she saw it for themselves.
And the fact that the anti-gun crowd isn’t going to rush in and make up the loss is something that could easily be overlooked by everyone.
Robert should have explained to them that those signs are nothing more than “anti-law abiding gun owner signs.” Only law abiding individuals would follow that sign. It targets the wrong people. In the event of a robbery, rape, or homicide in the bakery – criminals aren’t going to care about, or change their mind when they see that sign.
But anti-gunners believe there is no distinction there. To them, anyone with a gun is a potential criminal. To them, a “law abiding gun owner” is someone who has not been convicted of a serious crime…yet.
I don’t think establishments that post “no gun” signs really believe those signs will prevent crime. I think they have found a legal way to discriminate against a group of people they philosophically dislike.
+1
Discrimination is discrimination, simple.
Spot on Vhyrus.
I would write them a physical letter, and an email.
That would bum me out to not be able to get some delicious food. But I stick to my convictions. I wouldn’t shop there with those signs.
I’d make a larger order over the phone, arrive on the scene to pick up the order, notice the signs, then call and cancel the order from outside their front door, explaining that I can’t go in to pick up my order. I’d explain to them that I’ve loved their establishment in the past, but I’m disappointed and will no longer be purchasing from them.
I’ve done this twice in Arizona, where the signs do not have force of law. I doubt I was the only one who voiced these opinions because both of these places took down their signs.
I agree, utilize all channels available through the free market to voice your displeasure either to the manager directly or to the business. If people do not know that policies are having this effect on their customer base, they are unlikely to change them. A good explanation is due if the owner is confident in his or her decision to make a business restrictive to millions of peaceful people.
I’ve always been curious to know how that works.
Do you come back later without your weapon? Do you put it in your vehicle? Do you go inside with it anyway?
CJ is correct. Most new 30.07 signs are just hoplophobes making a political statement. The only brand new 30.07 signs I have seen in my neighborhood are at the local liquor store and at Sprouts. The Sprouts already had a 30.06 sign, the liquor store is still 30.06 free. The free market will sort this out. Austin is the liberal armpit of Texas so I expect lots of 30.07 signs to go up in that area.
(gentle tease!)
Liberal armpit? I suggest it is the liberal legpit of Texas.
Is there actually a “victim” here at all? These businesses have a perfect right to lose your custom. Time will tell if they have made a wise decision… and they are always free to change their minds.
Seems as if the people in Texas with their undies in a twist over OC need to carefully read all the hysteria and hype that surrounded the initiation of concealed carry in Texas (and other places). It’s so interesting that the same rhetoric is circulating now. Given enough time and the lack of blood in the streets… they’ll get over it just as they did last time. All but those who actually want total gun confiscation, of course. But I don’t see them gaining the numbers they’d need to do anything but whine about it.
I think the victim here is RF’s taste buds.
But his waist line will thank him for it.
I don’t know: Mr. Farago praised a salad that they appear to offer … it would be a shame to eliminate salads from your diet!
I would say that the victim is the Constitution. By posting these signs the establishment is announcing that they do not support the Second Amendment protection of the right to keep and bear arms and by ignoring this attack gun owners are allowing the muggles to assume that this is perfectly acceptable.
I recommend large and frequent “empty holster” groups to walk through these places, possibly without buying anything, just to make a point. The worst that can happen is management will ask you to leave or face trespassing charges, but the point will be made.
^ This.
Anyone who interferes with your absolute right to self-defense — or promotes interfering with your absolute right to self-defense — is a cancer to our nation. They are sympathizers and/or accomplices to the scumbags who will steal whatever they can get from us … and there should be consequences for that.
I’ve seen a few places (enough to count on one hand) put up the new 30.06 and 30.07, which had no prohibited signage before.
One could argue OC causes this to happen. However, I’ve seen infinitely more places which continue to have no signage.
Just because you get a few sour pecans, doesn’t mean the tree has gone bad.
Yes, open carry has unquestionably created a backlash. More and more businesses are posting both 30.07 and 30.06 signs since the open carry law went in effect. I think I’ve seen one business that ONLY posted 30.07 but still allows concealed carry.
I’ve carried concealed for more than 12 years, and thanks to the open carry law I can now carry in fewer places than ever before.
How many places have you seen go 30.06/30.07 over the last two months and what are your general whereabouts?
I’ve seen exactly one 30.07, without 30.06, in a doctors office (my daughter’s allegey doc is a 2nd A guy, but just doesn’t want to frighten the muggles.) And I’ve seen a handful of 30.06 and 30.07, which didn’t prohibit before OC. One of those places was a school, which doesn’t say much, due to being prohibited regardless of signage.
Honestly, I haven’t seen much change. Including people OCing, I’ve only seen a few of those, too.
My pediatrician’s office used to have no signage, now has both. I’ve seen several convenience stores that weren’t posted now have both. Cane Rosso in Ft. Worth has posed 30.07 but thankfully still allows concealed carry. I’ve also seen at lesst one movie theater post 30.07 only.
The point is that the open carry law has had a net negative effect on the places I can legally carry. I see this as creating a schism among gun owners, as evidenced by comments such as “boo friggin hoo” leveled at those of us who don’t wholeheartedly support open carry.
It’s not the fault of the LAW…
Other than the doctor, of course, do you have to go to those places? Or do you like/choose to go there?
I would say that if the places you go posted both, and not just 30.07, it was because of ignorance of the actual law. The passage of OC likely only brought out the ideology which was already present.
Add one more location to the growing list of places I can no longer legally concealed carry in Texas since open carry went into effect… The grocery store across the road from my house is now posted with both flavors of prohibiting signage.
Big difference between “Can” and “may”. Concealed means concealed.
That’s easy to say… But some people work in a profession where they stand a very real chance of losing their livelihood if caught carrying illegally.
In Waco I’ve seen bunch of new 30.07 signs and a few places that have added both. The 30.07 mostly seem to be HEB and restaurants. My credit union also just added a 30.07 sign but I’ll be moving my account soon. There is a bank down the street that is closer and has no plans to add signs. In fact, seeing my pistol started a conversation about getting a license and a couple of the bank employees are now looking at getting licensed.
As a side note, I’ve also talked the the manager at my local Wells Fargo branch (no signs) and he told me the also had no plans to add any. He said that WFB left it up to the local managers to post signs if they wanted but there was no corporate policy that requires them. I thanked the manager and sent a letter to WFB.
This is a good thing in many respects. It puts things out in the open how people feel about our rights and allows the free market to work as intended. Business owners will have to take into account that they could very well lose customers if they make decisions such as these (which they have a right to do). We get a big sign out front that tells us “we don’t respect your natural, civil, human and constitutional protected right to keep and bear arms” and as such we can go elsewhere with our business and make sure that both the owners and other customers know why we made that choice. Eventually things will work themselves out or businesses will go under.
Well boo-f’ing-hoo.
I love C.J. Grisham. Those dbag cops arrested him for “rudely displaying a weapon” – lol while walking with his son down a rural dirt road. And now he is Mr. Open Carry Texas. Where would open Carry in Texas be today if those cops hadn’t harassed him that day.
Well, I’m sure they have a presence on sites such as Facebook and Yelp where customer reviews are taken very seriously. Small mom and pop stores (non big box) can’t afford 1 star reviews and often are very quick to respond. Get a good dozen or so people to throw 1 star reviews up on Yelp stating the reason for such and you could very well get some traction. No business wants poor rating or reviews and they may have to weigh the very real risk of losing tons of money or the small potential of an ND.
I do not agree with this method. Ruining a business based on something not directly associated with the service of the business is a very whiny SJW move and a cheap shot. Complain to the owners directly if you like but rating a company down because they exercise their right under the law is poor form.
I think you misunderstood what I meant. In no way am I saying their business should be ruined. If you are unable to carry your firearm into the establishment, it makes it difficult to get in contact with the owner in addition to not knowing when they will be in or out of the store at the given time. It is a method of showing there is more than just one vocal party, and as much as you and I would like to think so, not every carrying person has the time to stand around and talk to a business owner, they have things to do.
Furthermore, open forums like that encourage that the owner explain their actions. You aren’t dismissing one guy who comes in to talk to you, you are putting your views out there for all to see which is important if you are going to spend your hard earned money there. I for one want to know where they stand. If you have the capacity to speak in person, do so. But it is not ruining a business to find fault with new practices online.
They have to answer for their business decisions the same as a business next to the beach would have to answer for a policy of not allowing people inside that are wearing bathing suits. People have a right to voice their concern with the new policy and how ridiculous they think that it is that they can no longer frequent a store they used to love simply because their new policy makes it impossible to patron.
Heard of a phone, or mail? Or heaven forbid, disarm long enough to make your point.
Sure you can call, you can send a letter and you can walk back to your car and lock it up before returning to talk to a manager, BUT you can also use your free speech in a professional manner on websites that are solely designed for the purpose of putting the customer in contact with owners and managers.
As Ben B said farther down: “So the business owner gets to make a public, blanket policy, but the people affected by that policy are supposed to, one by one, in private, complain to them, so as to not put them in a bad light… like they have done to the people affected by that policy. Mmmm. Okay.”
How is it that its wrong for the customer to step up and exercise their rights to free speech, instead opting to go out of their way in order to preserve the public integrity of a business that has done nothing to show the same courtesy to you as the peaceable customer?
I agree. It’s a punk move.
Call the owner and say your peace.
Trying to get people fired and ruining people’s lives is what the SJW Commies do. We should look at it as a chance to possibly change someone’s view, not a chance to hurt people.
The SJW only care about the ends, never the means. We have to care about both, because only the good guys/gals do that. And we want to be the good guys/gals. Otherwise it’s all for nothing.
Once again, not trying to get people fired and I never insinuated as much, simply to show that there is more than the odd ball that is asking about a sign. We cannot pretend that its far more difficult and time consuming to talk face to face and any way that you can express your displeasure with the new policies is equally acceptable. Why is it that one form of expressing your displeasure is worse or somehow more damaging than others? If the business owner is not secure enough in their decision to post the 30.07 and 30.06 signs that they cannot explain with a degree of confidence in a public forum, than they should question their decision to post them.
Like I have stated, you aren’t calling for their job, you are making the owner, and other people that patron that store aware that policy is in place and there are those that are unable to patron their store as a result. Perhaps there are those that are not ‘in the know” regarding firearms laws and regulations but are pro freedom people that would like to know which businesses respect the right of their fellow citizens and which do not.
Its just putting things out there and being confident of your decision. The business owner deliberately posted these signs. If he or she is not aware that there are those that find fault with this practice it is implicitly regarded as acceptable.
I disagree. What are you doing by not going into their store? You are making sure not to spend money in their store. It all comes down to money, hit someone in the pocket book for their anti -freedom decisions, they will quickly come around to making the right decision.
Ultimately a business is there for one thing, and that is to make money. Losing money, is contrary to the very nature of a business so their bottom line is absolutely the most important thing. HOWEVER, I think it is almost equally important for the business owner to KNOW why they are losing money. Through any means available, you let them know that the reason why they are not receiving your money is because of this practice. This puts a ‘face to a name’ so to speak and provides an easy method of recourse. Allow your patrons to carry and we will come back, if you don’t, you will continue to not see our face or more importantly, our pocket books.
So the business owner gets to make a public, blanket policy, but the people affected by that policy are supposed to, one by one, in private, complain to them, so as to not put them in a bad light… like they have done to the people affected by that policy. Mmmm. Okay.
Ben B: Exactly my point. We have a right to publicly ask for an explanation as to how this policy will make us safer, and to assert our right of free speech to tell other customers that we will not be frequenting this business because they do not respect the rights of the people that patron their establishment. If they are confident in their decision, they will have no problem with the criticism as I would have hoped they have accounted for this prior to posting the signs.
The trouble with Yelp/TA is that I just want to know if the food is good or the business performs its core service competently. I don’t care if a waiter didn’t compliment your latest body modification.
Granted, being served is part of a businesses service, but I know that tends to vary by the individual.
I don’t see why you can’t go directly to the business and ask what their reason is. If they ignore you or have a really bad reason (“gun owners are all criminals”), at that point it suggests deeper concerns about the business and you may want to post publicly. But, if they are responsive and just don’t like firearms or had a bad experience or are otherwise polite and rational in their response, I have no problem respecting their views.
I have a coworker whose father was killed in a hunting accident and hasn’t wanted anything to do with guns since. She won’t begrudge you having and using yours, but I would never carry to her house and I suspect she would have signs posted if she owned a business. Would you really call out her business?
Katy; As I have already said, going to the business directly is certainly an option to take and if that seems more appropriate given the circumstances than no one is going to fault you. However, the onus is NOT on the customer to preserve or ‘save the face’ of a business that has made a public, blanket policy.
I would have to assume that the business owner is a smart, savvy individual who has taken backlash into consideration before posting the signs. Why is it our burden to preserve the public image of a business that has clearly not taken your safety or rights into consideration in the first place?
I am not calling for the jobs of anyone, Im not doing anything other than advocating for the rights of citizens in a free market who also possess freedom of speech. A customer (or in this case RF) who frequented the business has a right to ask questions and express their displeasure in anyway they see fit which includes public forums informing other patrons what to expect from that business.
I do not have a problem addressing these issues in a public forum. The owners of this business have taken a stance against the right of the people to keep and bear arms in their store and they have a right to do that on their property. Under the same reasoning though, the people have a right to express themselves and tell the business, the owner, and other customers that value their 2A rights that this business is no friend of theirs.
I understand what you are saying. You aren’t trying to shame or destroy a business. The goal is to change behavior. I think we are just approaching this from different angles.
My concern is the end response. When a negative public review is posted, some folks stiffen up in response. I’m just wary of the folks that might have been amenable to removing signage if approached directly, but feel backed into a corner and double down when the laundry is aired.
I tend to operate that way. You point out a mistake I’ve made in private, and I’ll probably correct it; do it in public, and I’ll probably try to justify it as an intentional decision.
Thoughtful and concise. Well put.
Vhyrus,
I just wonder if you think it would be “poor form” of the business owner who does not allow you to defend yourself while you are staring down the barrel of a gun of a disgruntled customer or employee or some wacko as occurred at the Texas Luby’s so long ago.
No, I am not talking about using Social Media to make a business go bankrupt.
Merely, to influence owners to make better decisions.
Customers have every right criticize a business for anything.
I don’t think it’s poor form to underrate a business because they don’t respect Your rights
just so long as you state why.
Underrating a business for their 30.06 or 30.07 signs is a far cry from say,
using the government to force them to cater to your business
like the gay/lesbian alliance.
I still think that a cake shop still has the right not to serve wedding cakes for gay
weddings and pastry shops have the right not to serve OC’ers or CC’ers.
governments should not have a say in that, but business owners need to know
the consequences of their business decisions and political statements.
And customers have every right to use whatever form of feedback they choose to
achieve the desired net effect.
This. All I was trying to say is to use the tools available to express your displeasure with this practice. If that entails in person, by mail, or by social media, it doesnt matter, its all free speech and expression. We aren’t talking about name calling or lying like the SJW crowd, we are finding fault with factual occurrences and very real infringements on rights. If they don’t care that they are losing this business, that is their right to keep displaying the signs, and as a result, keep losing out on business.
So if a business has decent food but crappy policies . . . the only reviews allowed on the interwebz should be good ones about the food? No. A business that makes good but does bad absolutely deserves both praises for its product and condemnation for its conduct. The business is responsible for both. Intentionally hiding either is lying.
I may not agree with the business owner’s decision, but I will defend to the death his right to be a preternaturally stupid, selfishly hypocritical, unremittingly hoplophobic and terminally unemployed assh0le.
Besides, the less baked goods you eat, the less the chance of getting diabetes.
There are some pretty interesting studies about diabetes out there, now.
It might not be the carbs and sugars, like once thought, as much as the vegs based starches used in most baking (veg oils, corn starch, corn syrup, etc.)
Some, also, believe that old world baking is the way to go and will help the issue. Where yeast was not added during baking, but is created through naturally occurring bacteria which is formed by the process preparation itself.
Veg oils are pretty damn deadly too, but sugar is the ultimate killer.
All carbs turn into sugar once it enters the body and people have been living on carb heavy diets for thousands of years.
I think there is more too it than just sugar.
Funny – I don’t see any TTAG reader comments on the baguette baker’s Website or Facebook page. Maybe nobody actually reads TTAG any more.
Read TTAG. Don’t facebook.
Baguette et Chocolate has some of the best macaroons this side of the Atlantic Ocean, risking a class c misdemeanor would be worth it to duck in and get some while packing. Just sayin.
I’ll wager that those diabetes-inducing macaroons have killed more people than RF’s guns.
With 69,071 deaths and 234,051 death certificates listing diabetes as an underlying or contributing cause of death, diabetes is the seventh leading cause of death in the US. And a lot of those deaths are directly attributable to sugary treats and refined grain products.
No wonder a bakery is deflecting attention to guns.
http://www.diabetes.org/diabetes-basics/statistics/?referrer=https://www.google.com/
Unlicensed open carry is legal in Ohio and always has been. The only thing preventing me from open carrying in public is the fact that Ohio police have a history of bogus arrests for open carry. Then again, I could use the money from a million dollar lawsuit…
well, ain’t claiming to be sophiscated, an’ all, but i think the fifth word in the posting should be all the warning RF needed.,
I’ll just put up a pro 2 A sign in my place to counter this bs.
It’ll die off eventually. Open carry is legal in all but like what, 3 states? And it’s not an issue in any of them except Texas, simply because it’s new. I’d suggest the next move for ya’ll in Texas is to aim to remove the “force of law” from the signs, like in most pro gun states.
They already did (sort of) violation was decreased to a class c misdemeanor which is basically no worse than getting a speeding ticket.
Dan and I were dismayed to discover box-fresh 30.06 and 30.07 signs darkening their doors.
Holy plastic sign keep boogeyman away with gun just go off.
Me put up GFZ sign to keep evil spirit away!
As has been seen in Indiana, with OC, there is blood in the streets! I tell you now!
Beat me to it Tom-what is the problem with you guys in Texas? I see open carriers(in Indianaland) with only the occasional whiny comment. NO signs I can recall. BTW-the customer is king. I see no reason to NOT be rude. It’s your $ to spend as you like. LIKE the guy wanting to license magazines to “keep out the riffraff(?)”…
No-o-o-oooooo, ya think? This is my shocked face. Yet, notice how the defenders of in your face OC, act and comment as though it’s still everyone else that has the problem? The absolutism of self-righteous certainty is the oldest, truest home of tyranny.
Kentucky has had open carry since our founding as a state. Other than hospitals and government buildings, I haven’t seen a sign of any kind prohibiting firearms in years. The local mall did have signs, but when I was there over Christmas, the signs were down and I spotted several people open carrying.
The 1820’s era state court case that affirmed the state’s authority to regulate concealed carry used the reasoning that “Honest men carry their weapons openly. Outlaws and brigands hide their arms.” Or words to that effect.
I do have to add as an edit, that the Kentucky hospital and government signs I have seen ban weapons, not just firearms. Kentucky issues a ConcealedDeadlyWeapon license. It covers knives, other than traditional pocket and hunting knives, and impact weapons as well as firearms. So, you can carry your switchblade and brass knuckles concealed in Kentucky.
Don’t forget to stop by their booth at the Barton Creek mall’s farmers market and let them know you can’t support them there, either. Sadly I’ll have to do the same. They do have some wonderful baked goods.
I travel all over Texas and never will spend money in one of those places than ban any type of carry……..it is important that we never buy from these places and actually tell them why an also to put a comment on Trip Advisor informing the world they are anti gun.
If Grisham has stayed out of the political debate with his grandstanding, in-your-face tactics, open carry would have passed anyway (thanks to the efforts of many others who made it possible) and there would have been minimal backlash.
Grisham and his goon-squads intimidated everyone they could. Open Carry passed, but it’s now on adversarial grounds with EVERYONE.
He poisoned the well, so to speak. Many of us in Texas wish that Grisham would keep his mouth shut and quit making ANY kind of carry a confrontational situation. The damage he and his group caused might take decades to repair.
Thanks CJ for nothing.
Still not constitutional carry and arround 5 -6 off places thats start white felonie charges 🙁
Texas is not realy pro gun maximum friendly !
I’m not anti open carry.
I’m anti OCers who make it sound like a good tactical advice instead of just a means to further our agenda.
Blaming the victim? Well, since i’m on a blog filled with victims who accept the blame of violent crimes and tyranny by spending hard earned cash to buy chunks of steel instead of a vacation, i am blaming the victim and rightfully so.
I don’t think open carry (the law) caused a backlash. I think, however, some of the OC twits sure did.
Here in Alabama we have open carry and CC with the $35 permit. I prefer to CC when in a urban area. In the woods out wheeling – open carry. I was in Lowes getting some poly for a floor project and saw a guy open carring in the checkout line. Hand Cannon in a nylon holster – Nobody seemed to really notice. I love Bama’
We need to tell the Managers at posted businesses that we will not be coming back as long as they remain posted.
A new gas station / convenience store opened near me recently and posted both 30.06 and 30.07 signs next to the entrance. I went inside and spoke to the Manager. I told him I would not be visiting his store again because of the signs, since it would be illegal for me if I was carrying concealed. I mentioned that if open carry was his concern, then only the 30.07 sign is needed, but by putting up both he was excluding both open and concealed carry. I also left a Texas State Rifle Association – No Guns = No Money card which explains why CHL (now LTC) holders are basically certified good guys. The cards are available here: http://www.stampedesolutions.com/stores/tsra/Accessories.htm
Later that day I submitted a notification on the Texas3006.com website which maps posted 30.06 and 30.07 signs.
A couple of weeks later I drove by and both signs were down. I went in and bought gas and a snack. I mentioned that I had noticed the signs were no longer up and that’s why I came in. The Manager said that one of his employees had been frightened when he saw a gun, so they put up the signs. But feedback from customers convinced him to take remove them. I thanked him and went home to remove the Texas3006.com notification.
During both visits I was wearing a sports coat, since I was out job hunting. I’m one of those casualties of low oil prices. I can’t help but think that proper presentation and the information on the TSRA card helped change his mind. We also need to reinforce good behavior by returning if the signs are removed and letting them know that is why we came back.
“Are Anti-Open Carry Gun Owners ‘Blaming the Victim’?”
Yes. Next question.
(Note: I don’t open carry, but I don’t attack and demean those who do.)
I’m very glad of the ability to open carry. I may only open carry rarely, but I can now carry concealed without concern for the clothing I wear. I was always concerned with printing and potentially being cited for it. Now I don’t have to worry about it.
I recently started open carrying (actually just started carrying in general) and I can testify at least 95% of the world goes through life either blind or convincing themselves their eyes are false. The person who even notices a carrier is the exception to prove the rule. Of course, I still make sure to guard my gun side, watch my surroundings, and keep my hand near enough to my gun to discourage spontaneous idiocy. Did you know that this is also responsible for me suddenly discovering I can do a lot more with just my left hand than I thought?
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