“Legislative debates over gun rights, up significantly since the mass shooting in Newtown, Conn., have spurred alleged death threats,” usatoday.com reports, “resulting in two high-profile arrests and causing lawmakers in one state to declare their legislature was under attack.” Notice the word “alleged.” Despite the declarative headline—Lawmakers who proposed gun laws face threats—the article uses the qualifier six times. That said, the post paints a picture of a vicious circle: gun guys get mad, gun grabbers call them madmen, gun guys get madder. Wash, rinse, repeat. Add unpopular (with the gun guys) gun control legislation and a few SWAT raids gone bad and you have millions of gun guys contemplating revolt against their own government. Are we there yet?
No, but it does seem like a storm is brewing.
Close…but not quite. I think there will be more incidents of violence, and that is exactly what the gun grabbers want to fuel thier cause with. I think they also want to divide and conquer the people of the gun from within, to make thier end goals easier.
I think its close as well, but with many of the gun grabbing laws getting shot down in flames, there may have to be another ‘event’ (school shooting) where fresh blood can be waved by the libtards to fuel another go at removing our liberty.
I suspect the tipping point will be reached if government decides to seize all 401K and IRA retirement accounts and replace the accounts with “guaranteed” government bonds.
Before anyone accuses me of being a conspiracy theorist, such discussions have taken place. I’m sure some will say “it’s only a discussion” to which I’ll respond “Government shouldn’t even be discussing such things.”
now a days, if you aren’t a conspiracy theorist, you just aren’t paying much attention
I think your on the right track but you come up a little short. The gov will also lop off a zero from all peasant bank accounts and do a 10 to 1 swap from green dollars to some new color. The old green dollars will become more worthless than they are now.
Ten cents on the dollar? We will be extremely lucky if Authority scrip maintains even a tenth of that value given the nature of fiat currency to explode when prodded too hard.
I think a tenth is a first step. If they try for more than that they’ll start a panic. The panic may happen anyway but I think they’ll try to ease into the BOHICA moment.
Reference to “the moon is a harsh mistress?”
Don’t cry for me Argentina!
they will as soon as the next bubble pops (whether it is student loan debt or derivatives).
Thats why you get rid of your 401K and never look back. There are ways to prevent buttf^ckery such as that.
No. We aren’t there yet. We can see it from here though.
We’re not there, but you can see it from here.
Not till the
RedcoatsPolice State start shooting first. They must take the first step to violence, till then we are still seeking peaceful redress of grievances.Spot on. They must show themselves for who/what they are. *Then* we fire back.
Right on Rebecca, but I doubt if they will do that, these people are experts at boiling frogs.
If I may say, we are getting WAY ahead of ourselves.
Before the Battles of Lexington and Concord the colonists tried everything short of warfare. Boycotts, demonstrations, voting in patriots to the Colonial Assemblies, Tea Dumpings and Burnings – not just in Boston, non-cooperation with Royal Officials and endless petitions to Parliament and King from “Your Loyal American Subjects”.
There was – and is – a long way to go before it came to an exchange of round, .70 cal lead weights and such.
I got a wild idea, let’s try Representative, Constitutional Democracy.
Only after we run the course through the Courts, de-elect some dedicated grabbers and treasonous dogs, pass some laws to protect our rights and have an NRA of some 20 million members, and the grabbers still don’t stop or resort to illegal means, only then should we even think this way.
Remember also that almost as many Patriots died on 19 April 1775 as British Regulars. With all due respect (and no offence to those who I know have been working hard) I don’t see people who can’t be bothered to vote, contribute or make a lot of noise, fighting the Agents of Grabberdum to the death.
The 2nd Amendment may be getting smacked around but the 1st is alive and well. Get out there and do stuff !
Very well said. +5
So how many “mistaken” raids with deaths until we really consider that their fired weapons have truly been fired?
Not to say the lines aren’t there but I’d venture to say they are a bit more blurred nowadays.
^ +10000
No, because for all their talk, gun guys are just going to do what they’re told to do.
As I’ve stated before, Rosa Parks — a 42-year old black woman in 1955 Alabama — had more courage than all of the loud-mouthed American gun-owners put together.
I really wish everybody would shut up with the “Don’t Tread On Me” and “From My Cold Dead Hands” rhetoric, because by now it’s obvious that nobody really meant it.
Rosa parks is a good parallel to whats going on today.
Did Rosa Parks NEED to ride in the front of the bus? NO! But it was her RIGHT.
This is the answer i give to the pro-gun grabbing people that dont see a purpose in owning a semi-auto centerfire (ar, ak, mini, or otherwise).
Most people are just gonna run their mouths and not try to effect change, or even write/call their reps…. i agree there. This platform is a fantastic and simple way to spread knowledge and get people moving!
Don’t bet on that!
It sounds like you’re saying “Eat, drink, and be merry. All is well in Zion.”
What you don’t realize, though, is that some of us have made a decision. Some of us realize that we have an obligation to defend our rights, should they be “tread upon.”
I’m not saying I’m going to be at the forefront of any kind of revolution. I’ve got too many health problems to get myself into a heap of trouble. But before you bag on these people, you should take into your mind that everybody has a snapping point.
And quit with the whole anonymous thing. You’ve got an opinion, and that’s fine, but be a man about it. Stand proudly when announcing your convictions, rather than hiding behind a veil of anonymity. It makes you look like a coward.
> quit with the whole anonymous thing.
Is “Cort” your full legal name?
Do you criticize other people who don’t post comments under their full legal name for using a handle?
go back to 4chan.
I took an oath to protect and defend The Constitution. It is an oath for life.
I’m guessing Cort would have told Silence Dogood to shut up too.
‘Some of us realize that we have an obligation to defend our rights, should they be “tread upon.”’
Are you saying that some rights are more important than others and can be tread upon just a little more? I can vote without showing my papers but not purchase a firearm. An FBI agent murdered Vicki Weaver while she was holding here baby. He suffered no consequence. The FBI and ATF murdered 80 men, women and children at Waco Texas without consequence. The ATF ran guns to Mexico resulting in the deaths of two federal agents and hundreds or thousands of Mexican citizens without consequence. Our rights are being trampled daily and we choose to do nothing. When they finally come to our door, there will be nobody left to do anything to help us. I hope when that time comes we remember how we did nothing to help our fellow citizens when their rights were being trampled. We need to ask ourselves a few questions. Is watching sports on television more important than freedom? Is the beer in the fridge more important than freedom? Is the sucking the teet of government to get the social security check more important than freedom? Is setting on our lazy asses waiting to die more important than freedom? If we can answer any of these questions with a “yes,” then lets just keep the status quo!
Dude, Rosa Parks didn’t plan her act of civil disobedience; her feet were tired, and she didn’t feel like giving up her seat. Similarly, the militia on Lexington Green were in the process of dispersing when someone (maybe a Lobsterback, maybe not) opened fire.
As other people have said, we haven’t crossed the Rubicon yet. Obama’s neither a Mugabe nor a Messiah, but he is a statist progressive, so we can expect further expansion of both the imperial Presidency and the federal bureaucracy.
The people pushing civilian disarmament are creating a very unstable situation, but they’re either too stupid or too malicious to worry about the potential consequences. The current trajectory took a while to develop. Stepping back is going to involve a return to, in some sense, American traditions (especially limited government) that we’ve abandoned for various reasons.
> Rosa parks is a good parallel to whats going on today.
When an American gun-owner is brave enough to defy the law and be arrested, talk to me about how “Rosa Parks is a good parrallell to what’s going on today”.
Rosa Parks wasn’t risking her life when she committed her “courageous act of disobedience.” She was risking a night in jail on a misdemeanor charge of disorderly conduct. And all she needed to do was sit. That’s all. She was tired, and she sat.
On the other hand, for a gun owner to resist the government as a gun owner pretty much requires the presence of a gun in his hand, and then it’s kill or be killed. The personal stakes are quite a bit higher.
If Rosa Parks had had good reason to believe that keeping to her seat would have called forth a SWAT raid on her home in the wee hours of the morning, I bet she would have stood up and moved to the back of the bus.
Or at the very least a felony charge and a loss of access for firearms for life. And if you are any sort of licensed professional, the loss of the ability to earn income.
The song says “Freedom’s just another word for nothing left to lose”. The corollary, is that those with a lot or even something to lose have a lot less freedom of action. So you want to preserve a free America for your kids to inherit? Pretty hard to take care of those kids if they are being sexually assaulted by their foster “parent” while mom and dad are in jail on gun charges.
“Rosa Parks wasn’t risking her life”
Sure, cause they would never think of lynching a black in the South in the 50’s.
I have no quarrel with Rosa Parks. We are still talking about prejudice here. Ms Parks was black, and therefore, in some quarters, a second class citizen. Now, I own a pistol, I am not only a second class citizen but a killer? Being white, a racist killer as well? I promote and cause mindless, insane acts? Where does your definition of race and courage start and end?
I think you mistyped the URL. huffingtonpost.com is what you’re looking for. You’re welcome 🙂
It’s hard to take with the truth smacks us in the face isn’t it?
Theaton, you have no idea of any truth, courage, honor. Rosa Parks was above you.
MOG, you don’t know me. You don’t know what I’ve done. I do know that Rosa Parks was above me when it comes to courage and I’m sure she was above you in the same respect.
Buell301 shouldn’t be telling people they aren’t welcome here just because he doesn’t like the truth they are telling. We gun owners are accurately describe as chest thumpers full of hot air. We have had our rights stepped on for 80+ years and we have done nothing. We have watched others murdered while having their rights stepped on and we have done nothing. I’m just as ashamed of myself as I am of you.
I’d say you are dead on, Anon. Lots of bluster and chest puffing but in the end if the G-man wants us not to have guns we will not have them – legally, that is.
Everyone will talk about 2A rights and suddenly lose them without very many, if any shots fired.
I, for one will readily hand over anything I have if the G-man wants it. I love my firearms but I love my family and life more. Prison time and death for an inanimate object? No thank you.
Many will argue that a holocaust scenario would not be far off in how the G-man will treat its people. I would like to point out that most of the holocausts work was done before anyone even declared war on Germany.
How many SWAT raids and deaths will it take? About 4-5 million looking at past instances.
> I would like to point out that most of the
> holocausts work was done before anyone
> even declared war on Germany.
Thanks to IBM.
That, my friend, is the talk of a defeatist. Do you think the average continental soldier had anything less to risk when he took the decision to fight against the British? How many of them left their livelihood, their wives, children, property and harvest to fight for a cause they believed in, knowing full well the ramifications of failing? You and “anon” should hang your head in shame for hiding behind others willing to put it on the line for you.
I’m just stating the facts. You all talk ‘cold dead hands’ and shit but you are all gonna put ’em down if it means prison or your life.
Difference in me and you is that I know what is important to me and you will find out.
This war is going to be fought by votes and so far this country has twice voted against gun rights. There are many of you in here who voted ‘D’, it really says all that needs to be said about standing up for rights.
As for the creation of a country… totally different story there my man… send an invading army and I will stand up. I ain’t down with shooting people D’s voted in.
“I’m just stating the facts. You all talk ‘cold dead hands’ and shit but you are all gonna put ‘em down if it means prison or your life.”
Wanna make a bet? would you bet your life on that assertion? It wouldnt be my first war.
“Difference in me and you is that I know what is important to me and you will find out.”
Then stay the f^ck home. Pretty simple.
“This war is going to be fought by votes and so far this country has twice voted against gun rights. ”
I agree with the votes thing but the bill of rights is not up to the chopping board with votes or the majority. That is not how the Constitution works. Specifically, our republic is intended to guarantee the minority protection from the majority.
“As for the creation of a country… totally different story there my man… send an invading army and I will stand up. I ain’t down with shooting people D’s voted in.”
Whats the difference if the end result is the same?
> You and “anon” should hang your head
> in shame for hiding behind others willing
> to put it on the line for you.
What have you put on the line re gun rights?
I am with you Anonymous. At least some are honest in their response to you. They represent the mentality of 99% of gun owners, self-centered cowards who don’t care about anyone else. They hope someone else is brave enough to stand up for their rights. The only threats they are willing to stand behind are the ballot box, but even that will fail us. I have seen countless comments on this very site that claim they could never vote republican.
So you’re correct, it’s all talk. A little middle-aged lady in the 50’s had more courage than these so called men will ever have. Dinner parties and watching the next sporting event with their buddies is far more important. Don’t even mention jail either. That scares the *%*$ out of them. They wouldn’t last a night in jail; just the thought of it is enough to cause them to willfully hand in their guns.
This fight is over before it started and the liberals know it. They know our side is filled with the aforementioned cowards and that we are easily divided. We will turn on each other for anything. It happens on this site all the time, when the NRA doesn’t do what they think they should do. One minute we love Magpul and the next we are calling for a boycott. Liberals at least stand behind each other. They don’t allow people to divide them as easily as we do. They even stand behind each other when it’s apparent they are in the wrong. That’s why they are now leading the country and why we will continue to lose.
There are some that give us a little hope (Ralph, Silver and a few others) but it will not be enough in the end. I will probably end up being a lone wolf and will gladly die before allowing the government to tell me what to do. The sad thing is it doesn’t have to be that way, if only we were united we would be a force to be reckoned with. They would be afraid to bring up gun control bills. We have the numbers, if we were united we could force treasonous people like DiFi and Bloomberg out and put them in jail where they belong. We would put the power back to we the people and make government officials realize they work for us. But that will never happen because sports and watching the new episode of Two and a Half men is more important. I feel sorry for the future children of this country. At one time this used to be a great country, thanks to our fore fathers and their courage. Unfortunately this generation came along and threw it all away.
The fool mistakes patience for cowardice.
The fool mistakes patience for waiting to turn his guns in so they don’t withhold the SS check. Isn’t it weird that the initials of an governmental agency are SS?
An example of a simple act of civil disobedience would have been an organized display of standard capacity magazines in jurisdictions where they are prohibited.
On January 11, 2013 — over two months ago — the Attorney General for D.C. went on the record as stating that prosecuting a person for violating the district’s magazine ban
Think about that. Although the criminal in question committed his crime in front of millions of witnesses, he was never charged. Why? Because the prosecutor admitted that gun control laws do not promote public safety nor serve the best interests of the people.
Unfortunately, because Wayne La Pierre has more in common with David Gregory — they’re both Washington insiders — than he does with American gun owners, so the fact that a gun-criminal was allowed to go free was never exploited by the NRA.
Other cities have a similar ban. For example, Denver Municipal Ordnance 38-130(i) states that
What would have happened if dozens or hundreds of people had shown up outside the state capitol building waving standard-capacity AR-15 magazines in the air?
Somebody’s organizing such a thing for July 2 — 1 day after Colorado’s magazine ban goes into effect. This is something that should have been done before the mag ban was voted into law.
And how many television shows must we miss to do some fool thing like civil disobedience?
> how many television shows must we miss
http://www.quickmeme.com/meme/369eer/
Some gun nut years ago was convinced his guns would be taken so he set up an ambush & killed 2 ATF agents I believe. This was when the threat was very very distant, not so far anymore, Randy
@ WLCE
“Wanna make a bet? would you bet your life on that assertion? It wouldnt be my first war.”
We shall see how it turns out. I don’t know if I would make a bet on it. Are you threatening me?
“Then stay the f^ck home. Pretty simple.”
I shall. The stupid usually are the first to die. The smart say nothing and make their move.
“I agree with the votes thing but the bill of rights is not up to the chopping board with votes or the majority. That is not how the Constitution works. Specifically, our republic is intended to guarantee the minority protection from the majority. “
I agree. It isn’t going that way though is it? People in this country illegally have as much rights as you do AND to vote who leads them! Some get to vote six times. Six times! Look at the Ohio ballot boxes. I don’t know how this could even happen but it did and some are even coming forward and saying so and have the proof to show they did.
“Whats the difference if the end result is the same?”
The difference is that I am not keen to pick up arms against follow countrymen. I don’t take talk like that lightly. The British were a different story. They were the original settlers here, yes but they stepped away for long enough time for a new, free people to be born. Big difference.
“I really wish everybody would shut up with the “Don’t Tread On Me” and “From My Cold Dead Hands” rhetoric, because by now it’s obvious that nobody really meant it.”
I agree with a large number of gun owners but the 5% shouldnt be scoffed at.
I know I fucking meant it.
Nonsense. The movement to restore the Second Amendment has already had many “Rosa Parks” moments. Rosa Parks had the most of the liberal establishment on her side and most of the northern media.
Just as there were many “Rosa Parks” who never made the headlines, there are plenty of Second Amendment activists who are still rotting in jail.
The big difference is that in the 60s -90s, we did not have the media that the left has owned for decades. Now we have a little new media on the internet and talk radio, and a smattering of Constitutionalists on Fox.
Not yet, but the drums are rolling assembly. And if things go to hell quickly, nobody can legitimately say there weren’t warned.
The game is trying to get the gun guys mad enough to look like crazies to everyone else. I can’t say they’re loosing.
Are they tightening then?
Gunnies are rugged individualists. For every two gun guys there are three opinions. Some of them even voted for Obama, and the rest can’t even agree on a caliber. So while millions of gun guys think that their government absolutely sucks — and they’re right — the odds on them getting together to do something violent is ludicrous.
What bothers me the most is the inequality that exists between our elected scumb@gs and the people. When our representatives threaten us with midnight SWAT raids and felony prosecutions for exercising our Constitutional rights and the murder of our household pets, that’s supposed to be good. When we shake our fists under the noses of the little tin gods who are trying to destroy our rights and our lives, that’s supposed to be bad.
Patrick Henry was right.
Nailed it, Ralph.
+1 well said
per ususal, ralph with the intellegent insight.
We don’t need to agree on caliber. We only need to agree on FREEDOM! We don’t need gun owners who voted for Obama. We don’t need gun owners who voted for McCain or Romney. We don’t even need all gun owners. We just need people who agree on FREEDOM!
Exactly, Theaton for the win!
Patrick Henry? What does the British are Coming have to do with this?
HAHA. You are referring to Paul Revere. Patrick Henry was known for “Give me liberty, or give me death”.
Individuals are smart, but groups of people are stupid. This applies equally to both sides in the current debate.
Your correct, our group of founding fathers were to stupid to see an America in which all the men were cowards!
It will only take one man with that dreaded silver tongue to turn the “stupid” masses on either side into a cohesive group. Then we’ll be there.
The tipping point has not been reached. As our county continues in its anti-freedom sensibilities, rights of all types will become increasingly restricted. Confiscation of cell phones near the border, ammo taxes, increased fees, range restrictions, psycholgical evaluations, etc. will give way to additional incremental restrictions and marginalization of gun owners. Obamacare will no doubt cause additional gun restrictions (as well as additional debt and taxes – because this president sucks).
Although my guns are stored safely, I’ve advised my children not to tell doctors about guns in our home. They simply do not need that information to treat a medical issue.
I am relatively surprised that one of these SWAT raids has not gone badly. What really concerns me is the next mass shooting, which damn well likely will occur in a “Gun Free Zone.” Then the fight to keep and expand our rights will get even uglier. Regardless, I live by the Boy Scout Motto: “Be prepared.”
That fact that you say our country continues in it’s anti-freedom sensibilities shows that the tipping point has been not only reached but passed with not even a notice.
Then it can hardly be called a tipping point now can it? We may be past the point where you think things should be, but that isn’t the tipping point.
I think that I would define “tipping point” as the point past which people start acting en masse
What’s your point? The question is are we reaching a tipping point. You also verify that we are passed the tipping point. Are answers are the same. Accur81 said the tipping point had not been reached and then presented facts showing it has passed.
No we are not there YET! But as they say the 3 % could raise a lot of Hell… To the gun control people i say BACK OFF and fix the real problems… DEBT…
Okay, let use some facts to see about raising hell.
Voting age population in 2012 240,926,957 only 53.6 percent turned out to vote. In other words, there were 129,072,347 people who actually voted. That is pathetic. However, we all know that there are around 100,000,000 gun owners. Imagine the hell that could be raised if those gun owners would get of their couches and vote fore freedom instead of government checks!
Good I’, very pleased that 111million retards did NOT go vote.
The PROBLEM is that millions of the dead, “noncitizens”, the “low information (morons)”, and illegal voters did.
If millions of dead people vote then we should even be further motivated to get off our butts and do something to restore freedom.
On the money, Theaton.
FUBAR
Have to agree.
Well, if I counted every time I read or heard an alleged liberal say something along the lines of “he should be shot with his own assault weapon–that’d be social justice,” or “he just has a gun because of a little peepee–we ought to shoot him in his little peepee and just fix the problem for good,” then I could report to the news that I’ve had violent threats too.
The difference is that I’m not a whiny baby trying to justify the abrogation of civil rights.
That’s the problem though. While we try to illustrate our position with statistics and reasoning, the other side is busy rolling around on the ground kicking and screaming. Think about it, if your kid had a well-reasoned, intelligent appeal for why he should have a cookie, you likely would still say no, because that’s your job/right as a parent. BUT, if your same kid screamed bloody murder and rolled around on the floor for hours, you’d probably consider giving it to him just to shut him up. A parallel can be drawn between the two situations. (Not perfect, I know… But the point is made nonetheless)
Very well put. I’ve said over and over that we have got to make noise and spread misery among the powers-that-be till they get the message. We don’t need numbers, we need action!
“BUT, if your same kid screamed bloody murder and rolled around on the floor for hours, you’d probably consider giving it to him just to shut him up.”
Or from the very beginning you could teach him/her that tactic doesn’t work, that there are always consequences good &/or bad for every action. After a while they don’t even try the tantrum route but grow into responsible thinking humans.
And while your dreaming the rest of the world has been taught the way you want, Obama gets elected twice by the tantrum throwers and your left to wonder why your rights are disappearing from under your nose.
Case in point, apparently when I was around 3 yrs old, I threw a tantrum because it worked on my Dad. He asked why I acted up when he was home but not around Mom. I told him that it was because he gave me what I wanted. He said, well that’s not going to work anymore, and I never threw another tantrum in my life.
The Syrian revolution began when 15 teenage boys were arrested and tortured for writing “down with the regime” on a wall. To those who nay say the idea that we could end up in that kind of ground game I think you need to look at the history of the Syrian Revolution in comparison to where we are today. Violence is a terrible thing, but it does not take much to remove the veneer of polite society and replace it with war.
Comparing Syrian people with American people is like comparing tigers to housecats. Life in Syria without war is a hard thing. Life in America? Pppffttt. How many of you have an ‘i’ device that costs over $500? How many of you know someone who has everything they need but didn’t need to work a day in their lives? Yeah, exactly.
Comparing the two people and trying to use them in relation to anything we have going on over here is way out in left field.
While you may have a spine, the vast majority of this society are cattle waiting to become veal and happy to do it.
Now if we took away a cell signal, cable and the Interwebs… oh… there might be fights aplenty.
Nah, we more then most believe in the checks and balances of the current system. To go to war against your neighbors is about as extreme a measure as can be imagined.
If our petty tyrants are willing to be incremental and appear to let the petition for redress appear to be available and functioning, I would doubt an insurrection would happen.
If someone gets crazy and declares martial law or similar
or if government has internal strife, that would not be a good sign.
That would not be a good sign. After the Congress passes a firearms confiscation law, the first question that most gun owners will ask will be: “Where do I go to turn my firearms in?”
I’m not so sure.
I’ll think that many would turn in some (token) guns, but I actually think the majority would probably keep at least one firearm stashed away somewhere.
You could be correct and I really hope you are.
‘That would not be a good sign. After the Congress passes a firearms confiscation law, the first question that most gun owners will ask will be: “Where do I go to turn my firearms in?”’
I don’t think that’s going to happen, turning in firearms. It didn’t happen in Australia or Europe, those countries have millions of illegally held firearms in spite of the laws. Why should it be different here?
The guns that were surrendered in UK and elsewhere were already registered & their owners known to the authorities, yet only now is the extent of noncompliance being made known. We don’t have registration here, just Form 4473.
If BATFE has created a Frankenbase of owners based on paper 4473’s and FFL holders’ logbooks, then the administration has only to decide if it’s accurate enough to direct state & local LEOs to round up the guns.
Only – food for thought: in 1983 I was sent to Germany on active duty. I retrieved my Chiefs Special from my car, threw it in my bag & got on the plane. Once overseas I learned the Model 36 wouldn’t be importable under GCA-68 `factoring criteria’. I wrote to BATF & they provided a letter confirming the original place, date, & time of purchase. Stateside buy, no problem.
I had bought the gun in 1973.
See? Noncompliance with gun control measures:
http://reason.com/archives/2012/12/22/gun-restrictions-have-always-bred-defian
http://synonblog.dailymail.co.uk/2013/02/gun-control-surprise-europeans-like-americans-resist-any-gun-ban.html
Thanks to Dave for those links.
As a sign of protest if any ban gets passed in your area why not start flying the flag upside down? I bet dollars to donuts that take a drive through any neighborhood stop at any house with a flag pole that is flying the USA flag that homeowner is more than likely gun owner, pro-2nd Amendment and against any weapons ban. Sure there will be some oddballs but for the rest of us who support the 2nd Amendment why not fly the flag upside down in protest?
I haven’t flown my flag since Obama was elected & I will not fly it until that GD POS & the demoRATS don’t have a majority…of course that could be never again.
Fair weather patriot?
I figure that a high profile raid on an innocent party in the style of
Ruby Ridge or Waco is fast on the way. That will be the tipping point.
Escalation from the gungrabbers will force things to go down-
hill fast. After that is anybodies guess.
If it wasn’t before then why would it be now?
It won’t be.
Public opinion. It’s not about what is actually happening, it’s how people feel about it.
“But your friends are fewer now. Some have drifted off somewhere or submerged themselves in their work. You no longer see as many as you did at meetings or gatherings. Informal groups become smaller; attendance drops off in little organizations, and the organizations themselves wither. Now, in small gatherings of your oldest friends, you feel that you are talking to yourselves, that you are isolated from the reality of things. This weakens your confidence still further and serves as a further deterrent to—to what? It is clearer all the time that, if you are going to do anything, you must make an occasion to do it, and then you are obviously a troublemaker. So you wait, and you wait.
“But the one great shocking occasion, when tens or hundreds or thousands will join with you, never comes. That’s the difficulty. If the last and worst act of the whole regime had come immediately after the first and smallest, thousands, yes, millions would have been sufficiently shocked—if, let us say, the gassing of the Jews in ’43 had come immediately after the ‘German Firm’ stickers on the windows of non-Jewish shops in ’33. But of course this isn’t the way it happens. In between come all the hundreds of little steps, some of them imperceptible, each of them preparing you not to be shocked by the next. Step C is not so much worse than Step B, and, if you did not make a stand at Step B, why should you at Step C? And so on to Step D.
“And one day, too late, your principles, if you were ever sensible of them, all rush in upon you. The burden of self-deception has grown too heavy, and some minor incident, in my case my little boy, hardly more than a baby, saying ‘Jewish swine,’ collapses it all at once, and you see that everything, everything, has changed and changed completely under your nose. The world you live in—your nation, your people—is not the world you were born in at all. The forms are all there, all untouched, all reassuring, the houses, the shops, the jobs, the mealtimes, the visits, the concerts, the cinema, the holidays. But the spirit, which you never noticed because you made the lifelong mistake of identifying it with the forms, is changed. Now you live in a world of hate and fear, and the people who hate and fear do not even know it themselves; when everyone is transformed, no one is transformed. Now you live in a system which rules without responsibility even to God. The system itself could not have intended this in the beginning, but in order to sustain itself it was compelled to go all the way.”
Excerpt from: They Thought They Were Free: The Germans, 1933-45 by Milton Mayer
http://www.press.uchicago.edu/Misc/Chicago/511928.html
This is where we are. We all see it ramping up in small steps but we still do nothing. We are waiting for the big event that will shock people awake. It won’t come and one day we will find that we are living in the society we have always feared.
Reflect on the fact that recently a senator had to filibuster for 13 hours to get an answer to a question about a scenario that would’ve been unthinkable just a few years ago: could and would the President assassinate an American citizen via drone inside the US?
Expect more wars, more rallying around the flag, more distractions and diversions (sequester), etc. etc.
Either dig in and accept the responsibilities and possible consequences of resisting, give in, or get out. I’m making plans to do the last thing. Anywhere that’s less of a police state than what America’s becoming will be safer.
We are the frogs in the pot of water on the stove. Once the point of boiling is reached, will we be able to do anything or will we have been boiled into submission?
Keeping in mind that most of us are law abiding citizens who have purposely chosen to play by the rules so that we can continue to enjoy the 2nd Amendment Rights protected by our Constitution, there is a lot of inertia to overcome to move this mass of gun owners into action. I thought I could see it reaching that point in New York and was waiting for mass demonstrations with thousands waving 30 round pmags in their Governor’s face and daring him to arrest them but I think that moment of outrage has passed. There will be court cases and protests, but the outbursts of rage have died down.
Will there be one spark which will ignite {and unite} us into action? Or will we wait for the first man to stand and die in a confrontation and the coalesce around his fallen body? Or will we watch that man die and then walk away? These questions occupy more of my thoughts lately.
You will hear “well, he was breaking the law!” as people who talk big justify to themselves why they won’t do anything this time.
To be law-abiding in a time when such corrupt madmen make the law is to be a slave of your own choosing.
Imagine if the founding fathers had been law-abiding.
I was trying to point out that to move from following the law to civil disobedience-or more-requires a great step for those who have spend their lives conforming to society’s rules. It will take a conscious decision to risk life and family and property. I watched people get swept up by a whim and join the Rodney King riots here in Atlanta.{ I was on the 3rd floor of a building which had its ground floor windows broken out by basically college kids on a lark}. I don’t think that gun owners will be so quick to become a herd.
I am not saying the time won’t come and that action won’t be warranted.
On the plus side, we are not lone frogs. If enough frogs or the right frogs around us start croaking (sorry, I had to do it) it can lead to a tipping point. Predicting the scenario of the necessary conditions before the tipping point is impossible, but we’ll know it when we see it.
Excellent reference to “They Thought They Were Free”. It is a book that I think very highly of.
We have tremendous advantages to the Germans of that time. We have not just lost a war. We have a much longer tradition of freedom. We do not have a long tradition of bowing to authority.
We have the internet, a readable Constitution with checks and balances that does not have an “emergency clause” to give all power to the executive.
I agree that the problem is incrementalism, but I am heartened by the responses in 1994 and 2010.
We shall see. Personally I don’t think we are anywhere near a revolution or other kind of shooting war in the United States. However, I think that given the current course of the nation towards socialism , eventually it will result in one of two things. Either people give in to complete socialism, or there is indeed a shooting war.
Either way, the nation as we have known it will not last another fifty years unless there is drastic change in liberals being in charge. Don’t count on that.
It’s not just the 2A, it’s the fate of the entire nation that is being undermined.
A shadow Soviet State is being created and except for the Radio Talkers no media is covering the event as a co-ordinated take over
A shadow Soviet State already exists: it’s called Russia now.
I served in Germany during the Cold War and Russia today looks nothing like the Soviet Union of old. Current and proposed American policies today look much more similar to the Soviet Union in many ways than modern Russia does.
Thank you for your service.
Theaton, no reason to thank me, the honor was mine. I wanted to stand up to tyranny in defense of the country which had given me so much freedom and opportunity.
Unfortunately one day many years later I opened my eyes and realized the ideology which I had stood against overseas…seemed to have reconstituted itself here.
Wayne Lapierre should haul out some of his hate mail, pick out the most hateful, incoherent, and extreme, and read it in public.
I hope that Mr. LaPierre is getting hate mail. He is anti-freedom. He is not a friend to the Second Amendment.
Uh…
Smile, be civil, I mean you no harm. Trust me. An individual, or group, that is afraid, is very dangerous. Threats are counter productive. A government official can have you investigated/arrested for very little reason.
If Mr. LaPierre and we eighty-million gun owners would have said no to the first NICS check, we wouldn’t be here talking about an expanded NICS check. If the NRA and all the gun owners at the time would have said no to the 1934 NFA, 1968 GCA and 1994 AWB, we wouldn’t be here fighting another ban. We’d probably be fighting it, but it would be a much easier fight.
> Lawmakers who proposed gun laws face threats
I think that just about any public figure — politician, actor, singer, etc. — receives threats on a semi-regular basis.
It’s probably not unusual for these people to receive threats all the time, but usually there’s no political advantage in making an issue of them.
Gun rights proponents need to exercise as much self control as possible. All of the noise about gun control may make you mad as hell, but if you slip and lose your temper, then you’ve done immeasurable harm to the cause.
One (otherwise) law-abiding guy, legally carrying concealed, sitting in his car in a parking lot slips and shoots at some kids who are playing their music too loud for his taste or talking trash, and the antis have a new head on a pike to parade around saying,
“See? Gun owners are all assholes! They’re all dangerous! They’re all waiting for an excuse to shoot someone!”
It doesn’t matter at all that this is completely false. Maybe he was unstable to begin with, and it’s just coincidence that he happened to be carrying, but it doesn’t matter at all, because the part of the public that can be swayed to one side or the other – the people that both sides need to sway if their side is to win – will feel scared or even horrified by that one guy’s single slip, and pick a side based on that feeling.
This argument, in the public’s eye, has nothing to do with fact or reason and everything to do with impression and emotion. Each of us has to be constantly vigilant about our own behavior, especially when we’re frustrated or angry. You have to catch yourself before you get angry, measure every reaction and choose wisely, because one slip and we just might lose a swath of those undecided people that we need on our side. Repairing the damage from one slip might take years and thousands of people protesting and writing thousands of letters.
That brings up another point. Keep in mind that laws aren’t permanent. One sitting government can make a stupid law, and the next can overturn it. We should definitely fight like hell, and by “fight” I mean write letters to our reps and to newspapers and magazines; go to protests and be heard; in debate, bring reason and fact and leave the antis nowhere to hide but their own fear; introduce new people to shooting so they see what it’s really about; and do it all peacefully, calmly, and with consideration of the impression your actions will leave on the undecided; but also, maybe even above all else, keep perspective. In a year or three we can vote this government out and vote another in who will erase stupid/wrong laws.
The thing about tipping points is that it’s a slow creep up to that point and a quick drop once it’s hit. I feel in my gut that we’re not at that point, and as bad as things are, it will take even more before things really go FUBAR. That being said, the statists are clearly willing to use any event to lunge towards disarmament. If it wasn’t for the fact that both congress and the media have such low approval (and high distrust), we would already be under UK levels of grabbing and regulation.
All thay being said, expect anything, prepare for the worst, and involve any friends or family that will listen and prepare with you.
Why should I “notice” the word “alleged”? You should know better than most that the absence of this word could lead to legal liability for defamation if the criminal charges are not later proved; “alleged” is a safe-harbor for the press, as it means no more that ” somebody else said it and I don’t know if it is true or not.” No need to stir the pot; there is plenty going on to keep this issue at full boil.
I’d like to believe that 99.9% of our community, while angry, are sensible and strategic enough to keep up the peaceful protests + some civil disobedience. Most of the TTAG commenters give me this hope that if we play the long game, we can win. Being passionate, but peaceful, loud, but rational… that’s how we’ll defy stereotypes and win more supporters for our 2A rights, even if they don’t own a gun right now.
But I’d be lying if I said it hasn’t occurred to me that somewhere out there is some LONE NUT, who rather than be courageously peaceful and wise, is some self-righteous nut like Dorner and goes on a killing spree, murdering either police / government officials, thereby adding more fuel to the fire. Things are bad enough already… an incident like that would make the current backlash escalate to confiscation-type levels.
Eighty plus years of passification, 1934 NFA, 1968 GCA, 1986 whatever it was, 1994 AWB on and on and on. We’ve pussified ourselves out of our rights. How many more years of pussification do you want? Will you only be happy when you hear dozens of fellow citizens saying, “why are they putting us all in this big shower?”
“Stand your ground. Don’t fire unless fired upon, but if they mean to have a war, let it begin here.” – Captain John Parker, April 19, 1775, Lexington Green
Unless or until they actively attempt to disarm the people we must cleave to the legal processes. If that Rubicon is crossed, well, we are keeping our powder dry.
Watts v. United States, 394 US 705 (1969); Virginia v. Black 538 US 343 (2003); Terminiello v. Chicago, 337 US 1 (1949); Brandenberg v. Ohio, 395 US 444 (1969).
Regarding threats to politicians, and hate speech gernerally, in the context of First Amendment protections.
Not there yet, but the push is on. It will be, of course, “radical gun owners” that light the fuse, over alleged 2nd amendment violations by the government.
If one more arm chair warrior cites some Revolutionary War scenario or quote from 300 years ago I might just ditch this site and go get my gun news from CBS.
What are YOU gonna do? Where were the “Oathkeepers” during the confiscation during Katrina? Where were you guys like you when they banned fully automatics?
Or any other POS gun legislation that was passed in the last century.
You were at home staring at your guns trolling the internet to talk about how you’ll never give up your 2nd Amendment right. While you were busy fighting for the 2nd, we lost the 1st, 3rd, 4th 5th, etc. Unmanned planes now patrol our skies waiting for one of you numb nuts to wave your guns in protest. Your internet is now monitered and your right to privacy non-existant. CIPSA will allow raids of your home because your 13 year old daughter pirated the latest Justin Bieber album. DHS bought over 2,000 tanks and most have the ability to intergrate microwave guns. Yes, microwaves.
Saying : “we’re not there yet, but We can see it” is like saying you havent stepped in dogsh*t but can smell it, meanwhile obama and the republicans are wiping your nose with a sh*t stained napkin telling you there is a Constition.
If any of you want to do something. Draw a line. Let the world know where you stand. Make peace with your God. Have your military buddies on speedial. Because you beer belly totin’ allstars can’t do this without them. If you can get them to mutiny and have a military take ovegovernment then you have a chance. But as far as I’m concerned no one on this blog is going to do anything, ANYtime soon.
This! end of story.
Been saying this all day… what are you gonna do?
One guard unit refused orders to confiscate guns during Katrina.
After it was over many states, including Louisiana, passed laws against the practice, and a law against it was passed at the federal level, as I recall.
So the way I see it is… The only way it’s going to happen is if a state breaks off/fights back – then many from the pro Constitution side will flock to that state and form up ranks. Most people would choose not to go down in a flaming gun battle on their own with no hope of victory, with the state run media just painting them as some crazy militant, as they would… But if a whole state fought back, well then it’s a whole new game and the triangle hats and flutes come back out.
No. We haven’t even had any elections to vote in yet since Sandy Hook.
Yeah, that’s the real answer. Dems have no idea what a can they have opened up. I think they’re going to get wiped out in the next election. I know, honestly, I’m not a Republican. I’m a moderate dude who tried to stay out of their lousy two-party, get nothing done, corrupt as the mob game. But I for one will NEVER vote for a Democrat again as long as I live just because of this. Just as I didn’t want my rights taken away after 9/11 because of a foreign terrorist, I don’t want my rights taken away now because of a domestic terrorist. The only people this makes happy is the way left Libbos, who vote Dem anyway. What it did is push everyone else like me farrr to the right. None of their proposed laws do anything but take away from the people. The people will resent that heavily as I do and they will get washed away in the next election. If the Repubs don’t pick up on this and use it as their theme to take back control, then they are blind. This one issue has made me see right through their whole nanny state ideology. The question is: how many more are there like me? I’m guessing many. All of those people who are flocking to buy guns who never did before are all on our side now. The Dems are on a suicide mission and their so blindly foolish they have no idea they’re driving themselves off a cliff like the sheep that they are.
Yeah, let’s see what happens in 2014. Obama’s plan has been to destroy the GOP so he can go to town second half. The backlash against the 2A attacks, the drones, the sequester drama, etc. may cost them big in 2014. I don’t see the senate swinging GOP at the Fed level, but some state legislatures might.
So you’re saying Obama did nothing to gun owners before the 2012 election?
No dude. I’m not saying that. I’m saying Obama went full bore after the 2NDA as soon as he got re-elected. I’m not a Dem. I’m a radically independent moderate. I’m saying that is a radically unprecendented attack on our constitution and has pushed anyone who is not a flaming liberal retard to the right. Far right. You’d have to admit nothing this bad has happened before. When has ammo tripled and everything else doubled and ran out of stock in 2 weeks? I’m not a new gun owner. I’m not naive. I just chose to stay out of politics until they forced me to go far to one side by attacking my God given liberties and everything I believe in. I grew up right next to Valley Forge Park. I know my freaking history. The people who walked that ground before me are the ones who made this country with their bravery and conviction. If I don’t have the same conviction and bravery then I don’t deserve to walk this ground I grew up on. You don’t have to guess what side I’m on. I’m the dude who will be standing next to you bro.
Fast and Furious happened before the 2012 Election. That resulted in the long gun reporting in the Southwest states. Yes, the Second Amendment is under more attack now but Obama was attacking other right full bore before the 2012 election. Second Amendment people need to be all rights people. If we’re not willing to stand up for the rights of gay people to marry whom ever they wish, why should we expect them to stand up for the right to keep and bear arms. That’s just an example, I don’t want to get off topic. There was plenty that Obama did before the election and the stupid Republicans nominated a not so different candidate and they did the same thing in 2008. We have to get this two party bull crap out of the heads of people. we have to get gun owners to vote their own best interests. Those interests are rights and freedom, not who will give them the most free shit from the government.
I don’t take the idea of a revolt very seriously, but non-compliance has precedents:
http://reason.com/archives/2012/12/22/gun-restrictions-have-always-bred-defian
http://synonblog.dailymail.co.uk/2013/02/gun-control-surprise-europeans-like-americans-resist-any-gun-ban.html
These “threats” are just another part of the gun grabbers’ strategy. Some of them are made up by the “victim” to justify a vote for more gun control. Some are instigated by members of the gun control team — tools of the Obama-Bloomberg machine. They’re calling and threatening legislators in a bit of clever reverse psychology, posing as right wing extremists. They know it will cement that legislator’s opinion.
A tiny percentage of them might come from real gun owners. Let’s face it, we have a few fanatics in our midst. But the vast majority of us know that singling people out and threatening them with violence won’t win us any battles.
When it blows up – then what?
Molon labe
bo needs to be real carefull who he gets in bed with or he could go the way of sadam, traitors aren’t treated kindly. I think his only hope would be NATO & I believe those piss ants would get more than they bargained for, Randy
They are playing a game of chess , (they want the NEW WORLD ORDER) yes there is a line in the sand , different for different folks, it’s about LIBERTY or no liberty. Most will never do any thing… But the sleeping GIANT is starting to awake.. (look at the sky rocket in NRA and other gun rights memberships etc.) yes we may not have the numbers ,,, but never forget WE HAVE THE GUNS… and if it starts …. the rest for be forced to take sides …( our Civil War) …. the south never had the numbers or factories etc… The RED COATS in our war for Independence were the worlds largest army and had lots of skills at war… But a cause like freedom and liberty makes a different mind set ,, a will to win … paid armies never have this …. look at the middle east …. they fight for god and country and keep on fighting …
Ah hell, y’all do what you want too, I’ll do whatever I have to. Not worth all this. Quit, give up, fight to the death, kiss ass, rotate and stick head firmly up. Play bad ass, play appeasement reasonably sane. Blame everyone, blame no one, there is no rational for irrational people. My opinion is as worthless as anybody else’s. I can tell you this, this is not America anymore.
+1 MOG.
Those of us that are commenting about the time of violence against the government not happening “Yet”, might be missing one thing. The millions of gun owners who are NOT here commenting, have no interest in discussion, will NOT remain calm and reasoned, and wouldn’t hang around with us on a bet.
Let’s not get the idea that we have a finger on the pulse of all the gun owners. There are some hard core gunnies out there that won’t tolerate near as much as we would. I believe we will be surprised and disappointed when the SHTF.
I agree. I am pointing out that no one on here will be those folk and few are smart enough to get why. I think you do though.
Would it have anything to do with “Main Core” or any other such similar NSA computer programs?
Not that I know of. It has to do with those that are speaking too loudly will be the first ones traced, addressed and visited by the G-man. No one on here will know that there have been arrests. The owner of this site will likely be the first one carried away.
My point is that those that are screaming loudest and may in fact be the ones to do something are the first ones gone.
What are you gonna do? Even a simple rally would be monitored by the government. Everything is watched nowadays. How do you disagree with that kind of power?
@ Buuurr, “Main Core” & similar programs are how they are going to ID them and anyone else who has ever visited a site that is deemed unacceptable by the .gov like this one which includes you too despite your lack of inflammatory rhetoric.
What am I gonna do? I’m not stupid enough to even bother answering that question.
http://youtu.be/MkAn3VIe1yQ
All Gun Owners: If you want an idea of what you are up against, the lies you’ve been told for your entire life, if you want to see the current system for what it really is, please view this youtube channel. Watch his videos in your free time. Do your own Research. Come to your OWN conclusions based off facts, not main stream media. Its not conspiracy.
If you do not believe me look up “USA Corporation”. The US is in fact owned by shareholders. Obama is in fact a CEO and congress just carries out the orders.
And to answer the question, Robert, if we were there Obama would pull an Abe Lincoln and declare martial law. Which he hasn’t. He’s a puss*. He couldn’t even make eye contact with a Mormon who doesn’t drink or smoke during the first debate. He resorts to unmanned drone strikes on civilians. He blames everyone for everything going wrong. The economy(Bush), sequestor (Republicans), WH tours (Secret Service) and the list goes on and on. Maybe Nancy Napolitano, she’s insane enough, would start kickin’ down doors. But Obama is definitely 1)scared of gun owners (That’s why he didn’t do jack squat his first term)
2) He and his family are livin’ the dream at the taxpayers expense. Why ruin a good lifestyle?
3) Congress and rhe Federal reserve are also enjoying printing unlimited money and spending it on killing people overseas who just want to be left alone.
I’m more worried about money. The economy. The only thing holding this bubble together is money.
The only thing holding our economy together is the illusion of money. It looks like money, feels like money and spends like money. the problem is that there is way to much of it being printed with nothing to back it up. When the curtain is pulled back on the illusion, the panice will start. At the end of the panic, we will be using $1,000,000 treasury notes for kindling and toilet paper. Those who don’t study the past are condemned to repeat it.
My concern is that someone on our side will make the first move at the wrong time. The press is already on the grabbers side. It wouldnt take much to take a stand for freedom and turn the fence sitters and country against us.
So you’re worried about something of which you have no control? That is the defintion of fear and fear is what has gotten us to this point.
Burrr or whoever you are….
Thanks for letting us know that you have never fought for your country and never will. I should stop there, but I’d love to really tell you what I think.
Thanks for the laugh, Joe. Ironically the vast majority of my friends are marines and navy vets. They are generally 15 years older than me and disagree with very little I say in regards to our current condition.
I love and honor our vets and hold none higher but even they (the friends and shooting buddies I know) are at a loss as to what this country is on about.
You can take that as you will. I could care less.
The proper phrase is “couldn’t care less.” To say you could care less implies you care at least some and there is room to care less.
Sure. Whatever. How do you know by my reply that that is not what I meant? Would I rather not be having this discussion because this may happen. No, I wouldn’t. Could I care less? Yes, I could. But I like rights.
@ Redleg says:
“March 15, 2013 at 22:03
@ Buuurr, “Main Core” & similar programs are how they are going to ID them and anyone else who has ever visited a site that is deemed unacceptable by the .gov like this one which includes you too despite your lack of inflammatory rhetoric.
What am I gonna do? I’m not stupid enough to even bother answering that question.”
I’m with you. I have been trying to point this out without saying all day. Some just don’t get it.
Anyone waiting for the government to fire the first shot will be waiting a long time. They’re not stupid enough for that. They’ll just use their useful idiot slave-citizens to vote rights away. Until people realize the first shot’s already been fired, though not literally, nothing will move.
Correct. Thank you, Sir.
It’s interesting to see that the liberal trolls have found TTAG in growing numbers… I wonder what that might be a sign of?
Just wondering who might the trolls be in your opinion, the ones who don’t blindly support the enforcers any longer or the ones who justify everything done by those with badges?
I skipped the flame war and shouting from the various and sundry trolls to make a quiet comment.
After CA. began sending swat teams to confiscate guns from owners who had been determined to be no longer “qualified” to own them…
After NY began setting stings to reinforce the new draconian measures in the misnamed SAFE ACT…
After watching the Daley/Obama/Madigan machine try to force – feed the rest of IL measure after measure that are all focused on eventual criminalization and seizure of all firearms…
I’ve drawn my line in the sand. When they show up at my door, or my neighbors door, or doors in my county… When the seizures start here – I’m done backing up.
Till then I’m calling and writing my reps. Hoping and praying for the best.
As soon as the weapons I own become illegal, then I become a felon. I WILL NOT comply. I will not hold my children’s hands as we wait passively to board the cars to the camps.
And while you ridicule me for being a paranoid alarmist, a kook, a nut job – remember your history. The gulag, the camps, the prisons. We’ve seen it all before, folks. And it can only happen if they can convince us it is not. And if they disarm us.
Well, not this particular Old Fat White Guy. Don’t care to live in that world.
Yes, I’m still taking the meds. No, I don’t think they’re coming tonight. But I know exactly how far I will be pushed.
And I’m makin’ plans.
It is good that gun owners are angry. And it is time that this anger is channeled in a non violent way to hammer away at the anti gun locales and politicians in our country. Whatever the number of gun owners is – 80 million or 130 million depending upon whom you ask – even half the smaller of this number boycotting products and services offered by anti gun states would make a big dent in the finances of the states in question. Illinois, California, New York and New Jersey are not in the pink of financial health. Their most anti gun politicians don’t know thrift either. Let’s just help them with a non-violent punch to the wallet. There are many businesses that are still in these states. Give them an incentive to move out through reduced sales. I’ll bet many of these businesses are considering moving to low tax locales anyway, and these will invariably be pro gun locales as well. There’s no need for violence. This is a war that can definitely be won through peaceful means.
The tripwires have been crossed and it’s (long past) time we were in open revolt, to arms! TO ARMS!
Or
There are and have been infringements, but redress of grievance is still possible from within, it is not time for armed rebellion.
Personally the latter seems the more accurate, but there is no consensus. Further, I think it folly to believe that a consensus will be reached in time of peace. I’ve been hanging back, reading much and saying nothing (not just of this thread, but the site, even the whole debate where ever it rages). In all that, I think everyone has a piece of the puzzle, but at least in this thread no one has got the whole picture.
The picture:
This is not a time for armed revolt. Further, as some have said, it would be hard to conceive of a general uprising with most people can’t be bothered to vote. This is accurate by degrees, but also misunderstands a lot. One of the strongest reasons there isn’t, and isn’t going to be momentarily an armed revolt is the simple fact that redress of grievance is still entirely possible from within. To say that there aren’t any among us who are willing to fight, engage in violent acts, assassinate, murder, bomb and poison and yes, to endure imprisonment or even to die literally for symbolic reasons (martyrdom) is to grossly misunderstand both the people and the situation. Firing a shot is easy, going to prison is easy (not pleasant, but it’s not that hard to do, especially these days), dying is in fact very easy to do, something I’d expect ‘gun guys’ to understand. What is hard it to do any of these things in vain, which is what a one man revolution comes to. What’s also hard is to organize, to protest, to write and call and email and to sacrifice in multitudes of small ways when these also seem to be in vain. I assure you though, they are not in vain, they have an effect on the political and legal process, they also have an effect on the people. Were one may not stand alone, how many would offer or come to the aid of thousands under siege in open revolt that stood a chance of making real change? Where one would not protest at the statehouse, how many would join hundreds there?
These things take time to develop momentum, and you have to be able to sustain and hold out long enough for that momentum to develop, and for others to recognize it, and to understand that what you’re doing is not in vain. This is as true of armed revolt as it is of protest, lawsuit and politicking. Furthermore, the organizations that will serve as rally points for those who would fight a revolution are the self same organizations that would form to protest and etc.
For those of you who feel it is all in vain, my apologies, for you are not properly motivated, and that’s to some degree the fault of those of us who feel otherwise. For those of you who are ready to violently resist, my apologies, most of us won’t be joining you at this time, yet however rash your decision and actions, if it comes to a violent revolution you’ll be hailed as martyrs and heroes. . . of course if it never comes to that you’ll be remembered as fools and criminals.
For everyone else, decide which camp you’re in, and if the former, resolve to be more motivated, consider what about freedom is important to you and your progeny, if the latter, rather than unnecessary violence, and wasteful inaction waiting for the moment to strike, resolve to make a few phone calls, write some emails, budget a monthly donation to a political or social organization that is trying to make a difference.
To all; reach out to your friends and families, your co-workers. The more organized we are the more effective we will be if it ever comes to a fight, and the less likely it will be that such a fight is ever the only way.
A storm is brewing
I believe we are getting close. I will not comply with any registration or confiscation. If they want em they gotta come and take em from my cold dead hands.
Marvelous, what a blog it is! This website provides useful information to us,
keep it up.
Comments are closed.