The San Bernardino terrorist attack stimulated yet another gun sales surge and did nothing to discourage the anti-gun agitators from continuing, indeed ratcheting up their campaign for civilian disarmament. Imagine a(nother) mass murder attack on a school, this time by a team of terrorists. How would that effect the landscape for U.S. gun rights?

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87 COMMENTS

  1. Obama would use the words “time and time again” and call for more gun control. Josh (not)Earnest would talk down the the press and the american people in his usual condescending tone and portray the entirety of the american people as idiots for not agreeing with them.

    Something like that.

    Realists would tool up further and prepare themselves. Idealists would continue dreaming about a gun-free utopia and continue their hate filled vitriol on main stream media and in the comments sections of blogs that delete comments from disagreeing philosophies while simultaneously calling for a “discussion.”

    • You forgot a few:
      * Michael Bloomberg would pay for lots of PR about why we should ban guns and expand background checks, even though the criminals bought the guns with background checks.
      * A few states, like CA or NJ, would pass laws that will do nothing but infringe on the rights of the law abiding.

      • Too late. There are now pending THREE bills to ban ARs and AKs by banning bullet buttons and classifying all existing firearms as “assault weapons,” another bill to ban 80% lowers, and a proposed ballot initiative to require licensing or ammo vendors and purchasers. Plus, no more Colt 1911s. And and and

        • so what. they can propose anything they want, it has no bearing on whether or not it has a snow balls chance in hell of passing, which nothing they ever propose does.

        • You don’t understand- Mark N is referring to citizen propositions in CA, proposed by likely new Governor Newsome, which can be bought onto the ballot by simply hiring enough signature gatherers in front of the grocery stores, and hiring enough journolistas to persuade the critical mass of Democrat voters.

          California has had Democrat control of the state congress for decades, including a super-majority that is veto proof, and despite being considered moderate- the outgoing Governor Jerry Brown could not vote down all of the many, and often ridiculous gun control bills sponsored by Sacramento.

          We will see the same thing happen that we saw in Washington, and Oregon- massive ad buys in the liberal urban press, television and print coverage by the self-admitted 90% democrat journalists, and collusion from bottom to top amongst left-wing non-profits and foundations to push gun control.

          Once the law is written, no matter how bad, it can take decades to make its way through the courts- and that supposes the federal district and 9th Circuit is populated by moderates, rather than liberal democrat appointed judges, who have demonstrably abused their position in case after case. See Calguns.net for more of the history.

          The semi-auto long-gun ban (for that is what it really is- hiding behind the deceptive AWB label) and background check for ammo, only follows the already abusive handgun and long-gun registration laws, and the Roster of Approved Handguns, that is a rolling ban on any new models other than revolvers sold in the state. All these are in the court, and decades away from resolution, if not sidelined by new laws that address the weakness, that Sacramento writes to get around the judges decision.

          California IS the cautionary tale for what happens when you let progressives run the government- its not about gun control, its about people control. And, no – it wont be fixed before it gets a lot worse- it took 70 years for the Soviet Union to fall, and we dont have a Berlin Wall around California, to inoculate the rest of the US from its state sponsored socialist control… but we should.

          In the meantime, the best thing to do is stand by, and wait for it to hit bottom…and learn from the mistakes, and do what you can to avoid them in your own state. More Californians who can read the writing on the wall are leaving every day, and that will become even more obvious- the middle class will disappear, while the coastal elite puts maids and gardeners to work behind their gated community walls, and in McDonalds, but everyone else goes some place else, and flys in to enjoy the beach, if they come at all.

        • “it has no bearing on whether or not it has a snow balls chance in hell of passing, which nothing they ever propose does.”

          It has a *very* good chance of passing, because it’s CALIFORNIA…

    • BTW – where was TTAG’s article about Samco Global filing chapter 7 liquidation? I’m so freaking out about it.

  2. The Democrats would try to disarm all the people that didn’t do it, and the Republicans would try to arm all the people who don’t have the balls to use them.

    • You were half right, about the Dems. If you go as far as taking concealed carry classes, applying, buying a carry weapon, etc. the odds are you are going to be ready to take the shot if there is a threat that must be stopped.

    • Right. Because people don’t defend themselves with guns everyday. You reading MDAs brainwashing again?

      • Without knowing Ralph, I’m guessing that would be an Iraqi Army/Police reference and not a swipe at armed self defense.

      • Actually, I am going by personal observation and personal experience. I do carry. I am confident that, should a threat arise, I would react appropriately. I am not looking for trouble, and really hope I never have to face that decision. But, if I had to, I could and would. Others that I know who carry would act similarly.

        You do not hear much about it in the Main Stream Media, but there are regular instances of defensive gun uses occurring very regularly. People step up when needed.

    • It was the Republicans who created the “terrorist watch list”.

      So the Republicans would probably just extend it further.

  4. MDA would start screaming about “thinking of the children” and the rational part of the country will do what we did after Newtown. Tool up.

  5. NOT WELL…the bawler in chief would shed a few fake tears and try to ban everything. And what would be the difference between a “terrorist” and a demon filled lanza? It’s every left-wing commie azzwholes wet dream… The hildebeast likewise would shed(except I don’t think she’s a great actor).

  6. A Beslan-style school attack will forever change the dynamic of gun ‘safety’ in America.

    And for the better.

    We would have law enforcement trained and vetted local volunteers in every school, likely more than one each.

    School entrances would be hardened.

    And lots more than I can think of immediately…

    • I believe (hope?) you are correct. We are real capable of figuring that somebody flying airplanes into buildings can’t happen near us, just ignore it. But schools are everywhere, a terrorist can find one in any state he chooses which has thousands of helpless victims. A group of 4 or 5 killing off 500-1000 children would wake a hell of a lot of people up. Especially if they were then smart enough to actually take on law enforcement when they arrived, while continuing to kill children. Somebody would figure this out, and I don’t think it would take months to do it. Anybody who then opposed parents guarding their own children’s schools would be run out of town on a rail, or simply shot dead on the spot.

    • I’m fairly surprised a CONUS Beslan/Paris/Westgate-style attack hasn’t happened yet. I’d be even more surprised if there isn’t a sizable cell of jihadis here who are currently planning such a thing. I figure it’s only a matter of time; when it does happen, the disarmament-complex’s gloves will come off, and things will get ugly for collaborators and politicians alike.
      That said…. if the perpetrator(s) aren’t jihadis but are unhinged white men, the ugliness will be heaped upon us instead.

      • It’s all about the lack of land borders here. Beslan happened first because the training camps were right across the border there (in Georgia). Paris happened because there’s a land route from/to ISIS camps in Syria and Iraq. But there’s no such route to US.

        It will still happen eventually, it just means it’ll take them longer to prepare.

    • I don’t know if I call that better. It sounds like fear. As it is, my school district is governed by fear. If it’s “for the safety of the children” they do whatever they want without thought for the community at large. I shudder to think how they would react if they were to become any more paranoid.

      • You don’t believe your school district wouldn’t seriously upgrade access security if there were an attack?

        I can guarantee the public wouldn’t demand civilian disarmament, well, the Progressives would, but they wouldn’t win that battle.

        • I believe they would. I just don’t believe it would be a good thing.

          Also, I’ve asked the person responsible at the district PD why they don’t allow armed teachers. His response was a weak combination of, “teachers don’t have the training of police officers,” and, “if a teacher got shot by a responding police officer, that would be sad.” Even with a terrorist attack, I doubt they would allow arming. Instead, I expect they would put in more ineffective layers of theater.

  7. Depends how bad it was and how strong the terrorism linkage. Assuming Sandy Hook magnitude and San Bernardino strong terrorism evidence:

    The Dissembler-in-Chief would seize upon the opportunity to chisel away more freedom from the 99.9999999% of the population who had nothing to do with it and who never would. Congress would halt the effort. GOP presidential candidates would pray for the victims. Democrat presidential candidates would pray for more laws, while pretending to pray for the victims.

    Some more states would pass campus carry and/or allow for armed teachers/staff.

  8. Nothing good, because, as usual, the concentration would be on the guns, rather than on the terrorists.

    Thus stopping guns, rather than stopping terrorists…

  9. The politicians, regardless of party, would go even more Orwellian with cameras covering every inch of schools and house arrest type ankle bracelets for all of the students.

    • problem with the first half of your statement: a lot of schools are already like that. My rural oklahoma high school had cameras everywhere and this was 5 years ago, and from what I’ve heard, they’re really going full retard now.

      • Some schools have it now, but if a terrorist (likely US government funded) attack occurred in a school, there would be Federal legislation mandating it for all schools.

    • Well, at the risk of being “The Man” I’ll fess up that I suggested and installed cameras in the school I work at.

      A lot of student/teacher, student/student arguments come down to just one persons word against the other. Having actual video of certain situations has helped out quite a bit. When you have video evidence of what actually happened, it’s hard to refute.

      But it’s not like we actual ever monitor them, it’s there mainly for after the fact stuff, and a few incidents of after hours vandalism.

  10. Do you walk to work or take your lunch? Depends if the sunshine is raining.

    The momentary pause your brain takes (drawing a blank) to process those words, explains gun registration. Despite evidence, no amount of reason can justify insisting on an action that has nothing to do with mass murder.

  11. It would finally prove to the anti’s that America and Australia are spelled and pronounced completely differently.

  12. Tool up & vote!
    Sit on your hands, and hand the election to a Democrat, party platform is opposed to gun rights

  13. It would just further reinforce that no one, not especially your government, can protect you moment to moment on an individual level. If terrorist activity should ever succeed in your breaking your pact with your neighbors, you will need arms even more to coalesce something else, and those that previously sh_t on your rights, the Constitution, and your peace and quiet, will also need guns, because they will be hunted.

  14. I don’t think its gun rights you would need to worry about.

    Every mosque in this country would be set ablaze followed by a state of emergency, martial law and open rebellion.

    • In some parts of the country, you might be right. Islam would still be welcomed in others, where entrenched communities exist and pay politicians to look the other way. If we are following the Eurosocialist experiment by roughly a decade, then Rothersham and Cologne examples can be expected as immigration continues, and clusters grow as they have in Dearborne, Minneapolis, and New York.

      That provides cover for the inevitable radicalized cell to hide in the community, just as it was in San Bernardino, where friends and family admitted they knew of the shooters preparation activities, but were afraid or unwilling to report it to the authorities.

      The response would be Jacksonian. “I fear we have awoken a sleeping giant” ~ Admiral Yamamoto, on being told the Pearl Harbor attack failed to target the crucial aircraft carriers.

  15. I work for a private school. After Newtown, we had serious discussions about keeping a rifle locked in the Principal’s office and the Facilities Manager’s office. We considered simply defying the Federal Gun Free Zone act.

    For our administration, it was a sea-change to even think about such measures.

    What we ended up doing was hiring a retired police officer as our security guard. Apparently, retired police officers in our state are allowed to carry on school grounds.

    Everyone – including the anti-gunners – were happy to have an armed presence on campus.

    Obama better tread lightly. I’ve seen anti-gun mothers become pro-gun when it comes to protecting their kids.

    • I hope your retired cop / security guard doesn’t wear a uniform and carries concealed. Otherwise, he is the designated initial target. How well does he shoot? You want a gunfighter, not a grandparent.

    • Thank you, Ted. I expect the same is happening at other private schools. Parents who care enough about their kids education, and can afford to pay for the best, are not dumb enough to buy into progressive propaganda on guns.

      Beslan is the scenario that keeps people in the fusion centers awake at night. It seems inevitable here in the US, given the attacks elsewhere, world-wide. Pakistan just had its second:
      http://kstp.com/news/stories/s4022609.shtml?cat=1

      I expect the public schools in the common-sense school board led districts would follow the same route,
      initially, by hiring trained security guards, and
      then the Israeli example, by training civilians, ie “the motivated to learn and willing to defend the kids” type teachers and parent volunteers who work with kids at school, monitor playgrounds, go on field trips.

    • What we ended up doing was hiring a retired police officer as our security guard. Apparently, retired police officers in our state are allowed to carry on school grounds.
      Inadequate, but better than nothing. Do not have him wear a uniform.

  17. ‘terrorism’ is a political, derogatory term with no real, inherently meaningful definition so any attack on a non-military target could be termed ‘terrorist’ by TPTB. The meaning is fluid but the agenda is set by the interpreters not the perpetrators.
    If the ‘terrorists’ agenda is victory for their political or religious ideology maybe we should ask why they do not attack political figures? Go ahead, ask!

  18. What would happen? A whole hell of a lot of people, republican, independent AND Dems would realize that whether we like it or not… We are at war. We are at war because another group(s) of people have declared war on us. And the appropriate response during a time of war is arming MORE people, not less. And a whole hell of a lot of people who never gave a serious thought about it would realize that they live in a country where their right to arm themselves was enshrined over 200 years ago… And THEN, a whole hell of a lot people will realize the people THEY voted for spent a whole hell of a lot of effort and money degrading that right.

  19. Cnl David Grossman predicted this exact thing would happen years ago – just like the massacre at Beslan in 2004.
    He predicted lone wolf attacks would evolve into multiple attacker scenarios.
    He predicted that long guns would more and more become the tool of choice, and that secondary explosives would be used with increasing frequency.
    He predicted that in our lifetime there would be highly-coordinated, heavily armed attacks on our schools by trained operatives, not basement-dwelling loners.

    So far he is been right on all counts. I pray he is wrong on the last one.

    Tool up. For the love of God, TRAIN LIKE YOUR LIFE DEPENDS ON IT.
    Educate your local school officials and your family. Have a plan, and practice it regularly.

  20. Others have commented on all of the likely outcomes for gun control/gun rights rhetoric and activities pretty well.

    If there were a Beslan style attack here upon a public school – especially one in a state where public schools are gun free zones, as is most likely – that ends in three hundred or more deaths as Beslan did, it would have another and even farther reaching effect:

    Parent confidence in the safety of the public school system would drop to zilch overnight. It might spell the death of the public schooling system as we know it.

  21. We stopped having massive fatalities from fires at schools because
    (1) We made building codes require fire resistant materials,
    (2) We regularly train all of our children what to do in the event of a fire and drill regularly, and
    (3) Keeping fire extinguishers in all school facilities was mandated by law, and staff were trained in their use.

    We have not lost a SINGLE CHILD to a school fire in 50 years. Let that sink in.

    I’ll let you do that math on what our approach to school shootings should be.

  22. I don’t think it would go well. If you consider the moves by Congress to circumvent the 4th Amendment after 9/11 and the willingness of the American people to blindly jump right into another Vietnam style conflict in Iraq “cause terrists” 18 months later, I think the majority of people are so easily manipulated we’d be literally fighting for our rights. Instead of recognizing that a decentralized enemy requires a decentralized defense, most people would be going along with whatever the leaders (masters) tell them to do.

  23. it would depend what kind of terrorists they are, and on the hue of their skin. because political correctness.

  24. Why do all of the comments here assume a massacre? What if the school attacked actually had good guys with guns and they repelled the attack, better yet killed all of the attackers? How would that fare for more us POTG? What’s the difference between the Paris and Garland? In Paris the first LEO on sight was unarmed and killed. In Garland, a traffic cop with a Glock killed them both.

    • If the attackers were effectively repelled, the statists, mainstream media, and other usual suspects would take no notice.

      How often does the Garland, Texas terror attempt on the Mohammad art event come up? Never. Only bad guys die? Just like any other defensive gun use, as far as the media are concerned, nothing happened.

    • Two other points to consider: the target was deliberately “provocative” (as opposed to innocent children) and a police officer stopped the threat (acceptable level of training/authority to statists). It is similar to all of the DGUs that go unreported whether a shot was fired or not: facts don’t matter unless they support the narrative.

  25. “We don’t have to protect you and we won’t LET you protect yourself” is a tough sell NOW.

    Imagine when MILLIONS of people get the message that the ONLY person who’s going to PROTECT you is YOU.

    Memorize:
    * Police have no legal duty to protect individuals.
    * Police have no legal liability when they fail to protect individuals.
    * Police have virtually no physical ability to protect individuals.

    Police don’t protect individual. They draw chalk outlines around individuals who don’t protect THEMSELVES.

    If you’re not willing and able to protect YOURSELF, you’re just not going to get protected AT ALL. Anybody who tells you different is a LIAR.

  26. And GOD forbid the “terrorists” were Oklahoma City style killers. Hell slick willy tried to pin that one Rush Limbaugh and his “rhetoric”…

  27. I would hope lots of people would wake up and see that gun control is an empty gesture.

    Judging by europeans reactions, though, that is a foolish hope.

  28. Everyone should read the book Day of Wrath by William R. Forstchen . That’s what’s coming next to the USA

    • Everyone should read this book. I seriously thought about sending a copy to each member of my county’s school board, because Georgia law allows the school board to authorize anyone they see fit to carry a gun at school. I didn’t because I figured they would perceive it as a threat.

      As I recall, the book mentions that the events result in the government further cracking down on our freedoms. For those who haven’t read the book, think about how 911 affected air travel and apply that to firearms, because the attackers in the book obtain their weapons in the US.

  29. The day after Paris a European CNN reporter said that gun free countries need to revaluate the effectiveness of their gun laws.

    There was a cheer in the room, breakfast at a rural motel full of grown men up early to express their rights.

  30. Just going to put this here.

    http://www.reuters.com/article/us-pakistan-attacks-idUSKCN0UZ232


    “We were hiding … but were unarmed,” Shakil told Reuters, speaking after four Islamist militants attacked Bacha Khan University in Pakistan’s troubled northwest on Wednesday, killing more than 20 people.

    “I was worried about the students, and then one of the militants came after us,” Shakil added. “After repeated requests, the police threw me a pistol and I fired some shots at the terrorists.”

  31. Interesting to use a picture in this story, that has been alleged to be a victim (actor) at more than one mass event?
    Could it be true? I sure don’t know, but there are some confusing things that have seemingly shown up at multiple events.

      • No tin foil, Not making anybody look “looney”.
        The Question asked, “How Would A Terrorist Attack on a School Effect Gun Control?”
        So with everything that has kicked up since, it would probably look very close.
        Whether an event is staged or not, crazed or “terrorist” the results would be very much the same.

  32. Stabby people in Israel have Israeli’s clamoring for more guns. Home grown self radicalized jihadis or the real deal smuggled in from the sand box hit an American school hard and the first pol suggesting that the parents be disarmed is likely to get lynched.

  33. Question of the Day: How Would A Terrorist Attack on a School Effect Gun Control?

    That depends entirely on the robustness of the media ops of the anti-anti-gun folks. (Assume the anti-gun folks are geared up, tooled up, staged up, t-ed, up, ready to go with their hysteria and slime. They’re 10 for the last 10 on maxium exploitation – they’re good at this. It’s what they do.) They are t-ed up just waiting for another “crisis” to not let go to waste. They’ll even make one if they have to – FnF, anybody?

    Thus, how any event effects gun control depends entirely on how well positioned the “other side” is. The good news is: that’s entirely up to us. The bad news is: that’s entirely up to us.

    Talking heads, stats, well-formed arguments, identified media-friendly types to get pulled in to give the “other side” in the hit jobs, oversight on the investigations after the incidents – all matter.

    Most important is battlespace prep, as the military folks say. If the meme is already out there, you don’t have to make the whole argument, say over Musket’s interruptions, which absolutely, assuredly can’t be to make sure you can never speak your peace. This is why stuff like the open letter in the WP the other day is a Big Deal.

    And while Lurch of the NRA got slimed by the smug-o-sphere when he said his piece, *now* even people who object are acknowledging the argument, if only to dismiss it. And, there’s follow-on evidence, as various jurisdictions have chosen to give school children the same protection we give our garages and our money. Stories of BGs getting stopped by getting plugged… drip, drip, drip. Lack of stories of carnage in our proud schools, because janitors, teachers and coaches are only murderous aliens in our flawed childhood recollections. (Sorry. School was not my best time ever. Also I exclude administrators on purpose – they’re still jerks.)

    Battlespace prep is up stream of the exploitation. Memes are up stream of the arguments. News stories are up stream of the assumptions. Culture is up stream of politics. (Before I’m accused of being a Breitbartian … pick the totalitarian visionary of your choice. What did they do? Even the Catholic church: “Give me a child of 7, and I will give you the man.”)

  34. I don’t understand why anyone thinks “gun control” is about control of an inanimate object…

    Its all about “people control” as every lib and progressive legislation has shown us before…

    Does anyone still think that ObamaCare is about health care?

    • Let’s not forget the real world events terrorists and schools…

      From the UK Telegraph: The world’s five worst terror attacks involving children
      By Richard Spencer, Middle East Correspondent4:29PM GMT 16 Dec 2014

      Beslan school siege, Russia, in which 156 children died at the hands of Chechen and Ingush Islamist militants. September 1-3, 2004
      Bombings of Al-Qataniyah and Al-Adnaniyah, Yazidi towns in north-west Iraq, in which 796 people were killed, many of them children. August 14, 2007.
      Shootings at Peshawar Army Public School, Pakistan, by the Taliban, in which at least 100 children died. December 16, 2014.
      A suicide bombing of a crowd welcoming a delegation of MPs to a factory in Baghlani-jadid, Afghanistan, killed an estimated 77 people, 61 of them children. November 6, 2007.
      Utoye island shootings by bomber-gunman Anders Breivik, Norway. Of the 77 deaths, 69 were at an island youth camp, with 33 out of 55 teenagers killed under the age of 18. July 22, 2011.

      Gun control? Maybe just maybe some of these horrific incidents could’ve been mitigated if the staff at these places had been trained and armed – that sort of ‘gun control‘ is what is needed…

  36. Federally, I don’t think much would happen. I think most Americans would recognize that the problem was terrorism, not guns. Americans are not like the Europeans who after one mass shooting demand all guns banned and after the attack in Paris, accept full martial law nationwide with suspension of rights. Despite the steps taken by the U.S. government after 9/11, there was no wholesale declaration of a national “state of emergency” and tossing all rights out the window.

    In the state where it happened, if not already California and if a blue state, there would probably be a push to outlaw all semiautomatic rifles with detachable magazines period. Especially since California is going to likely do this, other states will then try to follow.

  37. If there’s another terrorist attack, Democrats can’t win in 2016. If this hypothetical terrorist is one of Obama’s refugees, Democrats will be slaughtered on election day. Democrats badly want this election to be about the economy, healthcare, or anything other than foreign policy. If foreign policy becomes a major issue, Democrats are in trouble. As for gun control, Democrats not only need the White House, they need the Senate and House too. Without all three, they can’t pass gun control legislation.

  38. Terrorist cops attack schools in the US all the time. They lock the place down then sexually molest the children, looking for contraband.

    Unfortunately, the teachers and students don’t shoot back.

  39. Question of the Day: How Would A Terrorist Attack on a School Effect Gun Control?
    SSDD. I think we have been there and done that.

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