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“Presidential involvement in small arms has been strategic and game-changing in our history. Obama comes along and tells the Army that, in this administration, money is going into small arms to build — not a deadly weapon, not an effective weapon, not a dominant weapon, not a lifesaving weapon, not a technological cutting-edge weapon — but a weapon that prevents accidental discharge. Give me a break.” – Retired Army Maj. Gen. Robert Scales in Obama’s gun control executive order to Pentagon: Make combat weapons safer, not more lethal (via washingtontimes.com)

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101 COMMENTS

  2. Because what the military needs most are:
    1. A new way to lock themselves out of their guns.
    2. Guns that can be tracked remotely.
    3. Politicians telling them how to fight wars.

    • Well, at least this administration is consistent. If it weakens the American military or strengthens those who hate us, he’s all in.

      • Washington DC really did not start running the day to day operation until WW2 and has been none stop since with the exceptions of the whiskey rebellion. But hey George Washington was on the front line. Even in the civil war the generals ran the day to day operation. Where before the picked the generals but the generals ran it

        • George H.W. Bush let the generals fight Desert Storm (for the most part), only intervening to call an end to the fighting. The results, one of the, if not the most lopsided ass kicking in history.

    • Guns that can be tracked remotely? WTELF?

      This means either passive, that is RFID, which would be dead simple; mill out a small area on the reciever to allow you to epoxy in a small RFID chip. No real issue with this, it wouldn’t affect function, it’s cheap…. however, this is only a small improvement on the serial number that is already present on every receiver. To read the RFID you have to be near the item, and given that you are near it you could just look at the serial number. Yes it does allow for more automation and perhaps accuracy in tracking at a small cost. Can’t really argue against it.

      However I don’t think this is what they are looking for – you don’t need a study to come to the same conclusion I just did in the above. Going past RFID means going to active electronics. Are they thinking about putting the M4s on the internet of things? That is to say, install wifi or 4g cell phone tech on the things and incorporate this into the devices function? That means it will need to have power and a lot more electronic crap that you can’t just mill out and epoxy in. This will all need to be designed, prototyped, tested, implemented, managed. What an absolute clusterf*ck. And just consider, to what end?

      Collosal waste of money! Our money! They don’t care, they don’t have to earn it.

      Oh and there’s this gem; “reduce the frequency of accidental discharge”.

      Good gravy. No gun ever discharges accidentally. There’s already a safety on every gun. What else could possibly be done?

      What these idiots are actually looking for is a magic gun that only shoots bad people. Really! That’s what they are thinking – in their soft headed incoherent babbling of meaningless orders calling up for unicorn fart powered guns and bullets that are smarter than the operators.

      I just can’t understand this level of stupidity. What are they going to ask for next?

      • Why, it’s simple! The modern firearm upon actuation transmits a high resalution image of the target to the president’s office for review and awaits approval to fire the round. Simple, safe and easy to do with today’s technology.

      • An IOT ( internet of things) enabled weapon? Yeah, that won’t get hacked by the bad guys, ISIS, China, every 12 year old with a smart phone.

      • All you need is active rfid, like an ez-pass. You would not have to be ‘close enough to read the serial number.’ It’s not going to be read by satellite either, but for inventory control on base I can see its uses.

      • 1. They are called smart guns 2. They are already developed, they contain GPS and a computer chip that allows remote operation including an override function. If the gov or law enforcement needs to track you, they can. They can stop the gun from firing. Surprised you haven’t heard about them. They were all over the news last year or year before, Obummer was pushing for only smart guns to be allowed to be sold. He never gives up & Hillary will continue it if elected. Too bad he hasn’t been as dedicated to really solving some problems, like repealing the trade agreements that sent nearly all of our manufacturers to China, Mexico, India, Pakistan etc… Or stopping the influx of heroin into the US by illegal immigrants and etc…

      • What they want is the ability to deactivate military hardware remotely in the event units decide not to follow orders.

    • My cousin has been on the presidential protection detail before…I’ll see if I can put in a word, just in case he ends up there again in the near future. (Can’t believe I didn’t think of that earlier.)

  7. How is this not treason? Seriously. Our military Commander-in-Chief orders a reduction in the effectiveness of small arms … how is that not providing aid and comfort to our enemies?

  8. An EO from a lame duck leftist in his last months in office. ..I’m sure the military’s machinery will get right on that.

    • Yeah I was thinking that too. It takes the Army years to move on things they WANT to do, let alone this sort of tomfoolery.

      • You forget about the massive purge of the officer corps of the last 7 years.

        Congress needs to jam thru a special appropriation for this important project. An appropriation of $100 with the specific directive that NO other funds from any source may be used for this project.

  9. If their are any “fighting admirals” or “fighting generals” left in the military, I pray they kill this murderous presidential order against our troops and sailors.
    General Douglas McArthur was correct when he said president Truman was responsible for the murder of American boys in the Korean War with his restrictive rules of engagement.
    That true statement got him fired.

    • And when you go to Incheon, you’ll note the monuments to MacArthur, and the lack of monuments to Truman.

    • MacArthur was an incompetent glory hound who tried to start a nuclear war with China and Russia, expressly disobeyed his commander in chief, and ignored all the warning signs that led to the near disastrous withdrawal back down the Korean peninsula when the Chinese entered. If he had paid attention, he could have stopped short of the border area and remained in occupation of North Korea and won the war.

      Truman may have been a lousy President, but MacArthur was a worse general.

        • I’d forgotten that. He also wasted so much blood, treasure, and time marching up towards the Philippines, and then retaking it to salve his ego, that I bet he delayed the main Central Pacific thrust by a year. On the other hand, by sheer dumb luck, that did stall the Pacific war long enough for the atom bombs to make an actual invasion unnecessary.

      • When he was running things in Japan, MacArthur sent a detailed letter to Truman advising him of an impending invasion of South Korea by the North Koreans. Off hand I do not recall the exact timeframe (12 or 18 months prior to the actual invasion), but it was more than adequate warning for Truman to seek a diplomatic solution or, at least, prepare adequate defenses to repel or prevent the invasion to begin with. And so it was with good reason that MacArthur thought Truman was a moron.

        MacArthur did not seek to trigger a war with the Soviets or PRC. What he sought to do was actually win the Korean War by defeating the North Koreans. Americans used to do that. Win wars, I mean.

        The Chinese undoubtedly did exploit MacArthur’s ego by luring American forces into a vulnerable position before they attacked. Ego is a common fault of great military leaders. But you have to give MacArthur credit for the brilliant defense of Pusan when UN forces were greatly outgunned and undermanned. And the landing landing at Inchon Bay was one of the greatest military maneuvers in world history.

        • MacArthur did indeed try to trigger war with China. He sent a destroyer within China’s 12 mile zone, basically daring them to attack it, whereupon he would use it as provocation to retaliate massively. Luckily for everybody but him, the Chinese held fire until some higher up told the destroyer to get the hell out of Dodge.

          He also knew damn well that the Chinese were going to cross the Yalu if he went too close, and that was why he went further north than necessary.

          As for Inchon, yes, gutsy and good, but one moment of glory doesn’t make up for all the damage he did in WW II and later in Korea.

        • “+1 Starship Troopers”

          Never seen it, or read it.

          30 years of being close to Sc!entolgy’s corporate ‘Sea O#g’ here in Florida (16V has a point about FLA being home to nearly every scammer), I have zero point zero interest in any of their propaganda…

        • Geoff, you do realize that Starship Troopers was written by Heinlein, not Hubbard, right? Or were you commenting on some other Scientology link (e.g. most movies are made by the notoriously Scientology infested Hollywood)?

  11. Now we know why Beretta didn’t get the contract. Thats great news for Glock- Or any foreign maker who produces cheap “safer” weapons.

    • Do you really think Glocks are considered safer??? I think this would just about eliminate them for military use unless they make a model with a more traditional external safety.
      While common sense says that keeping your finger off the damn trigger until ready to fire is the best safety, non gun owners look at Glocks and other guns like that with more suspicion not less.

  12. There’s a switch, on the side. Turn it to where it points to SAFE. Ta-da! It’s now safe.

    I just saved us billions.

  14. Can we put the ‘If you can read English thank a teacher. If you can speak it, thank a Soldier’ bumper stick on all presidential vehicles already? Maybe the Hope poster with clown make-up and a big poof nose and wig.
    Don’t forget to mail me the royalties!

  15. Makes perfect sense. Gulf 1 we had SO many rear area ND’s, gun barrels were posted outside buildings. Our Master & Commander cannot persuade Congress on gun control, so he’ll circumventing taxpayers money directing the Army to secure a smart gun. Then demand citizens purchase them as well, calling it Guncare…a tax upheld by SCOTA. Groundhog lawmaking at its best.

    • Clearing barrels have been routinely used before and after Desert Storm/Shield at ranges, training events and in previous & subsequent conflicts. In my experience, they’ve always been a proactive safety measure and not a response to NDs.

  16. Ah yes, more military spending, just what the country needs… RMD, trails, contracts, production, new orders and shipments, implementation of the new weapons, and phasing out of the old, etc.

    So, what armament company greased palms to set this event in motion? Man, the O loves him some gun manufacturers, doesn’t he…

    See, when he was crying about #gunsense on TV it wasn’t tears of sadness, but tears of joy, thinking about all the kick backs and favors.

    #Obama’sgunstockisgoingthroughtheroof.

    • Yeah right. Lowest # of rifle companies since before Spanish-American war.

      Perhaps should blow more on Gov’t (VA style) “health” care?

      • Don’t get me started on the VA.

        I didn’t have best of experiences with those buffoonish, hack doctors, to put it mildly.

        • To chime in with a contrasting anecdote, my VA doctors and nurses have all been outstanding, performing very well (especially considering the system they’re hide-bound to) and delivering great care.
          On the other hand, the administrative do-nothing bureaucrats that push papers around are pretty close to belonging in Dante’s lowest circle. Of them I have nothing good to say. And plenty of bad, distasteful experiences ranging from being lied to all the way to being screamed at for asking a reasonable question.
          The VA is certainly a mess, not apt to get better.

    • I doubt that it is.
      He wants smart guns but he forgot the left salted that earth with mandates. The technology itself isn’t anywhere near ready and the basic concept of a sometimes-gun is flawed. The market doesn’t want it and the politics don’t help.
      He expects the military to solve these problems for him by fleshing out the technology and popularizing it.
      The military has a phobia about putting remote controlled locks on things, so I’m guessing it won’t be a priority for them.

    • It isn’t, FTA,
      “The National Institutes of Health released a report on firearms deaths and injuries from 2002 to 2011 for military personnel not deployed in the wars. It found 4,657 total firearms injuries in the 1.4 million active force, or about 400 per year at a time when stateside units were undergoing increased combat training for Afghanistan and Iraq. Of those, 35 percent were fatal. Of those, half were suicides and homicides.

      “In circumstances other than war, rates of both fatal and nonfatal firearm-related injuries are much lower among military members than civilian males aged 18-44,” the report said.”

      So out of 1.4 million troops about 70 deaths a year from negligent discharges, which is 5 per 100,000 if my math is right. And about 10 deaths per 100,000 total including suicides and homicides, so basically the same as the rest of the USA.

  19. What a stirring legacy. Some future G. S. Patton will stride into battle on a foreign shore in some middle-Eastern sh!thole, praising the “safest, most color-coordinated battle implement ever devised.”

  23. “Alright private, insert the barrel of the pistol into the clearing barrel. Now, insert the fifteen round magazine into the magazine well, and release the slide by engaging the slide stop. Now, attach this wrist band to your primary hand’s wrist. Wait 1 minute while it synchronizes… OK, it ain’t synchronizing, damnit. Call the IT department. Looks like you’re going to be late for watch.”

    • “Alright private, now press your thumb against the fingerprint reader… Damnit, it ain’t working. Did you register your fingerprints in the system when you checked in? No?!?! Damnit, private! Now we gotta change the whole watch rotation around just to find you a replacement! Call the watch officer, their reliefs are going to be late…”

      • Just remember Private, your Smart gun was made by the highest bidder, who was a major campaign donor to the POS CIC, which thereafter laid off all of it’s US employees, and it’s principals absconded with the ITAR materials and all of the cash.

        The functioning of your weapon is “notional” for this exercise, in a “real” non-training environment, you will have to pry the soft foam covering off of your ‘weapon’ and gently beat your enemy to death.

        That is all.

  24. Mr. Obama, who has made reducing gun violence and increasing gun control a top priority, signed a Jan. 4 order that directs the Defense Department, as well as the Departments of Justice and Homeland Security, to “Increase research and development efforts.”

    And there you have it – they think they’re pretty clever. Use the military’s vast resources and R&D capability to develop a smart gun that private manufacturers won’t – because with existing technology, isn’t reliable or profitable.

    This will get buried and obfuscated by the very procurement bureaucracy they created. It’s an empty promise to say,”Look I am doing something!” The people who don’t know any better will eat this up and hold it up as an example of his “leadership. LOLZ!

  26. So how about we emphasize in Basic not to be a moron with your weapon? It’s not like keeping your finger off the trigger is hard, nor is it a new concept. I highly doubt this is that big of a problem anyways. It would be a logistical nightmare for military to keep track of who can fire which gun. Plus, if your buddy needs to use your weapon in combat, wouldn’t it be great if he didn’t have to cut your finger prints off to do it. Also, any sort of smart gun technology wouldn’t even prevent ND’s by the carrier of the weapon. The M9 has a safety, problem solved. Finally, any gun manufacturer who made a smart gun would be ostracized by the gun community, and they all saw what happened to Colt when they lost their government contract….

  27. I can see them actually dragging this out another long period of time, especially since they’re still trying to knock the “stoner” gun off it’s pedestal for a long time now.

    Adding these standards will likely ensure that this will get dragged out a few more decades. This doesn’t even include the notion that this stuff will have to be paid for and that the payments for it will have to be approved.

    I also wouldn’t be surprised to find out Obama is teeing one of his buddies up to sell stuff to the gov kind of like the China/Solar thing.

  28. Less lethal, that would be a cap gun vs rubber band gun, no worry about putting an eye out.
    What is needed is a kinder, gentler military – scarc

  29. The insanity and stupidity of this President is beyond anything I have read in history. Even if he had a political ideology I supported, he is the last person I would want in a leadership position over our military.

  31. the quote in the OP says “ARMY” not the military or armed forces. Maybe just the ARMY needs a safer sidearm?

    • In general, the Army is responsible for the procurement, testing, and fielding of small arms–which will then be adopted by the other branches of armed forces. However, the Air Force was originally tapped to find a replacement to the M1911A1 back in 1979-83. This reduces the overall amount of R&D funding spent by weapons the DOD will end up issuing across the board.

  32. They’ll only be safe when they stop accidentally shooting themselves! 🙂

    That is pretty hilarious when you think about it.

    • I don’t know where you got the Vector idea… I ran 300 rounds through one on full auto and burst on my last trip down to Texas. Not a single stopage. (Hell, I was able to keep a whole stick on target on full auto. For a 45ACP SMG with that cyclic rate, that’s DAMN impressive.)

        • “Telling myself”? About things I personally experienced?

          Do you have a source for frequent VECTOR jams? I have yet to see it on either the real or neutered version of the weapon.

  34. Note to parents of Service members; “this IDIOT is trying to get your Sons & Daughters killed!”

  36. Military weapons aren’t supposed to be “safe.” They are supposed to be dangerous to B G s immune to other methods of persuasion.

    Even “safe” for troops to use is in aid of being dangerous to B G s. Dead troops can’t shoot their guns, and untrained troops can’t shoot well, so we want arms “safe enough” to train and use … to bring involuntary persuasion to bear on B G s who decline to be stopped by other means.

    The cost – including danger – of using arms can be pretty high because they’re only used when the cost of not using them is huge.

    This applies to citizen arms as well. They are relevant for defense when other methods have failed, and you’re gonna get killed anyway. “Safe” means “safe enough.”

    One of the three baae reasons for hating guns is the reminder that sometimes it comes down to bare force, or get killed.

  37. Who would have thought that voting for a committed leftist would have wrought the destruction of a great nation???

  38. Idiot in Chief does it again! Pure Democratic policy totally backed by the democratic party which should be outlawed!

  39. He’s going out with a bang! Ftf
    How much failure can one president pen out before he’s gone?
    The day he’s out I’m throwing a party!

  41. I didn’t know accidental discharges were a major problem. If they aren’t I don’t see why they need to be “safe”.

  42. If Obama wants to locate all those Abrams tanks and Bradleys that we gave to iraq, all he has to do is call ISIS. I’m sure that he has the number.

  43. Hey I have a crazy idea. Instead of wasting money on smart gun tech. How about we spend more time on Rifle and Sidearm training, instead on the B.S Culture Awareness and Sensitivity Training classes.

  45. He is telling the truth their are one or two guns that are kind of easy to have a accidental discharge. But most of them have left the service. The problem is negligent discharges the only real thing you can do on that is a de cocker or double action only. Some of the M14 where prone to accidental discharges due to their age with 50 years of abuse they where starting to have problems. Now to break it down a accidental discharge is when you carry a gun the way it is suppose to be carried and due to a mechanical failure the gun goes off with out the trigger being pulled. A negligent discharge is when you caused the gun to go off by pulling the trigger or by messing around with the mechanics.

  46. The only way he can achieve his questionable goal of safety is to spend all that money on training the people who will be using the tools. Unless things have changed, operational accidents generally account for more deaths and injuries that does combat. The true “safety” mechanism for any tool is located in the area between the user’s ears. Spend the money and time on the people.
    [W3]

  47. Isn’t this what all that ‘elite’ gun training the antis keep talking about our military having is for?

  49. No gun is immune to AD and ND (and almost all AD, apart from some freak accidents, are ND) — the only gun immune to discharge is one that physically cannot fire, which is no true gun at all. It’s like asking for a lightbulb that can’t illuminate. Safe is between the ears and on the fingers. Safety is the mechanical device that can be bypassed in any number of ways, from failure to accidental actuation to neglect to purposeful deactivation to malfunction. There are four rules (all guns are loaded, finger off the trigger, only point at what you want destroyed, know lies downrange), only two safety lessons which need to be taught (watch where you point weapons, never touch the trigger without good reason), and it can all be condensed into one sentence: “Mind that trigger!” I don’t know what they’re after — a gun that can only fire if given an authorization signal, a gun that requires a key to be loaded, a gun that only shoots if some software says it’s looking at a valid target? If 6 year old boys can go to a summer camp and be trusted to handle live arms at the rifle range and never have a problem, 18 year old men should be able to do the same.

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