“The owner of a local gun range called authorities last September, suspicious about an inexperienced group that had come to learn how to shoot a pistol. One of those men drew much wider attention last week,” wsj.com reports. “Abdirahman Sheik Mohamud, a 23-year-old Ohio man back in town three months after he returned from training with violent extremists in Syria, was the leader of the group at the gun range, according to court documents from federal authorities. He was accused by federal officials in court papers of contemplating an attack against the U.S.” If you see something suspicious at the gun store or gun range, say something. That said . . .
I’ve seen people at the gun range that look like gang bangers straight out of central casting. I said nothing. I am not qualified to ID criminals from their appearance. Even if I was, it’s innocent until proven guilty all day long. And I certainly wouldn’t assume that Muslim dress or Arabic speech indicated anything but an Arabic-speaking Muslim exercising their natural, civil and Constitutionally protected right to keep and bear arms. BUT—
If I heard something indicating some kind of criminal conspiracy, I just might have a word with the range owner and/or law enforcement. Depending on the totality of circumstances.
It’s a judgement call, obviously. Equally obvious is that there are terrorists – or the non-political equivalent thereof – in our midst. Though hopefully not, if something horrific went down and we were in the vicinity, we would be the first responders. In that same sense, we are the eyes and ears of law enforcement.
Just remember that direct confrontation is just about the worst possible strategy if your spidey senses are tingling. Note the suspects’ description and grab a license plate number if you can. If you can do it safely and discreetly. Your actions could easily be interpreted as suspicious. You don’t need that kind of problem.
But neither do you need, or do you ever want be in the position where you end up saying, if only I’d . . .
Everything else aside; “He was accused by federal officials in court papers of contemplating an attack against the U.S.”
That is just wrong on so many levels.
Pretty sure that should be ‘actively planning’.
Translation: he was entrapped by the FBI.
Going to Syria and training with ISIS got him on the FBI radar.
If someone can be entrapped to commit jihad against the United States, then they are feeble minded people with no values and shouldn’t be allowed to live here. I can’t believe the losers who would defend this p.o.s.
Being gullible is now punishable by life in prison. Check.
@ST — Except he wasn’t entrapped by the FBI, in this case, and he knew exactly what he was getting into. “Gullible” is a term that absolutely does not belong anywhere near this article. Much less these or any other comments.
Actually gullible is extremely relevant. In regards to people who actually believe this government claptrap. 🙂
Actually it’s not at all relevant, you mean, especially since even if only occasionally government claptrap happens to be true. Something about broken clocks or blind squirrels and what-not. 😀
Alas, it’s all hogwash. The government is actually worse than a broken clock. 🙂
That was my first thought as well. Since when did contemplating become a crime.
It’s legal language filtered through the usual crappy MSM “reporting.” Presumably they had something more than mind-reading going on with this guy and his pals. If indeed “contemplating” any action/s against our holy Almighty State was a crime, half the derps on this board would be getting jammed up likewise.
Contemplating is not a crime, conspiracy to commit is. Kind of like when they get some fool on tape trying to hire an undercover cop to kill their spouse or whatever. Thinking about committing a crime is not a crime, taking proactive measures to make the crime happen is a crime, even if the actual crime never happens.
That said, there’s also entrapment…
Fool or not, it is difficult for me to believe that anyone would attempt to hire a stranger to kill his wife (or to kill anyone) if he has not been led to believe it was a possibility, and that equates to entrapment.
Whoa! He is in shackles for the crime of “contemplating”?
I’m not an Islamic extremist or anything, but every time I shoot a wood-furnished AK I feel an urge to yell “ALLAHU ACKBAR!” Sorry.
Not funny bud–If you served and have seen brothers ambushed/hit and afterwards heard that chant when all hell breaks out, you’d think twice about the failed attempt at humor…
just because you dont find it funny doesnt mean he cant. the irony here is that despite his childish joke, you’re the one who needs to grow up.
You obviously have never served due to your lack of humor, you probally think grabbing your buddys junk on man love Thursday isnt funny
Wahhhh, we got shot up while invading a foreign country based on a completely fabricated casus belli by people defending their homeland. WAHHHHH.
So it seems that “Snackbar Yell” is slowly descending to the realm of pop culture now where it will be used as synonym to venerable “WAAAGH”. Its not surprising, given the similar level of cultural development of Jihadists and Greenskins.
Your great leader Obama is the one killing folks. I guess he likes the power. Bush is long gone.
Implying Bush and Obama aren’t both violent psychopaths soaked in a sea of blood.
Seems to me, and others here that your on the wrong board. There’s no “sting” in your retort………Apply to Wal-Mart, you will make better money………
@morokko Cmon now dont insult the Orks like that, I think the Aloha Snackbarites have a certain tyranid appeal to them also 🙂
@Roger The original sin here is pretending there is a difference between Bush and Obama on war crimes. 🙂
Bruce Jenner Tyrannosaur
You ignore human nature, physics and human history in too many ways to argue against U.S. (DoD or past Presidents) involvement in any war.
Suffice to say though. During my short stint overseas the live birth rate increased whole percentage points in Iraq, and we got the lights back on 24/7, Progress? You bet your abused a _ _, and there’s a pile of recently-dead in a few dusty holes over there that wished we never got pulled out.
@Joe R
Let’s put this “progress” into proper perspective:
Maybe the birth rate didn’t need to go up if your ilk didn’t murder several hundred thousand Iraqis.
Maybe the electricity plants wouldn’t need to be repaired if the USAF didn’t shock-and-awe them into rubble.
Maybe ISIS wouldn’t be in iraq if the US stupidly ousted Saddam Hussein to enrich the war profiteers at home.
Yours is the broken window fallacy of foreign policy.
Which is quite telling seeing that the most troublesome, violent and detached insurgents in Iraq, Afghanistan and other Middle East heck holes are the ones that were foreign Jihadists. These are the ones that would have no problem blowing up a market full of civilians to hit a passing American convoy since they have no ties to the community they are operating in.
Bruce Jenner Tyrannosaur,
Your too hard to get ahead of your f’d up train of broken facts.
The live birth rate was lower because the country’s indigenous washes their butts with their left hand and a jug of water, and they are still eating-from, drinking-from, washing their clothes, pee-ing, sh_tt_ng in the same dam rivers. We brought them the only hospitals that provided healthcare.
The power was out because Saddam had cannibalized the whole country of copper wire for his palaces(populated with some relatively lush spots by the invited big-name oil drilling companies). Nobody even bothered to try a switch supplied by anything other than a generator because it was so unreliable.
The WORLD thru the UN asked us to go in there, after asking us a decade before to rid Kuwait of them without going in there. We may have propped up Saddam initially, but it was only so we didn’t have to NUKE IRAN after Carter left us another power vacuum in IRAN in the 70’s by not backing the Shah. ISIS is the FILTH that happens everywhere there is a power vacuum, it only makes the news when it calls itself a religion, and kills people for not joining, and though our prez is mute on this point, we are certain that the rest of the WORLD is going to invite us again.
Wow Joe, would you care to explain why third world nations in Africa have even higher birth-rates than first world nations with practically non-existent healthcare? Never mind pre-invasion Iraq was considered one of the better places to live in the region. But no, all the mass murdering that occurred during the US invasion had nothing to do with average lifespan and birthrates dropping, no way. 🙂
By the way you might want to read up on the actual turn of events with the UN arms inspectors before you start with that tall tale. Hans Blix himself disavowed the Bush’s little fundraising tour for the military-industrial complex.
And lastly, who created the power vacuum that allowed ISIS to fester? Take a guess. 🙂
Bruce Jenner Tyrannosaur,
World Health Organization says your wrong: http://www.who.int/bulletin/volumes/88/1/08-062554-table-T1.html
I say you are wrong on purpose.
Hans Blix was the U.N. Tool of Europe limping-in to prolong the Oil For Food Program. There were WMD’s but who gives one of your dented turds. We had an Armistice after the first Gulf War, Saddam didn’t uphold his end, and it is wrongful and dangerous, and ignorant of human nature (see my initial post above) to allow that to continue. The U.S. are not mercenaries, we were asked for our help.
If I here another ‘gimp’ cite the military industrial complex I will hunt them. If the world knew what that complex was capable of, they would kill their kids and then themselves because they would not like the way we could do it. If a lot of money is spent, it probably barely covers R&D on 1/3 to 1/7 th of the projects bid.
See, I can see that if your not aiming and just shooting all over the place, over your head from behind something that won’t stop bullets. However, if you actually aim your AK and shoot to train, perhaps yell: “FOR THE MOTHERLAND”- considering the Russkies actually trian. Personally, when I’m at the range alone, I like to do a mag dump and let out the Rebel Yell….
So, TTAG approves of the government locking up people for thoughtcrimes and wants readers to become Stasi rats.
No, big dino wannabe.
TTAG only supports locking up the obvious village trolls before they step into traffic.
Time for you to toddle home now…Daily Kos is missing you.
Funny how some people who claim fidelity to the 2nd Amendment are so quick to crap on the rest of the Bill of Rights.
Funny how people that like to claim fidelity to the rest of the Bill of Rights tend to deliberately misconstrue literally everything they see in order to tortuously twist and contort it into they desperately want it to be, and know for a fact that it can’t be.
Oh really? Are you saying that all the “terrorist” plots that the the FBI “stopped” in the last decade weren’t just entrapment schemes to ensnare idiots in order to generate good PR to the police state?
>tortuously twist and contort it into they desperately want it to be, and know for a fact that it can’t be.
Oh, the irony. It’s like you actually believe the people swept up by the FBI were all terrorist masterminds, because you so desperately want it to be true. 🙂
Are you including Christian gun owners in that rights statement? Or do you want to crap as you said on the civil rights of Christians?
Let me know if you read about a Christian who was entrapped by the FBI and sent away to rot in a prison for decades, I’ll be the first one to condemn it.
I’ve never even heard of a Christian gun. Are they select fire?
ISIS and jihadist groups are against all 5 parts of the 1st amendment and are willing to cut your head off and throw it at your dying ass to keep you from exercising any of the 5 parts.
@BlueBronco Somebody tell Mr. Mohamud that ISIS would have killed him for exercising the 1st amendment. Oh wait, it’s the federal government that is about to send him to prison for decades for exercising the 1st amendment. Oh well.
Are you saying that the Boston bombers were just exercising Freedom of Speach and Religion?
Oh really? Are you saying that all the “terrorist” plots that the the FBI “stopped” in the last decade weren’t just entrapment schemes to ensnare idiots in order to generate good PR to the police state?
>tortuously twist and contort it into they desperately want it to be, and know for a fact that it can’t be.
Oh, the irony. It’s like you actually believe the people swept up by the FBI were all terrorist masterminds, because you so desperately want it to be true.
@ST — Oh, please, do point out where it was even remotely implied that I actually believed these things you knowingly erroneously accuse me of. This in spite already knowing for a fact that no such implication exists, which absolutely required you to fabricate it in your own mind.
Are you saying that all of the so-called “terrorist” plots that were “stopped” by the FBI were entrapment schemes?
Please, present me with evidence of this being the case. I won’t hold my breath, though, since you clearly don’t have and won’t ever find any.
You do realize that the only irony to be seen here comes exclusively from you, right?
It’s like you actually believe that none of the people swept up by the FBI weren’t terrorist masterminds, because you so desperately want that to be true.
If you simply look at the list of supposedly stopped “threats” since 2001 you’ll see people were convicted of “allegedly” planning attacks, lying to the feds, videotaping buildings, or talking to the wrong people.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_unsuccessful_terrorist_plots_in_the_United_States_post-9/11
Naturally due to government secrecy no one will ever know exactly how involved the feds were, egging these people along to generate propaganda for the police state. But hey, since all the charges include the word “allegedly”, it seems likely they were just patsies following orders from a government double agent.
@BlueBronco
No, the Tsarnaev brothers committed murder (the WMD charges are ludicrous).
But this guy isn’t charged with murder, therefore I wonder why you bothered to bring up the Boston case. Guilt by association?
The Boston brothers spent time at their homeland with radical jihadiists getting training. In case you missed it, this guy just spent 3 months in Syria getting training. Pay attention.
@BlueBronco There is literally zero proof that either brother received any sort of “training” in Chechnya, unless you count talking to “bad people” as “training”. This claim is simply parroted by Homeland Security hacks and relayed by the pliant media. Look at the list of charges.
So maybe you ought to be the one to pay attention.
Hey Dino brain, the Russians gave the FBI heads up on these guys when they were there on their visit. Plus, the jury disagrees with you.
@BlueBallsBronco
You might want to check on the list of charges that Dzhokhar Tsarnaev was convicted of before you start making claims about “training” in Chechnya.
And what Russian “list” was he on? He talked to some people? Anything about training camps? I can wait. 🙂
Look up the Brothers and the Russian-FBI stuff fossil brains. You also haven’t paid much attention to the contrast of her mother and other family members. The uncle said they were trouble.
http://www.cnn.com/2015/04/28/us/tsarnaev-boston-bombing-sentencing/index.html
http://www.huffingtonpost.com/2014/03/25/russia-tamerlan-tsarnaev_n_5031694.html
You know ST. It’s not that your perspective is so out of place here. I’m a more of a libertarian/constitutionalist that believes most of the republican party are hard core statists, with a few that actually follow the constitution, like Ron Paul. Not all people on this site agree with that, but there is more agreement than not.
But the way you present your ideas are consistently with of an attitude of contempt and derision upon most of the people on this site. It’s with a sense of the people on this site as enemies to be destroyed, not as potential allies.
So the results are as shown, from repeated comments by multiple people, there is the the repeated acknowledgement as you being a “troll”. If that is what you want, if that is your purpose, then so be it. Continue as you are, perceived as an enemy of most of the people that want to return to limited government and the constitution as the law of the land.
If that is what you want. Or you could find allies, even if they don’t all believe exactly like you.
If that is what you want.
He’s an mda plant. Now his bosses can single out his comments and say that we’re all like him. The only allies he’d have here are other paid mda shills.
Probably, but one can hope. Even Paul, the dedicated persecutor of the Christians, came to see the light.
It’s not my fault a contributor to this site advocates Stasi ideas about thought-crimes, or that a number of readers start yapping about the “ISIS threat” like a bunch of kool-aid addicts on a two-minute hate session.
These are not the 2A allies we need or want.
Hmm. So your saying you aren’t a plant from MDA or from the Daily Kos. You do realize that your reply was quite condescending and derisive.
Sorry S.T. Then I would have to say that you aren’t being very effective in promoting freedom, the second amendment, small government and the repeal of the police state. It’s the superior, condescending, just plain hateful attitude that keeps people from seeing you as anything but a troll or a plant.
I would suggest reevaluating your approach if you want to be an effective advocate of freedom.
@ST It’s still not your ideas that get you labeled a troll, it’s that you are a jackass. Most of the adults in the room gave that stuff/attitude in 6th grade. I’m guessing that you are about 10 years old and like being a troll.
It is amusing to me that TTAG writers and readers gleefully heap well-deserved scorn and derision on MDA, Bloomberg and their ilk, but get all pissy and upset when they themselves get called out for advocating far worse transgressions on the rights of due process and free speech. At least try to be consistently pro-liberty, people.
@Matt You mad bro? 🙂
@ST — Except that’s not what’s happening here and you have not the physical capacity within you to even begin to articulate exactly how that that is the case. You are not the 2A “ally” we need nor want.
Don’t you mean intellectual capacity? Obviously something you lack because you refuse to understand the government has been locking up anyone who has been travelling to the “wrong” countries or associating with people who went from friend to enemy in the blink of an eye.
Wasn’t the US state department supporting those Syrian rebels for the longest time? Straight out 1984. We were always at war with Eurasia. 🙂
Hmm, interesting ST. If one gets past your superior mind, dripping scorn, condescension and just plain unpleasant persona, you make some good points. But if you are trying to make a difference, it ain’t happening. You will continue to be written off as a troll.
What a waste.
Oh well.
If you think pro-government statists will ever be convinced to change their minds with internet conversations (even of the most erudite sort), you’re delusional.
Pretty much the only thing that will change their minds is if a SWAT team kills their dogs and burns their babies. And even then some of them won’t budge.
So if an “erudite” argument won’t change peoples minds, and your condescention and contempt won’t change people’s minds, then what is your purpose here?
Light banter? Witty chit-chat? Personal amusement?
Why are you here? 🙂
I also disagree about the idea that an “erudite” idea, can’t change peoples ideas or beliefs. It’s a seed, planted in soil, that once that soil is disturbed, as in a person is mugged or a child or a dog is killed by our “peace officers”, can blossom into a transformed paradigm. A new world view. That is what happened for me after a human predator tried to mug me.
It happens, just not quickly, and for some, not at all. But it took time to move to this level of police state apparatus, it will take time and many seeds planted, to move towards more freedom.
My proposal ST, is that your methods allow not one seed to be planted, only thorns and cactus on a dry a and barren plain are the result.
Why am I here? Good question. It was ideas that I read from the founding fathers, very erudite I might add, that started me on the path towards seeing the truth. The truth that government is force, not eloquence, not reason, like fire, a dangerous servant and a fearful master. (Paraphrasing some say by G. Washington, perhaps apocryphal)
It is because of ideas that I’ve read from various sources, as well as sites like this that has re-enforced these ideas of freedom.
So I come to sites like this to be inspired, and hopefully inspire that same process in others. And to have my ideas challenged as to a better grasp of what freedom really means, and hopefully challenge others the same.
Ideas can’t be erudite, people or conversations can be.
In any case, just look at this very thread and observe the number of people who are fully invested into the “terrorist” bogeyman. You’re not planting any seeds here.
Ummhmm. I kind if figured that would be your response. It’s OK ST. I had fun. We’ll just agree to disagree.
@ST — Don’t you mean physical capacity? Being that you clearly lack the necessary neurological facilities in what only barely passes for a brain nestled deep in that thick skull of yours, and that’s plainly evident in that you are the only one refusing to accept the fact that not everyone the Feds target is a perfectly innocent little angel.
Especially in light of the incontrovertible fact that there are groups of people out there that do indeed want to kill us, and possess not just the means to do so but a path to get here with relative ease. Of course, that is largely — if not exclusively — a dangerous byproduct of the ongoing (and explicitly illegal) proxy wars the U.S. has been fighting with the Russians, the Chinese, the descendants of the Mujaheddin, and all of their sympathetic allies for several decades. We even created some, if not most, of these groups ourselves and once they were no longer useful our brilliant “intelligence” apparatus (such that it is) simply neglected to keep track or control of these “assets” of theirs.
There’s a term for this: “blow back”. You would do damn well to actually learn it. That’s if you’re even remotely interested or capable for that matter.
Did you read the list I linked? Maybe you can explain how some kid who got played by the FBI is really an agent of a foreign government.
Here’s a pro-tip: blowback doesn’t come in the form of entrapped idiots. That’s when America loses an entire nation as an ally because of its criminally stupid foreign policy.
Hey ST. I was needing to get to bed. But I wanted to acknowledge another good point you made, once I waded through the condescension, arrogance, superior mind and general contempt.
Of course the Government uses the terrorists as the “Bogeyman” to help promote the police state. Hitler said that it is easy to control a population, give them an enemy to fear and they will fall into line like good boys and girls, clamoring for their mommy and daddy, (the Nanny State) to keep them safe. Anyone read “The Lord of The Flies”?
Some they help promote,(agent Provocateur) some that are self-motivated like Major Hassan. But the idea that a bunch of savages with guns or an IED could be a serious threat to the most powerful country in the world that requires us to become a police state is absurd.
Unless they got a hold of a nuke, but who would be the one providing them with a nuke? Hmmm, now that would be the question. Who would benefit the most in the drive towards total government control if a nuke went off in this country and it was blamed on the terrorists?
That’s why I like the show Jericho. It had a story line that is possible. If people deny that a small faction in our current government is not capable of such a motivator for total government control, then they are very naive.
I’ve had to notify law-enforcement once about a group of four guys who showed up to the public range (now closed) in Colorado Springs. They were definitely gang-bangers (shooting a Hi-Point of all things!) and at first I ignored them and let them do their thing. But when everyone else left the range and I was last packing up to leave, they decided it was time to break out the meth and booze. Damn, that stuff stinks! I wrote down a good description of their vehicle/etc, and after driving a mile down the mountain I called the troopers. I met the responding ranger and sheriff deputies about halfway, and they asked me about what they could expect to deal with at the range.. The next day I got a call from a deputy asking if I’d be willing to stand up in court on behalf of the prosecution, but the case never made it that far after the gangbangers took a plea deal.
So shooting a Hi-Point makes you a gang banger? Guess I need a BFWG tat on my neck.
Not necessarily but last year I did hear a clerk behind the gun counter at a pawn shop in South Carolina say that they did not sell Hi-Points to guys under 25.
sounds like he was doing them a favor.
I’m with you RF. I have a 40year old son who DOES speak arabic and works at DoD. Too bad we had to spend a trillion bucks because people weren’t watching or speaking up. Allah acura…
We didn’t “have” to spend a trillion bucks. A sane immigration policy, no immigrants who are not natives of the British Isles, and Muslim terrorists would have never been a problem.
Only native born britons allowed to immigrate? Wow, a tidal wave of pierce morgans.
Wouldn’t just be a wave of P. Morgans; the waves would include hordes of Third World immigrants who’ve spawned progeny over the last few decades, thanks to the U.K. regime’s crazed policies, which seem to have been some sort of blueprint for our own.
So was the call responsible in any way for his “capture”? The linked article is paywalled.
“Paywalled”. I like that.
Reminds me of a time back in 2011 when I was active duty and I was planning an out-of-country trip. I was required by my unit to complete an anti-terrorism web based training course. It was pretty standard stuff and provided examples of recent terrorist incidents including the snippet below which I submit for your consideration:
“The plotters’ other activities should have raised the suspicions of other
vigilant people. For example, they frequented a firing range …
and practiced attack tactics at paintball facilities. They collected
handguns, shotguns, and semiautomatic assault rifles and engaged in
firearms training…. However, no observers reported
these suspicious activities….”
Well, I shouldn‘t make assumptions, but having read this blog for awhile, I have reason to believe many of you have participated in some, if not all, of these activities. I certainly have, but I assure you I am not a terrorist plotter. Maybe I should be reporting you all?
I think this example is, unfortunately, indicative of governmental paranoia and mistrust of citizens. Most certainly the individuals referred to in the training example were in fact hatching a terrorist plot; however, the activities listed above are not suspicious in and of themselves and I find it disturbing the government would encourage citizens to report someone engaging in such activities, without any other indicators of malice present. Are we to be investigated as suspected terrorists simply because we collect firearms, go to the range, and play paintball?
My youngest son spent about 5 years as one of the HMFWICs plotting attack tactics at several paintball fields. Right in my own home, I never recognized he was a terrorist. Wonder if he was “contemplating”, as well!?
I’m wondering why if they were trained by ISIS they needed training on how to shoot a pistol?
Bingo! This story doesn’t pass the smell test.
ISIS trains one. They go home and train a dozen and so on. Not only cost effective, but also practical. The U.S. government does this very same thing with training foreign militaries and such.
First, just cause they trained with ISIS doesn’t mean they are going to be trained well. And they probably never even touched a pistol. Even the US Army doesn’t teach pistol in Basic.
Apparently, he was training a crew. Plus, don’t assume that a 3 month training course by El Bagddady’s boys is going to make a marine drill sgt in that period of time. Plus, pistol shooting probably isn’t part of what ISIS was training him to do.
Practice. If you trained on a Mak at jihad johnny’s desert retreat a year ago and haven’t touched a pistol since, you need practice. Especially if you’re about to go “hot”.
Right, because every good deed will be rewarded.
I can hereby attest that yes, my Spidey senses would be tingling if I saw this guy at the range with a group of others practicing whatever and the same senses would be tingling even more if I knew his name at the time. Same as if I’d seen the aforementioned gangbangers at the range. Profiling? Tough chit, amigo. I do it anyway. Any of these types at the local ranges here and I’d doubt they’d even get in through the front gate, esp. without a membership card. And they’d stick out a LOT.
It comes down to: Abdirahman Sheik Mohamud can’t shoot at our range and I CAN. Simple as that.
Identifying the actual “Radical Islamists” from those that have declared “refugee” status or even immigrated “legally” to The U.S. is going to become next to impossible going forward (for the “average Joe” that is). Look at it in historical context, say WWII, when the U.S. had to concern itself the relatively small numbers of Japanese Americans which were densely populated/located and easily surveilled during times of War after Pearl Harbor (I’m not going to get into the Internment Camps in this comment please)…Now contrast that example with today when we 1) have OPEN BORDERS and 2) immigrants in every single State in The Union…
That said, I am of the opinion that as Americans it is our Duty and obligation to report any and all suspicious situations if we are to protect The Homeland…Indifference is a sure recipe for defeat, the question at that point is only one of time…
It seems the NSA has no problem keeping tabs on them, with enough leftover manpower to watch you and I (and everyone else on this blog). In fact .Gov probably has more access and intelligence on them now than the resident American-japanese in dubya-dubya two.
Are we safer? I really don’t know, all I know is a lot of freedom was sacrificed to get wherever here is.
I see it as my duty and obligation to be armed, trained and willing to put my life on the line defending my fellow Americans from human predators. What ever species, common criminal, terrorist(s), etc.
But I get hives when someone uses the term “the Homeland”. It smacks so of fascistic, communistic government dominated ideologies. The Fatherland, The Motherland, The Homeland.
When Bush signs the Abomination Act(Patriot Act) and goes on about the hundred year war against terror as the terrorists attack “The Homeland”: all I see is a Swastika waving in the breeze. No. I love my COUNTRY, America. And my fellow Americans.
NDAA anyone? Something Goebbels would approve of.
Thank you. That really bugs me too. I don’t have a “homeland,” dammit.
OMG. I am so glad others feel the same way. When they came up with the name I immediately thought of the Heimat Sicherheitsdienst. What a fail. Yet no one opposed it because you got labeled unAmerican back then. I am pretty conservative in most things but I remember arguing against the Iraq war. I was told by more than one person, “How can you be against this! You were a Marine!” My answer was always that I was against it because I was a Marine.
This organization is nothing but the Stasi, reincarnated. We keep ceding our rights and freedoms for just a little more security every year. My question is when will we stop? Will it be too late? We have to vote out the lot of the current statists in Washington, disband 3/4 of the federal government and repeal about 90% of the stupid laws we have on the books. Eliminate income tax, term limits and salary caps for public office and hold citizens responsible for their actions.
/off rant.
Well stated, sir. The term smacks of ultra-nationalism which is a truly terrifying thing.
Many people felt the same about the Pledge of Allegiance when it was introduced, but now we’ve all been taught to not think critically about it and instead get pissed at people for not standing for/reciting it.
Homeland Security. Really? Combined with the NDAA, where a person can be incarcerated for the duration of the hostilities, which could be,a hundred years, without being cbarged with a crime, talking to a lawyer
or face his accusers or the evidence against him, for over a hundred years. Which the arbiters of all that is constitutional, the USSC, has said is constitutional. Hmmm.
We talk about having some of our gun rights being renewed as evidence of a reawakening in the population of the importance of freedom and personal responsibility.
But until the outcry of the people include the elimination entire apparatus of the police state, the (GAG) Patriot Act and the NDAA, we aren’t truly free.
Indeed. I’ve said from the minute they proposed it, that anything called ‘Patriot Act’ that brings about the creation of something called ‘Homeland Security’ is straight out of Orwell.
The Founders are spinning in their graves.
The problem with the NDAA, is that we don’t how many people have already been seized and placed in isolation. From what I understand about the act, the government is not required to say who has been seized. If that is the case, hundreds, even thousands of people might be held without us even knowing.
The government has said that they consider that those people that believe in limited government and the constitution as the law of the land as being potential terrorists. I’m a person that believes in limited government and that the Constitution is the law of the land.
At this point, I would not be surprised if the government does have a Red and Blue termination list of those people considered a danger to their statists dream of total government control that would be seized in the event of national martial law being declared.
At this point.
Some will be more difficult to seize than others.
Strange times we live in to have this as even a possibility to consider.
You know something is up when a bill is named to sound good. These things should be named for what they are. the unPatriot Act, NY unSafe Act, the unAffordable Care Act etc.
The people who work at my gun range have seen it all. If they thought that someone was “off,” they’d probably be correct in that assessment.
In this case, Abdirahman Sheik Mohamud was at the range after “training with violent extremists in Syria.” I’d say that the range personnel did the right thing by reporting him to the po-po.
Well if, for instance, you’re conducting flying lessons and you’ve got a group of Arabic speaking foreign nationals who just want to learn how to fly the plane and don’t care to learn how to land it, THAT should be a big red flag. As for the rest, part of the price of freedom is that the bad guys are also free (until they’re not). It sure beats living in a society where only the bad guys have guns though.
Still, if you’re absolutely convinced that someone’s up to no good you should let the authorities in on it and let them worry about it.
On an unrelated note TTAG needs a movie review/analysis of “Everly”. Talk about defensive gun use and VIOLENCE OF ACTION!!!11FTW.
If a group of swastika wearing gun owners came to a gun range would you be uneasy, call the FBI?
If the people were Asians with swastikas would that make a difference?
How about a group of bikers?
I would hope any range employee would screen anyone shooting at their range. Their life may depend on it.
I only feel uncomfortable when cops or government agents are on the range.
It’s hard to separate the good from the bad when they all wear the same costume, and serve the same master — and often times, that master is not the people they allegedly swore to “protect and serve”.
Why the heck are these people even in our country in the first place? It’s interesting to note that the World Trade Center bombing, the Boston marathon bombing and 9/11 were all committed by people our government welcomed in. Allowing your societies enemies to immigrate to your country and set up shop is not a winning strategy.
Who exactly are we at war with? Terrorists? “Radical Islamists?” These types are notoriously difficult to identify until they’re exploding or pointing Kalashnikovs at somebody. And known terrorists are already denied access to the US to the best of the gov’s ability.
The alternative is to deny legal immigration to people from nations we aren’t at war with, cultural/ethnic backgrounds that MANY great Americans share, or a religion that probably has the same number of crazies per capita as Christianity.
Maybe we should round them up and put them in camps until we can all agree on something to do with them. Surely, nobody has tried that before.
Well, it’s like this: the vast majority of the terrorist scum who’ve attacked us or our friends around the world or each other, are young Arabic/Muslim males. Simple as that. Or young black males from wherever with Arabic/Muslim names. How hard can it be? But God forbid we “profile” anyone. Instead, let’s make my Irish-American, red-haired, blue-eyed wife jump through hoops at the airports (she travels 1-3 weeks every month all over the country) or run extensive and detailed background checks on me for a low-level IT drone job, complete with fingerprints and drug tests, as a U.S. veteran and former police officer.
Something is wrong with this picture.
You’re absolutely right!
There have never been small fringe groups of the Irish that ran terror campaigns! Or male veterans that either went on shooting sprees or blew up a bunch of innocent people. Take a step away from your bias and examine the problem objectively… The fact is, a percentage of EVERY cultural, ethnic, national, religious, etc group is going to be batsh*t cray-cray.
I’m not providing a solution to something that is clearly a problem, I doubt there is one. Unfortunately, risk and hardship are natural parts of freedom. In the glorious and noble quest to limit risk and hardship for Americans, we’ve welcomed limitations to our freedoms with open arms. Then we piss and moan because we don’t like results one way or the other.
You’re right, something is wrong with this picture when a supposed “veteran” advocates racist profiling.
The Boston bombers were Caucasian and had Slavic names. You just want an excuse to enforce your racism.
It’s eminently debatable as to whether it’s racist or not; it’s otherwise known as “survival.” If 99% of the hadji terrorists in the world over the last forty years are young Arab males and we take note of that and watch accordingly, that makes us racist, right? Tough chit. Most of the 9/11 murdering bastards? Young Arab males. See, not all Arabs are terrorists. But almost all terrorists are Arabs these days. Got it?
If Reverend Jesse Jackson is walking down a city street and sees a cluster of young males ahead and wipes his brow in sweaty relief that it’s Caucasians instead of other African-American males, does that make him a racist?
This is the thing! This cat in the pic has the hadji beard going on as well as the dress.
Davidx, that would make Jackson a hypocrit. But, we’re talking about Jaxkson, after all.
I have to say that you’re way off base here, Mr. Farago. Profiling is not a dirty 9-letter word. You don’t and shouldn’t treat everyone else the same. A Muslim, serving you a hot dog at a 7-11, who keeps a gun under the counter is quite a bit different from these jihadists in the story. You bet your gefilte fish I’d call on them in a heartbeat and let the police sort it out. The 2A does not put a force field around a person that then shields them from suspicion. A gang banger entering the above mentioned 7-11 while open carrying can expect to be shot almost immediately if the owner has situational awareness. Why should we put our collective heads in the sand as you are advocating? It’s nonsense.
Who are “these people” you refer to? Anyone not white? There are Bosnian Muslims that are as white as can be.
We want open carry. We say gun laws are rooted in racism. Yet if a black man walks into a 7-11 open carrying he’s getting shot?
Wait. You said gangbanger. How can you decide what that is? By dress?
A gang banger who is open carrying was sarcasm. He is no more exercising his 2A rights than the man on the moon. His intent is to steal and destroy. Went right over your head, didn’t it? 🙂
That’s rich. The act of open carrying is now subject to social and associative norms as dictated by the government and their supporters.
Tell me, were the Black Panthers open carrying at the California capitol, or were they just “gangbangers”?
Gang-bangers don’t carry openly like the Black Panthers did. Though, even if they did, they wouldn’t pay any mind to the Mulford Act anyway. There is a clear different between a peaceable protest and a gaggle of psychopaths getting ready to kill someone.
Just throwing that out there.
Didn’t Reagan and the NRA refer to the Black Panthers as well as the neighborhood protection groups formed after Chicago cops murdered Fred Hampton in his sleep as “gangsters”?
If anyone are “gang-bangers” it is the modern day police. They open carry, by the way.
@ST — Uh, no. Maybe Reagan did, but the NRA didn’t. Hell, it was the various local chapters of the NRA that helped train the Panthers for crying out loud.
Most likely BS, since the national NRA supported the Mulford Act:
http://reason.com/blog/2014/06/17/when-the-nra-opposed-open-carry
Now if there were local NRA chapters that defied the national organization and trained the Black Panthers, I’ve never read about it. Please post sources.
The old-fudd NRA was packed full of racist law-and-order fascists and they weren’t replaced until quite recently.
In Dearborn, MI, it’s not uncommon at all to see Arabs open carrying (especially in their businesses). It’s quite nice actually, I always commend them for protecting themselves and their businesses.
Dearbornistan….gag.
A classic example of what is totally fvcked up in this country.
European leftist multi-culturalism instead of American E Pluribus Unum.
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