Walmart ammo ammunition gun shelf empty
Image courtesy Jim McGuire
Walmart ammo ammunition gun shelf empty
Image courtesy Jim McGuire

With retail shelves practically empty of firearms — semi-autos in particular — and available ammunition a distant memory of The Time Before, no doubt all of TTAG’s readership is well aware that the past nine-plus months have been a strange time for gun and ammo manufacturers, distributors, retailers, and customers. But you probably didn’t know things had gotten this weird.

Allow me to set the stage: I co-own a firearm and component brand and, while we don’t retail other brands of firearms as part of our business, we have accounts with the four largest wholesale distributors in the industry so we can purchase components (grips, magazines, optics, etc.) for building out our complete guns.

Since things got “interesting” early last spring, many friends, neighbors, and other acquaintances have asked if my company could source a gun for them to buy. In all cases they looked locally and came up dry. The typical request: “XYZ handgun, but at this point I’ll take basically any semi-automatic handgun at all . . . maybe a semi-auto rifle of some sort if there aren’t any good pistols.”

So I hop on a distributor’s website and filter their inventory for firearms > handguns and rifles > semi-auto > in-stock only. And the search comes up nearly dry. What starts as over 9,000 unique firearm SKUs ends up with one to four models that have at least one unit in stock, and they’re almost never what my friend or neighbor is looking for.

Having played this game a couple of dozen times since last spring, in-stock semi-autos have almost never included more than some Smith & Wesson Model 41s (a high-end .22 LR target pistol), a SIG P210 (high-end 9mm target pistols), and the occasional .22 LR carbine of some sort. And ammo? Zilch. Well, there was some .50 BMG and some 12 gauge available here and there.

To be clear, this isn’t because the distributors aren’t receiving any inventory. Manufacturers are making as much as they possibly possibly can, and the product is getting into distribution, but there’s such an incredible level of demand that anything and everything made has a long line of dealer backorders. As soon as it arrives at the distributor, there’s already a huge list of dealers who have committed to buy it.

So for a company like mine, which doesn’t stock other brands of firearms to sell at retail, there’s effectively zero chance of getting our hands on one until supply catches up with this unprecedented demand.

Which brings us to Friday, when a box containing two pistols — a Ruger and a Smith & Wesson — showed up at the office. It was shipped to us from one of our distributors…but we hadn’t ordered the guns.

I hopped on their website and, sure enough, the order for those guns was in our order history, but I was sure we didn’t place it either intentionally or accidentally. A quick email search showed that we hadn’t received the automated order confirmation email that normally accompanies orders we place. A glance at our checking account history showed the $853 withdrawal from the day the package shipped.

So I emailed our rep and told him that it appeared an order was accidentally associated with and charged to our account, but we hadn’t placed it. If the guns were supposed to go to another customer, I said, I’m sure they really want them so we’re happy to ship them to the correct location. But if it was some sort of error, well, I suppose we’d just keep the guns and put them up for sale at full MSRP since they’re almost certain to get snatched up right away.

Our rep emailed back within a few minutes. Get a load of this: He placed and sent the order “to hook you up,” because we hadn’t ordered in a while and he knows how impossible it has been to get guns like these two allocated (heavily backordered and quantity-limited per dealer) models. Basically the message was “I did you a favor, I’m awesome, you’re welcome.”

At the same time, of course, he offered to immediately send a return shipping label if, for some reason, we didn’t want them. You mean these gifts that we unknowingly bought for ourselves thanks to your generosity? Actually, I guess we do want them.

This, then, is the current state of the industry. The level of demand for virtually every firearm made is so insane now that a sales rep surprise-sells me something I didn’t ask for and expects me to be grateful. The sales guy closes the sale, informs the buyer that it happened, and says “you’re welcome,” and the buyer says “thank you.”

Never in my life have I heard of anything like this. It absolutely cracks me up, because it’s entirely bizarre…but at the same time, he isn’t wrong. Every gun shop in the country right now would have been thrilled to learn that they had unexpectedly paid $853 for two random handgun models that they didn’t ask for.

It’s true, which is why it’s utterly bonkers.

 

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148 COMMENTS

  1. Hhhhhmmmm. Despite the “good” outcome, seems like a retailer intentionally charging you for something you did not order is not quite legally kosher. Which is why I refuse to setup “autopay” for anything.

      • “Nothing illegal about this. You just don’t have to pay for them.”

        Charging someone’s account without proper authorization (a sales order) is OK? Not seeing in the original order that the items were “free” to the author. Might have missed something.

        • To be a straw purchase you would have to buy it for someone you KNEW was unable to lawfully have it.
          Also dealers delivering for resale are not selling to end users and cannot be straw purchaser (perhaps if that dealer had lost thier FFL and the rep was buying for them but then how would they resale it with no FFL).

    • Same thing happened to me:
      Sales rep: “I got some 230 grain ball .45 for you. I set aside 10 boxes for you but you’ve got to buy em now.”
      Me: “Who are you again? I ordered no such thing.”

      • Anyone notice what has happened to the supply of actual physical silver over the last few days?

        It has gone the way of ammo.

        I hope everyone also has a good supply of long term food storage. The world is getting weird in a hurry.

        Last year, I kept adding .270 (and 7.62*39) to my supply, since .223 and 9mm were hard to find. Now they are also gone.

        • That was the reddit bandits at it again. r/wallstreetbets advised their readers to run up the price of physical silver. (These are the same people that inflated GameStop stock last week).

        • Reddit users. People had a good weeks worth of forewarning that they were going to do silver next. Same thing with the hoaxademic, people who float about on the internet knew it was coming to the USA months before the store selves went empty.

    • Yeah, that’s fraud. If the victim isn’t going to complain nothing will happen about it, but people have gone to prison for this kind of stuff. Look up “channel stuffing”.

      • “Look up “channel stuffing”.”

        I knew it was something, but the mind fogs. Thanx for the reference.

  3. AGREE GUN CRAZ BUY TIME ..
    UuH DO YA GET 500 ROUNDS OFFERED WITH BUYING A NEW WEAPON
    UuH DISCOUNT ON 500 ROUNDS WITH NEW WEAPON ?
    UuH pray ammo in stock for ya new weapon ..

    • Just found 28ga ammo in stock at several local big box retailers. Bought all the ammo at every store within 50 miles. Then, bought a 28ga Browning BPS Ducks Unlimited to use it. Is that reverse logic or just normal gun guy logic????? Whatever….works for me. 🙂 🙂 🙂

    • I lust for a Beretta APX compact to replace my carry gun. I have decided to become better acquainted with the 20 or 30 guns I currently own rather than join the mayhem. I will admit, I don’t really need another gun. Half of me say’s I won’t pay current prices for a gun I don’t really need and the other half says, to buy the gun deprives someone else of a gun they really do need…. (don’t argue with me on this).
      Early, I stocked up on powder, bullets…have buckets of brass in all calibers from .380 to .308. Primers became the problem. Especially small pistol & small rifle. To supply the primer cabinet for the next few years, I’ve paid $0.30-0.60 ea. for primers to restock shortages. Very painful but, in reality, the average cost of primers in my inventory are still around $0.13ea. I’m good for several years.
      While I would love a new Beretta, it’s more important to put a few magazines through the guns I carry every few weeks (If you can’t shoot it well, DON’T F%#KING CARRY IT!), a few dozen rounds through the hunting rifles (practical) and, a few magazines through an AR or two (the fun part).
      The guys/girls that are lining up at guns stores to buy a gun or ONE box of 9mm range ammo, need it a hell of a lot more than I do. I feel for these guys/girls.
      My state has the FOID, long delays, severe shortages of guns and ammo. My daughters (from a prior marriage) and my girlfriend (of 10 years) have never fired a factory round. I load range ammo for accuracy, not power. Most people do not load their own ammo and, probably shouldn’t… it requires a certain dedication to precision, science and a bit of art. I’ve been doing it for 50 years.
      Think hard about whether you really need another gun, more ammo, etc. If the answer is …well, no I really don’t, leave the limited inventory to those who do or, are new to the sport.
      We’re all in this together!

      • You can still get a Beretta direct from Langdon Tactical. Stock or lots of cool enhancements The Langdon Tactical trigger is a must in my book but not cheap..

    • On the weekend I was able to buy a box of 1000 small rifle primers and 2 bricks of CCI standard velocity. 22LR. But that was the ONLY economic standard velocity 22LR available. Lots of high velocity which my local rimfire range doesn’t allow. And plenty of target grade 22LR which costs per round the same as low end .223.

        • Southern Cross

          My neighbors raise hell regardless of which 22 rounds I use to shoot squirrels in their yard.

        • The range is run by the local council (local government) and the SSAA (Sporting Shooters Association of Australia) has use on Friday and Sunday nights 6-9pm. The nearest houses are over 500 yards away but they do everything they can to limit the noise. I don’t mind going there because it is a literal mile-and-a-half from home, costs about $15 to shoot with several replacement targets, and if you follow the rules (which aren’t onerous) you’ll have a good time.

        • Specialist38

          I often shoot offending raccoons and starlings at my wife’s bird feeders, and maybe a few other varmints as opportunity presents. My neighbor understands and approves. His wife had some white ducks for their pond down the hill, that would occasionally make their way into our yard and hoover up the spilled seed. My wife would go barreling out the back door, “Shoo shoo shoo” and some other syllables, waving a towel, broom, or butcher knife (whichever was closest to hand). We thought that was the funniest thing, the neighbor and I did. My wife didn’t just put her foot down, she stamped it. There’s a landfill across the road, and we have free trash collection. If you ask the neighbor’s wife, she believes minks and ‘coons from the creek got them.

          His wife brought home a black cat a short time ago, wanting a good “mouser” to keep outside around their outbuildings. Well, in my experience, growing up on a farm with cats and a raft of other critters, good “mousers” are also good “birders.” My wife is awfully protective of her songbirds. The neighbor is a practical and understanding man, and probably had a story cooked up for his wife before she ever brought the cat home. There’s a decent sized flock of sparrows hanging around his equipment yard, so perhaps they’ll keep the cat sated. We shall see.

          • “My wife would go barreling out the back door, “Shoo shoo shoo” and some other syllables, waving a towel, broom, or butcher knife (whichever was closest to hand). ”

            One of the cool things about living in the inner-city is you don’t have to put up with all that animal crap.

  4. its because the smartest people in the room understand that 2020 was likely our last chance to vote our way out of whats coming based on whats already here…
    see: maoism…great leap forward…cultural revolution…red guards…struggle sessions

    • Discounting any widespread artificially generated paranoia on the part of the general population; yeah, I’d say you’re right.

    • You forgot the self-criticism and the public beseeching to be allowed to atone for your crimes against the state.

  5. The only firearms I want are ones I can get more ammo for.

    I’m looking at a semi auto M2HB on gunbroker that’s currently $16025 but I can’t justify that much on a toy so I have to convince myself it’s an investment. Even though I have the balance, I sure wouldn’t want to surprised by that deduction in my account.

    • I’ve seen 100 rounds of 50BMG for sale, cheaper than 250 rounds of 9mm. Maybe you’ll get in some trigger time.

      • Right now 100 rounds of .50 lake city linked 4:1 tracer is $279 on target sports USA with prime membership. If you can find any 6.5 Creedmoor, it’s about the same price. Might as well have fun with the big stuff since apparently no horde of whores are hoarding it.

        • “Might as well have fun with the big stuff since apparently no horde of whores are hoarding it.”

          Nicely done.

        • Was at sportsman’s Warehouse at Capital City Mall in Camp Hill PA yesterday buying a mag pouch. They had plenty of 6.5 Creedmore. I don’t shoot it, so I didn’t check the price. Also plenty of .375, .300 WM, .350 Legend, and some other similar calibers. I’m much more of a pistolero and don’t own guns in any of these chamberings.

  6. I saw this start in March of 2020. I was at the store getting some 20 guage birdshot to finish a review of a semi auto for TTAG, this was a Friday afternoon. In came a hoard and started to wipe the shelves clean. In the 10 min I was there I grabbed 250 rounds of birdshot and watched what was left of slugs, buckshot and 9mm ammo completely disappearing. I checked back a week later and there was 2 boxes of 10mm and 12 guage birdshot left, nothing else. Since then all the local shops have been void of ammunition, even Cabelas has been out of the big bore pistol stuff. I haven’t finished my review because I am saving the birdshot for my daughters trap season. I have some (almost enough) but I don’t shoot as often because I can’t easily replace what will be used.

    • “In came a hoard and started to wipe the shelves…”

      Just because….

      “Hoard”, “Horde” and “Whored” are entirely different things; not interchangeable.

        • “Sorry. The horde came in and started hoarding what was left.”

          There ya’ go. The universe is back in balance.

        • This is for Sam:

          “A man said to the Universe:
          Sir, I exist!
          However, replied the Universe,
          The fact does not create in me
          a sense of obligation.”

          • “A man said to the Universe:
            Sir, I exist!
            However, replied the Universe,
            The fact does not create in me
            a sense of obligation.”

            I like that. Similar to the old plaque over the finance office desk: “Piss Poor Planning on your part does not constitute an emergency on my part.”

            – “I am, I said, to no one there. And no one heard at all, not even the chair. I am, said I, and I am lost and don’t even know why.”

            – – N. Diamond

        • ‘I know a girl that lives on a hill. She won’t f*ck but her sister will.’ Said a mean tempered man in a smokey bear hat.

          Notice how I cleaned it up so it won’t be too adult for Sam?

          • “Notice how I cleaned it up so it won’t be too adult for Sam?”

            “Adult content” is guns and gear. The other stuff is fun and games.

          • “What “adult content” was Sam talking about?”

            Guns and Gear. Very, very few trolls comment about that. The other content allows for trolls, hence non-adult content. The very serious readers (adults) are attracted to guns and dear, while the audience for politics and headlines includes the children (trolls).

            Ok, I admit it. It was a lame meme.

        • @ Sam I AM…..“A man said to the Universe: Sir, I exist!

          As I sit here thinking of my friends on the left and on the right and what “forever” means, I am in awe watching the waxing moon ride across the zenith of the heavens like an ambered chariot towards the dark ebon void of infinite space wherein the tethered belts of Jupiter and Mars, hang “forever festooned” in their orbital majesty! And as I looked up at this “amazing universe”, still sitting here I thought…….someday; I must put a roof on this shit house!

          • “…still sitting here I thought…….someday; I must put a roof on this…”

            Now, that’s tacky.

            “Clowns to the left of me, Jokers to the right. Here I am, stuck in the middle with you.”
            – – S. Wheels

        • Susie went into a bank to open an account. She dumped a sack full of quarters out on the managers desk.

          ‘My word. Did you hoard all those quarters by yourself?’ He said.

          ‘No.’ Says Susie. ‘ My sister whored half of them.’

  7. When police Chiefs and sheriffs across the country told people they couldn’t protect them that started the panic. That is how societal collapse begins.

    And the destruction of the city’s last year is proof of that. I think our country has lost a large amount of trust on law enforcement. Including the Feds. And it’s part the country that has traditionally trusted that the cops, would eventually come to their rescue.

    Libertarians liberals and the left might rejoice in the general Public’s loss of confidence in law enforcement. However the Three L’s don’t support the alternative.

    And that is people with guns taking the Law into their own hands. Since law enforcement might become unreliable. We can always go back to the days in this country, when it was the person or persons with the most guns and ammunition who got their way.

    It’s already that way in certain neighborhoods of Chicago and Detroit and elsewhere. But it could be expanded to the vast areas of the United States.

  8. Eh. I have to think it’s at least some regional variation.

    In New Mexico, the mom-n-pop gun stores I’m a regular at, are pretty well stocked for pistols (except concealed-carry size) and higher-end ARs on the wall; a few have some midrange ARs too. Even the local Cabela’s was doing pretty well for pistols, shotguns and bolt-actions on the walls.

    The issue is ammo, according to my favorite LGS. The panic buyers bought guns over the summer (if they could); right now, people who know a little more aren’t buying a gun if they don’t think they can get ammo for it.

  9. My regular local shops have guns, a fair selection given current events. Ammo is an issue, but I’ve gotten lucky a few times here and there. Sounds like things are pretty sparse in a lot of places, but the nearest dealer to me (in suburbia 20 mintues south of St.Louis) may have no ARs, but other than that he’s good. Pocket pieces in .32, .380 or 9mm? Yep. Mid and full size in a variety of calibers? Yep. Revolvers? Pick your caliber. Lever or bolt guns? A bunch. Mags? What do you need?

  10. All the gun prices are INSANE but that’s the way the free marker work. Case in point, I need a parts set to complete a pistol build. Went on Gunbroker and found a guy selling the kit for $80. He had 10 kits available. I didn’t buy right then. Came back later and they were gone. A few days later those same kits went on sale on GB for $144. Snooze and lose.

    • I bought ammo for shit I didn’t even have.

      Still haven’t listed it, but I will profit. Smart? Or asshole move.

      Probably both. No shame.

      • You might be able to trade it. I’ve bought what I guess you might call an auction lot or an estate when the price was right and have some junk I’m not even 100% sure what it is specifically.

        I’m holding onto some .222 Remington, 30-40 Kragg, 30 Mauser 7.62 tokarev because someday someone will come over with those guns and I’ll get a chance to pull the trigger. Already got to shoot a box and a half of .32 acp through a Beretta Cheetah last year.

      • Hey I’ve been an antique dealer for more than 25 year’s. Doubling your dough isn’t good eunf. You have to make big scores to keep going($15 to $32000,$250 to $10000 and so on-all oil paintings.) I don’t usually deal in guns but would if the opportunity presented itself. Chef don’t judge(or ask what you paid!). If a dealer has price gouge pricing I just DON’T buy.I do leave reviews on social media!

  11. If the time comes and no sane person wants it too, guns and ammo can be picked off the corpses. Be prepared, be ready and pray for divine intervention so your not one of the corpses.

    If that time is forced upon us, my sincere hope is the second place finisher had the sense to buy quality ammo and magazines.

    • We are holding ham radio classes for the upcoming tests, and one of the questions in the class was “can we just get this stuff out of police vehicles?”

      We all chuckled and said “yes”

      • Don’t underestimate the antifer’s and BLM’rs gear. I have seen some with some pretty nice kits. I have also seen some Patriots with full-on chinky airsoft gear and knock-off mags.

        • Don’t underestimate the antifer’s and BLM’rs gear. I have seen some with some pretty nice kits. I have also seen some Patriots with full-on chinky airsoft gear and knock-off mags.

          Yeah BLM has to do something with the hundreds of millions they get from McDonalds, Pepsi and other Global Corporations cause.. you know, BLM..

      • I wouldn’t want to bet my life on a cheap promag. I’d really prefer to not bet my life against someone else’s cheap promag either. Same is true of a Hi Point, best to do your utmost to avoid situations where you’re getting shot at.

  12. Up to December I was able to buy .223, 9mm, 32 S&W, 32 acp, and 32 H&R mag. I have what I need. I’ve been stocking up for many years now.

    I learned from the days of the Sandy Hook shortages. I was new to guns back then.

  13. If it goes bang or plays any part in anything that goes bang chances are it’s out of stock.

  14. One of my LGSs (i don’t frequent the other – don’t like em), has a decent amount of long guns and keeps trickling in a few handguns.

    I ask them about supply and they set up an agreement with two distributors. If the distributors have guns they can allocate, they ship them and let the store know what they sent. Keeps the prices lowers and a semi-decent selection of arms.

    He said if they specified only certain guns, that’s all they would get – when they were available. So taking the grab bag gets them more guns.

    Reminds me of the 70s when Smith and Wessons came through a jobber. To get a model 19, 29, 27 or other highly-desirable revolver, you had to 5 model 10s, a couple of model 31s, and a couple of Model 14s and 18s. LOL we’d take em all now and be happy.

  15. Just wait and see what happens in the overall markets this week. The autists at WSB get their way and there will be bloodbaths galore across numerous sectors.

    Shit, they already caused a shortage of physical silver. But will it get them what they really want? JP Morgan bent over and screaming?

    Things be getting interesting across the board here.

    • I’m watching the silver markets daily. It’s one thing I’ll offload if the market hits the right point.

      • Just curious – what would your sell price/oz. be?
        If Ag goes to $150/oz. (yeah, right…), do you sell? Or is it Armageddon? In which case, “no”…….

      • I’ve been a silver bug for many years. Bought good delivery bars at $8 to $12 per oz, sold at $48/oz, a bit below the peak of $48.70. Damn things are heavy. I wasn’t smart, just lucky. Waited for the decline and started buying again. The problem is the length of the cycle. Peaks can be 10 years apart or more, and dips last a long time.

        If you want to buy something that might appreciate like crazy if the world goes to hell, try guns and ammo (we collect both), liquor or canned peaches. Even if the world doesn’t collapse, you can’t go wrong.

      • They get what they want, pushing physical to $1000/oz and the world’s gonna have a major reset. There’s a reason RH has significant limits on AMC, BB, EXPR, GME, GNUS, KOSS, NAKD and NOK right now. One share per trade.

        Unfortunately when it comes to the WSB folks, now numbering more than 7 million and targeting SLV and PSLV “We can stay re-tard-ed longer than you can stay solvent” is their motto. And they want to fuck JP Morgan badly.

        Blood’s in the water after GSE. This could get real rough real fast. Like all the retirement funds going bye-bye in a week while the dollar takes a beating too. Yellen’s only tool is to stop the markets all together. Lulz.

        I really hope this doesn’t go sideways, but it has serious potential to do so. The people doing it are angry and they give no fucks what the ultimate outcome is… if they even recognize the downside risks here.. I warned about that woodchipper… well, this goes sideways and the chipper goes BRRRR grinding up the older generations faster than most of them believe is possible.

        But hey, batching about ammo prices will fix it, eh?

  16. I notice in the local gun shops, 9 mm and .380 pistols are available. Just no ammo. They must have gotten a few in because a couple months ago they had next to nothing.

    The wife and I stopped by the local farm chain store and, naturally, I checked the ammo. I knew right away something was up. Guys were buzzing like bees around the ammo aisle. They had 9mm Winchester FMJ, 150 rd box for $34.99, limit one. So I grabbed one. Not like I need it, but I’m thinking we’ll never again see prices like we’re used to. Anyway, the wife says, “Want me to get one too?” Bruised my jaw on the floor! But got out of there with 300 rds.

  17. The local Bi Mart got some 9mm in, just ball ammo.
    The only way you could get 1 box, is if you bought a handgun.
    Watched it happen.
    They actually have about a half dozen handguns and over a dozen long guns. Kinda surprising.

    • There’s a local shop in my area that has ball ammo pretty consistently. It’s rare that you see any HP though.

      When all this happened I was looking to stock up on some Hornady critical duty and defense, and I found some at the gun show, well, a lot at the gun show, and I know I overpaid but I got it all. No wife, so no explaining necessary.

  18. Long guns we have, ammo and pistols not so much.

    What’s everyone s idea of when ammo becomes common again and why?

    I’m predicting maybe spring 2022 now unless Creepy Joe continues on creating havoc. Gas prices going up, his minions putting people out of work for the new green BS and wokeness..ect

    • I only wish it would come back to normal that quickly. My prediction is much more dire. I’m thinking possibly never. Seriously.

    • What’s everyone s idea of when ammo becomes common again and why

      If prices ever get back to anything near pre 2020 prices I will go back to two to three trips weekly to the range and return to replacing what I burn up plus 20% (shoot up 500 buy back 600) keeps supply rotated and because I can… Really have all the guns I’ll ever NEED so it would take a real special deal to make any more purchases (at least on the books) will probably pick up a few more 80% lowers and more maintenance kits (BCG, firing pins, trigger assemblies, barrels, etc.)

    • Honestly, I’m thinking late 2022 you’ll get some stabilization in availability if things go well. Back to “normal” in terms of availability mid-2023.

      A return to prices of 2019 prices could occur but it won’t.

      Of course this all assumes that the craziness in the markets doesn’t go pear-shaped and, if we’re honest, there’s a real risk that it could. The spillover effect in other parts of life worries me a bit here.

      You’re already starting to see the more rabid parts of the Left start to blame all the market chaos on “racist Nazis” and the like while referring to SLV and GSE as part of “financial terrorism”. That’s worrying in a lot of ways, not the least of which is how they might try to “fix” the issue, especially when they’re already talking Patriot Act 2.0 due to the Congressional “riot”.

      If things go badly in the markets there’s no way that Joe & Co. will know how to react to that. Their initial impulse will be to shut-down everything to “protect the markets” followed by authoritarian restrictions on trading. If they go with that “financial terrorism” thing that could get really ugly in the real world very, very quickly.

      • “Of course this all assumes that the craziness in the markets doesn’t go pear-shaped and, if we’re honest, there’s a real risk that it could.”

        Ammo will spike even *harder* if that happens.

        There’s already talk of “fixing the courts”, but Schumer is at this point keeping it to expediting filling current federal vacancies, and adding jurists in some circuits, to move cases through the circuits faster. That can be good for us, as well as them. Also mentioned was chatter of creating a ‘bi-partisan commission’ to “Study expanding the SCOTUS”. The only problem with them doing that is 1, it’s not polling very well at all (including Democrats, believe it or not!), and 2, they run a very real risk of infuriating us even worse before mid-terms. That can cost them *everything*, legislative-wise. Oh, and there’s video of RBG stating the SCOTUS should not be larger than it is. If they are seriously contemplating doing that, a politically-effective counter argument is flooding the media with that video. It will influence Democrat voters…

        They are shitting bricks at the prospect of Trump in 4 years. He well could say no in 3.5 years, he’s not getting younger. His endorsement of someone with elect-ability like Ambassador Nikki Haley could be powerful MoJo for her. And her being the first conservative ‘POC’ female president would be a brutal kick in the teeth for the Leftists.

        Yeah, I agree, things might get interesting in the not-distant future…

        • The scariest part is that a lot of damage can be done, much of it irreparable, in the next 2 years before mid-terms. There is already a barrage of gun control bills in the pre-filing queue.

          Registration – check
          Database – check
          “High” capacity magazine bans – check
          All semi-autos covered under NFA – check
          Mandatory government-supplied self defense insurance – check
          Red flag orders nationwide – check
          Elimination of online sales of anything firearm related – check
          Backgrounds checks for all parts and ammo – check
          Liability on manufacturers for guns used in crimes – check

          There’s hope that the filibuster will be maintained, although you can’t count on a Democrat to keep their word. SCOTUS would likely toss a few of the above items, but not all of them.

          Any 2A supporters who voted for Biden because they hated Trump that much owns this. Even with the suspected fraud, the outcome might have been different if the 2A community set aside all other issues except for this one that really is the most important to the future our nation.

          Now, we have a militarized capital with walls and razor wire. We have a government declaring up to half of its citizens as “domestic terrorists.” We have a dictator in chief who has signed more EOs than the previous four presidents combined by this time in their terms.

          How is this better? “Anyone but Trump.” Well, not a great way to make a decision this important.

        • Geoff,
          Wow, You really have a hard-on for that RINO (Let her prove this wrong). How many times have you mentioned her now?

  19. Joeyj –

    I have around 300 assorted 28gauge shells I would sell. Bought a Browning Cynergy a couple of years ago; stocked up on Ammo…but it’s still unfired. Don’t ask…

  20. This story and others like it need to be posted every single day. Right now, and for the foreseeable future, it is THE biggest story for firearm enthusiasts. Ammunition and firearm availability and price. That concerns me a whole lot more than a new product review of something I will likely not see available for years. Frankly, I am tired of hearing that ammunition and firearm manufacturers do not see the wisdom in significantly expanding their facilities. I guarantee if there was this much pent up demand for electric vehicles, General Motors would be breaking ground on new assembly plants and/or already have them online.

    • The problem with expanding to meet these demand spikes is that they’re temporary. If a company can even bring new capacity online fast enough to take advantage of the spike, as soon as demand returns to normal they’re left with tens of millions of dollars in machines, people, and inventory that they can’t move, and in many cases have to make payments on (they either leased machines or took debt to buy them). Dozens of gun and ammo companies have gone under or severely damaged themselves by doing this. Right now it would be a no-brainer to invest $80 million to bring a primer factory online. The demand exists that you’d sell 100% of your potential capacity guaranteed. But that demand isn’t stable, and when this buying spike subsides and demand goes back to normal you won’t have a market, because normal demand is already met by the existing supply. You couldn’t make this investment knowing that the temporary demand might be completely gone within a year.

      What these companies should be doing, perhaps, IF they can afford to, is during times of normal demand manufacturing at full capacity regardless and stockpiling as much excess inventory at possible, so when we get these occasional gun & ammo buying spree demand explosions they can cash in on it and meet demand. Their ability to meet demand during these times, too, will actually help prevent panic buying and the whole snowball effect.

      • “…IF they can afford to, is during times of normal demand manufacturing at full capacity regardless and stockpiling as much excess inventory at possible,…”

        Economically not attractive, even if they have the warehouse space. It’s money they spent just sitting there, not making more money. Yeah, I suppose it could be considered an asset, but how long is the shelf life of primers not a part of loaded ammunition?

        A bunch of ammo companies have gone out of business, the question I have is, was the tooling sold for scrap metal, or is it oiled up and parked in the corner of a warehouse somewhere?

        • “Economically not attractive, even if they have the warehouse space. It’s money they spent just sitting there, not making more money. Yeah, I suppose it could be considered an asset…”

          As a warehouse manager, had a long conversation with the finance manager about building inventory in order to make the books look good. “Assets” are only useful for a P&L statement. I showed the finance manager that we had 2yrs of unsold inventory, almost across the board, and he wanted the production line running full time in order to amortize the cost of machinery. I asked the finance manager if inventory building was so good, why did the company not borrow millions to expand the production line, and create another 2ys of unsold inventory so it could be carried as an “asset”. The finance manager told me that would be stupid, but we should keep building unsold inventory at current rates in order to keep the “utilization rate” high. Finance managers don’t care if the company goes out of business, so long as the books look good.

          BTW, when companies collapse and try to raise money by selling off “assets”, the sales price is nowhere near the amount carried as “assets”. The “assets” go at fire sale prices.

  21. @Tom W. “….General Motors would be breaking ground on new assembly plants and/or already have them online….”

    Make no mistake, they are going that way and probably sooner under Creepy Joe’s administration.

    The plan is to force US car drivers into electric vehicles even if the electrical grid can support it or not…and no, you can’t have nuke power plants either according to the environmental wackos.

    Electric cars cause more pollution than IC, and if they were what people wanted there would be no subsidies and credit for buying the things. Heck, I dream of getting a cash back credit for buying a CheyTac .375..lol. Ds & Rs ain’t having none of that though cause guns is icky, but some POS transport that you have to charge for hours and only gets you a little ways down the road is good?

    Everyone knows the entire game is rigged now….or should.

    https://www.nbcnews.com/business/autos/gm-go-all-electric-2035-phase-out-gas-diesel-engines-n1256055

    • If CONSUMERS wanted electric vehicles, the new factories would have already been built. I’m not suggesting arms and ammunition producers are conspiring. I’m suggesting they seem to be lacking the courage to make capital investments when a future demand (by consumers) is not even risky.

      • “I’m suggesting they seem to be lacking the courage to make capital investments when a future demand (by consumers) is not even risky.”

        Panic surges for firearms and ammo come and go. What will be demand stasis for those items in the next whatever time frame you want to choose? And don’t think for a moment the feds cannot swamp the manufacturers with orders to absorb the new capacity.

        Or shut them down completely as a “compelling government interest” in maintaining public safety, or health.

        • I’m pretty sure I’m already hearing about a full year’s worth of backorders. I would assume that number is growing, rather than getting smaller. How far out does the demand need to be guaranteed?

          • “How far out does the demand need to be guaranteed?”

            I worked in a defense plant. We had backorders for six years, and did not expand capacity. The expense of capacity is not trivial. Even in defense contracting, backorders are not set in concrete; government policy can turn on a dime, and orders disappear overnight.

            In 1991, after the end of the Gulf War, demand for defense supplies dropped like a stone. We complained the peace broke out. We ended up dismissing 2/3ds of our work force in the next six months. Production equipment went dormant, but the expense of maintaining the facilities remained. In 18mos, the company went from 33,000 employees to 12,000. While new items were ordered, and production equipment altered or replaced, the company never recovered near its workforce in 1991. In the case of defense work, subsequent contracts were structured/priced such that some portion of the idle facilities costs were mitigated. Commercial companies do not generally have that option. Commercial companies can try to keep prices high in order to recoup some of the burden of over-capacity, but that doesn’t last long.

            Managing demand surge is serious business, and companies can be ruined if mistakes are made. And an Executive Order can be instantly created describing the panic buying to be a national security matter, eliminating all commercial sales for a defined, or undefined, period. If it were simple, cheap, easy to ramp capacity up and down there wouldn’t be scarcity.

          • “I wouldn’t make any capital investments with the Democrats’ promise to put me out of business.”

            That is a five-by-five risk.

        • “Managing demand surge is serious business, and companies can be ruined if mistakes are made.”

          This. There are far more ways to get it wrong, than there are to get it right.

      • ” I’m suggesting they seem to be lacking the courage to make capital investments when a future demand (by consumers) is not even risky.”

        You force demand by announcing fossil fuel vehicles will be forcibly phased out over a set period of time.

        That is will be a part of ‘Climate Change’ laws the Biden administration will get passed into law soon, count on it…

    • The problem is not that there is no demand for electric vehicles. The problem is that substantial technological hurdles had to be overcome in order to provide consumers with a product that incorporates the best of both worlds. The R&D required to get these revolutionary products to market takes time. Once problems like range anxiety can be overcome, people will make the conversion happily, I think. Incidentally, an Israeli company just announced technology enabling an electric car to charge in 5 minutes.
      And in no world but the fertile imaginations of some naysayers do electric cars create more pollution than IC.

      • “And in no world but the fertile imaginations of some naysayers do electric cars create more pollution than IC.”

        And the electricity to charge batteries comes from where?

  22. LGS changed hours from 10 to 5. So if you are a working stiff you have to go on your lunch hour or play hooky. They have nothing to sell and what they do have comes in between 10am and 1pm via Fed Ups and is gone in a couple hours. The guns and ammo situation is off the chain crazy.

  23. I just scored a case of 9mm for cheap, sight unseen!
    Does anyone make a pistol chambered in 9mm Mauser Export? 😛

        • My LGS had a broomhandle for about $1300 around 3 years ago. Don’t know the caliber but I I know they ain’t all the same(7.65×whatever equivalent to 9mm). I have a guy who has millions in guns in his jewelry store vault who buys all that stuff. But I ain’t investing unless I can turn a decent profit!

  24. Wait a moment, Jeremy is in Austin, just like RF, isn’t he? Well, I’m in Austin too. And a week ago I visited the remaining Red’s in Pf. It was pretty well stocked: P365, Glocks, whatever. My LGS in RR is not as fat, but they also had some guns, like Walther Q5 SF, a Canik, and a few noname black plastic nines. Also in RR, at the Austin SPB location they have no less than four (4) Ruger 57, and again P365. You can tell that their stock is a little thinned, especially for MSRs, but it’s not like shelves are bare like they were in April.

    • You used abbreviations that other people can’t understand. All three of us don’t understand what in the world you’ re trying to say. Please explain:

      “Red’s in Pf”?
      “LGS in RR” ?
      “at the Austin SPB “?

      • Red’s in pflugerville, tx
        Local gun store in round rock, tx
        But I don’t know Austin spb

        Nice area but I can’t deal with traffic or leftist.

  25. You used abbreviations that other people can’t understand. All three of us don’t understand what in the world you’ re trying to say. Please explain:

    “Red’s in Pf”?
    “LGS in RR” ?
    “at the Austin SPB “?

  26. Jeremy,

    We’re all very proud of you for being a Co Owner of a parts business etc….
    But uh, might wanna not open every story with that.

    No offense, just gets old fast.

    • I disagree. It provides context and implies credibility. I don’t recall reading any previous stories by Jeremy. Had he not said it this time, I would not have known. Besides, it’s germane to the story. Otherwise, how could a distributor be shipping him firearms he did not order?

    • “Jeremy,
      We’re all very proud of you for being a Co Owner of a parts business etc….
      But uh, might wanna not open every story with that.
      No offense, just gets old fast.”

      Might be true for regulars, but new people show up all the time, and would not have important back-story information.

    • It’s the whole point of this story, dude. It makes no sense without it, or wouldn’t have been considered reliable if chose to go third person and did a “posting for a friend” story. I didn’t even mention my own company by name or link, for frick sake. Every time I *don’t* mention that I co-own a gun brand people complain that I need to be transparent about it to avoid perceived bias. When in doubt I default to more information, not less, and I’m afraid you’ll just have to deal with it. Perhaps you can start a company that makes giant crosses so you can nail yourself to one?

      (LOL, sorry, sorry. I watched The Ref again around Christmas time — the cross joke — and just love that movie haha. Best Christmas movie ever.)

  27. Purchased a gun from a Pawn shop recently. I was told I was #5,000 in the que for the State’s background check. The owner says it’s in the 5,000 range every day, and typically takes 4 to 6 days to clear. My question is, How can it be 5,000 every day in my State, when there’s no way that there’s 5,000 guns available in the State?
    You’ll never convince me this isn’t being manipulated, from outside the industry by some group with an agenda. There’s too many questions that aren’t being answered.

  28. There is nothing legal about charging a person or a company for something that was not ordered.

    Unless there is some sort of contractual agreement at play which allows.

    But hell yeah, I can certainly see a retailer of boomsticks going along with it anyway, under the current unpleasantness.

    One more thing, if you receive a thing in error that you had not ordered or otherwise contracted for you may not simply keep it and refuse to pay for or refuse to return the item. That is unlawful conversion, even if by accident. The concept of “Finders Keepers” is a thing between children, not courts of law.

    Although in a trial a court can decide who the winner and loser may be, that’s process of law. Completely different from just saying “Screw you for your screw-up I’m keeping it!”.

    The law can be a fickle beast.

  29. The current gun and ammunition shortage is mostly caused by panic buying by people who are new to guns and gun ownership. That, of and in itself is O.K., every gun owner, hunter, collector, competitive shooter started out as a “newbie”.

    What I wonder about is the following. How many of these “newbies”, prior to the current panic, were Anti Gunners? How many have actually “reformed”, have come to be wiling to allow others the option of choice. The constitution proclaims that I have rights. It does not say that I should or must exercise them. Not everyone displays such largess.

    The current panic situation will pass as, as such situations do. If I were able to foretell when, I might well end up filthy rich. I do wonder as to how well and or for how long the “reform” that has seized yesterday’s Anti Gun Types will last.
    .

  30. I hear that ammo plants are running 24/7 but there is no ammo to be purchased, are they building new plants and hiring more workers to catch up with orders or are they forced by the government to hold orders from being made and shipped.

    • CM, I feel your pain and would like to help you out. The sad fact is that those of us who prepare for times such as this simply can’t afford to stack it deep enough to take care of everybody else. If I had helped the ones I personally know I’d be out by now.

      I could offer a tip. Bigger chain stores are still getting shipments on their existing contracts. If you can get an employee to tell you what days their trucks come you’ll have an idea as to what days you want to be in line when they open.

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