More than a few members of TTAG’s Armed Intelligentsia took exception to our post Springfield Adds Two New .45 ACP Model XD-E Hammer-Fired Pistols. Commentator Robert spoke for many when he wrote . . .
You can give up trying to push Springfield crap at us. They are a POS company and will always be a POS company. There is nothing they can produce that will cover their past sins. And, Dan Zimmerman, by association, you are right down there with Springfield. I will dump all your articles automatically from now on.
Regular readers will know that TTAG exposed Springfield Armory and Rock River Arms perfidy when their lobbyist engineered a carve-out on a deeply unconstitutional Illinois firearms dealer licensing law. An exception that included big box stores and enabled the bill to proceed through the legislature. Not to mention years of SA and RRA-funded cash payments to anti-gun rights legislators.
Those following the story will also know that the duo repented publicly (denying foreknowledge of their lobbyist’s spin) and spent big bucks lobbying against their lobbyist’s lobbying. The bill — recently resurrected — is dead. Again. For now.
Regardless, TTAG will not “punish” Springfield Armory, Rock River Arms or anyone else who endangers our Second Amendment protections. We will continue to cover their news and review their products fairly — despite the fact that these and other gunmakers “punish” TTAG for our no-holds-barred coverage by refusing to provide T&E sample guns and excluding us from press junkets.
So be it. TTAG is not an advocacy group per se. We’re a firearms blog. We provide news, reviews and editorials as truthfully as we can. So we don’t blacklist or boycott anyone in the firearms business, nor seek retribution for their actions or inaction.
In short, we report, you deride. OK, we do too. But without fear or favor. Thank you for supporting our work with your time.
Maybe it’s time for me to unbookmark the TTAG page.
If an echo chamber is all you are interested in, maybe going elsewhere is a better use of your time.
There are a number of gun types, and makers, that I have no interest in. I have no interest in any product or company that glues critical parts into their firearms. I dump those articles. Their presence doesn’t inconvenience me a bit.
While I would like to see TTAG post only news from proven 2A champions, proven resisters to political winds, I do not own this blog. I am not blog police. But I am free to subscribe to whichever blogs do interest me, for entertainment, if nothing else. You should be guilt-free for doing the same.
It’s gotta be a little hard / painful (FOR TTAG) to carve out such a big chunk of the manufacturer market out there, but Springfield and Rock River also get a vote. I don’t think it would pay TTAG to play the b1t<h now. It's a stick to your guns issue, LITERALLY. I HOPE Springfield and Rock River come around, but that's on them, and it's either an issue of company governance, or of company culture or both. If you have a few (D)heads at the top trying to drag the whole thing down, then their shareholders will be looking at the next Bushmaster / Windham / Core 15 . situation. Again, that's ON THEM.
It’s not about not supporting 2nd amendment champions. Echo chamber?? We are not talking about glock fan boys or smith fan boys or sig fanboys. It’s about a company that actively supported anti-gun politicians with their time and most importantly with money. The idea that they didn’t know what their lobbying arm was doing is blatantly false on its face. That dog don’t hunt! The company and lobbying arm were one in the same except for one guy.
That’s a deal breaker for me.. How TTAG can continue to showcase their firearms is beyond me. They say they are not supported in any fashion by Springfield Armory. If that’s the case then its no skin off their back to not publish articles on this back stabbing company..
Again you are saying you want a newspaper that publishes only articles you like. That is the definition of an echo chamber.
The information about SA and RRA was open, clear and objective. Happenings at SA and RRA are “news”. Ignoring those manufacturers is not presenting TTAG, but only TTAGMTWL (TTAG Manufacturers That We Like).
But the point is you have options, you have the freedom to find the niche you like best, the freedom to not subject yourself to the blogs you do not like.
If this is the hill you’re going to die on because you have nothing else to worry or complain about, then I envy you.
But whatever. I ain’t yer mama.
“Again you are saying you want a newspaper that publishes only articles you like. That is the definition of an echo chamber. ” Reading comprehension is not your best quality is it. Re-read my post and show me where I stated that. There are many articles I have no interest in, I just skip over them. Such as the dumb TAOFLEDERMAUS posts. Your missing the point. I just don’t think they should be supporting a company who was willing to sacrifice their reputation and standards to make a buck off supporting anti-gun politicians. Politicians who want nothing more than to eliminated the second amendment. Talk about a company who cuts their own throat for 30 pieces of silver.. If you want to support that go ahead. You’ll be contributing to the demise of firearms freedom..
https://3.bp.blogspot.com/-ixFtY1eaWqw/WQPpRZA840I/AAAAAAAAPCQ/FFXYI0Bo47gsfQaF_hO-pK8_llLhzvHiACLcB/s1600/SpringfieldJudasPistol.jpg
“Your missing the point. I just don’t think they should be supporting a company who was willing to sacrifice their reputation and standards to make a buck off supporting anti-gun politicians. ”
No, you are now waffling. Your original opening was that you were so enraged about publishing news concerning companies you abhor that you were contemplating abandoning this bloggesphere. Is reporting about robberies the same as supporting roggers? Is reporting rapes equivalent to supporting rapists? Is reporting about criminal convictions somehow the same as lodging support for said criminal?
Just about everyone here was aghast at what SA and RRA tried to do. We are in agreement there. You stated your contemplation of deleting your one-click access to TTAG because they report on things you do not like. Wanting only to read that which pleases you is the essence of wanting to participate in an echo chamber.
You should read your own commentary. Indeed, based on your stance, you should no longer be commenting here.
“Sam I am” Again, reading comprehension seems to be a problem for you. That wasn’t me, let me quote it for you..
“Mark says:
November 21, 2017 at 18:12
Maybe it’s time for me to unbookmark the TTAG page.”
Also I’ll comment here whenever I please, who made you a mod??
Thank you.
Did not realize I had railed onto a different track. Not sure at all how that happened.
Don’t let the browser door hit your ass on the way out.
TTAG can talk about any company they want, if your such a mindless automaton then your probably going to wind up selling your guns and becoming a vegan Prius driver the first time you accidentally read a Shannon Watts editorial. How do you not just stare into those dreamy anorexic eyes, but I digress.
Springfield and RRA are off my shopping list, and I pass over the content that TTAG post about those brands, but threatening to stop reading the website…..
Lighten up Francis.
+
: )
There is a pistol packin 2A lovin redneck in my Prius.
Just sayin. 😉
Prius saved me about $200 a month (yes, gas out here is $3.20/gallon and I commute)…. in gun math thats 1000 rounds of ammo per month or a new gun every 3 months.
It probably burned 10 x as much energy having electricity produced and transmitted constantly (to various recharging points) over that same period, just so you could recharge that thing at-will. That energy isn’t really ‘stored’ until it gets into the car’s batteries, and even then there’s losses, it’s a dynamic thing.
Joe, it’s OK to not post when you don’t have a clue what you’re talking about. 🙂
I must have an old Prius; I just fill mine up with gas, and there’s no place to plug it in….. also, I don’t care about Gia, Mother Earth, COEXIST, Kerry ’04, dog is my copilot, or any of that other bumper sticker crap…. I like money because I use money to buy gun stuff.
Not everybody who reads TTAG has followed the Springfield/Rock River story. Some people are making their first gun purchases. If they end up on TTAG, which is pretty likely, they’ll see a story/review of a Springfield or Rock River product and not know their history.
That’s the problem. What SA/RRA did should be an albatross around their corporate necks. It should dog them for a long time. It should be the FIRST thing mentioned in any writeup of their products.
The comments section does a nice job of that.
Are you kidding me? Geez with this crap guys. Springfield messed up bad, and I get that YOU don’t want to buy there stuff (I prefer HK and CZ anyways) but its still a good gun-it’ll fit some people better then others. You want to take that away, because of stuff that happened there? Fine-YOU don’t have to buy it. But TTAG has been doing an excellent job of reporting the friggin TRUTH-and if a Springfield pistol is good, they damn well should say so-because that’s the whole point of “truth about guns”. My dad carries their XDS everyday-and if it saves his life, doesn’t malfunction, then I will send them a thank you card. Bc. That’s what decent folks do.
How about the fact they don’t send out prizes for the contests they hold weekly? TTAG is a shell of what it was just a year ago….
We sure as shit do. I’ve mailed some of them myself and I see the things leave the locker at TTAG HQ where they’re kept when Dan or RF sends them out. There’s a phone number listed on the Contact Us page and you can also e-mail at TheTruthAboutGuns [ at) gmail.com if there was an issue with something you won but didn’t receive.
(BTW the only means we have to contact you by is the e-mail address you enter when you submit a comment. So if it has a typo or you don’t actually get e-mail there, we won’t be able to reach you to get a mailing address, etc etc)
I see. People with different opinions are mindless automatons. Where have I heard this before. Ahh yes straight from the left..
Exactly
Gah, get over yourself. Springfield said sorry and they make great products. Move on.
Right. Personally I just don’t see why SA/RRA don’t justify pour some campaign cash into some real pro 2A candidates as a sign of their alleigence. Fastest way to make this all better.
Because they’re not actually allied to 2A.
There’s not a whole hellava lot they actually *make*. M1A’s are really the only firearm they manufacture. Literally every other company out there making M1A/M14 clones, makes them better than Springfield (Fulton Armory, LRB, etc.).
XDs are actually HS pistols from Croatia. Springfield 1911’s are forged and rough-machined by IMBEL of Brazil.
Even if Springfield didn’t shit all over Illinois gunowners and the 2nd Amendment as a whole, I’d still criticize them for taking an historic American firearm manufacturing name and change it to importing 80+% of their catalog from other countries.
Springfield said their sorry?? When you give money and support to rabid anti-gun politicians sorry doesn’t cut it. You do know politicians make laws right…
I’m cool with TTAG although I have my issues with it occasionally which are made blatantly clear when I’m drunk. But I keep coming back because there’s few places like this on the internet anymore. Anyways, Now that they’ve been denied T&E for products I’m formally probing about the T&A TTAG promised me.
Oh no, baby, please don’t go. I promise I can be better. It breaks my heart to see you unhappy, and I don’t ever want to do that to you again. Please give me one more chance.
No?
OK, don’t let the door hit you in the ass on the way out.
“Springfield makes M1As”
Yet another reason to relegate them to the dustbin of history. I like all guns…and the M1A (and M14) should have been aborted before ever being foisted upon the armed forces.
Calling it a dumpster fire POS is being extremely complimentary, and insulting to fine, upstanding dumpster fires.
And no, Mr. Farago. Them saying “sowwy, we didn’t mean to be heinous capo a-holes and throw our customer base under the bus” is not good enough.
And to Sam-Who-Is: in the interests of becoming more “diverse,” would you be ok with including guest posts from Huffington Post and Daily Kos journalists? The notion that keeping a low-delusion factor in the writings here makes for an “echo chamber” is specious. Or, put another way: I would rather come to an echo chamber that gets things mostly right, than pollute my brain with the demonstrably false maunderings of a morally and intellectually bankrupt mob. “Diversity” is bad if you are letting in cretins, just to say you are diverse.
Three monkeys.
Got it.
Bookmarks? Really? Too lazy to type http://www.th before Chrome or Firefox autocompletes the website for you? (or you’re still using internet explorer?).
after you unbookmark TTAG, go get yourself some vagisil.
Personally, I think you have most blog websites beat purely on content. The refresh rate is great, and it’s rare that you can open TTAG and not see a new / fresh OP or two sitting there to look at.
Springfield and Rock River have to bight the . . . bullet, and court you. Maybe if they fool themselves long enough to where they think they are a 2A supporting (not just being supported-by) organization, then they can begin to try to fool the rest of us again.
Bet Springfield’s ‘Saint’ program director is throwing up his hands at the board meetings like (How’s about you cr_p on my efforts at momentum some more). Haven’t seen a Rock River ad or weapon (except on a ‘for sale’ rack at the local gun stores [collecting dust]).
It worked for Smith & Wesson. People gush about their products now while forgetting all about how they threw in with the Clinton administration. Here’s a refresher for those who forgot. “That year, President Bill Clinton proposed legislation that enforced safety and design standards, such as locking devices and restrictions on magazine sizes, and limits on the sales and distribution of firearms. No marketing or advertising restrictions were put in place. Clinton had been working on gun safety for the later part of his term, so this was a huge milestone for his efforts. Current New York Governor Andrew Cuomo was the architect behind the agreement.
Smith & Wesson voluntarily jumped on board.
There is a history of companies doing this type of thing. Most famously, tobacco companies have accepted stringent regulation of their product. Liquor companies make the same regulatory compromises all the time. Both industries are subject to all sort of arcane laws limiting their marketing, advertising, and distribution.
But those regulations always guarantee one thing: The right to stay in business.
So S&W agreed to play along with this agreement and to be accountable for its enforcement by a five-member oversight commission.
Much to the company’s surprise, the NRA almost immediately instigated a boycott of its products. Other gun companies looked down on S&W for giving into political persuasion, and gun advocates didn’t agree with the new restrictions S&W succumbed to.
Consumers began refusing to buy S&W products and the market became flooded with used S&W goods that people wanted no part of. Gun enthusiasts saw the company as breaking solidarity with them, as a traitor and perpetrator of gun control. Consumers severely punished the firm for its disloyalty.
Needless to say, S&W was taken completely off guard by the response.”
Did S&W give money to rabid anti-gun politicians?? No… Also they learned their lesson and that was a long time ago. Springfield hasn’t been in purgatory nearly long enough..
it’s great when people don’t buy guns from companies with anti-gun boards, because it often causes a change in behavior.
and it’s also great that TTAG gives us the info to know about it when companies act like vacillating worms.
“Personally, I think you have most blog websites beat purely on content. The refresh rate is great, and it’s rare that you can open TTAG and not see a new / fresh OP or two sitting there to look at.”
Yes.
But the comment section still sucks.
Where’s the notification of followup comments by email? it simply doesn’t work. Still.
It’s nice to get “housekeeping” notifications, but why none about the comments section?
I found that my WordPress settings had inexplicably changed recently and I had to refollow the blog. Email notifications of her comments returned after that.
Does TTAG fear they will lose credibility by not covering anti gun companies? You won’t. I just don’t understand why TTAG is so insistent on giving them free advertising.
This. That article wasn’t a critical review, it was just giving their marketing department free exposure.
…which isn’t necessarily bad, since it also lets people know about a product, but why not ALSO remind people what they did less than a year ago and add a link to your own coverage?
I don’t make the decisions ’round these here parts, but I agree with this one and here’s my take: our readers are interested in news about firearms. Politics, new products, training and technique, ammo, hunting, gear, etc. When a manufacturer releases a new product, we try to inform our readers of that. We broke ALL of what you know about what Springfield and RRA did, covering our findings as well as their responses. Just as we did not tell you how you should feel about that information or what to do with that information then, we aren’t forcing you to be ignorant of new products released by these and other companies now. If you have chosen to boycott these brands or Troy, Smith & Wesson, Ruger, HexMag, and whatever others that have angered customers in the past that’s great. That’s your choice and you’re welcome to it! Ignore the new product news related to them. If you still purchase products from these brands, that’s fine, too. From where I’m sitting, my goal and job is to help you make an *informed* choice, not to make the choice for you. If you want to be told what to do, join the Army. If we’re censoring news then we’re forcing our own personal opinions on you. It isn’t for me to basically trick you into avoiding Springfield by pretending like their products don’t exist. How about we all put on our big boy pants and consume as much information as we can and then make up our own dang minds?
^ This !!!
Again, This!!
I don’t need a newspaper to tell me how to vote, and I don’t need TTAG to consign Springfield and RRA to the depths of gun purchase hell – I can do that on my own.
If a company gets mad at TTAG for telling the truth, well then please keep on telling the truth. And that includes listing anyone who won’t give you evaluation merchandise because they got pissy.
I guess I can see where the TTAG writers are coming from. How about at the end of every article have a link to an article about their sins? That can go for every gun company with a skeleton in their past. Every day new gun owners enter the market. If they see a Springfield review but don’t realize they sold their soul to the devil, they might think Springfield gives a damn about anything other than profits.
The comments section on everything that has mentioned Springfield since TTAG broke the news of their treachery has made it very clear what happened. I don’t think there has been an example of a post since then where the very first comment wasn’t related to that news. Just look at the comments section here!
We did put a little blurb at the bottom of the only Springfield review we’ve done since that news though: http://www.thetruthaboutguns.com/2017/08/jeremy-s/gun-review-springfield-xd-e-9mm-pistol/ …but as long as people care about what they did, I don’t see it disappearing as a major feature in the comments and I’m fairly comfortable doing straight reporting on the products and allowing our readers to continue reminding people of what happened.
It’s not free advertising – it’s firearm news. TTAG is in the business of providing news regarding firearms.
Furthermore, you wouldn’t even have a complaint about Springfield if it weren’t for TTAG. TTAG did the legwork. TTAG broke the story. All that ensued was because of TTAG. You people shouldn’t sit back and spout off about how TTAG is supporting anti-2A establishments when you don’t even seem to know wtf is going on.
TTAG’s integrity is the reason it’s been my go-to source for gun news for about 6 years now. You guys keep doing you, with honest and open-minded content, and let the haters see themselves out.
^This.^
I value honesty and integrity in reporting – something woefully lacking in almost all other “news” sources… and TTAG makes no attempt to call themselves “journalists”.
Besides, none of us are required to click on each and every article written… you’re quite welcome to pass over anything that has something in it’s title that offends or simply fails to interest you (Spyderco ads, anyone?)
Oh, and how many of you clicked on this article just to read a bunch of comments crapping on Springfield/RRA? Good, your clicks were what TTAG wanted anyway.
Fair enough…as a resident of Illinois I know TTAG was the ONLY media reporting on the quislings in question. Specifically Mr. Boch. Thank you! The “no politics”(unless WE decide it’s imporant) blog was deafening with their silence. I’ll continue to support you guys unless you pull a Springfield! Oh yeah fix the required fields…
Personally, I put the Springfield screamers in the same catagory as the Glock only fans. They can bleat frantically all they want, but they won’t stop me from selecting any firearm that fits my need. If this is unacceptable to them, then I suggest they put their head in the toilet and slam the lid repeatedly. At this might provide something useful in the form of entertainment.
^ this
Replace that first part with the “Anyone BUT Glock” crowd and I’m right there with you.
“TTAG Doesn’t Blacklist 2A Antagonistic Companies” It’s not a ‘list’ per se. It’s like a bingo tumbler. If they stick you in there, your number may never come up.
Springfield sucks, but I’m not selling my Loaded 1911 over it. I’m certainly not going to crap on a site reporting on news regarding them, even if it does mean the article get skipped over.
They don’t suck. They made a mistake and have apologized. Move on.
NOT. GOOD. ENOUGH. As for me, I won’t be satisfied until both companies are forced into bankruptcy. Whatever little influence I have in my little sphere of this universe, I now use to dissuade all gun owners I know to avoid SPRINGFIELD and RRA as if their lives depend on it, because it does.
“NOT. GOOD. ENOUGH. As for me, I won’t be satisfied until both companies are forced into bankruptcy. Whatever little influence I have in my little sphere of this universe, I now use to dissuade all gun owners I know to avoid SPRINGFIELD and RRA as if their lives depend on it, because it does.”
This^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^
No. A mistake is when you leave your phone unlocked where your friends can get to it.
They made a considered strategic decision to screw over everyone else involved in selling or buying guns so that they could gain a competetive advantage via legislative carveout. You think that they would have tried to reverse their little play if they hadn’t gotten called out on it? You think they would have apologized if they hadn’t gotten caught with thier hands in the cookie jar?
Buy what you want, support what you want, but have some intellectual honesty about it.
https://3.bp.blogspot.com/-ixFtY1eaWqw/WQPpRZA840I/AAAAAAAAPCQ/FFXYI0Bo47gsfQaF_hO-pK8_llLhzvHiACLcB/s1600/SpringfieldJudasPistol.jpg
sorry guys, I carry, and enjoy carrying any one of my springfield pistols DAILY! just cuz you leave TTAG won’t change my mind about what I carry or like.
springfield and RRA made a bad judgement, and so what?!?! haven’t you ever made a mistake? their judgment call doesn’t affect how any of mine, or anyone else’s firearms function, mine far, ALL OF THEM, have ran without a hiccup, I don’t like the XDE pistols because I think it looks horrible, not because of the name on it, or functionality (I’m sure it works just fine) I simply don’t like the pistol.
but if you do leave the site, thank you for not requiring the rest of us to read your rants, raves, and general “I’m a pro and you suck” type of bullshit, good day!
TTAG is free, it’s not like I bought a subscription to Time( fuck you) magazine. As far as adds, gotta make money to keep her running…… I would be quite disappointed if this site went down. I give 3’s n 8’s to TTAG, God bless
My 2010 XD-40 has now 12,000 rds through it. Have had to do nothing to the pistol. Loading a mag full can still slice your thumb. Yet I will never buy another product from them. Stab me in the back and I keep the knife, I don’t hand it back so you can use it the next time.
I never understood how someone could read a Title here or anywhere and click on what they know they are gonna hate. Guess it’s like a car wreck, just gotta see. Man the “F” up and either don’t click or don’t complain about what you did not have to read. Go have a cocoa in mommies basement and leave the hard choices to those who can take a little abuse to their feels.
As RF said “we report you deride” and we the purveyors of the gun porn here can deride…decide with whom we will spend our dollars. TTAG is not making you buy a product, or doing the whole…I support the 2nd but….bs. Read or don’t read, but the article didn’t make you go blind.
TTAG can do what they want, it’s their sand box. Readers can do what they want too. That’s the great thing about this country, freedom of choice.
What I won’t do however is forgive SAI or RRA. They tried to F over the entire population of Illinois, my home state for 40 years, for a few pieces of silver. Dennis Reese is a proven scumbag that only cares about one thing, money, and he doesn’t care who gets f’ed as long as he gets his. He should have been thrown in prison back in 1989, for bribery and defrauding the government. How this POS has a business license, let alone a FFL to manufacture is beyond me.
https://3.bp.blogspot.com/-ixFtY1eaWqw/WQPpRZA840I/AAAAAAAAPCQ/FFXYI0Bo47gsfQaF_hO-pK8_llLhzvHiACLcB/s1600/SpringfieldJudasPistol.jpg
This is a blog not a major news network. As such it’s RF’s sandbox and he can do what he wants with it.
That said, I’d point out something: TTAG holds itself to a pretty high journalistic/editorial standard. When mistakes are made they are corrected.
Blacklisting companies because some readers have a problem with them isn’t holding to a standard, it’s putting your finger to the wind, seeing who whines the loudest then capitulating to them. Those companies complained about are still firearms companies and new products they put out are, by definition, firearms news. You don’t have to like it but that’s the way it is.
So quit whining and, if you don’t want to read something, SKIP IT. If you find you can’t skip an article then grow up, reach deep down in your pants, find a set of balls, and start acting like an adult instead of a spoiled child who can’t stop complaining about not getting their way 100% of the time. Oh, and stop eating paint chips too.
“some readers”? What those companies did caused much more than angst in a few members. The companies showed s systemic & long standing action against the Second Amendment.
Moron
News of that bad behavior was broken by…. TTAG.
New products are still news so it gets covered. Again, blacklisting due to your butthurt isn’t holding to a standard.
If you can’t understand that it’s your problem, not mine. Then again someone who has a screen name like yours probably doesn’t understand much.
By your reckoning if HRC said something about guns TTAG shouldn’t cover it because, in the past, she’s been anti 2A. That’s colossally retarded.
What a load of crap! You are the worst sort of sanctimonious jerks. “we just report” is such a load of crap. Only by turning your back on these 2nd A sellouts can you retain any credibility.
Your “policy” is akin to covering Hitler but not condemning his actions.
Bye Bye “truth” (sic) about guns…
Did you miss the part where we only know about those actions because TTAG discovered and reported them?
Think about it this way: This site’s mission is to tell the truth about guns. They told the truth about what Springfield Armory and RIA were up to. And the truth is that SA & RIA are still making guns, so this site tells the truth about that, too. Pretty simple.
Dammit. Rock River Arms, not RIA.
I made this mixup last weekend talking to a new-ish 2A guy. I really feel bad for Rock Island Armory, who are (as far as I know) a fine company and not mixed up in this except for having Rock in their name.
This is the part where I stopped reading. I let out a rather loud snortle and then skipped over the rest. I also forgot the rest of what you were talking about, because it was just overwhelmingly overshadowed by this statement. Thanks man.
I’m aware of SA and RRA’s lobbying efforts, but that’s not why I take exception to them. In a world of innovative firearms they keep regurgitating the same old s*it!
I really liked my M6 Scout .22LR/.410 until it became superfluous. But I need another antique M-14 or 1911 knockoff, or a striker fired polymer frame handgun like I need a hole in the head!
Charles
How did your M6 become superflous?
Twenty three years ago it was Bill Ruger and his company being targeted for their support of the federal assault weapons ban. Things change. Company attitudes and practices change. Never say never.
Ruger regained the trust of gun owners when “Big Bill” died, just like S&W did when they changed ownership. Neither has happened to the ownership of SAI or RRA.
Well – then keep waiting.
Anyone remember what “Cheaper than dirt” did? How about Dicks Sporting Goods? Blacklisting companies smacks of what our adversaries do…but sometimes, its justified.
Both still exist and are making money.
I am amused by all those non Springfield owners who are boycotting SA. It is like my Glock boycott. I respect the former SA fans who won’t buy another gun from tnem even if they are taking what for them is second best. They are putting tbeir money where there heart is.
However, I am less amused by everyone who thinks it’s ok for Glock to give money to anti-gun politicians so they can sell them more Glocks. If Glock or any other manufacturer really cared about your right to bear arms they wouldn’t sell guns to police departments in anti-gun states.
Ruger pulled out of California for this very reason. I like my 10/22 and my P89 pistol. But I will not support Glock with my money. Any company gun company actively supporting gun grabbers, in committing treason.
I neglected to note Beretta supports our rights. They told Maryland to pound sand after they screwed over Maryland gun owners. I would consider buying an APX if I am ever in the market for a new full sized 9.
My boycott with Glock goes deeper…Gaston Glock was Hitler Youth, where you do more than just throw some grenades and shoot some rifles. Gaston Glock need to come clean about his time with the Nazis.
“Gaston Glock was Hitler Youth”
C’mon, man.
When Hitler annexed Austria, Glock was nine years old. Nine. When the war ended, he was sixteen.
Every boy in the Reich was required to be a member of the Hitler Youth or it’s even younger branch.
If you had been alive in Germany or Austria during that time, you would have been in the Hitler Youth, whether you liked it or not.
If you’re concerned about real Nazis, don’t buy products from adidas, Puma or the worst of the worst, Hugo Boss. The two brothers who founded adidas and Puma were Party members, but Boss was a Nazi activist who supplied the charming SS uniforms (among other things).
You can add IBM, Walther, and Bayer to that list. IBM for supporting the holocaust with their technology, Walther for voluntarily arming the nazis, and Bayer for human experiments. Siemens is still paying out lawsuits to victims’ families for their role in producing just about every piece of infrastucture related to the third reich.
What should we make of Ford and GM? Both sued the US for damages done to their manufacturing facilities in Germany. A result of US military action.
The US ponied-up.
BTW, there were US automaker badges on some of the war machines of das Dritter Reich. The Wehrmacht did not rely exclusively on Daimler Benz.
I have lived 39 of my 41 years in Illinois. The corruption of liberal politicians is ruining this state. I get that some people dont like guns. Pretty much every politician in Chicago is on that list. They push hard against our 2a freedoms. I have come to expect that. Maybe in an odd way to respect it.
However what i do not expect or condone is a firearms manufacturer stabbing us in the back. And they wouldve gotten away with it too, if it werent for these meddling kids.
I currently own a 1911 loaded, and an xdm9. Both are great guns. They will be the only springfield firearms i will ever own. Never had a rock river and never will now. We have enough problems with firearm freedoms in this state without these companies turning on us.
Just my opinion on the matter. I dont trust people who stab me in the back.
Sounds pretty good to me Ironhead, no room for phonies, nothing more than liars and cheats. If you don’t have morals and integrity ya got nothin !!!! You don’t play nice with the enemy (left wing loonies). Selling out to the left is about as bad as it gets !!!!!
The employees and gun lovers of these companies likely had no friggin clue what some asshat execs were up to….. the same asshat execs that couldn’t find a shooting range on their Mercedes GPS. Guess who suffers the most when companies lose profits? Execs will be last to go…. meanwhile the sneaky left can claim they shut down a couple companies…. now they have a strategy to kill jobs and manufacturers for future use. Hopefully the industry learns and the trolls move on to something else since many do not hunt/shoot/compete/operate or procreate. I think some guy is smashing up his Bushmaster Carbon 15 on Facebook for likes due to a “change of heart” so maybe that will be a good outlet. Keep on posting reviews and what not.
If there’s something new in the firearms world, it should be fair game to report on. Even if its just highlighting an announcement.
How many people complain about mainstream media bias? Some of that bias is not in misrepresenting the facts, or lying, but simply not reporting because of bias against the topic / subject. TTAG should not follow such an example.
Not liking what SA did and refusing to buy their products in the future is understandable, expecting a gun blog to not report about SA’s products is not understandable.
Should this standard also mean that TTAG shouldn’t report on Russian or Chinese firearms too? Those countries have done far worse than SA.
I don’t blame Robert, he should report on what Springfield and RRA bring to the table. He knows one of us will be reminding readers of what they did for the next few years, every time one of their products appears. In truth I started buying Ruger and S&W products again years ago.
I still won’t patronize Dicks, because they insist on running me through NICS, despite my exemption due to my GA carry license. My personal ban on them is permanent.
At least Dick’s tells you the truth right there in the name. Cheaper than Dirt was never cheap, and what they did was not just cowardly, but borderline illegal. Go ahead and mark up the product you haven’t sold yet and charge market price. But canceling sold orders at the old prices to maximize your profit is just some cheap unethical BS.
So CTD can stay on the “blacklist” – stupid name, sleazy company.
I applaud TTAG for their position. My problem with the strategy of SA and RRA is they chose a path that relied on cleverness without a corresponding plan to gain worldwide market growth. In other words bigger bonus but no growth. That kind of thinking leads to putting words like GRIP ZONE on your pistols.
I wonder how many Springfield/RRiver haters have firearm, or other items in their house that was made in Commie China. If it is firearm, outdoor, or “tech” related you’re supporting the freaking PLA. The CHICOMS are the ENEMY of the US.
False equivalence
China doesn’t make our laws particularly the gun laws nor lobby to make more like Springfield and RRA did. I don’t know if you are aware but Chinese gun imports have been banned for over 20 years so any sale involving Chinese firearms today is between Americans so that money stays in America. Red China doesn’t make a cent.
So sorry but politicians, libtards, and their lackeys stateside are more of a threat to me, my security, and my rights than some country halfway across the planet.
To all the haters. You hate on SA and RRA, why not Walmart, Cabela’s, and so on. They all got the same carve out in the (thankfully failed) bill. Who got them added? Hate on all of them or STFU instead of being a hypocrite.
As for me, I will continue to buy SA’s excellent made firearms.
Never shopped at walmart, and since the cabelas by me is in crook county i dont shop there either.
I didn’t buy any Rutgers until Bill was gone or S&W’s until they changed hands and I won’t be buying from RRA or SA.
I could less if anyone writes about them I just don’t read it.
Meh I just pointed out that my xds looks better and I don’t know of anything the new hammer gun can do better. I guess a better trigger in sa, but I don’t have a hammer digging into me with the xds.
Ttag is free to show new stuff from any firearms manufacturer. I don’t need to support a compa I don’t like if I don’t want to.
It’s a good decision.
As soon as you start deciding which news to ignore just because you don’t like it, you’re as bad as the media that we complain about.
Part of the reason I really enjoy this site is A) the comments that allow different views and thoughts and debate, and B) unbiased reporting of gun news, including those bad shoot, Idiot Gun Owner posts.
Now TAG knows how i’ve felt all these years loving my Rugers despite what Bill said about needing more then 10 rounds…LOL!
Thats said the upper management at Springfield and Rock River all need a good steel toed kick in the nads.
How much are SA and RRA paying TTAG to cover their products? I work in the industry and know how this works. Blogs like this with large readership are compensated for their coverage.
Not a dime. We aren’t paid by any companies to run their press releases or review their products.
Report on it. Hell we need to know what those snakes are up to so we can decide a course of action against them. I never bought anything Springfield (I think they are just a touch over priced) and Rock River was never even on my radar (too many AR makers) so really I can’t say this makes any difference in purchasing decisions since I’d likely never buy one. Should I want a 1911 I’ll buy a RIA basic model and modify it how I want, I want an M1A I’ll buy a receiver and build one, and should I decide my AK needs an AR to hang out with I’ll build from scratch or buy a basic model and modify as I see fit.
I’m not gonna blacklist a site over them not blacklisting companies that would sell us out to try and get some carve out in a state law. I want them to hammer them on that kind of news and still review their guns so that folks that want to buy their crap can know what they get.
Hey Bob. The ATF sucks.
unfortunately we have a lot of idiotic readers on here who happen to know how to reply to articles. The same people denouncing DZ and TTAG for publishing unbiased reviews(as much as one can) are the same dip$hits that scream at CNN and the like for their biased news base.
more than just make its readers aware, this site almost certainly heavily influenced these manufacturers to slam it into reverse (be kind to your tranny) and bring their proceedings to a grinding halt. “not dead yet” (ahh christ, frostback rock bands) but at least awares.
if [shoes] would part with his old p9, eyetralian or no, i’d buy it.
and if springfield released an affordable, functioning jetpack (like the ones we were promised) i would buy that too.
LOL some of these comments. Good on TTAG for continuing to report on the SA and RRA’s of the world. Without the work of TTAG, I wouldn’t have learned about their misdeeds and am thankful to have been informed of them. I’m glad to know I have an outlet willing to call a spade a spade and also be able to point out the things they do well. Not being petty counts for a lot. Keep up the great work
When I go to a site such as TTAG, I want to see the entire story. I do not want to see the entries clouded by politics. If I have a problem with a company and do not want to buy their products, I can simply bypass info about that company. But why should I deny someone who does want the info that chance. Unbiased, in my opinion, is more important than some snowflakes hurt feelings.
TTAG running ads for RRA/SA is really not a big deal. Somebody has to pay the bills.
What TTAG does do is they don;t pull any punches. They creamed the two brothers who own Springfield Armory (there is no “Board” or stockholders) and the family that owns Rock River Arms (again, no stockholders or “Board”). They have also creamed a number of manufacturers for trying to foist off crap on the customer base.
I do occasionally write for TTAG and I did win one firearm contest though so I might be biased. Uh, nope, I like TTAG for what it provides and the freedom it allows it’s writers too
Thanks for reminding my short memory about SA, because I was thinking about an XDS in .45, and now will take it off the consideration list. SA’s loss is a potential win for S&W’s shield.
Anyway, I don’t blame TTAG – you did your job by laying out what buddy-fuc*ers the SA management are.
For the complainers out there, go get some vagisil.
Bill Hicks used to say the news is supposed to be subjective and cover everything, not just what they want to write or talk about because it’s not in their best interest.
With that remark said, I’m never going to support SA but I don’t care if somebody else wants to. It’s their money and it’s their right to spend it.
O.K. All you gun slingers out there have a blessed and joyful holiday, remember and share what your thankful for.
Oh, and play nice together…
To avoid a foul mouth, don’t eat the bird…
TTAG can report on whatever they want. We can read or not read the content our choice. But people that try to justify their reasons for supporting companies that Sabotage the 2A like SA I don’t understand. I won’t support them and quite frankly will be disappointed with anyone that does.
Seems to me that there’s a difference between “not blacklisting” SA and giving them free publicity by republishing their press releases. But then again, let’s face it, TTAG is basically a news aggregator, not the digital reincarnation of Edward R. Murrow.
TTAG, just keep sending us the news form the gun world, and keep doing what you’re doing. I like your blog. What I do have to take with a grain of salt is the immaturity of so many of the commentators. Most of the time I don’t even read many of the comments because they delve off into such completely stupid tangents. Free speech is great and I naturally support it, but so is the freedom to completely disregard things other people say that you consider a pure waste of time. So I will continue to read TTAG, I will tell you if I disagree with you and I will applaud you for being what the mainstream media will never be again . . . open and honest.
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