The video below shows the horrific moment when the Parkland, Florida high school shooter attacked a classroom. A witness says that the killer couldn’t get into the classroom so . . .
https://youtu.be/AhwiRe5hdYY?t=56s
fired through the door window. Notice that no one’s moving away from the angle of attack or hiding or, well, anything. My advice to my daughter when I drop her off at school: run or ambush.
As I’ve mentioned in the previous posts, home school your children or grandchildren! It’s the only way for them to get a good education instead of an indoctrination! And everyone at home can carry!
Unfortunately, I cannot afford the CNC milling machines, wood shop equipment, welding equipment, automotive hoists and tools, electronics/computer/robotics laboratory, agricultural/hydroponics laboratory, chemistry laboratory, audio/visual production equipment/studio, commercial kitchen, and symphony orchestra curriculum that our local public school offers to students.
And yes, some of those options are critical to students who have no aptitude to be therapists/nurses/doctors/dentists, attorneys, executives, accountants, engineers, journalists, surveyors, economists, and other fields that require a command of Mathematics, Biology, Physics, Chemistry, Literature, and/or Composition. (Not to mention the fact that some of those options are also critical for students going into hard sciences.)
What public schools did you go to that had access to all that equipment? 15 years ago when I was in high school they had shut all that down for liability reasons.
Speaking of liability, when I was in high school shop, we were never given or instructed to use safety glasses while operating laths, circular saws, and other dangerous equipment.
After school and military service, I started working at Convair, then Lookheed, where some dude died while forgetting to take the chuck key out of a large lath, that had a push button to “Jog” the chuck around. When he leaned over to check the piece in the chuck, his shoulder pushed in the jog button, and the chuck rotated enough to have the key hit the back of his head, forcing it down and smashing his head into the lath ways.
What a way to go!
Pure cop-out. Geez. “Boo hoo. I don’t have a commercial kitchen. I guess I can’t teach cooking.” How can you be your own first responder, when you can’t even be your own Lunch Lady?
Coursework in all of that and more is available, without a $10 million annual budget. Get off your butt and get creative. Where is all that self-reliance and independence mindedness I keep hearing gunowners are known for? Nevermind. With about two million homeschoolers out there, all of whom have addressed these issues, you can piggyback on their solutions.
You should play Devil’s Advocate against yourself and go try to show that it can be done. Think of it like, oh, I don’t know, like a blue collar homeschool. Hmmm…..I wonder if that domain name is taken….I wonder…..I wonder…..
Really embarrassing stance out of you here. Laid a giant egg on that one.
And yet homeschooled students are generally superior to their government schooled counterparts.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=AGp4KFLuQNc&t=799s
@Uncommon_sense Your strawman argument is made of straw.
None but the largest schools in very well-to-do areas have half that equipment you listed, and are very poorly utilizing what outdated equipment they do have.
I was homeschooled in the 80’s and had learning opportunities that far surpassed my public schooled peers. There’s absolutely no reason you can’t secure access to any of the systems listed for educational purposes.
Uncommon… When I was in high school, we had a fantastic industrial arts program. My machine shop experience resulted in me getting letters from companies to come to work for them when I graduated. Now the program has been scrapped and most kids graduating from school do not know what a tool is or how to use it. I was on a construction job and a new hire was told to get a sawzall and hand it to another employee. The new hire said ” a what ” ? I feel that this kid was cheated.
Can we try arming teachers? Please? SMH this is awful.
I will wait to find out the facts, but unless he was standing right outside the windows it is highly possible that some sort of semi-auto rifle was the weapon of choice, in which case if every teacher inside the school was armed with a pistol they still would have had no option other than to attempt to lay down covering fire and force him to back off, not really a tactic you could expect from lightly trained non-military.
And apparently the officers in the school had access to AR-15s, in the trunks of their cars.
If the shooter is clever enough to force the victims into his kill zone there is little a person with a pistol can do that does not resemble heroic martyrdom. That said, those armed officers sure as hell kept him from ENTERING the school building, as would have armed teachers.
I agree the handgun is at a disadvantage to a long gun but it is LESS of a disadvantage than just a hand with some skin on it.
Chris Myrick stopped the Pearl School shooting in Mississippi with a 45 auto.
While you can’t know for sure how they will react, most of these pissant bastards are cowards. They are shooting people they believe cannot defend themselves.
A little grit and some lead going the other way tends to change their temperment.
I am certainly not ready to say “rifle or nothing”. That rifle in the trunk is worth exactly dick unless you are ready and waiting at the car.
Actually the evidence says mass shooters, being the cowardly liberals they are, tend to flee or kill themselves the second they faced armed resistence. They typically are not well trained or brave.
Interesting points. However, as the others said, this dude is probably a coward, and a pistol could definitely do the job. Also, I never said pistol. I said armed, which includes rifles, as well. And A-10s, I think (jk).
On top of that, I’d personally rather die with a pistol in my hand than without.
The idea of being killed without at least scaring my murderer is not one that makes me happy.
“… in which case if every teacher inside the school was armed with a pistol they still would have had no option ”
Yeah, well, we found out exactly what happened when every teacher was *prevented* from being armed now didn’t we?
How about we try something different for the next time and see what could have happened if one or more of those teachers were allowed to carry their own firearms. Then we maybe we can intelligently compare which option had the better outcome.
“no option other than to attempt to lay down covering fire and force him to back off..”
That’s most likely all that would be required. These people are not determined jihadis – they’re pathetic cowards with little to no combat ability. A turkey shoot against a helpless captive audience is the only scenario in which these little &$!%s are capable of causing significant casualties.
Time and time again they scurry off and end their sad existence at the first sign of an armed response. They have no tolerance for pain, or even the fear of real pain.
“I would wait to see the facts”
We know the facts already that north of 95% of what gun control lobby cited media mentions of mass shootings are not with semi-auto rifles. So regardless of the facts of this one (likely a semi auto rifle) most are not.
More importantly the metric is not successfully preventing or mitigating all of them, but some of them. If we make the metric successfully preventing all violent events then we can say the justice system, police, police with any firearms anywhere, imprisoning anyone for a crime are useless since they don’t prevent all crime, and should be abandoned.
As far as rifle vs pistol, I have my souvenir from OIF in the form of my vest with two central nervous system shots to my back (either of which without my armor would have taken me out of the fight permanently), and one to the arm that compound fractured me and took me out instantly, due to squad mate who “cleared” a room that turned out to have an Iraqi captain with a pistol. Incidentally we were in a schoolabout 18 miles north of Baghdad.
The fact is in close quarter a LOT of wounds or kill shots are to the back, it is the best place to shoot someone. face to face at 30 to 100 yards, sure, we’d all prefer a rifle 100x. But at 6′, 10′ even 5 yards, with movement? A pistol can be equal or sometimes better.
Looking at the mother jones list, it is mostly drug crime by adults OUTSIDE of schools and unrelated to them, just within 500 to 1,000′ “school zones and therefore tabulated as “school shootings.” of the ones in schools most are clearly with pistols.
Gun free vs not gun free is NOT about stopping all of them, it is about stopping some, and more importantly about reducing injury and fatality. These killers tend to be deeply ashamed deeply low esteem persons who kill themselves or give up the moment they contact anyone with any gun.
The number of school shootings that is now taken as fact (19) is horseshit.
It includes ND by a cop, accidental discharge by students, gang drive-by, and, apparently, a round fired from *somewhere* that hit a school.
Just… what a monstrous group of people to lie about what is a genuine tragedy.
https://everytownresearch.org/school-shootings/
Yeah, that number is serious crap. They called one a shooting at an elementrary school. Turns out, it was a 31 year old man that killed himself in the parking lot of a FORMER school. But police locked down the nearby elementary school. So that is a “school shooting”.
Another was a guy that shot a school bus with a pellet gun. OH THE HORROR!!
Per the Republican legislature of Florida. Schools are “gun free zones”. Thank the GOP.
Wait, I heard one report that ‘first responders’ caught the turd a mile away, an hour after he left the school. So much for first responders stopping anything…
Guns don’t kill people. People use guns as an implement of murder to kill people. It is the American culture of hate instead of goodness that is the cause. The sooner we start encouraging people to treat one another as they would want to be treated, the sooner this abhorrent behavior will start to subside. America is great because its people are good. Time to promote principals of respect and good character in our children again.
We are taking God out of our culture, in effect, turning away from God. This needs to be reversed.
We are one nation UNDER GOD. Time to actively recognize that fact. Otherwise more of this shit will be in the news.
Not to start an argument here, but WHERE WAS GOD at the time of this shooting?
If it was His will that these 17 be “called home” it seems he could have come up with a less traumatizing process.
GOD is life. GOD is light. GOD is love.
THIS evil was the god of this world…
God helps those who help themselves. If we aren’t teaching our children to respect life and love one another, that’s not helping.
That sentiment is not in the Bible.
The tennent is that God helps those unable to help themselves if they believe on Christ.
In the Bible or not..its still a good sentiment.
Revering others and life – yes, I agree that it is.
The other is contrary to scripture so…no it is not.
We live in a fallen world. Read the Bible without looking for loopholes.
Eccleiastes might be a good start…..was for me.
That’s the book no preacher I’ve ever met wants to discuss let alone preach about.
It’s too real, too honest, too complicated and too close to reality.
Really, I don’t have much time for preachers. They’re generally ignorant and too far up their own ass. Well, that and, pardon my honesty here, IMHO they’re a waste of time.
Right, preachers are not different than the rest of us.
Flawed and sinful by nature.
Redemption through Christ not men.
I dont expect much of mankind and imam rarely disappointed .
@strych9 Actually, the whole point of that book is one that any good pastor is happy to gab about.
Solomon had everything (extreme wealth, unprecedented wisdom, 1,000 ladies to sleep with) — and wrote Ecclesiastes to talk about its emptiness. The point of Ecclesiastes is to show that everything under the sun is meaningless, but that God isn’t under the sun.
To use a cliche, everything minus Christ equals nothing, and nothing plus Christ equals everything. I assume this sounds potty to you, but that’s what Ecclesiastes is saying.
“…and imam rarely disappointed”
Freudian slip? Typo? Either way, fucking hilarious.
“Actually, the whole point of that book is one that any good pastor is happy to gab about.”
Yeah, you know that 1% the Left is always talking about? In my experience a “good preacher” is about 0.0001% of those out there. The requirements to actually do the job are far, far higher than most people (preachers included) seem to think. It requires a mastery of the Bible, history, multiple languages and a heck of a lot of reading outside the Bible that virtually none of these people know about and probably wouldn’t actually do if they did know about it. How many preachers do you really think understand ancient Hebrew and it’s literary devices? Yeah, about none.
Also, Ecclesiastes is in the Old Testament and it was written before Christ was born (450-180 years depending on who you believe about the dates). At the time there was no real concept of “afterlife” in the Christian sense of the word. The point of the Book therefore cannot be about Salvation through Christ.
The Book is about accepting the oddities, absurdities and, for lack of a better term, “unfair” nature of life and being content with what YHWH has given you. It’s also about personal betterment through this acceptance, finding happiness in what YHWH has given us and hard work. Overall it’s about being as happy and fulfilled with life as we can be and how to “live right” to maximize that happiness and fulfillment.
A side note, if you saw my Bible you’d think I actually was a serious believer or that I enjoyed running the thing over with a tractor. I don’t damage the book intentionally. That hard use is from actually reading, glossing, marking, heavily studying it and then repeating all of that again and again. Really, I should probably get a new one and copy all my notes, glosses and other work before this one falls apart.
strych9,
As far as a good preacher, tell me about it. I moved to a free state only to spend the last 18 months looking for a good church. Preaching isn’t necessarily something reserved for the scholarly, but you’re right that it usually is. As far as them doing “a heck of a lot of reading outside the Bible,” I think you’d be surprised how many people/preachers in the Christian church (especially Catholics) know more about their “doctrines” and dead people’s interpretations of the Bible than the actual Bible itself. (<– A bad thing in my mind.) As far as having to know Hebrew, it's not essential IMO. Greek is more pertinent.
"Also, Ecclesiastes is in the Old Testament and it was written before Christ was born (450-180 years depending on who you believe about the dates)."
At first I wrote down God, but I changed it to Christ because we're post-Christ (hence it being 2018 AD) and have the gospel. Same difference.
"At the time there was no real concept of “afterlife” in the Christian sense of the word. The point of the Book therefore cannot be about Salvation through Christ."
Link: https://wels.net/faq/heaven-and-hell-in-the-old-testament/. Also, Elijah was taken up into heaven. You're right that God's plan wasn't fully revealed before Christ. People just had to follow his commands without the knowledge. Also, I never really said salvation through Christ, I don’t think.
You don't have to believe what I said about Ecclesiastes. Frankly I'm way too tired to debate it. Also, I have never been a theologian.
Thanks for the chat. You are a very interesting atheist/agnostic/theist/spiritualite/don’t put me in a box-er.
God exists with free will. Every once in a while He does not interfere and lets God-haters shoot off their guns (and their mouths).
PS – – perhaps you will understand the irony of someone like you who has no faith complaining when God does not work miracles.
Cliff H,
God was exactly where many of those students told God to go: far away from them. (Don’t be surprised if God leaves you alone after you tell God to get lost.)
You cannot constantly reject and brush-off God and then expect Him to be at your beck-and-call.
Also, this is a natural consequence when rejecting Godly values (especially strong families with loving, attentive, and responsible mothers AND fathers) is widespread. This is the very reason that God gave us basic instructions and templates for us to follow in the Bible. God did not design and provide those instructions and templates to withhold good stuff from us. Rather, God designed and provided those instructions and templates to withhold BAD stuff from us. It isn’t His fault if we reject those instructions and templates and BAD things happen.
The lack of a reverence for God is the most important factor behind these shooting. Destroy or eliminate God from public life and you eliminate the basis for a moral code. No moral code and anything becomes acceptable. Lets face it. Killing somebody created in God’s image is different than killing a hydrocarbon based lifeform that only came into being through sheer accident. Hell we abort a couple million babies a year. What difference if we add a few more slightly older kids to that number? The problem is the Relativistic Nihilism they are teach our children.
Rich M, please stop with the God in our culture line of reasoning. I’m sure you want to believe this is the simple answer to complex problems (and you are allowed to believe that if you want), but I’m not buying it. My opinion, no “God” or ” any God” had anything to do with this, just stupid and evil people. Feel free to prove me wrong if you can.
And BTW “under God” wasnt added to the Pledge of Allegiance until 1954 after a bunch of religious people/groups took on the task of many years. It means nothing, I’m just saying…
…but it was added by good, God-fearing Americans. That was a time when it was permissible for students to bring long guns to school. You didn’t see intentional shootings much less accidental shooting back then. There is a reason and my reasoning is just as plausible as any.
America does NOT have a “culture of hate”. Americans by-and-large are loving, God-fearing people who have put up too long with the hateful sub-cultures and sub-humans in our midsts! I’ll bet dollars to donuts that in addition to this poor soul’s other troubles he was on meds and/or drugs.
This shit is crazy. A week ago or so, a guy posted that he isn’t a conspiracy guy but every time there is some gun legislation coming that would be good, a shooting happens. And last week was something about some new legislation coming up and he predicted another mass shooting would happen that would shelve yet another proposal. He was right. This shit is happening every time gun rights come up for the good of us. Wtf.
Well, they tried shooting up concerts and churches, and that didn’t work, so they went back to shooting up schools.
There’s always some gun legislation “coming”
They don’t need a shooting to drop it, the GOP held House, Senate and Oval Office have not passed anything which means they aren’t planning to.
Please do remember to donate freely to their election campaigns, however.
Well, the legislation moves soooo sloooowly that eventually there will be another shooting or something.
Now that we’ve added Jihadi Crazies (California, Orlando, etc.) to run of the mill American crazies, they do happen relatively frequently. Plus of course the copy-cat effect thanks to our “friends” in the media.
Can’t say for certain this little punk had a political motive, he was apparently bad news, known as such, and recently expelled from this school, plenty of motive.
That said, however, the current Republican candidate for governor of Florida is a staunch 2A supporter and very vocal about it.
Just sayin’.
It happens because there is almost always pending firearms legislation, and there’s almost always firearms legislation pending because this marks the 29th mass shooting of the year 2018.
No it doesn’t
I just really dread hearing the Dems go to town again on gun control. It makes me angry hearing them spout stupid nonsensical shit. Mainly because they can’t hear me yelling at the TV. Someone is going to say background checks this, bump fire stock that, Republicans hate American lives this, Democrats are the savior’s that. It’s going to piss me off. I wish I could punch this fuckin kid in the face. Multiple times. Until teeth come out. And he chokes on his tongue or something. Just ranting now. Disregard.
“Notice that no one’s moving away from the angle of attack or hiding or, well, anything.”
Yeah, most kids (hell, most adults) sitting in class aren’t going to be able to assess a situation like this. You really expect 14 year old Timmy to do a mental run down here? “What is the angle of attack? Is this cover or concealment? Will this plastic desk or chair stop a pistol round? Is the gunman that is actively trying to kill me even using a pistol, or is it a rifle? Does he have a buddy with him that is also trying to kill me?”
“You really expect 14 year old Timmy to do a mental run down here?”
Umm, yeah if Timmy posesses the instinct for self-preservation, you’re damn skippy he should do something. If Timmy freezes while getting shot at, I guess it’s ‘expected’ that he’ll just freeze in a crosswalk if he sees a drunk driver speeding through the school zone right at him, eh?
I’ll bet money that there will be one (or more) fatalities, that were staring him down Facebook-living, thinking that somehow the presence of the video protects them.
Not to be cruel, but if a kid doesn’t know not to stand there and get shot, there is no helping them.
We played Cops and Robbers and Cowboys and Indians with cap guns and water pistols. I’d like to think that in that situation, we’d have drawn on that experience and at least tried for cover.
Children who never play at gunfighting are missing a lot of basic survival fundamentals. Are kids even allowed to watch the classic Westerns anymore?
You’ve got a lot to learn. Coming face to face with a shooter is not cops and robbers or call of duty. Hey try this. Go put your car into a high speed spin and remain in control and doing all the right stuff. Bet you crap your pants and let go of the steering wheel.
The major problem here is everyone imagines doing the right thing and blames the victim when they don’t. That’s just your inadequacies surfacing. Take some active shooter response training to learn more how you will respond. Bet you will just stare at the shooter until someone else slaps you upside the head and yells run.
You’ve got a lot to learn. Coming face to face with a shooter is not cops and robbers or call of duty. Hey try this. Go put your car into a high speed spin and remain in control and doing all the right stuff. Bet you crap your pants and let go of the steering wheel.
Coming face to face with a shooter is just someone trying to kill you, nothing more. It’s a challenge. life’s full of them. I’ve met several people that have dealt with active shooters, and they did what was necessary to survive, some out training, others instinct. I’ve had guns in very close proximity to my cranium from hostiles more than once, I’m still here. I’m no superhero, I’m just not fvcking stupid (and perhaps a bit lucky). As to cars, perhaps you should take a driving course if a high speed spin will panic you to do the wrong things to regain control. This is a basic life skill – that you haven’t learned it, is your problem – not ours for calling you on not having it.
The major problem here is everyone imagines doing the right thing and blames the victim when they don’t. That’s just your inadequacies surfacing.
Actually that critique sounds like someone else’s inadequacies. ‘Imagining’ doing the right thing is a technique called visualization, and it’s half the battle. Only a fool (or a psycho/sociopath) isn’t somewhat scared in these situations, but that doesn’t stop many folks from doing the right thing. Talk to those who have dealt with this sort of stuff sometime, visualization and unpanicked reaction are strong common threads that I’ve found.
Take some active shooter response training to learn more how you will respond. Bet you will just stare at the shooter until someone else slaps you upside the head and yells run.
BTDTGTTAIF. What kind of complete effete urbanite pansies do you know that freeze during a sim? It’s a frakkin’ sim. You knew going in it was a sim. If you can’t keep your sh1t 100% drilled-down during a sim, good god, get your testosterone levels checked, some anxiety meds, something.
I’ve raced formula cars and yes, I have done exactly the right thing at the right time when all heck breaks loose. And my Nomex stayed clean. I’ve worked safety at tracks and had out of control cars and motorcycles headed right at me. I don’t freeze. I might not do the right thing when faced with someone trying to kill me, but I’m pretty darned sure freezing is not what will happen.
But your point about training for it is a good one.
So long as those responsible are not held accountable for legislation that costs lives and delays proper and timely response to deadly threats, evil will always prosper.
The solution is clear yet society apparently isn’t ready to relinquish the comfortable blanket of complacency.
All good people have to do for evil to prosper is to do nothing.
And our legislatures and good people have done a stellar job doing nothing.
Actually yes I do. My kids learned this before high school because I can’t protect them all the time. They also knew that fire alarms could/would be used to get them out in the open…sheesh, kick up your parenting skills!! If you don’t teach them this knowledge, who will? Call me paranoid but they have all read Field Manuals and other books on tactics. All my girls are shooters and quite proficient fighters.
This incident’s details make it clear that a lockable “bullet-proof” door/window combination could be a simple and practical answer to this kind of situation, at least for a start. In addition, there was no mistaking the sheep-like behavior of the students in this classroom that miraculously did not result in casualties; every one of them should have move away from the possible line of fire against the wall where the shooter at the door could not see. I’m surprised he did not reach through the shot-out window and open the door from inside. Freakin’ nightmare.
Another reason “weapon free school” policies are dumb. If he’s trapped by the door frame Mr. Stabby becomes a viable option.
If he reaches through the glass Mr. Stabby becomes quite useful.
You could give classes in a hermetically sealed room surrounded by armor plate. If the shooter is bright enough to pull a fire alarm and FORCE you and the students into his kill zone all of that armor and all of those locks are just more security theater.
We send our kids to Gun Free Zones every day…idiotic policies.
As horrible as this shooting is, I get further aggravated by these media imbeciles who’s ego driven dribble spout nonsense, incorrect facts and meaningless personal opinions.
Now they will proceed to make this shooter a folk hero to all the psychos out there who get off on madness.
Take him to the PD bsmt, interrogate him and then shoot him in the face. No 60 Minutes interviews, no whining Libs screaming he is mentally ill or was abused by his coach or whatever. Learn what we can from him and then end him.
Prayers to all the victims and their families.
Bring back public executions. They worked pretty well. Try him at the scene within 72 hours and then hang em high!
I agree! I’d torture them a bit longer, just out of spite.
Not saying any form of death is adequately painful for him, just that we should see what meds he was on.
Common theme, just sayin’….
I’d bet that being fed feet-first into an industrial chipper-shredder (Fargo-style) would be an effective deterrent.
I saw this earlier today. My first thought was “So that’s what fish in a barrel feel like.”
My second thought was “Sounds like a rifle”. Fox is reporting it was an AR.
Sounded like a pistol to me. AR has more of a BOOM to it.
I completely agree with you Rich M……that sounds like a pistol, not an AR. I have several AR’s (including an AR pistol), and they all have a much different sound that what you hear in this video. Sounds more like a 380 or 9mm to me.
Reports are that he had an AR and multiple mags. Which makes sense: as a 19 year old, he could legally by an AR, a pistol not so much.
Also tonight, indications are that this kid was an adoptee, multiple issues with schools and multiple expulsions/suspensions, ROTC, and antiANTIFA. Other rumors suggest that his problem wasn’t politics, but rather that he is one sick puppy with severe anger/mental health issues, and that the teacher(s) had reported him as a threat to the campus.
The Republic of Florida, a white nationalist militia, confirmed Thursday that the man charged in Wednesday’s school shooting in Parkland, Florida, was involved in some of its activities.
Jordan Jereb, a leader within the group, told The Associated Press that shooting suspect Nikolas Cruz had participated in the group’s paramilitary drills in Tallahassee.
https://www.local10.com/news/parkland-school-shooting/what-is-the-republic-of-florida-militia
Report is that he purchased the long gun legally…waited the appropriate time and took possession. But he could have bought the pistol if he applied for and received a pistol permit. He was over 18 and he lied on his application about the mental health issue.
Seems as though some enterprising entrepreneur should see the opportunity to open private schools advertising that they were NOT gun free, the teachers were all armed and trained, and the buildings were designed to be defensible.
If the tuition was not excessive this format could be quite successful, one should think, as an alternative to the free fire zones mandated by the government.
I’m kind of surprised that this is the first mass shooting I’ve heard of where the fire alarm was used to draw the victims into the open. When I was in school and we had those stupid little drills, I always thought that the fire alarm was an obvious tactic.
Mentally defective are prohibited persons yet we let democrats buy guns. Makes no sense.
The little shit probably had a hard-on for Al Capone.
Question isn’t how to stop the next attack… that is impossible. The real question is how to minimize casualties… to that end, arm and train teachers!
Shenanigans!
Mass shooters continue to achieve high body counts because of three simple reasons:
1) The generation of kids today are not being adequately trained on what to do when a mass-shooting occurs. Or worse, they are taught the wrong methodologies. Who sits around making a video on their phone during a mass shooting? Wake up call to the sheeple: self-reliance and self-preservation is apparently a skill that is obviously not being taught by certain parents.
2) For some insane reason, people are still relying on off-site police response. Oh yeah, gun free zones.
3) The adults in this country seem to be OK with the way things are. Lockdowns. Gun free zones. Maybe when enough of their kids die, they will finally come around to what must be done. Abolish victimhood and embrace a self-reliant lifestyle.
just another filthy, fckn HOAX
youse Yanks just ain’t “getting” it are youse?
AUssies are well acquainted with these BS, false flags … having been totally ‘duped’ by the totally bogus Port Arthur massacre ….. but…never again!
yr NRA is SHITTING on youse by accepting the BS media accounts of these BS “incidents” even before the cops have concluded their investigation(s) …
are youse fckn BRAIN DEAD or wtf?
or…are they over-flouridating yr drinking water?
or…are youse on too many, BS psycho drugs or WTF?
fair fckn DINKUM!
uh….here’s how TF its supposed to work…
i/the media reports that something happened….it may have been a shooting;
(as in: it is reported that….. etc)
ii/the cops investigate;
iii/after gathering and collating evidence including interviewing any eye-witnesses and DOUBLE/TRIPLE checking their stories, a case is ‘made out’ against either living or dead perps’ … or…… maybe no-one….if it was an ‘accident’….
iv/charges are either preferred or not preferred;
v/a ‘brief of evidence’ is presented to an investigating Coroner who, usually, conducts an independent inquiry as to what actually occurred or didn’t occur;
vi/if necessary, a person or persons is sent to trial/”indicted”;
if there are no living persons, a Coronial Finding is handed down;
vii/a trial occurs where witnesses are X-examined on OATH;
viii/if a defendant(s) is convicted, s/(he)/them is/are sentenced;
ix/if necessary: an appeals process occurs….
not until point n°s 8 or 9 can you categorically, unequivocally say what did or didn’t actually occur … not until ALL the evidence has been thoroughly investigated and tested…..
can you actually fckn well under-stand that or are youse too effin’ stoopid, eh?!?
Sorry, not a hoax.
Prepare to be triggered.
If AR/AK patterned rifles were NFA items these kinds of mass shooting incidents would be less likely to happen. I know what you are going to say: “These bad actors would get there guns through the black market.” You go test this theory. You go out and try to buy an AR through the black market. The most likely outcome is that you will be arrested or ripped off and that’s if you are lucky. You could end up dead. Unless you are already involved in illegal activities your chances of actually obtaining a weapon are little to none. I used to be in the intelligence business and since I moved away from DC I would now be hard pressed to successfully procure a weapon on the black market.
However, gun control treats the symptom and not the disease. We live in a sick society which celebrates deviancy and fosters anti-social behavior. We like to talk about how in the old days high schools had shooting clubs and kids used to bring rifles to school so they go hunting after class. That was a time when society and educational institution taught values and enforced discipline. Without values and self-discipline we will continue to have bad outcomes.
If we want to successfully defend our Second Amendment rights we need to change the subject from gun control to values. Without values and self-discipline a society does not produce citizens fit for freedom.
So, triggered as in I’m totally in agreement? Then yes. Triggered.
I agree with the second part of your post, however, I do not agree with the first part. Sorry…..I just don’t think making AR/AK rifles an NFA item would make a bit of difference. This kid was not old enough to buy AR legally, so he either borrowed/stole it from someone (or his parent), or he got it illegally in a back alley Walmart. Either of those scenarios wouldn’t have been changed by it being an NFA item.
He was 19. And that is old enough.
“However, gun control treats the symptom and not the disease. We live in a sick society which celebrates deviancy and fosters anti-social behavior. We like to talk about how in the old days high schools had shooting clubs and kids used to bring rifles to school so they go hunting after class. That was a time when society and educational institution taught values and enforced discipline. Without values and self-discipline we will continue to have bad outcomes.”
Perfectly stated.
We live in an age when the sum of human experience is literally in the palm of our hands. From Plato, to Aurelius, to Thoreau, it’s all right there. Yet, instead of ennobling our selves, we’re eating detergent packets.
We’ve disassembled the foundations of society in the pursuit of misguided utopian ideas and lucre. Is it any surprise our culture spawns twisted misshapen souls that will murder to satisfy their narcissism? Not to anyone that’s paying attention.
The argument in this case isn’t “the shooter could just get it on the black market.” That’s a true statement for gang violence, or for determined Jihadist and/or otherwise politically motivated shooters like the Pulse, San Bernardino, or Vegas shootings, but doesn’t really apply to the disaffected, emasculated white kids that pull off most of these school shootings.
No, in their case, the argument is that they could just as easily do the same amount of damage with a rifle with no pistol grip or other cosmetic features, or more likely with a pistol, as is the case with MOST school shootings. Shooting fish in a barrel doesn’t require high end equipment.
In order for your argument to be true, then ALL semi-automatic rifles and pistols would need to be NFA items. That might cut down on school shootings, theoretically, but the costs would drastically outweigh the benefits.
(That isn’t to say that the “they can just get it on the black market” isn’t a valid argument, though; it might cut down on SOME school shootings, but doesn’t account for a situation like Adam Lanza stealing a gun from his mother. It’s just that it’s not the main argument against trying to regulate this problem away.)
Also, for what it’s worth, I forgot to point out that I agree with everything ELSE you said here. I also understand your argument against the black market argument; it’s definitely a bad argument in this case, I just don’t think it’s the argument most people are actually making.
The gun community ultimate does what anti-gun does. We focus on objects not people. This is a people problem which the result of an attack on civil society by the left and by the left I mean both Progressives and Randian-Rothbardian minded Libertarians. Removing objects from common availability will not solve the overall problem of social deviency.
As an aside, the reason I hypothetically proposed moving AR/AK weapons to the NFA list is because an outright would actually create enough of an illegal market where shooters like Cruz could get weapons.
Let me see if I understand you correctly. Are you saying that in order to protect our Second amendment rights we have to give up our right to keep and bear the military arms that the Second Amendment was intended to protect? Hmmm. sounds kinda FUDdy to me.
I told you that you would be triggered.
No, I was not suggesting we put AR type weapons on the NFA list. I just wanted blow a hole in the usual anti-gun control argument as a way of suggesting a better approach. We are playing into Bloombergian hands if we make bad arguments. Gun control won’t change the overall murder rate but it makes these kinds of mass shootings less likely and it is these kinds of incidents that drive gun control.
Your argument is inherently flawed.
It IS about guns.
Until there exists another means to ensure the defense of human life that is portable, effective, and accessible, then guns remain the sole tool for the forseeable future.
You put forth the same specious notion that limiting access to certain tools will in some way change human behavior. Forgetting again, that laws are meaningless to OUTlaws. Presuming as the antis do that if guns didn’t exist, murder would cease.
It is, always has been, and always will be about the guns. Everything else is just equivocation and distraction.
Sorry, but you are going to have to move off the line in the sand of “no rules, buy what ever.” That stance is non supportable today.
No open carry, knife preemption, waiting period for non ccw holder and big off place list florida is the same as texas overrated and ónly luke warm for gun rights
http://www.handgunlaw.us/states/florida.pdf
These shootings always have two common factors: Mental illness and Gun free zones.
Not to be too callous but after the first victim, the rest are freebees. Gun free zones are hazardous to your safety and life! But statistics show that more young people are killed and injured daily by texting and driving collisions than from firearms. Where is the outcry for banning cell phones? When are we going to hold tele-communication companies responsible for the unlawful use of cell phones.
Hey, people on phones keeps me working. I help test cell towers.
Can you hear me now?
It’s clear response time is critical. Waiting for each individual teacher to assess the situation and lock down classroom is sub-optimal.
I’d suggest a master lockdown switch that instantly locks all inside doors and can only be released by law enforcement. Maybe life alert style trigger as a backup for teachers to wear and trigger the lockdown? My emergency GPS locator has a simple toggle lock switch to prevent accidental triggering.
Also, maybe this is FINALLY a good use case for a ShotSpotter type system. Mics around the school and instant lockdown the second it recognizes a gunshot. It’s a loud enough sound to get a good rate of positives I think.
All of these would trigger an instant law enforcement response. I’d like to see Federal funds spent on something like this, rather than more security theater.
That sounds like a fire trap. Instead, a Metal detection door system Like my bank uses is a simpler option. It is walk thru detector with locking doors. Stopping any threat at the entrance.
There was a school shooting at my school as a kid. No one died and only the shooter was injured, but it scarred me for life. I think about that day all the time. That you people think your right to guns is more important than everyone else’s right to feel physically safe is disgusting. Shame on all of you.
I understand and feel badly for you. You experienced a life-changing event that impacted you as bad as any nightmare and worse because it was real. It really happened. You are suffering from Post Traumatic Stress Disorder. The good news is there is treatment for that and you should seek help to make you whole so you can pursue life and become your best self. The bad news is, you will likely not be able to purchase a firearm to protect yourself or your family from the evil doers that seem to be multiplying like locusts. In any event, I hope you feel better and I pray you get past the trauma you experienced.
Umm.. so I have a few older cousins that were in the Marines. They went through training, went through drills to prepare themselves while “being” fired upon (with blanks and audio) and were taught to react accordingly. Unfortunately…they’re training exercises were just training exercises. The moment they were in Iraq under actual “enemy firepower” (e.g. the guy shooting the weapon wants you dead) they shut down, then the trained soldiers who have been in Iraq for several months, protect them and wake them out of that stupor of fear. Considering the fact most students do not go to school with any sort of training for a war mentality. How should they react in during the 20 minutes it takes for a person to gun down most of their school mates. What should the teacher that spent hours the night before developing a lesson plan and not training for a battle scenario do in a such a situation?
I want to believe I would react accordingly and try to save my life or the life of my friends in such a situation. But it seems like a pipe dream to me…Like I’ve been watching too many Nic Cage movies and think I could have a quick one liner and kill the enemy in the same minute. The fact is the majority of us are not trained to be fired upon and react like a hero…
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