On a recent flight, I found myself seated next to a man I’ll call Rick, who was keen for conversation.
We established that we are both lawyers. Rick works for the government, and I explained that I lead a gun violence prevention organization. Rick took that as an invitation to talk about guns.
A self-described “2A [Second Amendment] fanatic” from Texas, Rick grew up with guns and today owns more than 40 firearms. He considers himself a collector, and many of his guns are antiques — he’s not interested in assault-style firearms — and he makes his own ammunition from recycled casings. In short, Rick is a gun guy, and I was interested in his views on gun violence.
Rick offered that he has family in Uvalde, where 19 elementary school students and two educators were murdered in a mass shooting last year. He declared that, despite his staunch pro-gun views, he felt that “something needs to be done.”
Seeing an opening, I asked Rick what he believed should be done. He wondered aloud about psychological testing for gun buyers but concluded that that would be too challenging to administer.
I asked what he thought about “red flag” laws that allow for temporary removal of firearms when a gun owner is determined to pose a risk for harming themself or others. Rick didn’t support these types of laws because he doesn’t trust the process.
Efforts to tackle military and veteran suicide by addressing access to firearms? No, he sees suicide as an individual decision.
What about limits on gun ownership for those with a history of domestic violence? Rick had mentioned that his legal work included handling sexual assault cases, so this seemed like low-hanging fruit. But again, Rick was not on board. He felt there were too many cases in which women falsely accused their partners of domestic abuse.
So, although Rick was saddened by recent mass shootings, he couldn’t conjure what could be done to prevent them or offer any tangible ways to address, much less reform, our country’s gun culture.
In addition to being a gun guy, Rick is also a father. He was quick to tell me that he stores his guns in safes because he doesn’t want his kids to access them. In his own way, Rick is trying to be part of the solution, and I told him as much. But though Rick deserves credit for practicing secure firearm storage, many gun owners do not.
Rick was intelligent, well-spoken and rational, and I enjoyed talking with him. But our conversation provides a real-world example of why we should be skeptical of the idea that gun violence will be solved by finding common ground with gun owners. I doubt I could’ve changed Rick’s views, even if we’d talked for an entire international flight.
To be sure, Rick doesn’t speak for all gun owners. Most gun owners do support some legislative action, though they often disagree on how much. Still, he echoed the pessimism of many gun owners and non-owners alike when he told me that our gun culture would never change. …
What Rick and others may not realize is that modern gun culture is actually quite new. Twenty years ago, most Americans knew that having a gun made them less safe and household gun ownership was on the decline. Today, most people have bought into the myth that a gun makes them safer ― and that misconception is driving up gun use and, in turn, gun violence.
— in I Sat Next to a Gun ‘Fanatic’ on a Plane. When I Told Him What My Job Is, Things Got Interesting.
[ED: For more on Nina Vinik, see here and here.]
Makes me wonder how the conversation actually went.
Makes me wonder if Rick really existed and she just made him up.
That was my first thought but I am trying not to assume everything they come up with is a lie.
Shorter version:
“My mind’s made up. Don’t confuse me with facts.”
I am trying to be generous and suspend disbelief ……………but ……..yeah that is generally exactly how such discussions go especially when an agenda is involved.
I agree. Probably AI written.
You should never try to teach a pig to sing. It wastes your time and annoys the pig.
Just had a conversation with a bank manager yesterday about the rapid implementation of AI everywhere. Most customer service platforms for larger companies are installing AI to alleviate caller wait times (who wants to call an 800 number and wait for two hours?). The result will sound and feel like you reached a real person, but is actually just a version of ChatGPT with no authority to make any policy decisions or fix your problem.
Haz,
How will that differ from talking to some idiot telemarketer / CSR with no authority to make any policy decisions or fix your problem?
@Umm,
An AI will actually answer your call and not leave you hanging with the company’s elevator music while you wait for hours, lol.
Haz,
PRE-cisely!
They drive me up the wall, but (just like most other market failures) are more driven by the customers than the companies.
Will they give the AI voice a foreign accent to make it seem realistic?
👍🏼
They really do want to take your guns and have every intention of doing so. They call it paranoia if you understand that. They believe that force up to and including deadly force is justifiable if you resist. But you are the violent one.
Yeah, no kidding. “I’ve concluded that reasoning with Anti-2A fanatics is futile.” Works both ways, Pal.
“They (Anti-2A fanatics) cannot be bargained with, reasoned with, they don’t feel pity or remorse or fear, and they absolutely will not stop… EVER, until you are dead!” Pretty much sums it up, Nina.
My thoughts exactly, the entire thing from flight to finish may be fiction!
Total bullshirt! If it were true Rick would have raged about how the teachers and staff at Uvalde weren’t trained and armed, the failure of the government officers and bragged about his kids safe shooting skills. Totally fake.
Spot on.
Rick doesn’t exist. Nina made him and the conversation up so she could write an op-ed.
Nina reads like a satire of herself. Maybe this was written by Ai, and she put her name on it?
Grace a.k.a. Author of this article,
How in holy hell does this not blatantly violate fair use? You republished a significant or material portion of this persons article without providing any commentary of your own. Even if you provide attribution to the original author, I believe this violates fair use.
I miss the days when Robert ran this site and we would at least get some original content or analysis when he would fisk something like this. Can we bring Farago back?
Years ago kids carried rifles to school and hunted on the way home…or you had a gun rack IN your truck.
“Gun culture” has been around for decades.
Concealed carry, not so much.
But with soft on crime and no bail and defund the police and rise in gangs…
Also fairly new…demise of the family unit. Multi generational welfare. Massive illegal immigration
My final speech in high school, albeit, an old style Military School was about my new 222 varmint rifle. Long story, but my class mates were getting loud. When the Head Master looked in he looked at me with my rifle and promptly told them to quiet down! Then he looked directly at me holding the Remington 700 and said “carry on”.
MY dad was on the Kankakee,Illinois HS rifle shooting team 100 years ago! So yeah this gal is full of chit. Will I do something? Planning on buying more gats🙄
Leigh – “Gun culture has been around for centuries” – there fify 😉
Other than that not too bad of a comment and BTW concealed carry has also been around for a long time (vest pocket pistols for example).
No use debating with these fascists. They are gonna come try and get them and we are gonna have to stop them. Conflict is likely unavoidable. Winter is coming.
It’s a toss-up for who can concoct the better far fetched story, nina vinik or hamas?
At least Vinik doesn’t go around murdering babies and cutting their heads off in front of their parents before murdering them as well. Well, not yet at least.
Fake news
I have always wondered how there could be Holocaust deniers. Now I know.
Democrats are the modern day Nazis and Holocaust deniers. The mask is off.
It’s “fake news” because not all of the 40 babies who were murdered in front of their parents had their heads actually chopped off. The murderers got impatient before beheading all the dead babies and went on to killing the parents too. Some of the babies were merely stabbed or had their throats cut in their cribs so saying that the “mostly peaceful protestors” cut off babies heads is not accurate and thus “Fake news.”
Got it!
While the concern of AI generated gore videos distributed for propaganda purposes is an increasing concern that does not appear to be at issue here and Nikita very clearly articulated many of the fact check issues we have seen over the years.
The beheaded babies story can be fake and Hamas can still be absolutely wretched terrorists. Don’t jump the guy for criticizing the propaganda. We don’t have to lose our ability to criticize one group because another group is worse.
Even if the story turns out to be true, it is still being used for propaganda to garner public support amongst western countries for intervention, with our tax dollars or our sons.
But maybe he “chose a side” and supports Hamas… I don’t know.
It isn’t like the Nazis and Holocaust deniers are trying to get to the truth. They’ve been busy downplaying the atrocities and hiding behind a fake moral equivalence to mask their inhumanity.
Also:
Amid horrors that defy belief, the past week has seen an extraordinary debate about whether Hamas savages had decapitated [defenseless] babies, or had merely shot them dead. Reports of beheadings have been furiously attacked as fake news by some high-profile doubters. It seems grotesque that we are even trying to get to the bottom of the method by which a baby was decapitated. But there are some who refuse to believe that even the terror group’s most sadistic fanatics would have stooped to such evil. On Saturday, I spoke to a colonel who told me that he had not only seen a beheaded baby, but had held it in his arms as he recovered the child from a slaughter site in kibbutz Be’eri. Yesterday, with a heavy heart, I asked Dr Kugel, perhaps the most senior pathologist in Israel, if he had seen any babies without heads. He replied: ‘Yes. Yes, I have seen that.’
https://www.dailymail.co.uk/galleries/article-12639247/Forensic-scientists-struggle-identify-297-bodies-Hamas-brutalised.html
I bet 90%, or more, of the people denying the atrocities committed by Hamas believed the Trump Russia Russia Russia hoax.
A leftist wants what criminals and terrorists want, but thinks the government should do the work for him.
I prefer those who at least have the decency to violate rights by their own efforts. Plus, it’s legal to shoot them.
When someone finds themselves locking shields with and fighting for the same causes as Talib Rashad then perhaps they should reassess their moral compass.
Indeed!
@Umm…:
Should Be:
“A leftist wants what criminals and terrorists want, but thinks the government should do the work for HER”.
Sorry for the correction Umm…, but I drew Spelling and Punctuation Patrol duties. Check the roster. You’re up next Wednesday!
BTW the only girlie men that I see doing this stuff are just primping to get laid by local true believer leftchicks.
@SPP Ossifer Banana,
Thanks for the correction! I was using it in the generic sense rather than addressing the author directly, but you are absolutely right: no real man would vote for their BS.
If I may return the favor, I’m sure what you wrote was true in the 60s and 70s, but nowadays I think lefty “men” would rather sit around with the leftchicks discussing “The View” and synching their periods.
@Umm, Thanks, after seeing no deer yesterday or this morning, I needed that chuckle! However true, it’s still funny as hell!
VNVet69,
Glad I could be of service (and thanks for yours!). Best of luck on the rest of your season. I enjoy the freedom and the weather out here, but unfortunately that comes with a deer-tag lottery that seems to have similar odds to the scratch-card variety😒
Umm, I’ve been applying for ELK tags in Nevada & Wyoming for years. Also in Nevada, Muleys. Still looking for those and the MD bear tag I’ve been applying for. Can’t buy a break, I’ll probably get one posthumously at the rate things are going. Meanwhile, MD whitetail are generally a good hunt and I managed 2 nice Toms during spring turkey this year.
VNVet69,
I was pleasantly surprised to receive your response, because my previous message – possibly the least offensive I’ve ever made – was held for moderation🙄
I’m glad you have good hunting in MD. I grew up in PA, went to school in MD, and live in NV now.
So, do people who work for “gun violence” prevention organizations find other forms of violence OK? Is knife violence OK? How about bat violence? Blunt objects? These people, including Vinik, actually work for the UTTER decimation and abrogation of Constitutional rights by non-Constitutional methods. They are nothing but deceivers and propagandists, and would resort to “gun violence” to strip citizens of their natural rights. Moreover, the “conversation” with Rick probably never happened and is just a convenient fabrication.
It’s embarrassing to hear the the author’s self justification, self-righteousness, and elitism. Just oozing with pride and contempt for other views outside what is considered “right” and “holy.”
The author is quick to judge “Rick” as a fanatic, of course never considering her own views might be equally fanatical. Rick doesn’t even sound all that strong in my mind as a gun rights proponent (more someone who likes and owns guns, government employee too), but the author preaches back to the reader the gun control propaganda that of course most gun owners want more gun control, of course guns make you more likely to be killed, etc. Poor little foolish Rick!
“The author is quick to judge “Rick” as a fanatic…”
A male in Texas who only owns 40 guns and she makes him out to be a “fanatic”? Sounds like a “lightweight” to me. 😉
Fixing a behavioral problem by attacking inanimate objects is a fruitless endeavor. For example we’ve outlawed many kids of drugs to stop addictive behavior, and all that has accomplished is making many criminal organizations very rich, and many people in their way very dead. No real reduction in drug abuse at all!
Our “War on Drugs” isn’t going very well, unless you’re either in law enforcement or selling drugs.
Law enforcement has benefited since over a trillion dollars has been spent on this “war.” That’s a lot of money.
Drug dealers have benefited because today, drugs are cheaper, more powerful, and more easily obtained than when the “war” started.
Society in general has not benefited. Countless lives have been ruined by “punishment” for inconsequential amounts of drugs simply because the end user had no information that might lead to the arrest of an easily replaceable dealer. This doesn’t count the families torn apart by these “punishments.”
Overall, the “War on Drugs” has been a dismal, expensive failure.
So, the Left wants to do the same with guns.
“What Rick and others may not realize is that modern gun culture is actually quite new.”
This may have some truth to it, but but back when the real push began ca 1968, most Americans could not believe that their own government would ever try to disarm them. They also did not believe the media would side with the government in trying to bring American citizens down to the status of the rest of the world.
“Twenty years ago, most Americans knew that having a gun made them less safe and household gun ownership was on the decline.”
By 20 years ago (2003), “gun control” (banning) was beginning to take it’s lumps and the lies about personal safety, and the government’s obligation to protect the citizens who put them there were becoming quite obvious. States were passing Shall Issue concealed carry laws, the AWB was sunsetting, and the prospect of people carrying for self-protection without any governmental permission slip was making traction. Now, the Genie is truly out of the bottle in many locales and there will be no putting it back.
Vinik’s problem is similar to the elites in the House, Senate, and others inside the DC Beltway- when you are only around others who think and act as you do in your private clubs and gated communities, you come to the conclusion that everyone believes the same baloney you do. The idea of an educated and civilized human owning firearms doesn’t ever cross their minds, let alone firearms for personal protection.
“I’ve concluded that explaining 2+2=7 to ‘fanatics’ who insist it’s 4 is futile.”
What took you so long?
I would hope this is not the reality of the situation………….but I hope to win the lottery
Ah, yes, the tax on people who are bad at math😉
Almost as bad as the state run casinos ……..but tend to have some of the cheapest gas stations around.
The hypocrisy is equally strong both ways.
Hope got Obama elected.
Dude, she just might. Barry’s trans husband is probably going to be on the ballot instead of Mr. Senile Potatohead in 2024 and if they do as good a job stuffing the ballot boxes this time as they did in 2020 he might just win.
S/he/it’s beloved with an easy life. MB may not want to do that, but desperate times and all that…
*many not want to give up the easy life.
Seams there’s not enough outreach to save people who are looking for a way out. The irony is when I read statistics on Canada where euthanasia is at or near the leading cause of death. It makes the argument for red flag and restrictions to save people from themselves mute. This Vinik is a SJW maroon.
Seems
No worries point got across, I would counter some of it with Canada can charge a fee/tax for euthanasia and it employs professionals that justify further taxes. Suicide cuts out all the middlemen and leaves the government wanting more. Then again I do not believe the government really cares that much about preventing suicide.
“Suicide cuts out all the middlemen and leaves the government wanting more.”
What it actually does is eliminate the natural high medical expenses of someone dying of old age.
A socialized system is highly interested in eliminating such a financial load on their budget…
I was going to ask if it wouldn’t just be taken out of their estates but then I realized it probably wouldn’t matter unless high value real estate is involved as the ones that could afford to pay for treatment would (often here in the US) and those that couldn’t could be encouraged towards that other option.
That would be true if they were spending their own money, but soshallists love voters whose only hope for subsistence is soshallism.
Your judgement was narrowly averted. Be moor careful.
“Moors!”
“Moops!”
Poor Bubble Boy.
Moot, not mute. Be moor carfull.
Mute can work as well, if they shut up in shame. But that isn’t very likely, I suppose. It’s a shame there is no shame.
Indeed. People today complain about “shaming” as though nothing is wrong except noticing something wrong.
Shame is good. Shame is an @sshole’s last little shred of decency shining through, acknowledging “I may not have the self-control to stop doing X, but I at least recognize that X isn’t something to be proud of.”
They are actively working to get rid of shame by celebrating their degeneracy. “Shout your abortion!”
As with all Democraps, their idea of common ground means you change your mind and agree with me to do what I want.
“common sense” gun reform.
“common sense” immigration reform
All from people who have zero common sense.
I did notice she didn’t mention prohibiting Democraps from owning guns. That would be the best definition of common sense gun reform.
‘. . . why we should be skeptical of the idea that democide will be solved by finding common ground with gun controllers.’
We were instructed by Chairman Mao: “Political power emanates from the barrel of a gun.”
So, in the gun-control/-rights debate the first thing to do to get clarity is to ask: ‘Who has the gun barrels?’
Then, it becomes clear that the “debate” between two diametrically intransigent viewpoints is not relevant. We will evolve our gun culture organically; or, undergo “politics by other means”.
I think that the gun-controllers are eager to resort to politics by other means. May God have mercy on us if they get their way.
Well said MarkPA.
Pictures or it never happened.
“Vinik: I’ve Concluded That Reasoning With ‘2A Fanatics’ is Futile”
Yeah, we long ago concluded the same thing about you.
If he even exists, it sounds like he was being nice to her. She repays his friendliness by labeling him a fanatic in an article. Yeah, that’ll change the culture. Liberals are so clueless.
I’ll trade make a trade with her – psych evals and literacy tests for new voters, raise the voting age to 26, and put a 3 day wait on cell phone purchases – for mandatory weapons training for 1st time firearms buyers.
…Along with no mail-in ballots except for the rare cases of being bedridden/highly contagious or overseas deployment. Those ballots must be notarized and include two government IDs. The bedridden/highly contagious cases must include MD verification. Actually, why can’t we have this no matter what?
No reasoning with us. Next step is the cattle cars and ovens. And it will be all our fault. We made them do it.
In the article, Nina admits her philosophy doesn’t work. Yet, she wrote an entire article about how “gun people” are too stubborn to change.
Circular arguments within casual idle chit chat between two people locked in a box high up in the air. It’s meaningless conversation that people have to pass the time and is not worth writing an article about like this. The author wanted an emotional response with an angry tone of voice and didn’t get it. The desire here was to provide proof that gun owners are not mentally stable and should be thrown off the plane.
It is the anti-gun communist left that cannot be reasoned with.
This argument is simple, just as every animal on earth has a right to self defense, so do I and by any means necessary. There is only one true law of nature, the victor makes the rules!
DAN ZIMMERMAN
I tried to post a comment three times. It doesn’t even say it’s awaiting moderation. The page reloads. Your website format sux.
I agree but who am I to tell people anything(.)
FEDERAL GUN CONFISCATION: Can President Biden Declare a WAR or EMERGENCY and TAKE YOUR GUNS?
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=_Bc7alAvOYQ
He can try! I guarantee a lot of gubmint goons will refuse to join in. Woe to those that DO join in😕
It’s getting close to 4th box time. I am afraid a second civil war is unavoidable at this point and it has arguably even started already as a cold civil war. I fear this one is going to be a bit more bloody and make the first one seem like a little children’s argument about who gets to hold the remote during Saturday morning cartoons. The way these Marxists keep pushing things I don’t see how events can deescalate at this point. I hope I’m wrong.
We may be in a war on terrorists right in our own country long before Civil War II, all thanks to Dementia Joe and his band of leftists allowing all of them across our southern border.
Wait those are separate issues?
It doesn’t help when the author starts out with a “more knowledgable than thou” attitude just to see what this idiot 2A guy has to say. Hard to imagine, but he could “conjure” no solutions to solve the “gun violence” problem. First off, I’d take issue with what the heck “gun violence” is and how we prevent all those wold guns running around by themselves and shooting people. Close second, there are MANY ways to address the criminal problem that includes criminals using guns as a weapon of choice. Many organizations such as the NSSF, NRA, and others have contributed significantly with solutions that are regularly posted in this forum. Solutions that include education in safe gun storage, identifying mental health problems in family and friends and helping them get help, AND at the same time fighting to secure law-abiding citizens right to arm and defend themselves AGAINST criminals because people like the author keep advocating disarmament and putting up obstacles to prevent citizens from defending themselves. Yeah, we know what your agenda is…
“Twenty years ago, most Americans knew that having a gun made them less safe and household gun ownership was on the decline”
Because the marxists dug their claws into the education system to “brainwash” (to quote Eric Holder)people into abandoning gun ownership, among other uniquely American values, in earnest through the 1990’s.
Never forget that in early drafts of the 94 AWB, Brady and others wanted to make possession of body armor, military camouflage clothing, and tactical gear of any kind illegal for civilians to own.
RE: vinik, “On a recent flight, I found myself seated next to a man I’ll call Rick, who was keen for conversation.”
If you are going to call someone by their first name only then there is no reason for doing that unless Rick is a 100% fictional character.
RE: vinik “We established that we are both lawyers. Rick works for the government, and I explained that I lead a gun violence prevention organization. Rick took that as an invitation to talk about guns.”
Again “Lawyer Rick” sounds like a dick who does not know there is no such thing as gun violence simply because violence is violence whether violence is committed with a firearm, bat, brick, fists, feet, vehicle, etc. Another sign Rick is a fictional character.
RE: vinik, “A self-described “2A [Second Amendment] fanatic” from Texas, Rick grew up with guns and today owns more than 40 firearms. He considers himself a collector, and many of his guns are antiques — he’s not interested in assault-style firearms — and he makes his own ammunition from recycled casings. In short, Rick is a gun guy, and I was interested in his views on gun violence.”
Amazing…Texas Rick is everything under the sun but the kind of yucky gun owner who is interested in those yucky so called Assault “style” firearms…And as for those recycled casings, it’s called Reloading. A real Rick with 40 firearms would have thrown the word Reloading at you vinik. In short vinik was using Rick to sell her views to gullible readers.
Perhaps the next flight vinik is on she’ll be seated beside a Real Attorney…
https://youtube.com/watch?v=ZFEz3Bt9hCw&feature=shared
“Reasoning With ‘2A Fanatics’ is Futile”
Correction: reasoning with someone who is EMOTING (and vice versa) is futile.
And it doesn’t matter which side of a controversy an emoting person is on–you simply will not be able to reason with him/her.
Treading dangerously close to goring some sacred cows there…………..absolutely correct but some may grumble.
The author is claiming to employ facts and reason to argue an idea that contradicts facts and reason, leaving emoting as the only option.
The guy can’t make rational arguments for or against guns, so long as he believes this bit of hogwash: “Twenty years ago, most Americans knew that having a gun made them less safe”.
That, and the claim that most gun owners support additional legislation to control the gun owners.
He almost sounds intelligent, until his mental short circuits kick in.
So, you’ve decided that “reasoning” with 2A fanatics is futile because one wouldn’t accept your unreasonable premise that controlling an *object* will modify peoples *behavior*. Yeah, sounds like reasoning with someone is futile but I don’t think it is Rick.
Try this little thought experiment on for size, Nina. Don’t worry, it is a simple one: To stop people from falling off the edge of a tall building we should, A) Tear down the building B) Teach people that falling off the edge could kill them and put up a warning sign.
Do your best, no time limit.
No good. Rep. Jamaal Bowman would ignore the warning sign. He would fall off the edge thinking that’s how you get the elevator to work.
And that would be a bad thing?
I advocate anus control for all San Franciscans. Now accepting donations for my Committee to Prevent Public Defecation.
Yeesh, you people are so hard to reason with.
Ok now you are just talking shit
“…now you are just talking shit”
*snicker*… 😉
Thinly disguised advertising pitch for her propaganda campaign targeting youth with half-truths. Where guns are available, GUN violence is higher (with no statement on violence overall). “Gun violence” has increased since 2000, but no mention that it’s still much lower than the 1990s.
And, most recent FBI data are that violent crime dropped in 2022, despite all those millions of new gun owners: https://www.axios.com/2023/10/16/fbi-violent-crime-data
One might argue that the violent crime rate dropped because of all the new gun owners rather than despite them. Certainly constitutional carry has impacted crime in many areas. It’s become a lot like Russian roulette for the criminals in those states.
Does TTAG realize that none of us will get the 5 minutes of our precious lives back after reading that horsesht?! Gonna have to start being hyper selective regarding the types of emails I open from these guys… geez that was awful.
Two Chicago studies as well as numerous law enforcement studies show that the majority of guns used in crime are second hand guns sold with no paperwork and funneled in by gun runners into big high crime cities.
Any criminal or nut case can buy all the firepower he wants on the used gun market, no questions asked jut fork over the money.
Also our lack of Federal Mandatory safe storage laws result in thousands of guns being stolen and 1,300 children a year being killed in the home from loaded unattended guns,.
Our lack of a Federal Red Flag laws results in thousands of women being killed by husbands and live in boyfriends.
Civilized nations have had all these laws and more such as mental tests and Gun Registration and Universal Background Checks for decades and their much lower homicide and mass murder rate prove beyond all doubt their laws work far better than our deliberate lake of such laws which are blocked by paranoid, ignorant and racist hillbillies who regard human life as cheap and expendable, even their own children’s lives as they continued to be slaughtered by nut cases with assault rifles almost every month.
The Far Right admit they want weapons to defend themselves against their imaginary bogey men like immigrants, refugees, racial minorities and religious minorities. According to the Far Right paranoids anyone different than themselves is “the enemy”. Herr Drumpf (The Donald) is still exploiting them with a tirade of racist political comments on how much danger they are in from their bogeymen , its right out of Hitler’s “Mein Kampf”, which has always been the bible of the Far Right Fanatics.
:yawn: let me know when we have a doj willing to go after straw purchasers or lock up gang members.
Chicago studies? Seriously? And law enforcement? You have never spoken a kind word about law enforcement but suddenly they’re the experts? Really?
You make daffy duck look rational.
So, criminals doing criminal things are supplying the tools criminals are using to do crimes.
I suppose that means that the 99.99% of gun owners out there who are not criminals are doing nothing criminal that they need to answer for. Thanks for clearing that up, ldiot.
dacian, do you keep all those false boogymen in the closet with you?
He has to justify that large panic purchase of Vaseline. Keeps his boogymen happy.
First off, I don’t favor the far right or the far left. Most of us regular people don’t fall in either category and we are by far the majority. So over generalizing is always a bad thing because it is always inaccurate. Good people with guns stop thousands of crimes and violence annually and yet seldom is that reported in the news. The only things that get publicity are the heinous crimes committed by mentally unstable people that are then have the blame transferred to innocent people who would never commit those types of crimes. Given the Leftist policies that now exist today those policy makers are the ones to blame and should be removed from office.
When someone is deranged and has fully embraced the tenets of totalitarianism, they cannot conceive there is anyone who is neither far right or far left.
The far end of either part of the spectrum meet in the end, tyranny.
dacian the DUNDERHEAD, Here we go again with your two uncited Chicago “studies”. Don’t you ever get tired of presenting discredited “studies”?
Here is some reading material for you: https://www.dailysignal.com/2023/10/17/fact-check-red-state-homicide-problem-is-mostly-a-blue-county-homicide-problem/?utm_source=TDS_Email&utm_medium=email&utm_campaign=MorningBell&mkt_tok=ODI0LU1IVC0zMDQAAAGO4UclYqSHHvytIGH-dc9xfl-dzBY3waZsSSooCQ4x16dC9v_lNyK47nAjJD6zcrSMx_L6HQdSkv3hRMnvsyQNUBw1eO3RFf36VKSK_nIC1RroXOVhPQ
For your edification, murder of anyone (except on Federal land) is a STATE CRIME prosected in a STATE Court. Your “answer” to everything is a “Federal Law”. Never mind that Red Flag Laws are UNCONSITUTIONAL.
No, Leftist, we want to have firearms to be able to defend ourselves against your criminal friends you want to keep releasing on “no bail”.
All these “Federal Laws” you want passed intrude on the state’s rights as outlined in the 10th Amendment. Seems you need a lesson in Constitutional Law as well as firearms.
You still can’t tell us the firing sequence of a cartridge.
Kudos, Grace! Your article may get the Gateway of the Year Award!
The best part of this is our fearless Editor’s appendage of “For more on Nina Vinic, see Here and Here”.
To ALL TTAG readers:
Please go back to his comment, appended at the very end of the article. Punch “Here” and “Here”. Then carefully read and take notes. These nuggets should be TTAG posts!
They sure scared me!
From the full article:
“Gun violence has gone up, not down, since the early 2000s.”
The “gone up” words are liked to this article:
https://www.pewresearch.org/short-reads/2023/04/26/what-the-data-says-about-gun-deaths-in-the-u-s/
Which shows that gun violence went down throughout the 2000s, then sharply up in 2019, and has been trending back down ever since, even while more and more people buy and own guns.
To be clear, the data the author posted shows that gun ownership and the amount of guns in the US is not correlated to gun violence.
One of the charts shows a sharp increase in gun suicides beginning around 2007. That should have been setting off alarm bells, but these people only care about the tool being used.
There is no “Rick” as he only exists as a strawman to illustrate how reasonable the author is vs how unreasonable all of us are.
I am happy to be unreasonable, because in her view she actually means unyielding and unwilling to compromise. Why should I compromise since she and her ilk would just be back for more. We have seen this from people just like her over and over. They are no different from any of the rest of Satans spawn; once you have sold just a piece of your soul, it is tough to get it back!
For an attorney, he sure has a lot of assumptions instead of facts. We’re not a “gun culture.” We’re a Second Amendment culture based in a Constitutional Republic where people have God given rights to protect themselves. More guns do not mean more violence. Stats prove this. If government schools were’t creating violence in their environment and letting criminals into the country and criminal go free, then there would be less gun violence.
He’s another vile evil destable lefty devil son that deserves to be wiped off of the face of the earth by Jesus Christ at his second coming and more than deserves it.
Futility is arguing with someone who sees removing access/taking/banning relatively modern inanimate objects as the only possible solution to human problems that have existed for thousands of years.
Another evil lying liberal moron trying to bring national disarmament by guilt shaming and manipulating stupid people with another bogus made up cock and bull story who deserves his eternal damnation in hell. Just like potato Joe.
Truth of the matter is Nina was staring at the bulge in Rick’s pants the whole time during this discussion. When they got off the plane she asked Rick where he was staying. Later that evening they met for drinks and Rick ended up screwing the living daylights out of Nina. Later she felt guilty for loving it so much, that’s when she added the last paragraph to the story. End of this fictitious story.
Graduated High School in 1980, and we had some guys who brought cased shotguns into the school and kept them in their lockers during the day because they went hunting before or after school. Yeah, there wasn’t a “Gun Culture” back then because almost everyone had guns at home, it was a normal everyday thing, Dad had some older magazines with adds for guns by mail order! Handguns to Anti-Tank guns, order yourself a 20mm anti tank gun and ammo and have it delivered to your door by the US Post Office!
We didn’t have a “Gun Culture” because it wasn’t needed to counter the Anti Rights Movement then, and Anti Rights is exactly what these people are, not anti gun, they really don’t dislike guns, just that YOU have them.
Because when they decide to take your guns what will they do? Send people WITH GUNS to come and take yours.
Ever notice all gun regulations and bans Exempt all Govt employees?
Ask yourself, If the problem is the Gun, why do they still want to have them??????
“Twenty years ago, most Americans knew that having a gun made them less safe and household gun ownership was on the decline. Today, most people have bought into the myth that a gun makes them safer ― and that misconception is driving up gun use and, in turn, gun violence.”
Most Americans “knew” that having a gun made them less safe? How did they “know” that?
Twenty years ago, we didn’t have “progressive” DA’s and judges who refused to hold violent criminals and sent them back through the revolving door of today’s “justice” system to continue preying on society. Twenty years ago, cops responded rapidly because they could assume that they would be backed up by DA’s and judges. So, twenty years ago, perhaps most people didn’t feel the need to own guns for other than recreational purposes.
I would love to see Nina’s evidence that 20 years ago people felt safer without having a firearm and I wonder if she realizes how violence has escalated due to fanatic Leftist policies like open borders, unvetted access of illegals, allowing prisoners out of jail, not prosecuting criminals, allowing people to steal from stores if they steal less than $900 worth of items, etc. Most of the Blue States/Cities with the strictest gun control have the most violence, many of the big Blue Cities are going bankrupt. Most of the Blue cities have the worst homeless problems. Did I miss something or did she forget to offer her solutions to the problem most of which have been tried and haven’t worked. Oh yes and the Sinaloa Cartel came up with the solution to selling fentanyl, if you sell it or make it you get killed because you are killing customers who can no longer buy drugs. See there is a solution. Nina is another Leftist fool who should be ignored because she brings nothing new to the table except more babble.
This conversation was a fiction. I don’t believe any gun grabbers story.
I’ve got the fix for gun violence! Revert to the policy used in the west 100+ years ago: use a gun (or any other deadly weapon) in a (any) malicious manner, get caught for doing so, and after a trial and being found guilty beyond a reasonable doubt, the perp swings publicly on the gallows. Public execution would be a deterrent and there would be no repeat offenders.
“What Rick and others may not realize is that modern gun culture is actually quite new. Twenty years ago, most Americans knew that having a gun made them less safe and household gun ownership was on the decline.”
Note the use of “modern gun culture”. Apparently the “modern gun culture” began less than 20 years ago? There always has been a gun control in this Country. There was a time when regular civilians had superior firearms that the standing military had.
About the time the far left started demonizing firearms and scapegoating the innocent, people denied having firearms, that does not mean people suddenly gave them up. If the far left wasn’t being far leftish, the polls may have showed something different.
The homes where firearms made you less safe also had other contributing factors that are not discussed by these harlots. Factors such as criminal activity, whether it was drugs, prostitution or general anti social ills. Those factors determine more than just general firearm ownership. Only the demented far leftist believe that lie they parrot.
“Today, most people have bought into the myth that a gun makes them safer ― and that misconception is driving up gun use and, in turn, gun violence.”
The myth that you can take an object away to prevent bad behavior is actually the truth they do not want people to know. Fact is that firearm misuse falls in a few zip codes, the majority of the US does not have these misuse issues. Fix just two zip codes and 90% of the issue is gone.
We have heard this story before, at least once a year for the last twenty years. The names and places are different, but the same narrative is always present.
This story doesn’t pass the Biden approved sniff test.
There always has been a gun control in this Country. Was supposed to be culture.
“I doubt I could’ve changed Rick’s views, even if we’d talked for an entire international flight.”
Starting from a place where she (thinks/assumes she) is right and Rick needs to change his view to reach common ground. Not open minded, and that’s why she will never find common ground. Also, she’s a lawyer that doesn’t know that laws cannot prevent crime? You don’t want her defending you.
Yes, violent crime has increased in the last decade or so. Now, break by the where, and who.
Add to the score the cities/counties not prosecuting or even bothering to track down and arrest violent criminals, or if arrested released with a court date before the LEO who made the arrest can finish the paperwork.
Want a workable solution to violent crime? First would be to track down arrest, convict and incarcerate those committing the violent crimes. Second would be actually educating the next generation instead of indoctrinating and pushing the crap being pushed in public schools today.
Last would be holding parents responsible for their minor children and stop supporting the destructive single parent working mother culture with the men either off with the next woman or in prison for being stupid and committing stupid crimes.
“I’ve Concluded That Reasoning With ‘Anti-Gun Fanatics’ is Futile.”
There, fixed it.
This was a news story on Yahoo. The consensus among the commentors there is that this conversation never happened (except maybe in the authors mind). It was published by the HuffPost and we all know how unbiased toward firearms they are (heavy on the sacasm). I believe this is nothing more than an opinion hit piece by the author and the HuffPost.
Miss Vinik I have to say this…You are an IDIOT! Being a gun owner does not make you less safe, but in fact you are safer with the provision that you get some training and practice with your new firearm.
As far as storing your weapon in a safe, is counter productive. Your weapon for protection is NOT available in time of need. I never stored my weapons in a safe. I taught my children the proper ways to handle weapons and the fact that no one was to be told about them.
All of the current gun laws are unconstitutional (which means illegal) and counterproductive. ANSWER THIS ONE QUESTION! What gun laws do the criminals obey? NONE! Why? Because they are CRIMINALS!!! I’ll fall back on an old standby — “When the law-abiding people are disarmed, ONLY THE CRIMNALS will have guns.” Oh, I know, that’s too simple, but there again you’re not too damne bright.
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