In the United States of America, with the Second Amendment protecting our natural right to keep and bear arms, one would think that computer difficulties wouldn’t stop gun sales in an entire state for nearly two weeks.
Alas, one would be wrong.
Since November 1, nobody has been able to legally purchase a firearm in Washington State because of a computer system in the state’s Secure Automated Firearms E-Check (SAFE) system being “compromised.” That’s the program through which Washington conducts its background checks, instead of just going through the FBI’s National Instant Criminal Background Check (NICS) system.
When employees realized the system had been “compromised” on November 1 (they won’t say what that means), rather than figuring out how to fix it or putting some standby system into place, they immediately shut it down, making it impossible for gun dealers to run background checks for purchases. Since private sales are outlawed in the state, that effectively shut down all legal gun buying and selling.
In a Seattle Times report, Wendy Ferrell, associate director for the state Administrative Office of the Courts, said she couldn’t reveal the cause of the “compromise” because of “security reasons.”
“In an abundance of caution, we proactively took down our systems to secure them and are working around the clock with leading experts to restore services as quickly as possible,” Ferrell told the Times.
At that time, officials expected the outage to last “at least a week.” However, 12 days later, the system is still offline.
And officials don’t seem to be in much of a hurry to get it back up and running, based on a letter sent to gun dealers last week by Kevin L. Baird, assistant commander of the State Patrol’s Firearms Background Division.
“What this means to you: We are effectively on hold with any checks submitted from November 1, 2024, onward until AOC brings their systems back online,” Baird wrote. “Once that happens, the backlog of checks will process through as normal. But, until that time, we cannot make any determinations on any checks. We are currently working through as many pre-November 1 checks as possible, but even those are likely to be delayed due to another AOC system that we check also being down. We will do our best to get as many checks completed before their 10-business day wait period is met (to prevent unnecessary delays to your customers), but there may be some that we are not able to proceed/deny for a few days afterwards.”
That letter prompted leaders of the National Shooting Sports Foundation (NSSF), the firearm industry trade association, to encourage Washington officials involved with the fiasco to quickly find a remedy. In a letter sent on November 12, NSSF Senior Vice President and General Counsel Larry Keane asked state officials to quickly change to the NICS system, at least for now.
“ICS operates effectively nationwide, ensuring accurate background check verifications and accommodating safe and responsible firearm transactions,” Keane wrote. “Until the SAFE system is restored, we believe the NICS program is a sufficient alternative to maintain both security and access.”
Keane followed that statement with a warning to Washington officials that a prolonged delay in gun sales would not be tolerated by the organization.
“Please be aware that the inability to conduct lawful transactions may lead to further action, as we seek to protect the rights of our members and their customers,” Keane wrote. “We urge a swift resolution to these technical issues and stand ready to explore additional measures that should be taken to ensure Washingtonians are not unduly burdened in the future.”
The Second Amendment Foundation (SAF) has also vowed legal action if the situation isn’t remedied promptly.
“This is simply unacceptable, and we will not tolerate it,” said SAF founder and Executive Vice President Alan M. Gottlieb. “Washington State citizens have had their rights under the federal and state constitutions suspended, and we will take legal action if this isn’t solved immediately.”
sales continue uninterrupted in many parts of the state.
I would imagine those most bothered by the election would be the most impacted. With that said still a bullshit system.
If I remember correctly by federal law if there is more than a few days of delay for background checks the firearm must be transferred.
Vinny,
That only applies to firearm sales when Federal Firearm Licensees (also known as FFLs, in other words firearm dealers) request a criminal background check through the federal system.
Coincidentally? just before the Election of Trump. Hmmmmm.
Coastal Washington has always been a breeding ground for militant lefty groups. Wouldn’t be surprised if it was intentional but more likely a low quality system that they are dragging ass on repairs to try to let the crazies cool off a bit.
Otherwise known as The Peoples Repubelick of Pugetopia.
They’re running this up the flagpole to see what the reaction is, like Her Majesty Lujan-Grisham in New Mexico banning lawful carry over a fake “emergency order.”
My hope is the Republican Party grows some balls and uses the momentum from this last election to execute a frontal assault on blue states to regain those legislatures and governor’s mansions.
johnnyboy…Speaking of growing balls when are you going to the inner city and straighten the “usual suspects” out with the bigotry you display on this forum? For moral support you should take that mealy mouth History illiterate pos void with you…Let me how it goes.
So yelling people to call out violent savages around violent savages and receive violence from said savages? Your point seems lost in retardation.
Tells Johnny that using words with savages will elicit a violent-felony response, as though that does anything but prove him right
Debbie, I came up against such a person a few years ago after I counter protested an protest of ICE. He followed me down an alley. Once I saw that the group could no longer see us I did a quick about face. Up until then he had been calling me every name you could think of and threatening to “beat my white ass”. When he realized I was not afraid of him and he was not going to get a sucker punch and that the fight was going to be one on one he called me a “crazy white bastard” and left. EXACTLY what I expected. Those people are cowards.
Be quiet you unnatural inarticulate lunatic.
Maybe the voters of Washington State grow a pair and take control!
Sounds like a whole lot of infrenging.
“private sales are outlawed” WTF?
Once an awesome place.
They’re not outlawed. You have to conduct the sale through an FFL, with all the fees and the b.s. waiting period. Apparently, that’s all on hold now.
The leaking word is this “somehow been compromised”, that “somehow” was a few left wingers. But lets see what happens.
All it took was for the AG Ferguson to put his plan in action and further enforce it by becoming the governor on November 5th.
This is just the first of the games.
Ferguson’s montra is we will pass all the laws we want then they are legal until the Supreme Court says otherwise…..taking years.
“Kill them all, Satan will know his own”… Or something like that.
Just file the lawsuit now. Lost revenue, punitive damages the whole ball of wax. A right delayed is a right denied.
🤨👍🏼
Not to worry it’s backdoor Gun Control and demented Gun Control zealots are in no hurry to see it fixed.
Good news is AR platform receivers can still be ordered direct from Aero Precision in WA and shipped to your Free State FFL. Best to begin a build by purchasing their M4E1 stripped upper and lower receivers or purchase their stripped M4E1 upper receiver and save some moola by using it on an Anderson lower receiver which is usual route I take. Cannot mix the M5 as both receivers should be Aero. Just support your suppliers even if it buying another bore brush, etc.
They forced the 10 business day waiting period down our throats, which means 12+ days in reality, because of weekends. Now they’re not processing background checks? The state turned more blue with this latest election. I’m sure the government is dragging their feet in getting this fixed. Our next governor is going to be worse than than the previous idiot.
Maybe only one of the couple of states that actually turned bluer in this election. Go figure.
Yup, Dem idiots in WA voted to uphold new capital gains tax, carbon tax, income tax (while allowing a select group of those self exempting themselves with a little known and no longer available loophole, of course government officials are exempt) and brought in a far left governor. A ban on natural gas was so closely repealed by the voters that the current governor is believed to be preparing to veto the vote of the public (that’s protecting democracy of course by their twisted standards). The state is a poster child for tyranny, communism and now preparing to desensitize the public to potential all out gun rights denial. Is already illegal to purchase ANY semiautomatic center fire rifle in WA. So what’s the point of the 2A in WA? Prepare for more tyranny in WA with the incoming heavy handed left wing leaders in 2025! Oh and wait until they unleash their left wing militia known as ANTIFA to flail against their own cities (Portland and Seattle) with fire, urine and feces to protest MAGA!
I will file this under tin foil flags, along with the 11k of 7.62 they caught on Nov 5 coming into the US from Mexico.
What is odd about that one is unless it is something typically not importable/readily available for sale (AP and similar) it’s not like it would be hard to get substantial amounts of ammo for similar costs (unless it was stolen) throughout most of the US. They ever I’d what kind of 7.62?
My guess is 39, but no, just the one media blip…
No follow on, and no follow up.
I am starting to speculate that the latte bolsheviks were thinking that a Harris landslide would allow them to clamp down and finally rid themselves of all this stupid redneck bs like 2a, 1a and border security.
That’s just crazy talk I suppose, but they do ironically live in their own little broad-minded globalist world.
One thing to keep in mind re smuggling, if you catch 1 you can assume several already made it through. Plenty of time and opportunities for foreign militants/domestic operatives/cartel goon squads to infiltrate and organize and this may just be one of many such supply runs. Alternative on the optimistic end they just loaded up a bunch of Russian ammo that is becoming more scarce and wanted to sell it at current market value on the grey market.
There are lots of scenarios that are less than worst case, to include simple absent-mindedness or fear of mpending confiscation by Mexican authorities. However, I am 100% on the idea that 11k rifle ammo is worth way more $$$ in Mexico than the US. Full stop.
I find the timing of ammo headed significant, and the lack of interest in various media remarkable, also.
15-20 million well-nourished, well clothed “refugees”? Rifle ammo following them north from a leftist reconquista-loving country? A radical left blue state government shutting down firearm sales during a big election? Filthy rich neo-Maoist baby boomers panicking because they are running out of time and dupes? Chronic pain afflictees in Indiana buying black tar on the streets because it is cheaper and easier than the doctor? Blood-soaked foreign criminal organizations making huge money on decadal timescales off the whole mess? Pffft!
Why worry? Be happy. Life is good…
If it was x39 it could be substantially cheaper in Mexico (or Canada) as they still import some combination of Russian and Chinese ammo and cartels have long had access to anything in the inventory of Mexican military and police. For the private Mexican citizen you are correct even domestic Aguilla is taxed to be more than here.
Smugglers are like cockroaches. If you see one then one hundred already got away.
“cartels have long had access to anything in the inventory of Mexican military and police”
Don’t doubt it. Do doubt it is cheap for the cartels.
From free99 to whatever the government pays. Either way was cheaper than what I saw in the US back in 2011 when I had any dealing with the topic.
This is one reason I rail against background checks.
Govern mental permission to exercise a Constitutional Right is not a right at all.
If the NICS system can’t be used as an alternative, it makes me think the Washington state system is also a registry as well.
Southern Cross, of course it is.
A lot of people I know, myself included consider our guns are registered because of the 4473 form we fill out.
If the law requiring the waiting period does not specifically extend that time for unexplained failures to access their own records, I can’t help but think the government’s playing fast and loose here. However, I am a Washington lawyer and not the least surprised. In the end they will blame some poor DEI hire and move on to their next outrage.
“If the law requiring the waiting period does not specifically extend that time for unexplained failures to access their own records”
You seem to be saying that down time should not count as waiting period. As in, cour computers are back on line, so your wait clock is running now.
Why so?
They have a certain amount of time from the date of purchase. This allows them to vet your ability to exercise your 2nd amendment rights. Down time is on them and SHOULD count. Sorry if I was unclear.
Got it. Thanks.
Further – ATF says the clock starts at time of purchase, including online sales. So shipping time counts as wait time. Most FFLs in my experience insist it starts at time of passing background check – even where state law is in line with ATF.
Grrrrrr…
Evil never rests; ever.
“Hotel California” has an appropriate lyric line.
All that is necessary for evil to be triumphant is for good people to do nothing to stop it.
Or something stupid to “stop” it.
Seems to me that a few thousand people should record themselves on video walking into their local gun store and asking to purchase a firearm, at which point the gun dealer will of course inform those customers that Washington State government entities are not allowing them to purchase. With irrefutable evidence in hand, those people should then petition federal prosecutors to start charging responsible state government employees under the federal law “deprivation of rights under color of law”. And if federal prosecutors refuse to charge said state employees, those people should then file civil lawsuits against those state employees under analogs for civil proceedings.
Absolutely right and well reasoned.
State employees cannot be sued under the federal civil rights acts.
Correct me if I am wrong: a state employee who willfully and knowingly deprives a citizen of his/her civil rights under color of law has no such immunity. For example a state employee who wrongfully and willfully arrests and jails an innocent person–denying said person of his/her freedom–is both criminally and civilly liable. The only question is whether or not a court of proper jurisdiction will recognize that it is wrongful to deny someone their right to keep and bear arms. Needless to say, the overwhelming majority of courts (99% or more) never seem to truly recognize our right to keep and bear arms.
Or are you telling me that a state legislature can pass a law which orders state employees to immediately execute anyone wearing a red baseball cap, an employee can then go out and execute a person wearing a red baseball cap, and that state employee is immune to criminal and civil liability?
“For the purpose of Section 242, acts under “color of law” include acts not only done by federal, state, or local officials within their lawful authority, but also acts done beyond the bounds of that official’s lawful authority,”
From justice.gov
“…but also acts done beyond the bounds of that official’s lawful authority,”
That’s when govt employes can be individually and personally sued.
True. I was just citing the quote as an example of the applicability of the statute.
Context is everything. The Civil Rights Movement saw the Feds as the savior against southern state governments. It’s absurd to think that they would pass a law exempting the very people they saw as their main antagonists.
“It’s absurd to think that they would pass a law exempting…”
Absurb, yes; but, that is the current state of mind for anti-Americans.
Sam,
Not sure what you mean. The plain text of the law shows they are not exempt.
Back in August, I discovered this “system” managed to attach a felony to my Washington records. First and last name used for criminal records association by some database genuis.There could be hundreds, maybe thousands of Washingtonians that were incorrectly linked to felony records. Would love to have the 2AF research this for a class action.
‘We are effectively on hold with any checks submitted from November 1, 2024, onward until AOC brings their systems back online…’
Oh great! They’re waiting for Alexandria Ocasio-Cortez to fix it!
How about this? If something goes hay-wire on election/voting day, most jurisdictions permit a voter to cast a PROVISIONAL ballot (even states without voter ID). Why not permit a PROVISIONAL background check for a purchaser (even with an ID)? If it comes back no good later on, officials can follow-up then. Right delayed? Right denied.
Don’t worry so much. They can still have legal pornography and legal butt sex and drugs. That has always been far more important to the majority of voters in Washington State.
Besides the head libertarian. The proud gun toting gay libertarian c0m.munist, Chase Oliver supported the government, forcing gun stores and churches to close.
So this had the blessing of the libertarian Party presidential candidate back in 2020.
btw
Before we had background checks. And you could buy a gun at 16 years of age. Back then we use to lock criminals regularly. And the dangerous mentally ill were also locked up. Because their family had them committed.
Now the libertarians liberals and the left complain there are too many criminals being locked up in America.
I doubt that most citizen from anti-Constitutional states like California, Oregon, and Washington have no idea that citizens from free, lawful, Constitution-abiding states can walk into a store, pick up the handgun of their choice (ANY handgun), complete the NICS documentation, ammunition, and anything else they need, and be out of the store with their purchases in a half hour. That’s how long it took for me to buy my handguns after I moved from California. As an added bonus, they were MODERN handguns, not “off-roster” (i.e. California), limited to handguns introduced over 25 years ago, or even older.
They just don’t know. They would be SHOCKED if they ever found out. Particularly so, if they wanted a modern handgun, and/or really needed to defend themselves from an urgent threat. Two different Americas, and the US Constitution, Bill of Rights, and “lawfare” are the difference points.
Aside: Do a side by comparison of counties of homes in Washington state 1/2 hour close to the Idaho border, and homes on the opposite side of the border, in Idaho. My guess is that property in really beautiful areas of Eastern Washington state, is running 1/3 less than Idaho, and Seattle politics is the only difference. In fact, joining the “land rush” from California to Idaho are not thousands of Washington state citizens, seeking to leave their Soviet-bloc style Communist colony.
Correction – 1st Paragraph: “I doubt that most citizens from anti-Constitutional states like California, Oregon, and Washington have any idea that citizens from free, lawful, Constitution-abiding states can walk into a store, pick up the handgun & ammo of their choice (ANY handgun), complete the NICS documentation, and be out of the store with their purchases in a half hour. ”
(Hey, copy editor?) 😖
At one time, as a Washington CPL holder, I could go in and purchase a handgun and walk out with it after the NICS cleared me. We lost that exclusion when they expanded the waiting period to 10 business days.
The joke is anyone who does a background check.
I don’t believe the Lying liberal democraps!
Gotta give WA govt credit for a novel way to ban firearm sales.
This is worse than what happened in New Mexico. The People of Washington are being oppressed by a nameless, faceless bureaucracy. There will be no accountability, nobody held responsible.
The devil will know his own…
@Umm
“Sam, Not sure what you mean. The plain text of the law shows they are not exempt.”
Simply pointing out that Law of Agency always applies: an agent cannot legally do what the principle appointing the agent cannot legally accomplish. Thus, a govt agency acting outside its legal authority an be sued, along with an employee who acts outside their authority within the agency.